Open 80 - Double Day Mafia (Game Over!)

[SpyreX]

Good lord, I check in to see THIS happened.

I still have a small FoS on killa, but having played a game with him I could see his explanation as him doing that as town.

I dont like this play as town or scum - I think its a given that, although probably not the first lynch, there are enough questions about forbid's alignment that we're going to have to lynch before lylo. I, personally, lean slightly towards town but it IS such a great scum gambit that its hard not to keep that in mind.

I need to do a reread soon - I've got a funny vibe from someone else but until I figure out why I dont want to derail the discussion.

AAAND BACK

dcorbe - 2 (Gimbo, Joubert)
LaptopGun - 2 (armlx, Bogre)
killa seven - 2 (CF Riot, forbiddanlight)
forbiddanlight - 1 (killa seven)
Gimbo - 1 (dcorbe)
armlx - 1 (Manito)
Joubert - 1 (ShadowGirl)

Not Voting - Lquiz, Voodo, SpyreX, Corinthian, Firestarter, LaptopGun

16 alive, 9 to lynch.

-Mod

[Bogre]

I soft claimed? Actually, no, I wasn't implying I had a role at all. Since it was clearly a colossal failure I'll explain my reasoning. I wanted to test a tactic. Vote myself under the pretense of giving up, and see if any scum took the bait of. It backfired, causing people to think I was more town but frustrated, stupid, misguided, or all of the above. However, my little experiment did reveal a few interesting facts about killa seven. I think an

FoS Killa Seven

is a good idea here. He definitely gave a more scummy read than the rest of you in response to what I did. I apologize for not continuing the tatic longer, but it didn't seem to be getting anywhere.

This actually makes me feel pretty sketchy about you.

Truth. Now you try and make an excuse for poor play? That is anti-town. Townies accept their mistakes and move on, not try and lie to come up with reasons. I -seriously- doubt you were self-voting as a tactic.

[Firestarter]

Firestarter who does deserve a FoS from you? Recapping what's gone on, I noticed you have only 4 posts, one being a joke vote. I don't agree with your theory on reads in the random phase, but that post really didn't have much significance either. That was some major action for day one going on between K7 and FL, and you don't have a vote OR a FoS?

FoS Firestarter

And unless Im mistaken, you have 8 posts, so....

I wont be pressured into throwing Fos's around, nor votes at this stage by you or anyone.
I will however, vote/fos when my suspicions heighten.
At this stage I prefer to see how this exchange draws out.

Yes, you could argue that both players in the recent episode were acting scummy in certain degrees, but acting scummy does not entirely add up to "being scum".
____________________________________________________________
Your post fos'ing me, however, makes interesting reading...
Do you get the scent of townie blood up for a D1 lynch???

The more conversation on D1 the better for town, theres no need to rush through a lynch CFR....

[armlx]

I wont be pressured into throwing Fos's around, nor votes at this stage by you or anyone.

You think your vote is much more dangerous then it actually is. You should change this.

[Firestarter]

Maybe I should, but the only way I can do that is to vote someone, and if Im to vote someone for the sake of voting someone, then I need to explain it....
I dont currently have an explanation for voting anyone, as the only exchange of note has been between K7 & FL, and Ive given my thoughts on that.

However, CF7 has heightened my suspicion somewhat with his nonsense pressure fos.

Not worthy of a vote at this junction, but certianly a

FoS: CF7

[forbiddanlight]

I soft claimed? Actually, no, I wasn't implying I had a role at all. Since it was clearly a colossal failure I'll explain my reasoning. I wanted to test a tactic. Vote myself under the pretense of giving up, and see if any scum took the bait of. It backfired, causing people to think I was more town but frustrated, stupid, misguided, or all of the above. However, my little experiment did reveal a few interesting facts about killa seven. I think an

FoS Killa Seven

is a good idea here. He definitely gave a more scummy read than the rest of you in response to what I did. I apologize for not continuing the tatic longer, but it didn't seem to be getting anywhere.

This actually makes me feel pretty sketchy about you.

Truth. Now you try and make an excuse for poor play? That is anti-town. Townies accept their mistakes and move on, not try and lie to come up with reasons. I -seriously- doubt you were self-voting as a tactic.

Well, doubt what you will. I'm sticking by it cause it's true. That was my intent in doing that, and it failed. I'm not going to lie about that part, since there is no point. The only point in lying about why I was self voting when I actually did it was to execute the plan. I mean, the only thing you have is my word, and in this game you don't trust anyone's words (except your scumbuddies if you have them). So, it's immaterial whether you doubt if I had an actual plan or not. I know that that was my plan, and I'm sticking to it with my vote on Killa seven for pushing my action.

[killa seven]

lol i figured youd cop out and say, "i was baiting scum" ive seen this done before, your not fooling me. dont play the poor me im under pressure, vote = myself i dont want to play anymore then try to turn me into scum for voting a quiter who cant handle pressure.

[forbiddanlight]

Tell me, have you ever heard of a series called Spies?

[killa seven]

nah, ive heard of "the mole"

[forbiddanlight]

Spies was a very intensive version of mafia, having gone through 5 seasons. I participated in the fifth. To boot, I was scum. Now, you want pressure? Try handling not one thread, but a FORUM dedicated to this game, special AIM names specifically for the game (to prevent meta reads and such. Everyone goes in fresh), and basically and order to run wild? Lynch/Night Kill cycles of approximately 5 days, with 33 players in this case (though a couple special events prevented this from taking forever, such as a rapidfire lynching round that had 5 lynches all told), constant involvement due to the AIM factor, and more information to process then is really humanly possible. Add this to the fact that the spies (the mafia) were put into groups that didn't know each other and slowly met each other as the game went on, finally meeting everyone by the 6th lynch/NK cycle. Now, I handled that pressure, though I did die rather early because of a few mistakes I made (it was my first time being scum), but even if death I was strategizing. I am not a quitter, nor easily given to pressure. I realize that much of this post is probably unnecessary, and people will say I'm posting just to post, but I am PERSONALLY insulted when you say I am a quitter unable to handle pressure.

Addressing the actual meat of how I'm supposedly lying about me coming up with this plan, I'm not, to put it simply. I actually thought I was being clever, and am now being informed I wasn't. My mistake. My vote still stands because it wouldn't surprise me if you did accidentally or intentionally fall into the trap. If the people want a lynch em both, I'm willing to settle for that, since there is a high liklihood one of us is scum.

[Manito]

I soft claimed? Actually, no, I wasn't implying I had a role at all. Since it was clearly a colossal failure I'll explain my reasoning. I wanted to test a tactic. Vote myself under the pretense of giving up, and see if any scum took the bait of. It backfired, causing people to think I was more town but frustrated, stupid, misguided, or all of the above. However, my little experiment did reveal a few interesting facts about killa seven. I think an

FoS Killa Seven

is a good idea here. He definitely gave a more scummy read than the rest of you in response to what I did. I apologize for not continuing the tatic longer, but it didn't seem to be getting anywhere.

This actually makes me feel pretty sketchy about you.

Truth. Now you try and make an excuse for poor play? That is anti-town. Townies accept their mistakes and move on, not try and lie to come up with reasons. I -seriously- doubt you were self-voting as a tactic.

I couldn't agree more with this post. They are both fishy as hell...

[SpyreX]

However, CF7 has heightened my suspicion somewhat with his nonsense pressure fos.

Not worthy of a vote at this junction, but certianly a FoS: CF7

This reeks of OMGUS, but even worse, not even committal enough to actually place a vote.

Addressing the actual meat of how I'm supposedly lying about me coming up with this plan, I'm not, to put it simply. I actually thought I was being clever, and am now being informed I wasn't. My mistake. My vote still stands because it wouldn't surprise me if you did accidentally or intentionally fall into the trap. If the people want a lynch em both, I'm willing to settle for that, since there is a high liklihood one of us is scum.

Here's my problem with this whole approach. I was really tempted to vote for you. I still am. I would be surprised if I was the only one - in fact, I'll bet there was damn near enough to get you lynched for it. Does that mean we're all scum? Of course not.

Just because killer jumped the trigger does NOT mean he's scum (of course I'm not saying he's town). You did a very questionable manuver that makes almost 0 sense as town (why self-sacrifice, especially in a bandwagon both town and scum will jump on). The only problem I have is it also makes little sense as scum (why jump into the spotlight on day 1 in such a fashion that you're insuring your lynch in the near future).

If you had pulled this on day 2 or 3 I'd have hung you in an instant. Day 1... god, I have no idea. The more I read part of me thinks your BOTH town and your suggestion of lynching one to show the other is scum would end up with day 1 having 3 dead (two lynched and the scumkill).

All the talk about Spies doesn't really do anything except cloud the issue at hand. It IS posting just to post.

Tonight I'm doing a reread.

[forbiddanlight]

Please do. And I knew people would argue that. I was just pissed at being told I am a quitter. I got emotional, it happens. I honestly think that you are too quick to think both of us are town. I personally believe one of us is scum, and that's where my vote stands, since I know my alignment.

[Gimbo]

I personally believe one of us is scum

You should've written "personally I feel like he is scum since I am town"

What you wrote sounds to me like you don't even know your own Role, have you frequented Mafia Discussion lately and saw my thread "Strategy -> Not Reading Your Role PM" ?

-__- *eyeing you suspiciously*

[forbiddanlight]

I've asserted I'm town several times. I was rather under the impression no matter what I said someone would make a case for it. Null tell. Nice try though.

[Gimbo]

^ you tried to pull a noob-tell on us right from the start, so YOU nice try

[forbiddanlight]

I actually did state I've played mafia before around here somewhere, just not mafia here, which is slightly different.

[armlx]

I've asserted I'm town several times

Irrel. Worth nothing as its just an appeal to emotion.

[SpyreX]

I personally believe one of us is scum, and that's where my vote stands, since I know my alignment.

Again... I find myself agreeing with Gimbo. The wording on this seems very off.

Honestly, your case to me isn't that strong on K7 actually BEING scum. Is it possible? Yes but not with the certainty inherent in that post (I believe one of us is scum, if you lynch him and he's not... then I am scum).

However, the way you are pushing it (ready for the tinfoil hat) is like you KNOW he is scum for sure. Which...could only happen if you are scum yourself.

I dont like this at all.

[CF Riot]

Hahaha, didn't something similar to this happen to you recently Spyre? Sounds like you vs. Battle Mage, only with less commitment on FL's part.

Okay at first I was leaning towards dumb plan by FL making him look scummy, but the more he posts he just sinks further and further. Consequently, that sort of makes me less confident about voting K7, although I still think his posts were very scummy, enough so to keep my vote for now.

Firestarter did you call me CF7?

[Firestarter]

Firestarter did you call me CF7?

Thats correct, I did, a typo on my behalf...

..for clarification,

FoS

CFR

[SpyreX]

CF -

Yes, this is similar to what happened with me and BM. The big difference is that we were at 6 left and, by process of elimination, one of us HAD to be the scum (or it really didn't make sense).

This gambit is out of the gate and, really, with no one cleared or clearable making the statement one of us IS scum really bothers me.

[somestrangeflea]

Hey y'all, I'm back. Votecounts have been edited at the top of each page, and Joubert has been prodded.

[Joubert]

Sorry folks, lots of RL stuff, but I'm still good to go. A few comments from where I left off...

This is true. Those that attack people for things that are going on during the random voting phase are therefore making baseless attacks

That's basically true, but we need something to happen eventually, and attacking someone leads to that. The random stage serves this purpose as well...

lol K7 & SyreX, thanks for the ... compliment? ... hahahahaa
you know i could be helpful sometimes, lol

Looks like a ywllowish laugh, don't like that...

Yep. Take it or leave it. In hindsight my thoughts were not the most intelligent things to say, but they for a bit were invoking questioning. If all we do is chat about how long it's been since the last post or "All hail Gimbo our fearless leader," I have a hard time believing we are going to find many of the mafia.

This comment that early in the game, guuah, looks strange. Like the guy who sighs at the mountain of work in front of him...

People for better or for worse are making a big deal about random voting, including myself. However in my opinion, there is no coloration between what they say and if they are acting pro town or pro mafia.

Did you say that to be sure you will blend in the mix?

I think the people voting for me are town as they are pointing out flaws in my reasoning. This doesn't seem like the mafia begging for a mislynch.

Are you that insecure about your position or role?

SpyreX is coming off as the voice of reason. Seems to have exactly right thing to say about all the crazy.

I'd say he looks crazy more than anyone else doing that, because everyone's MEANT to be a little weird in the preliminary stages. Shortly after, SpyreX answers all the points, although they weren't meant to be answered. Strange... Possible connection between those two?

yea well if you are town, you might wanna stop doing that, this is the kind of things that causes mislynches on D1s

What? If a mislynch happens upon such mild commenting, it's pretty much sure the commenter is not at fault. Quite obvious. Digging air, here...

God, I hate feeling like a parrot, but forbid that looks REALLY bad.

Tsk, tsk... Now it looks like you are taking dirt from your own pockets and throwing it in all directions. Cheap behavior...

a town should NEVER be fine dying, NEVER, we play to win and find scum and self-voting unprovoked is extremely scummy.

I beg to differ. A Townie can certainly be killed (call it a "sacrifice") in order to uncover Scum. It becomes a beneficial "investment", if you excuse the methaphor...

i think forbiddanlight doesn't understand that this is a game where you cheat, lie, backstab to WIN and that you don't have to be civil and thank people, you manipulate and take advantage, that's the game, haha

Ooh? You seem to know a LOT about cheating, lying, backstabbing. I don't like you!

And yes, I know that a fool is a person who's goal in the game is to get lynched, and thusly win.

She was probably referring to the Jester...

However, CF7 has heightened my suspicion somewhat with his nonsense pressure fos.
Not worthy of a vote at this junction, but certianly a FoS: CF7

A FoS for FoSing someone? It's far fetched...

lol i figured youd cop out and say, "i was baiting scum" ive seen this done before, your not fooling me. dont play the poor me im under pressure, vote = myself i dont want to play anymore then try to turn me into scum for voting a quiter who cant handle pressure.

The argument is justifiable, but weren't you doing the same with your vote? Let's admit it, it really was 50/50 in terms of intentions and effect. Your vote had a relatively desirable effect, by making people readjust their positions, yet you did vote, and votes are used to lead to lynching, sooner or later...

A question to forbiddanlight: why do you have to over confirm your experience or reactions to the recent "attacks" that much? Such insecurity is fichy, unless you're very near a lynch, which is not the case...

This reeks of OMGUS, but even worse, not even committal enough to actually place a vote.

Is OMGUS supposed to be considered a scum-tell?

Other question for forbiddanlight: you did vote Killa Seven for his recent vote on you (I presume, feel free to add precisions to the heap), but did you have any vote intention BEFORE this happened? Because if you had NOONE in mind before this "incident", then how can we be sure you're not simply capitalizing on the event to suspect someone?

Unvote

[forbiddanlight]

As for the first question, it was me getting emotional, because I'm under a bit of RL stress, and tend to be moody sometimes, and dislike being told I'm a quitter who cracks under pressure. As for your other question, my only vote intention was inactives because that's usually how I played D1 in other games. After that, I took a step back, looked at the game, kinda didn't feel anything that stuck out, so tried to MAKE something that stuck out to see what results I got. I'm not OMGUSing K7, I actually think he might be scum and actually fell into my trap, and is trying to play it off. I SUPPOSE it might be possible he's overzealous town, but intuitively, I don't like it. I REALLY don't like it, hence my vote. And yeah, I knew she was referring to the jester, which would make sense if my goal were to get lynched to vote myself and try to seem scummy. But that's not the case, I'm just not having a good D1 .