mini #585 - A Tempest Has Formed (Over), Thanks Patrick!!

[Xtoxm]

Only scum want the lover claiming so as not to kill it.

That request is horribly antitown.

[Matt_S]

Only scum want the lover claiming so as not to kill it.

That request is horribly antitown.

This is the truth. The lover wants, above all else, to take the bullet(or knife) tonight. Claiming ruins the chance to do that.

[populartajo]

I feel good with either Skruffs or Matt lynched.

[Alabaska J]

:/ shit forgot who you replaced.

unvote

You should stop being so cavalier though. Throwing off my scumdar.

Skruffs or pop today for me then.

vote: Skruffs

for now.

[populartajo]

:/ shit forgot who you replaced.

unvote

You should stop being so cavalier though. Throwing off my scumdar.

Skruffs or pop today for me then.

vote: Skruffs

for now.

Hey why me?
I concur with Xtoxm. Id be really mad if Alabaska isnt town.

[Alabaska J]

:/ shit forgot who you replaced.

unvote

You should stop being so cavalier though. Throwing off my scumdar.

Skruffs or pop today for me then.

vote: Skruffs

for now.

Hey why me?
I concur with Xtoxm. Id be really mad if Alabaska isnt town.

I've said a few times but remember I'm voting Skruffs here.

[Matt_S]

Alabaska: Could you explain why exactly you want to lynch Skruffs?

And why does everyone have a hard time keeping track of replacements?

Since everyone's naming their suspects, I'd support any lynch except Xtoxm or Skruffs unless someone explains how they're mafia.

[populartajo]

Better question Matt. Why do you think Xtoxm and Skruffs are town?

[Matt_S]

Better question Matt. Why do you think Xtoxm and Skruffs are town?

I don't. I think either Xtoxm or Skruffs is the serial killer. I'm leaning towards the former, but the quick way the Skruffs wagon formed doesn't seem right.

[Cream147]

Only scum want the lover claiming so as not to kill it.

That request is horribly antitown.

This is the truth. The lover wants, above all else, to take the bullet(or knife) tonight. Claiming ruins the chance to do that.

Fair enough. This is why I put the question out, to see if it had any intelligence behind it. Clearly the answer is no. Xtoxm, you are desperately trying to implicate me at every turn since I discovered you were the SK.

I would like to get back onto proper scumhunting soon, something which I think hasn't happened since the early stages of Day 2.

I don't think Skruffs killed iamausername. However, it's very possible that

xtoxm

, ok, the SK killed him to frame Skruffs. I still think it's very possible that Skruffs is mafia though. Iamausername put a decent case (admittedly based on relationships more than anything) but if you couple that with the odd behaviour, and the fact that he hasn't in my opinion, been scumhunting much, makes me wonder.

[Skruffs]

Better question Matt. Why do you think Xtoxm and Skruffs are town?

I seem to remember someone using this as an excuse to continue voting MM day one: The concept of "This person should be assumed to be scum until proven innocent" is a GREAT scum ploy because there is NO WAY To prove someone is innocent. Now that the cop is dead, there is absolutely nothing that can be done to counter this question with any concrete evidence unless someone is a RBer and prevents a kill, a doctor and prevents a kill, or is scum and knows hte town is town and has a better reason for voting them.

So, since I Don't remember who originally used that as their reason to vote MM day one, and remembering how strongly youy pushed the case on Elias yesterday, basedo n ALVINZ postings and not Elias, I decided to look through your posts and see what happened.

Better question Matt. Why do you think Xtoxm and Skruffs are town?

I don't. I think either Xtoxm or Skruffs is the serial killer. I'm leaning towards the former, but the quick way the Skruffs wagon formed doesn't seem right.

Before I do, though: You think I am the SK bcause the wagon against me formed so quickly; doesn't that mean it's more likely I am town and that the SK and the mafia are both voting me? Explain your logic.

Okay on to PopTaj.

DAY ONE:

No need for a prod.
Im very tired atm, can anyone tell me what has happened in the last 2-3 pages?
Im still thinking in lynching either Cream or Mellowed. This might change with the reread Im doing tomorrow but I doubt it.
Also noticing Gaspode and Matt doing some serious attacks against Alvinz, where did this suspicions start?

Focus on crema/MEllowed, you later get flack for having not ever posted concrete reasons for being suspicious of these two; you always refer to suspicions posted 'earlier' but continue to encourage suspicoin without actually posting a case. However, you try to make it look like the two p eople suspicious of Alvinz are cooperating somehow, deflecting attention away from Alvinz.

Later on:

WHy is Gaspode so against Alvinz?

Interesting.

Later ON:

Skruffs you need to get glasses because I did say who my top suspects were. I dont know where did you get the idea of flying beneath the radar.
Read, we're pretty desorganized.

This only benefits scum. We should concentrate in one suspicious case (like Cream's or Mellowed's or [insert your top suspect here] to gain conversation or we're not going anywhere, like the last 2-3 pages.
If you want my opinion, I still think Cream is a healthy lynch. You can read my case about him some posts of mine ago. Mellowed is the next one. Ditto. Gaspode is also worrying me. He has been against Alvinz all the game.

And finally it still bothers me why Skruffs thinks I deserve a vote.
Just wondering Skruffs, can you tell me who Elias top suspects are?

A) You think conversation should be encouraged
B) Continuing to push the Cream/MM wagon without contributing reasons
C) Continuing to deflect attention away from ALvinz


In regards to A):

Skruff realli likes to read every little detail. Any necessity of that excesive scumhunting behavior?

Later on you decide you do not like excessive talking, if it's in relation to you (Or Alvinz)

mmkay.

vote: alvinz96

Elias and tajo, you are also scummy to me. It is late where I am, this is all I have time to post.

Porntime

Bedtime!

Why do alvinz seems more suspicious than Elias and me? Because he's easy to lynch? Are you saying that he's scum based in his relationship with Elias or did he do anything else that catched your mind?
Nothing to comment on Mellowed Man, Coheed or Matt? I expected a big post. Could you do that?
---------------------

For all the wagoners I still think Alvinz isnt scum. OMGUS is dumb not scummy. And he still looks to me like the agressive silly cop in NG556 (I can finally cite it since it recently finished).

Cream's reasons are pretty sucky IMO and does anybody think MM's play is how a doctor should play?

Come on. He continually tried to push attention away from ALvinz for NO REASON, even trying to give ALvinz a fake-cop claim by saying Alvinz's play reminded him of his play AS A COP.


Day Two:

WARNING : LONG POST.

Coheed should report now. Unless he was roleblocked.

Amazingly, he was. Interesting how PopularTajo assumed the mafia had a roleblocker.

Reading the flavor of the kill tells us that its very possible that we have a SK since they usually use knives (stabbing) instead of mafia weapons, right?

Assuming we have a SK why did he try to kill a claimed doctor when obv scum would do that? I can only think in a newbie or first time as SK.

You will note that the next night, the mafia shot the claimed cop and the SK stabbed someone else. Thanks to PopularTajo telling the SK not to go after the claimed power roles, we had two deaths instead of one.

Alvin coming up scum puts us in nice advantage. The following post should tell us many many things. I guess it was Alvinz's first time as scum so he probably made the typical newbie scum mistakes.

a) A heavily suspected person in his list isnt probably his scumpartner. (however take in count that he could be the SK).
b) Neutral players or players with no reads are possible scumpartners.
c) Townie players in his list could probably be scum but there are more possibilities that they are players difficult to make a case against.

Let's see.

You string up niltialicjoan. You check his house, and find it similar to alvinz95's, only without the roleblocking materials.

niltaicjoan, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 2

Town wins!

Alive:
Battousai-Cop
ting =)-Doc
Rosso Carne-Townie
Sir Tornado-Townie

Dead:
alvinz95, replacing Powerful Wizard IRL, Mafia Roleblocker, lynched Day 1
BlckKnght, replacing SilverConqueror, Townie, killed Night 1
niltiacjoan, replacing Glowie, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 2

Battousai investigated BlckKnght night 1
ting =) protected Battousai night 1
niltiacjoan kiled BlckKnght night 1

Sorry to alvinz95 for mistankenly telling him that BlckKnght was his partner.

This is from Mini 549.
This post was quoted in February, long before you said that he had never been scum before.

So your "Initial Assumption" about Alvinz having never been scum and so being an "Easy Read" is completely false, inaccurate, and intentionally misdirecting.


With that in mind, let's see how you distorted the facts to try to use a dead Mafiates post to get Elias lynched (rather than looking at Elias' posts instead), which is actually a fairly common tactic for one scum buddy to do with another's post postlynching.

Urrrghh! I just had a nice long analysis of everyone, then the internet died!

Evilgorrilaz

: The least townly because of his likeness of bandwagons. Dangerous if he successfully starts a bandwagon. Good person to look out for.

Evilgorrilaz isnt his scumpartner. 90%.

Populartajo

: Something fishy about his last post. Seems to be giving limited information, and trying to start a wagon on me, by asking everyone if they thought my comment was weird. (can you explain?) You usually post a lot more in depth. Are you trying to hide something? And is your vote on evilgorrilaz a random vote or a serious vote?

Obv I know I am town and this heavy suspicion also, using the logic above, confirms me 90% as not his scumpartner.

In the event that you get lynched and com up town, you have tied yourself to Evilgorillaz. Similarly, if Evilgorillaz dies and comes up town, you wind up partially clearing yourself.

Gaspode

: Overall seems the most townly, but I'm not entirely convinced yet, since it is at the beginning of the game. By the way, HAPPY BIRTHDAY!

Gaspode is an intesting case. He's 100% not Alvinz scumpartner since he was after him all the fucking game.Howver, I think that if someone is the SK then he could be. I have a bad feeling about him

Because scum do not bus? Is that what you are implying? If you turn out to be scum, Gaspode is much more likely to be a partner, b oth for his (as you say) unreasoned attacks against Alvinz as well as your ignoring those attacks after spending most of the first day trying to get him to stop attacking Alvinz. You are hte one saying Alvinz has never been scum before, and Alvinz was lynched for saying there was a mafia roleblocker, so why wouldn't Gaspode be bussing him as scum? I take it back, maybe you just didn't think enough into this to say that Gaspode was potentially scum.

Marmalade

: So far, hasn't elaborated on comments. (Most are one sentence long). Too little to tell. Leaning town.

Mmmm. Alvinz first case (communicatin in thread) was against me and Marmalade. Then, Alabaska suspected both Elias and Alvinz as scumpartners. So this probably means Marmalade isnt his scumparnter.

How? Explain the logic behind this. Especially since you later tried to push Elias as Alvinz scum partner, giving credence to ALabaska's case against the two of you.

Ashmite

: Can't really tell, hasn't done anything townly, so I'm leaning more on the scum side.

mmmm, this probably tells us Ashmite, Skruffs, isnt his scumpartner but Im not too sure, as Alvinz seems to feel about him.

And yet you had no problem voting me without adjusting any of your suspicions under the pretense that I would be the only person to kill Iamausername, even though that statement is so incredibly full of WIFOM that it can only be made by someone who loses NOTHING by it; you are probably not the SK (who stabbed IAMAUSENARME), which further pushes to me that you are mafia.

iamausername

: Leaning towards town, though his vote on evilgorrilaz is quite ironic. not much left to say...

Mmmm, although Alvinz reads imausername as town he doesnt feel too confident about him. We have a possible scumpartner.

The only person in the game that you said was likely to be town (as compared to just "not alvins partner", wound up getting stabbed the next night. Remember that the SK wants to kill townie people, and remember also that EARLIER IN THAT POST, you told the SK not to target the cop.

This is the interesting section

CoheedCambria09

: I'm thinking newbish, could go either way, not much to analyze.

Another possible scumpartner

Wrong. You also immediately believed Coheed's claim, which suggests you never really thought he might be his partner, because you knew he was town.

Cream147

: hasn't posted anything besides a random vote. Prod?

He has been strongly against Alvinz for some part of D1. This almost confirms him as not his scumpartner but he could be the SK for backtracking after their argument.

This must be YOUR first time as scum; you are attributing newbie-scum as plausible tells as if every single person in the game was scum for the first time, and would never think of distancing from their partners.

Hypatia

: hasn't posted anything besides "I don't random vote" post. Prod?

Elias_te_thief

: No posts. Prod?

These last two posters (Hypatia, Matt and Elias) are at the end for not posting. We should look for more info, lets see.

About Hypatia, Matt_s

No commets until she got replaced. This post is interesting.

I really dislike his stance on Elias_the_thief. He seems to be trying to get an easy wagon on somebody experienced. Besides that, he has been unimpressive. Pretty scummy.

A wagon? Why would I want to start a wagon on Elias? He probably is one of the contributors and starting a wagon on him would be untownly! And every knows that it was crap-logic, but seriously, it wasn't for a wagon, for a lynch, or any means of scum hunting, and I was just trying to contribute. You can go ahead and call that comment "a means off brushing it off", but If i were to try to let it slide, I would just have ignored it.

Here comes a sincere attack. This probably tells me Matt isnt his scumparnter.[/quote]
Interesting. Alvinz went pretty far in seeming sarcasitc in pushing a wagon on Elias. And it's interesting that you use a double standard; scum won't bus each other, but Elias is probably scum because Alvinz bussed him.

So are you teamed with her or are you scum pals? Or do just a liking to very bad back-up

I'm not liking your first post, because you have allied with cream, or scum partners, and you don't give much support in saying that almost everyone is scummy except coheed, cream, iamausername, marmalade. Nice.

Fos: Matt S

About Elias

I agree. I leaning towards Elias because he is definitely experienced, (2128 posts!), and his scum record is considerably high and has been scum 11 times (not like it has anything to do with this game, but hey, it might! ). IC's usually won't lurk like that. I

'm not sure at all, but if there is one scum in those group of lurkers, then I'd say Elias.

Lucky for now, but....

I don't think Elias is scum at all (lynch all lurkers is a bad policy), but, what I meant was that if there was scum in that group then I would say Elias. I'm not starting a wagon at all. I was just agreeing with Gaspode on the lurker opinion and giving a thought on it. Non of that was "evidence" to support a Elias lynch, because he is BY FAR, not on my scum list, because lynching someone just because they are lurking is not townly at all, especially if they have only posted one thing. The scum record was just tagged in for fun hence the parenthesis and "not like it has anything to do with this game, but hey, it might" which shows that it was merely a small joke.

Ding ding ding ding. We have a winner. Now that we know Alvinz is scum I think this post pretty much tells us that Elias could be scum, (notice the unsureness of "hey it might") but he's not on his scum list BY FAR, although his previous post said that he was leaning toward Elias.

Elias wagon? Hmmmmm.... just for fun. xD Vote: Elias the Thief Obviously temporary until I pick up some more scummy stuff.

Make sense now.[/quote]

I will have a detailed post later today explaining exactly why this connection case is retarded and probably lead by scum tajo. tata for now.

Lulz. Retarded FTW again? This should be fun. I want my revenge.

At the expense of the town?

You know Im not scum Elias.
If you were town you wouldnt suspect me. And you dont need a detailed post to say why that connection is retarded and why I am scum, unless you exactly dont know what to say.

THIS SHOULD BE SETTING OFF ALARMS IN EVERYONE'S HEAD.


There is more that I need to say, but this is a good start. I think if other people looked at this, especially knowing that PopularTajo

faked an assumption about Alvinz

as a reason to both clear himself and to fake incriminate Elias. His eager vote on me in the beginning of the day after he took up Alvinz's case against Elias (successfully) just confirms to me that he is definitely mafia.

Unvote, Vote: PopularTajo

[Skruffs]

I'd like to point out that Alabaska J voted me, unvoted me when I expressed anger over missing the night stage because he was wondering if that meant that I couldn't be scum, and then REVOTED ME ANYWAYS even though the only reason, that I can think of, for someone to express anger at missing the night stage (TWICE!!!) is because they have a PRO TOWN NIGHT ACTION That they did not get to use.

He has avoided mentioning it, but seems to believe my anger, so his actions do not make sense.

[Matt_S]

You think I am the SK bcause the wagon against me formed so quickly; doesn't that mean it's more likely I am town and that the SK and the mafia are both voting me? Explain your logic.

That's one possibility. The way I interpreted it was that the mafia was trying to get you lynched because they thought you were the serial killer. My idea is less likely than yours, but I think it's a reasonable possibility.

This new case on popular seems interesting. I don't have the time to read it in depth right now, but in a few hours I'll check it out.

[Xtoxm]

Hmm. I just thought of something.

Skruffs spent a period a L-1, right...If he was non-mafia...Surely maf would have hammered?

Either that or AJ and Pop are both maf...I somehoe doubt that...What do people think of that?

[Cream147]

Tomorrow, I am going on holiday. The hotel we are going to supposedly has Wi-Fi access, but I don't trust it. I will definitely be on LA, but it's possible I won't be able to post for the next 7 days. If the Wi-Fi at the hotel I am going to is good, I will make a post in the next 48 hours. Mods can deal with this in whatever way they want (replacement, temp replacement, nothing, etc.) Am posting to all my games.

[Skruffs]

Hmm. I just thought of something.

Skruffs spent a period a L-1, right...If he was non-mafia...Surely maf would have hammered?

Either that or AJ and Pop are both maf...I somehoe doubt that...What do people think of that?

WIFOM. You aren't cleared, so 2 of the 3 players voting me could very easily be mafia. Hell, the third could be the SK too, or any combination of those two. Also, with an SK around, MAfia are going to be wary about quick lynching a player if there is a chance one of htem wi ll be killed for it.

Why are you voting me, again?

[Skruffs]

I've been thinking about this game, and i've come to the conclusion that despite my read, Ala HAS TO BE MAFIA.

I have been cleared of being mafia, and the only suspicion on me is for being SK, which is what AJ is voting me for.

Now, lynching the SK today is a plan that only helps mafia, as it secures victory as long as they don't hit the lover overnight.

AJ has made it clear by going for me that he intends to lynch who he believes to me the SK today. This directly translates to mafia victory.

AJ is therefore mafia.

unvote vote AJ

So you think AJ is mafia, which is half of hte players you think would have to be mafia for me not to be quickhammered. You do NOT Think that Pop is mafia, which is what you REALLY meant to say when you said that you found it unlikely that both Pop and AJ were voting me. Correct?

[Matt_S]

I agree with most of what Skruffs has to say about populartajo. I had forgotten the way popular put forward how he thought alvinz played like a cop. I disagree slightly with alvinz's prior scum newbie game being intentionally misdirecting though. I'm still not comfortable with the assumptions populartajo made about how alvinz would play though. I'm still perturbed about Alabaska J's behavior, though. He's pushing the Skruffs case without logic as to why he's mafia. He abandoned the Xtoxm wagon when he remembered that Xtoxm replaced Gaspode, yet he's still pushing the Skruffs wagon because iamausername died.

[Elias_the_thief]

Im a tad pissed off that I never recieved a prod last weekend when I was home and had completely forgotten about this game, and Im even more pissed off that I wasnt informed when I died so now I went and wrote up this post for no reason.

Neither of those things are a mod's responsibility. It's your responsibility to remember what games you're playing in, and to know whether you're alive or not.

A prod was requested on me and you never gave it. This implies to town that I'm ignoring the prod. If a prod is requested (which it was) it is indeed your duty to provide one.

[Alabaska J]

Skruffs, now what am I supposed to use in my case against tajo?

Also, did you just softclaim? I REALLY don't like that given the situation. Also don't like that you made a big deal about revoting you

even after you told me the towntell I posted was weak!!!!!!!!!!

Another thing: I realize I was wrong about the towntell. If one of the mafia isn't present the kill will still go through if he has a buddy still alive.

[Patrick]

Votecount

Alabaska J (2) -- Porochaz, Xtoxm
Skruffs (1) -- Alabaska J
populartajo (1) -- Skruffs

Not voting: Matt_S, populartajo, Cream147
7 alive, 4 to lynch.

[Matt_S]

So Alabaska, why is Skruffs scum?

[populartajo]

There is more that I need to say, but this is a good start. I think if other people looked at this, especially knowing that PopularTajo faked an assumption about Alvinz as a reason to both clear himself and to fake incriminate Elias. His eager vote on me in the beginning of the day after he took up Alvinz's case against Elias (successfully) just confirms to me that he is definitely mafia.

I think you're exagerating things a little bit. I admit I didnt research how many times Alvin had played as mafia BUT I know that his first game in the site was NG556, not much ago. In fact I could say that his next game was probably this. As I see, you like to research things that may incriminate me, but Ill bet a million dollars that you didnt read that game. Go read it and then come back to agree with me that his play as a newbie cop in that game feels similar to his play as scum here. He even posted his PM that modikilled him. Now my assumption was that it was probably his first time as scum and that he could have made the typical mistakes newbie scum do.
This is called scumhunting, dude. I pushed Elias case and he came up town. What do I do now? I push my second suspect.
As I said Skruffs is a decent lycnh. Id be very surprised if he's town. He has spent all the game pointing out little and sometimes silly things about almost all players. This last post is a good try but Im town, Skruffs.
Matt in the other hand makes me wonder. I can see him as scum but his last post feels extremely townie and I support now the pressure to Alabaska.

[Alabaska J]

So Alabaska, why is Skruffs scum?

See iamausername's case yesterday. See iamausername dead today.

Although if the town does not support a Skruffs lynch, I am just as willing to lynch tajo.

[Matt_S]

See iamausername's case yesterday.

I don't recall you saying much about the case yesterday.

See iamausername dead today.

So you think that "drained of blood" is the mafia kill? Or are you hunting the serial killer, despite unvoting Xtoxm because you don't think he's mafia?