Mini 621 - Pantsville (Game over!)

[chenhsi]

I think you missed reborn's vote on me, I'm not sure though.

and

Deadline extension please

[Erratus Apathos]

Six votes for extension, seven needed to extend?

HAMMERTIME!

requesting deadline extension

[clammy]

i have been prodded, starting read from #139 now. Mob pm stated vtes required for extension;

vote: requesting extension

[Yosarian2]

I'd switch to chensi at deadline if it comes to that, but I'd still rather see Clockwork hang.

And I'd switch to Clockwork at deadline, if needed.

With 12 hours until deadline, and us heading towards a no-lynch (which would be quite bad for town), I'm suspicious of

A. Anyone who's not voting in a useful way (which basically means voting one of our top two suspects, unless you've got a better idea)

and

B. Anyone who dosn't request a deadline extension.

Anyone who don't do one of those things, or at least explain why you're not, then I'm going to be looking at you tommorow as possible scum hoping to allow a no-lynch to happen.

[Yosarian2]

Ah, never mind, looks like deadline has been extended. Ok, we've got 3 days. Let's use them well.

First, chenhsi, you're currently at lynch -2, and the closest to lynch. If nothing changes, it's likely you'll be lynched before deadline. Therefore, I would suggest you try and convince us to not lynch you (which might or might not involve a claim, that's up to you) and make a case for who YOU think we should lynch today if not you, and why, and that you do both ASAP. The closer to the deadline we get, the harder it is to end one bandwagon and start another one sucessfully, so if you've got a defense, or if you want to claim, do it soon.

[Awesome Pants]

Deadline has been bumped forward three days to the 19th at 9PM GMT +10.

Because I'm so awesome, I've made you all a countdown timer that has a countdown till deadline.

[reborn537]

I calmly await chenhsi's defence.

[Yosarian2]

Wow...that is awesome, mod.

We now have exactally 3 days, 10 hours, 39 minutes and 32 seconds until deadline. Heh, very cool website.

[Farkshinsoup]

First, chenhsi, you're currently at lynch -2, and the closest to lynch. If nothing changes, it's likely you'll be lynched before deadline. Therefore, I would suggest you try and convince us to not lynch you (which might or might not involve a claim, that's up to you) and make a case for who YOU think we should lynch today if not you, and why, and that you do both ASAP. The closer to the deadline we get, the harder it is to end one bandwagon and start another one sucessfully, so if you've got a defense, or if you want to claim, do it soon.

I second that emotion.

Because I'm so awesome, I've made you all a countdown timer that has a countdown till deadline.

I heart this timer. I want this in all my games.

[reborn537]

I've put it on my Firefox quick bar

[clammy]

*caught up*

Much the fan of the deadline-counter, Pants for PM.

On re-read my opinion of ClockworkRuse really hasn't moved, i believe he's by far the best lynch and then some. Chenhsi really didn't strike me as unwilling or lurking or scummy until he started responding in the #280s and started not being able to remember any details. However, if that is to be taken on face value it would imply someone who hasn't opened the thread at all rather than someone who's been actively lurking. WIFOM.

I would like to see ClockworkRuse swing.

[reborn537]

Can someone please give me a summary of the case before I vote for him.

[Yosarian2]

If someone could go through and lay out what the case against is Clockwork again, that'd be helpful.

[Farkshinsoup]

Oh nos, don't do it! If you get several more people voting for me then you will force me out into the open!

Also, how do you think scum would react to me using WIFOM on them?

FoS Reborn

The fact that you even just claimed you have a role is bad for the town. Either you are lying, which is scummy in itself and sounds like fishing, or you are telling the truth and you just got yourself targeted. Both cases don't help the town at all.

FoS Guzame

So,what's so great about this role that you're willing to give it away to everyone,including the scum?

Sounds like fishing to me.

Then this:

ClockworkRuse, i don't buy that Guzame looked like he was fishing.

Then:

I was joking with Guzame's 'fishing.' I should have put an emote in there or something.

And then repeated questions about how was that a joke (a bolded FoS) and repeated explanations from Clock.

Looking over this, though, I noticed that after the original FoS of Guzame, the very next post, Clock wrote this:

Pretty much everything Guzame said sums up what I was thinking. The fact that you just role-claimed something that keeps you from being night-killed means that Mafia isn't going to come after you now.

We just lost a day where a night kill is avoided because of your claim, if you actually have this role at all.

If he was seriously FoSing, it seems like he would have not immediately agreed completely with the person that he was FoSing. So I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt here and just assume that it was a poor joke, and that Clock did a bad job of expressing in his post that it was a joke.

Based on this, I'm more convinced that chen is our lynch today. At best (for us), chen is lurking scum, at worst, a completely unhelpful townie who does not care about this game and is distracting us from finding scum. I'd just as soon kill him as soon as possible either way.

[reborn537]

Yeah, I think the overriding point here is that you can't lynch someone based on "Your word against their's." I am, of course referring to the was he/wasn't he lie incident. If there is anything else against Clock, please show me but this seems to be the main point.

[Farkshinsoup]

Yeah, I think the overriding point here is that you can't lynch someone based on "Your word against their's."

I disagree. We can, and do, lynch for any reason we want, including "your word against their's".

Just so happens that in this case, there's a better reason to vote someone else.

[Adel]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/search.p ... or=chenhsi

is he lurking?

[reborn537]

Well he just posted here in post 325 for the first time in ages, to say basically nothing.

[Haschel Cedricson]

[quote="ClockworkRuse]

FoS Guzame

So,what's so great about this role that you're willing to give it away to everyone,including the scum?

Sounds like fishing to me.[/quote]

This is the comment that started it all. Before proceeding, we must ask ourselves

was Guzame fishing

? I think he was. Reborn softclaimed having a non-townie role, and Guzame made a comment asking for more details about the role. This is what rolefishing is. Guzame was doing it. Had I been online at the time, I would have posted exactly what ClockworkRuse did.

What do the rest of you think? clammy has already stated that he didn't think that Guzame was fishing. I don't understand this position at all. I think most of the rest of us will agree that Guzame's comment could have easily been rolefishing. As such, ClockworkRuse's response was entirely appropriate.

Later on down the page, clammy suggests that Guzame was NOT fishing, and ClockworkRuse, faced with pressure, decides to recant his statement by calling it a joke; ClockworkRuse didn't actually think Guzame was fishing after all! However, the "joke" position was

a perfectly logical position to seriously hold.

If clammy had not said anything, the game would have proceeded with the town taking ClockworkRuse at face value.

tl;dr version:

1) CR takes a position that a pro-town player should logically come to.
2) clammy disagrees with that position.
3) CR instantly states he was joking.
4) A joke does not make sense in that situation, as it would be likely to hurt the town.
5) Therefore CR was not joking and is now lying about it.

chenshi reread coming later today, assuming all goes well.

[Adel]

follow the link, the posts he has made in this game are not unique on that page -- he just isn't active, period. Notice how many games he is posting in, and note the the percentage of his posts that he is devoting to this game is about the same as the percentage of his posts that he is making in other game. Ditto for word count.

If we vote to lynch him today we won't be lynching him for lurking in this game so much as lynching him for having low overall site activity.

To make matters, his lynch will not be informative. It will tell us very little about the alignment of the people voting for him.

[Farkshinsoup]

To make matters, his lynch will not be informative. It will tell us very little about the alignment of the people voting for him.

Why not? Will Clock's be more informative?

[Yosarian2]

Adel: I'm totally willing to lynch someone for being completly not helpful and lurking in plain sight in this game, irrespective of his behavior in other games. I understand the meta "he's doing it everywhere" defense you're making here, it makes sense, but since he's clearly around and reading this game, a bandwagon should force him to participate and at least show up and defend himself and say who we should lynch instead. Or, if this "you're going to die in 2 1/2 days unless you do something" moment dosn't make him do something, then he's never going to do anything, and we might as well lynch him now rather then ignore him and then try to figure out his alignment in endgame based on zero content.

Although, if you've got a better idea, Adel, I'd be very interested to hear it. Who do you think we should lynch?

[Adel]

Adel: I'm totally willing to lynch someone for being completly not helpful and lurking in plain sight in this game, irrespective of his behavior in other games. I understand the meta "he's doing it everywhere" defense you're making here, it makes sense, but since he's clearly around and reading this game, a bandwagon should force him to participate and at least show up and defend himself and say who we should lynch instead. Or, if this "you're going to die in 2 1/2 days unless you do something" moment dosn't make him do something, then he's never going to do anything, and we might as well lynch him now rather then ignore him and then try to figure out his alignment in endgame based on zero content.

Although, if you've got a better idea, Adel, I'd be very interested to hear it. Who do you think we should lynch?

What I was contradicting was that he was posting in other games but not in this one.

I don't have a handle on this game yet. I need to watch things develop a little more.

The interesting thing about chenshi's wagon is that he was so close to being the deadline lynch. People requesting a deadline extension is a dta point I hadn't really thought of before. I think lynching him is a better idea than I originally thought: if he is scum then people requesting a deadline extension are more likely to be scum, and if he is not scum then the people who failed to request a deadline extension are more likely to be scum.

Does that sound reasonable? He was going to be the deadline lynch, right?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Interesting. CR was actually going to be the deadline lynch until reborn and Yos voted for chenshi. How does this factor in?

[Yosarian2]

Adel: Actually, no, he wouldn't.

Rules
...

10. A lynch will occur at ⁿ/₂ + 1 votes, where n is the number of players currently alive. Day will end with the lynch.
...
12. At a deadline, rule ten will still be in play. If there is not a majority, then nobody will be lynched and night will begin.

If anyone was delibrarly not requesting a deadline extension, they were basically trying to cause a no-lynch instead of a chenshi lynch, if they were trying to do anything at all. So, I'm not really sure that gives the kind of information you're looking for.