Alisae V Pine: Trees Apparently Make Good Treestumps

[Iconeum]

I don't really recall any particular towny or scummy stuff about him, other then his D6 interactions with Pine that feel over the top

[Dunnstral]

Ask anyone whether a fruit, once spoiled, can become unspoiled, and they'll tell you no, because that's part of our understanding of what it means for fruit to spoil. Pine knows this, and he chose his wording to produce that interpretation. If the fruit can unspoil, he lied, plain and simple.

My fruit is spoiled and unusable

[Dunnstral]

I think we're mostly at that point besides Mena but he should be waking up soon so we can talk more when he gets here

Well what do you want to talk about

I don't think he's scum because I've seen him as scum and this game doesn't feel like that

[Dunnstral]

I'm leaning more towards Dann being scum than not now

[Dunnstral]

pretty sure Ico doesn't make sense as scum with Fire since I'm pretty sure Ico is being suggested as a mislynch but scum

Who was suggesting Ico lynch besides me?

[Dunnstral]

I want to figure out Gamma Emerald's alignment

[Wooper]

i wish gamma had discernibly alignment told. he hasn't...like, done anything of much substance in such a long time and it's super frustrating.

this feels weird but looking back at krazy's posting previous to lylo i actually can kinda jam with a townread of him. i just think it's super vexing i asked ico to towncase three townreads, he presented to heavily towncase the one i was the last interested in, then give really sketchy summary reads on the ones i'm actually worried ico could be scum with.

ico's krazy case also feels closer to tmi than scum defending scum (probably closer to t!ico/s!krazy than s/s), like he's intentionally just casually hopped over the bits of krazy's and ceph's posting which had me worried and done the

he's just town duuuuuddddeeee

argument

someone please bounce this back to me - i think ico is actually scum here

[Wooper]

i kinda wish fireb had done something other than just casually shade ico tho because all i feel now is there's 1-2 scum in them which is how i felt before hand >:C

[Iconeum]

wooper you go and bring the worst in here - he can actually read me

casually hopping over what you think is scummy is a meh argument, I clearly gave you my thoughts behind the townread of what I think is important (Krazy). I asked you to present me the bits you wanna discuss if you feel the way you do.

Again, me 'hopping over' what has you worried is me not reading what you are reading there

[Iconeum]

At least I'm glad you are also seeing town there and that ur not adamant on him being scum

[Something_Smart]

i don't believe in meta-cleared tho

Well, it exists.

[Gamma Emerald]

It spoils immediately when the Town:scum ratio reaches (x+2):x." is objectively true.

I cannot specify what 'spoils' means in the context of this game.

There's only one thing it could reasonably mean.

I contend that if the fruit is usable now, he has stated something that he expected to be interpreted in a way that is incorrect, which is a lie, since lying is about intent and not about a literal correspondence between the words and the world (which doesn't exist anyway).

Ask anyone whether a fruit, once spoiled, can become unspoiled, and they'll tell you no, because that's part of our understanding of what it means for fruit to spoil. Pine knows this, and he chose his wording to produce that interpretation. If the fruit can unspoil, he lied, plain and simple.

Moon logic of the highest caliber

LOL no
That's fairly sensible

[Wooper]

i don't believe in meta-cleared tho

Well, it exists.

they said this til creature won a huge high profile game on MU

[Wooper]

as scum**

[Gamma Emerald]

Dunn didn't use the fruit

Well, no one wins, no one lose, that's ok. I thought your masterplan was protecting him, I was so excited

I am weirded out by your wording because thats the exact same wording I used when I was talking to Pine during the night phase.

I did note the typo, was that there in your message to/from Pinr?

[Gamma Emerald]

Any statement including an objective falsehood, with the exception of lies of omission (which are explicitly allowed by the OP).

For example, I can't verify the truth of "You don't have to worry about fruit X anymore" because I don't know if worrying about any fruit will have a net positive or negative effect on the town. I can't verify statements like "I never felt like using it" because I don't know Pine's inner thoughts and he COULD be telling the truth. If Pine were to say "The Governor fruit will give the ability to speak perfect Mandarin IRL" I could then give the exact wording of the Governor fruit's abilities as described in the scum PT, as that is an untrue statement. (I hope no one considers confirming that Pine's fruit can't magically affect you IRL a modslip.) I can specify a statement is true or unverifiable, and the statement that the fruit spoils under the specified conditions is both verifiable and objectively true.

Until or unless he does lie, I can't give out any information about the fruit and their abilities.

I don’t know if this is redundant, but based on this getting an answer out of Pine is the best way to check if spoiling means what we think

[Gamma Emerald]

I think me being a doctor is cool but probably super toxic, but something Pine should be able to play around, he's just a good player.
I think Pine being able to give out fruit is fine. I think the fact this is being turned into a bastard mechanic kind of just makes the game unfun.

Idk about unfun, yeah some of it seems cruel but know that we know, it's something to play around. That's why mods post whether bastard elements may be involved when queueing, so it's present in the players' minds.

[Gamma Emerald]

If pine gives a cop but it gives opposite of expected results then it’s bastard

But if it just gives you no result on most players or doesn’t ever give results it isn’t bastard

Yeah, cos that's not a side effect: that's a change of the main effect

[Gamma Emerald]

Today’s first fruit will grant the consumer a 1-shot ability, able to activate at any time, to become Informed. They will have a significant aspect of the setup revealed to them.

This shot must be used before the next daystart after it is received.

This is the image associated with the fruit:

You may begin bargaining now...

This is received at the end of this day right

[Something_Smart]

they said this til creature won a huge high profile game on MU

I mean Creature is a bad example because his meta of not trying as scum was mostly voluntary.

[Gamma Emerald]

there's obviously a mechanic which is keeping him handing out fruit
he didn't hand out the rolecop fruit yday

Ummm what
I don't think the rolecop fruit was necessarily not handed out, it could have gone to one of his team. However I think with the fact there was mass claim having a rolecop fruit wouldn't prove very useful outside of fringe cases. So you

might

be right. But I think you're kinda off base still.

[Gamma Emerald]

in fact, why even read his posts, other than for possible humor value?

Spew/antispew? It's actually pretty relevant to the game?
Why do you think it's so foolish to read what Pine says?

[Gamma Emerald]

Nothing ceph has posted over the last few pages makes me forget what Krazy was doing, no. It's a replace in into far late game, of course he will look townie by saying things like "does the scumteam has daychat"; that slot is doomed for me far before he replaced in and I'm not reevaluating at this point.

Ok enough with the dramatism. Yeah I've liked some of his posts but if it's not him it's Maria and I don't think it's Maria so...

I'mean trying to read it on it's on merits whilst weighing that against what Krazy did. So rn I'mean mostly liking what Cephrir brings, but his approach to dealing with Pine is ehhhh which tips the scales negatively.

[Something_Smart]

In what world does Cephrir not give his honest opinion on whether it's a good idea to listen to Pine?

[Gamma Emerald]

mariar/menaphos
^ strong town via meta

Talk about these, especially Maria