Alisae V Pine: Trees Apparently Make Good Treestumps

[Krazy]

I think this was a swingy setup that swung very heavily away from town with certain things (hider, vig, desp -- almost all the strongest power roles missed except the strongman doc)

while I agree the setup is slightly scumsided I think 2 masons + ari + weak hider + strongman doc is a lot of mech town and a reliable way of protecting mech town. Ali did get two separate saves throughout the game which is the only reason there even was another day.

Personally I want to say me winning the 1v1 with mastina was really big but I also don't want to bring it up because mastina wrote like 4 wallposts in the dead thread about it already

[Alisae]

like uh
I feel like if I was an actual player in this game, I would have replaced out if I interacted with LLD that way.
The only reason why I didn't (even though I was offered to) was because I felt obligated to see it through, and I wanted to see it through. I also wanted to use this game to try and test myself and see if I can beat Pine's game. Its kinda like a dream for me to actually be a town treestump in this game. That sort of thing is something I wanted to do for a very long time. Its just something I wanted to do for awhile, I just wish there was just less drama overall.

[Something_Smart]

The fruit mechanic was fine. You folks shouldn't have traded so dearly for the fruit. I was willing to part with them for much less than you gave.

There was nothing wrong with the fruit mechanic, for sure, aside from the cancerous governor fruit. The game really didn't provide players with much of a means to bargain; some of the bargains were interesting but most weren't.

[Krazy]

wait that was theater?

I think? Isn't bussing usually considered theater? Or maybe not?

[Jingle]

Ali you're fucking garbage you suck you're awful you're the worst quack

Get out of my game thread. All blame is to be laid solely at Dannflor's feet.

CURSE YOU DANNFLOR!

[Alisae]

I'm going to stop beating myself up now.
gg i was never scumreading Iconeum.
Thats a bus I would have never identified just from the perspective of it making no logical sense.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fucking Dannflor

[Firebringer]

the bargaining was exceptionally boring.

every bargain was like for a vote. It was like why even have it be called bargain when all pine cared about was taking our votes.

Except for penguin who he just made do gifs but he was his scum ally

[Wooper]

I'm going to stop beating myself up now.

this is the perfect reaction. <3

[Krazy]

There was nothing wrong with the fruit mechanic, for sure, aside from the cancerous governor fruit. The game really didn't provide players with much of a means to bargain; some of the bargains were interesting but most weren't.

I personally didn't really like the 'trick' of the neighbor fruit even as scum, mostly because I think neighbor pts are already toxic and cancerous so making them even more cancerous is just gross

[Alisae]

bastard mechanic
bastard game
luuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuul

[Pine]

Let's not dwell on Day One. It's already hurt too many people.

Ali, I think you did entirely fine in a tough position, and commend you for taking on a Sisyphean task, then nearly pulling it off. On D6, you had correct strong Townreads on Maria and Menalque, and mech clears on nearly everyone save Fire and Gamma, plus scumreads on the entire scumteam minus Iconeum. We thought we were headed for extra innings, which would have given loads of time for the Doc save and flips to swing things against us. This was a LOT closer than it looked.

[Something_Smart]

while I agree the setup is slightly scumsided I think 2 masons + ari + weak hider + strongman doc is a lot of mech town and a reliable way of protecting mech town.

Vig + desp + 2 masons + hider is maybe six mech town in an optimistic scenario, but it's really easy for the scum to figure out the masons, as I said, because the message mechanic and Ali being a doc and knowing the masons encourages the game to devolve into "everyone sheep Ali."

[Pine]

The fruit mechanic was fine. You folks shouldn't have traded so dearly for the fruit. I was willing to part with them for much less than you gave.

There was nothing wrong with the fruit mechanic, for sure, aside from the cancerous governor fruit. The game really didn't provide players with much of a means to bargain; some of the bargains were interesting but most weren't.

I agree; in hindsight, the governor fruit was not great, and frankly giving it to Firebringer was not a good choice for the health of the game.

the bargaining was exceptionally boring.

every bargain was like for a vote. It was like why even have it be called bargain when all pine cared about was taking our votes.

Except for penguin who he just made do gifs but he was his scum ally

Yeah, well, you folks kept giving me whatever I wanted and never offered anything worthwhile. Bargaining is meant to be a two-way street. I'd have sold them for FAR less than you gave, which ought to have been evident from the bargains I made D1.

[Dannflor]

I feel like the message mechanic is somewhat town sided

[Pine]

while I agree the setup is slightly scumsided I think 2 masons + ari + weak hider + strongman doc is a lot of mech town and a reliable way of protecting mech town.

Vig + desp + 2 masons + hider is maybe six mech town in an optimistic scenario, but it's really easy for the scum to figure out the masons, as I said, because the message mechanic and Ali being a doc and knowing the masons encourages the game to devolve into "everyone sheep Ali."

It was easy to figure out the Masons because they didn't bother hiding.

PE: Especially the way Ali abused the hell out of it

[Krazy]

I also think Ali's message ability, if used in certain ways, would have very nearly broken the game. I don't think Ali would have done that and I already talked with Jingle about it a bit but on *paper* this setup might have been theoretically townsided.

[Something_Smart]

I personally didn't really like the 'trick' of the neighbor fruit even as scum, mostly because I think neighbor pts are already toxic and cancerous so making them even more cancerous is just gross

The neighbor trick was one of the best ones, because it was predictable and didn't harm you unless you let it.

That's the reason the governor trick was awful-- because it didn't require the player to actually try to use it to their advantage. In fact given that Pine could give it out unbargained-for, it was basically a free scum governor (since there's pretty much no reason town would ever want to use a governor).

[Alisae]

while I agree the setup is slightly scumsided I think 2 masons + ari + weak hider + strongman doc is a lot of mech town and a reliable way of protecting mech town.

Vig + desp + 2 masons + hider is maybe six mech town in an optimistic scenario, but it's really easy for the scum to figure out the masons, as I said, because the message mechanic and Ali being a doc and knowing the masons encourages the game to devolve into "everyone sheep Ali."

I kind of
did way too much with that message mechanic
then I was supposed to

it was intenteded to be a flavor thing where we make people feel special for playing the invitational (except I never wrote anything for replacements because I wanted to get high and play video games instead of making our guests feel special lul)

it became "hey, lets play telephone where I signal to people and they signal back to me"
I am proud of those signals and would likely use them again
I don't think Pine could identify what they were they were just that good

[Firebringer]

Yeah, well, you folks kept giving me whatever I wanted and never offered anything worthwhile. Bargaining is meant to be a two-way street. I'd have sold them for FAR less than you gave, which ought to have been evident from the bargains I made D1.

theres nothing else to give u besides our vote, what r u talking about.

[Jingle]

I think this was a swingy setup that swung very heavily away from town with certain things (hider, vig, desp -- almost all the strongest power roles missed except the strongman doc)

while I agree the setup is slightly scumsided I think 2 masons + ari + weak hider + strongman doc is a lot of mech town and a reliable way of protecting mech town. Ali did get two separate saves throughout the game which is the only reason there even was another day.

Personally I want to say me winning the 1v1 with mastina was really big but I also don't want to bring it up because mastina wrote like 4 wallposts in the dead thread about it already

^Agree.

The slight scumsidedness was intended to account for the inclusion of players who were just never going to be viable Pine recruits. For example, I don't think Pine ever picks chen or Xof, and while town realized that early on they also dropped it and nearly lynched both of those slots.

The fruit mechanic was fine. You folks shouldn't have traded so dearly for the fruit. I was willing to part with them for much less than you gave.

There was nothing wrong with the fruit mechanic, for sure, aside from the cancerous governor fruit. The game really didn't provide players with much of a means to bargain; some of the bargains were interesting but most weren't.

The bargains were entirely Pine's prerogative. I was frankly baffled that so many people chose to give away so much when really it was designed to ensure you didn't just ignore Pine, as per his request.

I'm going to stop beating myself up now.
gg i was never scumreading Iconeum.
Thats a bus I would have never identified just from the perspective of it making no logical sense.

Ico got townread by not being there when the big shit went down. Therefore, he never got said shit on his shoes. Or at least, that's what I saw.

[Alisae]

I agree; in hindsight, the governor fruit was not great, and frankly giving it to Firebringer was not a good choice for the health of the game.

that fruit doesn't need to exist.

[Something_Smart]

I feel like the message mechanic is somewhat town sided

Absolutely. If I'd been the town treestump the first thing I'd do would be to set up a code so everyone can (a) claim and (b) communicate results confidentially to me.

That said, it's also degenerate as shit, for the same reason.

[PenguinPower]

I feel like the message mechanic is somewhat town sided

lol...I was posting every message that Ali sent me to the scumchat..."Is it a trap?" I think Pine made me paranoid.

[Krazy]

Vig + desp + 2 masons + hider is maybe six mech town in an optimistic scenario,

6 mech town on day 2, if the hider stays alive they can win the game for town tho.