Alisae V Pine: Trees Apparently Make Good Treestumps

[Alisae]

Either way look.
wooper, mena, ss town
Pink Ball I am also saying is town because Pine told me so and I believe him.
and Iconeum is just being pushed by scum

can we lynch quickly and end the game?
I want to get yelled at by literally the whole playerlist now

[Alisae]

and end the game as in
if I lose I want teh game to be over
if I am perfect in my reads, then we should be able to lynch this today and be okay
if I'm one wrong, then I deserve to lose
thats how things are right?

[Alisae]

ok i think im high but I'm explaining this wrong but

I'm betting the game on my reads and I want the game to be over if I'm wrong, so I'm at this point willing to quick lynch.

Gamma at this point is scum and he's not hiding it.
Krazy's cases on Dann was awful and Cephir made a horrible case for Icon so Cephir is also scum
Dann is scum because if he was town he would still put effort into lynching that slot or try as hard as he could to get that slot to be lynched. It wouldn't make him townie, but its just the right thing to do.
Firebringer flip as well as a recently finished game suggests to me that this isn't town!Maria's lategame. She does stuff here. What is she doing right now?
Boom nothing.

[Iconeum]

Ali, you think Menal is town after his D6 play around that Pine deal?

[Alisae]

Yes

[Alisae]

I think Mena has been consistently town throughout most of the game when he's been playing it.

[Iconeum]

Icon's take on Menalque as Pine's deepwolf

It all starts with a Pine bargain, and a push on FB:

Spoiler:

talk to me about fire tho?

What do you think of fb?

Ali you know how fire is also scum
Could we get a joint endorsement maybe?

Do u wanna vote urself then fire

Nobody in game was opposed to this lynch IIRC, so it's pretty safe.
However, the interesting part comes next

UNVOTE:

Menal comes clean about the deal and unvotes FB.

Ali, I did a thing

Explanations yada yada

I think the most worrying thing is that there was obviously no way for pine to stop me outing this even if I did really go for the deal once it got to twilight, which means obviously the most glaring implications need to be taken with a HUGE pinch of salt (namely, dann!scum and fb!town -- if you ask me dann probably is still scum, but I think it may not clear fb necessarily).

But in terms of movements: gamma actually comes out of this okay, I think. He doesn't seem to be that interested. I think it's worrying for icon's vote on fb, and I think, actually, the main concern for me is ducky. I don't think it's at all beyond pine to decide to NK last night in the hopes that the "conf!town" lands on one of the scum, especially if he already thought that ducky had a meaningful chance of being the save. I'm not sure about this, but I do think ducky needs to explain his movement towards fb in solid detail.

This post shades both Wooper and me wrt our voting on FB. Why? Because at this point scum know they can probably get a mislynch on FB, but need another one tomorrow (today). I'm 100% certain in the scum shortlist, but I think scum make this play to open up a possible lynch on Wooper through WIFOM. Menal uses his deepwolf status to do this.

fine w any of {Fireb, Dann, Ico}
think dann is vaguely better for gamestate analysis

think fireb removes a serious threat from the game who has been basically refusing to be readable up to & including xylo and has only started playing urgently now

don't think ico is likely to play harder or become more readable

I just realised fireb is the best lynch today LOL

this post worries me a lot tbh

More shading on Wooper

I agree Wooper is unlikely. But I'd still like him to elaborate more on what it was that made him shift his opinion to fb being the best lynch and how much of that was my case and why. I don't think he should be lynched until lylo, and probably not at all. But if he is in lylo, then I think it's something that needs to be considered as possible.

And now hedging his read on Wooper: 'He's unlikely scum, and he shouldn't be lynched. At least not until LYLO. Like, not lynch at all. Except in LYLO. Maybe'. This is an entire lategame minded post designed to explain his LYLO vote on Wooper.

VOTE: fb

Ends up voting FB anyway, after discrediting both myself and Wooper for switching votes there. You don't do this if you were baiting others into following him onto FB.

-----

I think scum are stuck in a PoE, despite having odds in their favour at this time. Menal is setting up the scum late game by this entire sequence, already justifying a LYLO vote on Wooper without actually going into a scumread at this time.

And also, if Pine offers you a bargain like this, you know something's up. Him coming clean can be town, but you don't end up voting on FB anyway in the end then.

[Alisae]

ok but he's town

[Iconeum]

ok but he's town

VOTE: https://media.tenor.com/images/0e05a372 ... /tenor.gif

[Iconeum]

[Alisae]

I'm sorry I'm not interested in lynching town

[Alisae]

i just want ur vote tbh

[Iconeum]

Like, we can solve this. Scum got a head start on us in the early days which I think is normal for a game this size but we gonna PoE them down now.
For visual aid:

[Alisae]

I solved it Icon

[Alisae]

can you stop making an ass of yourself, you're going to get some towny to throw the game and vote you

[Alisae]

if ur town
put down a mariar vote
if ur scum and mariar is town
put down a mariar vote

[Alisae]

and also say yes to quick nights
I want the game to be over, and so do you

[Alisae]

actually scrap that

Icon, my reads are so good that we can hammertest you

would you like to be hammertested?

[Alisae]

actually
we can hammertest you
but we don't need to

you're town who honestly just doesn't know what the fuck is going on or anything, and is more on the bad side rather on the scum side, and scum have to take use of the bad side to try to mislynch you
like its kind of really obvious to me.

Just vote MariaR and call it a day.

[Alisae]

wait hold on I have an idea.

@Jingle, you know how townies can give Pine their vote when bargaining for fruit? Yeah, is it possible for a townie to give me their vote?

[Wooper]

YO VOTE: MariaR GUESS WHO HASN'T READ DAYSTART

[Wooper]

Either way look.
wooper, mena, ss town
Pink Ball I am also saying is town because Pine told me so and I believe him.
and Iconeum is just being pushed by scum

can we lynch quickly and end the game?
I want to get yelled at by literally the whole playerlist now

agree w core town
also think pb is town, good reasoning

fireb informed flip doesn't really make sense; I think it's more likely clearing of a remaining TPR but I can't really back this with any more logic. idk I just think pb's town these days it looks good on me

not sold on. Icon as town tbh I don't think he's been pushed in a threatening/sketchy way that spews him town

Not sure about dann/krazzy. still think both slots are perfectly liable to be scum lol they've gone back to kinda not interacting I don't think town!dann takes such a fucking bad faith push and just lets it slide bc a noisy player repped into the slot; objectively I'm very surprised he let d6 end without a ceph lynch

Ceph still isn't towny I'm just like ...... less sure ........

Dann is probably scum tho

I still just don't think Maria is playing towny here; outside of you pulling rank on "I can read Maria and this is her damn towngame" I'm not really interested in considering her town unless I see it cased :U PoEish but she's surface scummy but I'm also fine with this being a PoE read

[Wooper]

Cephir made a horrible case for Icon so Cephir is also scum
Dann is scum because if he was town he would still put effort into lynching that slot or try as hard as he could to get that slot to be lynched. It wouldn't make him townie, but its just the right thing to do.
Firebringer flip as well as a recently finished game suggests to me that this isn't town!Maria's lategame. She does stuff here.

oops
yeah
all of this stuff you just said

[Alisae]

I still just don't think Maria is playing towny here; outside of you pulling rank on "I can read Maria and this is her damn towngame" I'm not really interested in considering her town unless I see it cased :U PoEish but she's surface scummy but I'm also fine with this being a PoE read

why does town!mariaR say she doesn't want to repeat the day phase 2 days ago to try and get us to not lynch PP?

[Alisae]

like, wooper, this post is super cringe

i liked ico's first few posts but i think we maybe have a case here of someone who couldn't keep up the townbeams. i am not bothering to annotate the first few posts, which were broadly good.

I don't really see a scum LLD in her ISO. Most of the votes on her seem to come from the fact full commuter is probably a scum claim. But if LLD really is this great 'force of nature', wouldn't she know that claim would hurt her in the long run rather then help? I see a lot of talk and respect towards LLD for being this mastermind-like player, but I don't buy that she would claim something compromising like that, then.

However, letting LLD live now would probably only cause more distraction on D2. It's a good information flip because if this flips town then there's guaranteed scum in the LLD pushers. I can imagine those trees shaking through there roots knowing there's a possible unkilleable LLD out there lol

I think it's pretty noteworthy that ico spends way more effort on defending LLD than, like, the game. it's only a few posts, but it's also the sum total of all the effort he put in at that point.

Yeah no I just don't see LLD as scum. I know i'm far from the best player in this game but i'm here and I stick to my gut now.

Most of the votes on LLD are literally 'you claim commuter? SCUMMMMM'

How easy is it for actual scum to follow that, huh? I bet Pine is laughing his ass off in his little forest right now

ok i haven't read the LLD wagon but i doubt this is an accurate representation of it
last line is scaremongery

IconWhats town about a full unrestricted commuter?And why do you give it to a hot head, who isn’t always super obvtown, doesn’t have the best reads, but is strong when it comes to game sense?Why do you give a super powerscum scum player a full commuter when they’re town? Especially since Jingle is townsiding here.

Ali that's my point! It's not really a towny claim. It's just not. But she claimed it anyway, while far away from being lynched.

LLD. Claimed. A. Role. That. Would. Draw. Attention.

Why would scum!LLD do that?

at the risk of upsetting duckboy:
????????????????

"It's not a towny claim, which makes it a towny claim" is pretty far out there. So is the idea that LLD is scared of attention. And you don't need to know her to think that. Her posts in this game are clearly not from someone who doesn't like the limelight. But hmm, maybe you're the type of scum play who doesn't like attention and that's why you lurk, eh?

Krazy dying is fine I suppose? He's not obv town and the flip gives information. I'm good with it

It's one thing to call it out, but not follow through on this with actions is bad

Krazy dying is fine I suppose? He's not obv town and the flip gives information. I'm good with it

uhhhh I need to reread Maria?

weirdly fencesitty post for her and not a good look especially if Krazy flips town here

I agree with this

Krazy dying is fine I suppose? He's not obv town and the flip gives information. I'm good with it

uhhhh I need to reread Maria?

weirdly fencesitty post for her and not a good look especially if Krazy flips town here

I don't need to make fencesitty posts as scum when I can get out of any read based on that logic. If this is how you feel the correct way to play it would be to wait until after the flip and then ask me.

So, why does scum me fence sit here? Because to me this feels setupish

Not if ur not voting there. You are saying x-flip is good and will provide information but you take no action to further what you are saying. And the first person who calls you out on this you instantly call 'setupish'. Overdefensive.

"overdefensive" is always a fun scum tack. i don't use the textbook often, but i think that one's fairly well documented

Firebringer if I get lynched and I ask you to please not govern would you not govern because I'm town and I asked?

This feels fake. Presenting yourself as a self-sacrifice without being at risk yet is easy.

This is the one I saw in the dann iso. This is a very poor representation of what pops posted. Like, insultingly bad. But it's a stretch to create a case, I think, because the whole case is steaming ass.

VOTE: the worst

"I'm not townreading pops" grossed me out a bit

Weaksauce. This vote came right after Ali called out to lynch the worst, too.

All of the wagons approved by Fire are on high contention reads.

I think we should just ignore the governor, and if Fire uses it we just lynch him the next day.

Fire regularly plays against win condition. That is just how he plays. I would be more likely to invite him to a birthday party than a game of mafia, I'll say that. No matter how much you hate it, it's not scum indicative for him to scumside. You have to figure out other ways to read him, like the actual flavor of his antics, in this case I think scum!fire would give a narrower pool of allowed lynches, this fire doesn't seem to know people's role pms. Threatening to lynch him will do nothing whatsoever to disincentivize his use of the governor as either alignment. Actually if he didn't use the governor it'd probably be better to lynch him.
Fire killed himself as mafia in a game of dance mafia once. He'll do anything.
Sometimes, possibly usually, you can't afford an extra mislynch just to punish bad behavior. I either won SC legacy of the void mafia or won it ahead of schedule because I convinced the town not to lynch a townie who had fake an innocent result on an unconfirmed player who turned out to be scum. That's absolutely disgusting play that "deserves" three lynches but it wasn't to my wincon to mislynch a townie for vindication.

mother of shades?

chennisden is not only not meeting his own hyperpost meta (he probably is, it's just in the PT, I know from Undertale Mafia he loves having a PT), the quality of his posts is way lower. This is not town chennis.

VOTE: chennisden

I don't know where the non-vanity wagons are right now


chennisden shouldn't be a vanity wagon though.

Literally all over the place, hoping one of these wagons draws enough attention away from him is how I read all of this.

VOTE: pops

this case sucks. this case is why people say cases are scummy. it's like, whole cloth fabrication of a read from innocuous posts.

okay before i *try* to answer that, I can shoot this back at you

why does scum!dragon, who had a townread on you and was not active enough to deserve a townread himself this game, come out of the gates D4 'to hop on worst wagon'.
There are alternatives, hell there's even no need for scum to be on a wagon right now or any day soon. Do you think I didn't realize what I could bring upon myself by posting that?

what is my scum motivation in doing so?

i'm gonna get myself in trouble here because i use the "what's my scum motivation" line as both but i think it's commonly a scum line from people who aren't me
heres a big secret about mafia: sometimes scum post things for no reason

name a thing chennisden did.

posted and squirmed a lot

name a thing spyconeum did that's towny

VOTE: mastina

I think he's tryna post stuff which looks good > is good

his push on me early this phase was intensely bad faithy and he kinda weaseled out of going into any kind of depth about his read/progression

i did full disclosure tho :s

okay so this post gave me a wtf, but...

name a thing chennisden did.

posted and squirmed a lot

name a thing spyconeum did that's towny

VOTE: mastina

Could you explaint he difference between this and a naked vote?

The one push that I felt comfortable with and attempted blew up in my face
I got a message with a vote suggestion
This is fine

this makes it a lot better. i like this post a fair amount, actually. maybe he predicted that he was going to get called out for his weird vote and planned to only out that he was asked to at that time in order to look town, but i consider this a point in favor of ico.

Spoiler:

Also was I told to watch Elsa because she was a mason or what

Yeah avtually one sec, that actually seems meaningful

Okay so it seems Elsa's kill flavor differs from Nacho's somewhay so I doubt any commonality in those kills. Also

Funny how people keep trusting things that come from scum.

Yeah I think had I read the day first my question would have been meaningless. There's no way Pine is operating for any good here, and though I distrusted Alisae for a moment I refuse to believe both stumps would be scum. Now I'm very curious about what drawbacks other fruits incur if those have such grave consequences.

The four names were SS, Krazy, Iconeum and pops.

Also if this is true we have a 50/50 between Krazy and Ico
I need to check something now

Lady Lambdadelta (13): the worst, Katsuki, Krazy, Formerfish, MariaR,

Titus, Jjh927

,

Gamma Emerald

,

GreyICE

, Firebringer, Dannflor,

ankamius, popsofctown

If this is a bus what spots did scum take on it? It seems the back is rather clear of scum, so they seem to be theoretically frontloaded.

Alright then, who are all the people who voted LLD? Whilst I do want to make a difference I need to avoid expending time on outsourcable tasks

A lot more effort to sort, and genuine feeling in this.

idk what this is in response to, but i cannot for the life of me find "genuine feeling" in any of these gamma posts.

what does scum!kats have to gain from that claim?

placeholder for ico's obsession with kats claim- he spends a remarkable amount of energy (compared to his overall low energy for the game) on this without ever pushing more than mildly for kats to be lynched. not a fan

I think pp's claim would fit a scumteam. FB seems content with the current gamestate and is posting to just be here?

Not the best cases or anything, but it's what I think. All based on my readthrough from today.

fb this is like the only mention of PP i saw what are you talking about.

@ what's left of Pine's scumteam: I can feel you circling around me, looking at me like i'm a mislynch. Let me tell you right here and now that's not gonna happen

talking a big talk is easy friend but when you gonna show up?