Tripped And Fell (Spoiled Dead Thread)

[mastina]

MAFIA
Mafia Dancemaster (redtea): Has read-only access to every private topic; knows there is a town dancemaster (but not their identity), knows the town dancemaster doesn't know of a mafia dancemaster existing; once in game, can permanently close down one Dance private topic.
Mafia Klutz (NicoRobin/Slaxx): During night, can roleblock one player. Once in the game, can reject a Dance offer without initiating a gladiate by bolding "I'm too clumsy", but after doing so, roleblock power is forfeit
Mafia Goon (EeveeLution Army)

TOWN
Town Dancemaster (TheGoldenParadox): Has read-only access to every private topic; once in game, can permanently close down one Dance private topic.
Town Dueler (mcqueen): Once in game, can force partner to reject the dance, initiating a gladiate, by bolding "In a duel"
Town Romantic (Eragon): Twice in game, can force partner to accept the Dance, by bolding "We're soulmates", OR, Once in game, lovers effect of Dancing is made permanent, by bolding "Forever" (they can still reject this, and if rejecting, power is lost forever); cannot use both, so using one locks out the other
Town Bladancer (Moment): Twice in game, during night, can kill someone who has never had a dance partner on any day (dance partners = accepted a dance offer, or had an offer to dance accepted; rejected dances/gladiates don't count as partnering up, thus, those who reject or are rejected are eligible for this kill); kill is "died in flurry of blades".
Matchmaker (Kokichi Oma): Can cause players who aren't paired up to have all actions targeting one target both; targets are informed of this (but not who matchmaker is) on daystart; knows of success; may self-target if having performed action successfully.
VT x 5 (CheekyTeeky/Vedith, AP, Aronis, DoubtingThomas, Darkwing Duck)

Roles, by Playerlist

:

NicoRobin/Slaxx - Mafia Klutz
CheekyTeeky/Vedith - Vanilla Townie
Kokichi Oma - Town Matchmaker
Moment - Town Bladancer
AP - Vanilla Townie
EeveeLution Army - Mafia Goon
TheGoldenParadox - Town Dancemaster
redtea - Mafia Dancemaster
Aronis - Vanilla Townie
DoubtingThomas - Vanilla Townie
mcqueen - Town Dueler
Eragon - Town Romantic
Darkwing Duck - Vanilla Townie

Spoiler: List of users with access

• mastina (mod)
  
• BulletNLynchproof (co-mod)
  
• TheGoldenParadox
  
• Aronis
  
• Kokichi Oma

[mastina]

TFW Town lynched their best PR on D1.

[mastina]

And

TheGoldenParadox

gets to cry now.

[mastina]

As it stands right now, it's as bad as it gets: the 2x vig is set to kill the town's other strong role, the matchmaker. (The matchmaker, mind you, can cause scum to inadvertently shoot themselves.)
Kokichi hasn't submitted an action even though he should; the scum are considering killing Eragon for having softclaimed.

Which would leave the majority of the town power dead before D2.

[BNL]

TFW Town lynched their best PR on D1.

Why is that theor best PR, as opposed to the Vig?

[mastina]

TFW Town lynched their best PR on D1.

Why is that theor best PR, as opposed to the Vig?

The vig can only vig people who have never been paired up at all any time in the game--in the game where the central mechanic revolves around pairing up. (Also, has only two shots, so.)

Admittedly, I designed the game to work off the assumption we'd be having a few pairs per day, butstill.

[TheGoldenParadox]

TFW Town lynched their best PR on D1.

After said PR claimed. Mind blown.

[mastina]

To be fair.
You did derp-gladiate.

But I specifically emphasized as strongly as possible to people, "hey so just so you guys know...because of derp gladiates? No lynching this game's not a bad idea".

[mastina]

So the good news is.
Moment is no longer killing the town's strongest remaining PR.

The bad news is.
Moment is now killing the mafia's nightkill.
(They have different kill flavors and policy is for both to show, so it'll still be known to be two different deaths, butstill. If you're killing the person the scum kill as a vig. Ur doing it rong. )

[BNL]

Something that I discussed with mastina is that you could've chosen to leave the request hanging instead of forcing a 1v1, even if you didn't want to dance

[mastina]

Night One Actions

:

Moment

flurry of blades

(kills)

Kokichi Oma

Vedith

(Vedith dies)

Kokichi Oma

matches

(pairs)

Moment

and

mcqueen

(Moment is informed of the pair with mcqueen; mcqueen is informed of the pair with Moment)

EeveeLution Army

shoots

Vedith

(Vedith dies)

Slaxx

roleblocks

Eragon

[mastina]

It's kinda disheartening to see

two

of the town PRs (admittedly their less valuable two) basically claiming to the scum, via being partnered to them--ensuring that even if scum die, town still pays the price...while also reducing the chance scum will die since the town when roleclaiming reduce their chances of being lynched.

[mastina]

This setup actually doesn’t feel scumsided from this angle. The two lynches are brutal and the mechanic with volunteering to pair is very informative.

For the record, almost responded to this in the mafia PT but decided better of it on the grounds that it could be seen as mod interference, so I'll make a note of it for him to see later, instead.

The

setup

is scumsided. The mechanic was not factored into the town/scum EV of the setup in terms of townsidedness/scumsidedness. By that, I mean, the mechanic was treated as net-neutral. Between Blitz deadlines (which some people SWEAR to as being pro-town), plurality lynches (to ensure the town only no-lynched when choosing to, meaning they don't waste days), and the dance mechanic, it was my hope that these things would serve to counter the scumsidedness of the setup. It was my hope that the mechanics would serve as a balancing factor, to make the setup be more even, more fair.

But I advertised the setup as scumsided because I felt the idea of relying on mechanics as a balancing factor would be unfair on the players--there was simply no way to guarantee that the mechanics were pro-town, and every mechanic I mentioned could just as easily backfire on the town. They can and did plurality lynch a PR; the Blitz deadlines limits time to talk; they can get two town players killed at once, etc.

So he's actually kinda right, in a way. The setup is scumsided, but with proper utilization of mechanics, the game is not. I just felt that calling the game loosely balanced because of mechanics in an otherwise scumsided setup wasn't a fair call to make. Especially not given the swingy-as-fuck nature of said mechanics. The roles for this game are fairly low-swing, and what little swing IS involved mostly favors the scum. The mechanics for this game are some of the most swingy I've ever invented, and I felt uncomfortable saying that they favored the town.

Also, he's assuming the vig is unlimited shot when it's not.
It was originally envisioned as one-shot, fully blockable by the klutz, and the matchmaker which could lead to town synergizing wasn't present as a role. I twice-buffed the town from the original iteration of the setup, from stupendously-scumsided to only about 60-65% scum winrate scumsided. (That's my loose EV for the scum in this setup. Prior to the changes, I'd rate scum EV in the 80-90% range; with the changes, it's at a more reasonable level, but still undeniably scumsided.)

[mastina]

And

Aronis

has access now.

[Aronis]

this is why i don't play mafia...

labrat, kokichi, mcqueen are scum??? can I have spoilers please?

[mastina]

COULD be worse.

You could've named the team as Eragon/Kokichi/mcqueen.

[mastina]

Btw incidentally, one of the interactions I prepared but didn't want to actually see happening, is probably going to happen.
mcqueen's preparing to force a duel with Slaxx...the one and only player capable of countering the power. The interaction was hashed out in the mod thread so we know how to resolve it, but it's still an ugly interaction that I was hoping wouldn't really crop up due to its ugliness.

Basically, it requires an incredibly on-top-of-the-ball moderator, and I'm probably not going to be around a desktop long enough to deliver.

[mastina]

(Basically, normally, mcqueen's power would automatically and immediately initiate a duel. That won't happen when challenging the Klutz; there's a maximum 12-hour delay, where the Klutz can choose to accept or decline the challenge. It's logical, it makes sense, it has reason to it, but it's still not the prettiest of events to unfold and there may be some complaints from the town when they see it. I was hoping that would remain only a hypothetical, because towns don't complain about hypotheticals that much; they tend to only complain about what really happened, even if there was a potential hypothetical worthy of complaint.)

[mastina]

So the mafia are planning on killing Moment.
Moment is shooting Kokichi Oma.
Kokichi Oma is matchmaking himself with Eragon.

Total wipeout of town PRs go team go?

[BNL]

Oops

[mastina]

Well the good news is, that scenario won't be happening; the bad news is, it's because that mod error almost slipped through unnoticed.
Eragon's currently paired with EeveeLution Army; Kokichi Oma can't target anyone who is currently paired up, so that's Eragon, EeveeLution Army, Slaxx, and mcqueen.

So Eragon and mcqueen live!

[mastina]

Oof.
So Kokichi did change his action.
Good news, we won't have three dead scum.
Bad news, we will have both town mutually dead; Kokichi linked himself and Moment, when Moment's killing Kokichi and the scum are killing Moment, so tonight will have both kill flavors for both victims.

[mastina]

Kokichi OMA

has access.

[mastina]

So if I read mcqueen's intentions correctly.

He's planning to duel Darkwing Duck moments before deadline, and via exploiting the mechanics thereof, cause Darkwing Duck to be lynched.

[BNL]

If that happens do we end the game or let scum no kill?