Mini #564 - Mafia in Crubtown - Game Over

[Talitha]

Why scummyscummyscummyscummy, Akonas?

[windkirby]

Wk have you done a look at all post by user, if you have I find it hard for you to call me out on "playing it safe" in the context I used it more than vf.

And look here....

I'm still entirely happy with darkdude and in fact will vote him, for all the reasons already mentioned,

Wk are you purposely trying to misrepresent my points made or do you not agree with them or do you not understand them.

I acknowledge that vikingfan has been the most talkative player, but I hardly see this as a scummy attribute. When he does say something, it's usually useful. I find the particular post (which Akonas also found scummy) very show-off-y, almost propaganda-like, as if you're trying to start something on a player who I feel has done little wrong in comparison to some of the other players. "Purposefully" misunderstanding another player's points is something I never do; I was merely stating that you were not exactly one to talk about "playing it safe" of any kind, seeing as how you didn't even vote yesterday, an action which would be your only role power if you were hypothetically town. Of course I knew that this was not exactly the kind of "playing it safe" you were referring to.

Furthermore, I do not find the vote for darkdude all so incriminating,

especially when you so blatantly misquote him.

His entire post was:

Apologies for being out-I've been busy but am back now. I agree with PP that dramatic changes like that is scummy behavior. It's one thing to change one's mind (with sound logic to back it up), it's another thing entirely to change one's playstyle. But I'm not sure altogether that Cephrir's play matches her accusation to the depth that she claims, so I'm not prepared to vote him.

That being said, I'm still entirely happy with darkdude and in fact will vote him, for all the reasons already mentioned, both by myself and others. Hanging back, making lame excuses, and so forth. vote darkdude

And while he didn't provide a landfill of reasoning, he at least provided more motivation than you let on.

Despite this, it does seem odd that one of his reasons would be "hanging back," as it most certainly describes his playstyle, and it should be noted that my FOS was on you because of how you were going after vf, not

because

you were going after vf. I have not done a "all post by user" and will do so (is there a way to do it unmanually?).

[Pink Puppy]

Now about PP: I am more on my way to formulating an acurate guess as to your alignment but further off about vikingfans. You I can count on posting on your own accord rather frequently to help this process but vikingfan I am a lot further off from having any accurate view. A vote in his direction will hopefuly be useful to me getting closer to his alignment.

It is awfully coincidental that your pressure vote on him to get him to talk coincides with a bandwagon on him.

As for viking fan it is a question of contribution as the game has gone on his input has grown less and less, as numbers get less chances of being noticed as scummy increase. I have a very uneasy feeling about all this and feel that viking has a night action that has led him to want to fly under the radar. I think L-2 is enough pressure to get something of content from vikingfan.

The way you phrase this is significant to me. You don't say "he's scum so he wants to fly under the radar." You say "I think he has a night action and so wants ot fly under the radar." Night actions are not inherently scummy. Have you thought about that?

Having a read through vikingfan the biggest thing that bothers me is his actions about dd. He never brings any real case of substance about re dd but instead makes a few minor points and uses everyone elses more convincing analysis about dd saying he agrees with all this to justify his vote.

That being said, I'm still entirely happy with darkdude and in fact will vote him, for all the reasons already mentioned, both by myself and others. Hanging back, making lame excuses, and so forth. vote darkdude

This I can see as typical fly low mafia tactics of let town do the case building and when things look good slip the vote in. Same sort of bahaviour by him in the moz lynch also has been noted.

These are legitimate points, I think. The fact that you had to be pressed for them is... not good.

[Pink Puppy]

WK... at the bottom of the page, you can display posts just by one person. Look at the bottom of the page, under preview and submit, and to the right. It will say "all users" now. Click on the drop down menu, select whoever you want, and then press "go."

You will get a chronological display of all posts by that user.

[thevampireofdusseldorf]

Yes I belive Vikingfan has a night action that might not be a mafia night action but certainly a killing role. As I didn't exactly wish to have to come out in the open and discuss this I tried to pressure him to ruffle his feathers so I can get a better idea about if it is anti town or pro town. My biggest reason for thinking this is this quote from day two.

I'm also not for forcing a claim at the moment. Though, there is this to be considered. Say we find through a claim that a vig is present. Then we can leave the vig alone and lynch somebody else. Then even if the mafia kill our vig (assuming he's telling the truth), the vig can still get a kill off and hopefully kill a mafia, assuming the mod arranges the kill in a proper way. If there is no duplicate kill, then we just lynch the vig. I'm not in favor of forcing any claim, but there are some that wouldn't absolutely kill the town.

Now this IMO shows that vikingfan is aware that there is a second killing role and that this will most likely be revealed after night 2 as doc was killed night one. Thus I believe that vikingfan was setting himself up for a future claim of vig through this post. The fact that we had two dos maybe both active maybe one back up makes it IMO very possible that vikingfan could be a sk. I realy dont know how to move closer to finding out this but through trying to pressure him. Thus my vote and bandwagon.

[windkirby]

Ah, well that explanation satisfies me a bit.

unFOS

... for now.

[Crub]

Third Vote Count of Day 3

vikingfan (2):

Talitha, thevampireofdusseldorf

thevampireofdusseldorf (1):

Pink Puppy

QuantumFruit (1):

windkirby

Not Voting (3):

QuantumFruit, vikingfan, Akonas

With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch.

[Akonas]

It feels like VoD just jumped on the wagon, as it were, didn't add anything new ("Using everyone elses arguments is fine as long as you contribute your own to the table"). Kind of a bland yeahleslynchim.

[Talitha]

Okay fair enough, Akonas. No vote, though?


I'm waiting for something from vikingfan. VOD's point and vikingfan's subsequent silence, plus the fact that we had 2 doctors makes me think that my vote is in a good place.

[Pink Puppy]

Yes I belive Vikingfan has a night action that might not be a mafia night action but certainly a killing role. As I didn't exactly wish to have to come out in the open and discuss this I tried to pressure him to ruffle his feathers so I can get a better idea about if it is anti town or pro town. My biggest reason for thinking this is this quote from day two.

I'm also not for forcing a claim at the moment. Though, there is this to be considered. Say we find through a claim that a vig is present. Then we can leave the vig alone and lynch somebody else. Then even if the mafia kill our vig (assuming he's telling the truth), the vig can still get a kill off and hopefully kill a mafia, assuming the mod arranges the kill in a proper way. If there is no duplicate kill, then we just lynch the vig. I'm not in favor of forcing any claim, but there are some that wouldn't absolutely kill the town.

Now this IMO shows that vikingfan is aware that there is a second killing role and that this will most likely be revealed after night 2 as doc was killed night one. Thus I believe that vikingfan was setting himself up for a future claim of vig through this post. The fact that we had two dos maybe both active maybe one back up makes it IMO very possible that vikingfan could be a sk. I realy dont know how to move closer to finding out this but through trying to pressure him. Thus my vote and bandwagon.

I've been thinking about this a lot. It's very interesting.

I originally really disliked how you didn't give all your reasons for voting viking, but now I see why you didn't. And I don't really understand why Akonas still thinks your reasons are complete BS after reading your last post. It at least made me think.

unvote

I think the best way to get closer to the truth is to go back through viking's posts and actions. I'll be going there soon...

[Crub]

Prodded vikingfan, windkirby, QuantumFruit & thevampireofdusseldorf

[thevampireofdusseldorf]

Boo...... I am here just waiting for some activity from my suspect before moving on to other things.

[windkirby]

I'm here, mostly waiting for a few players to post, namely vikingfan and QuantumFruit. Not lurking!

[Crub]

vikingfan is busy but has asked not to be replaced. QuantumFruit hasn't picked up her prod, and I'll look for a replacement if she hasn't responded by tomorrow.

Everyone else please pick it up, otherwise I can't see any way out of a deadline.

[thevampireofdusseldorf]

Viking is the most important person for me to hear from at this stage others can wait, it is unfortunate he is unable to post as this holds up my input. Others I am not sure why the lack of posting is but I believe that there might be purposeful holding back to bring on a deadline.......not cool if you are twon.

[Talitha]

I've been prodded.

There's not much to comment on right now. I've been suspicious of vikingfan pretty much all game and I feel in my bones that he is scum.

[Pink Puppy]

It's hard to move forward without vikingfan, and to a lesser extent, QF. That's why I haven't posted. But I did forget to analyze viking's posts. I'm gonna do that see if I see anything I can ask him about...

[Pink Puppy]

Yes I belive Vikingfan has a night action that might not be a mafia night action but certainly a killing role. As I didn't exactly wish to have to come out in the open and discuss this I tried to pressure him to ruffle his feathers so I can get a better idea about if it is anti town or pro town. My biggest reason for thinking this is this quote from day two.

I'm also not for forcing a claim at the moment. Though, there is this to be considered. Say we find through a claim that a vig is present. Then we can leave the vig alone and lynch somebody else. Then even if the mafia kill our vig (assuming he's telling the truth), the vig can still get a kill off and hopefully kill a mafia, assuming the mod arranges the kill in a proper way. If there is no duplicate kill, then we just lynch the vig. I'm not in favor of forcing any claim, but there are some that wouldn't absolutely kill the town.

Now this IMO shows that vikingfan is aware that there is a second killing role and that this will most likely be revealed after night 2 as doc was killed night one. Thus I believe that vikingfan was setting himself up for a future claim of vig through this post. The fact that we had two dos maybe both active maybe one back up makes it IMO very possible that vikingfan could be a sk. I realy dont know how to move closer to finding out this but through trying to pressure him. Thus my vote and bandwagon.

Went back through viking's post and not seeing so much that jumps out as me. His lurking is sort of a worry, but it seems he has had real life issues that have prevented him from being more active. Something did occur to me about the above post.

Viking made that statement in regards to dardude claiming. Which suggests that he knew there was a second killing role in the game (presumably vig), and that he thought that role might be DD. If viking himself were a vig, he wouldn't think the vig is anyone but himself, and not worry about outing the vig through a claim.

In a way, it could be some sort of convouted breadcrumb, or SK setting up a vig claim, as VOD suggests. But I think it fails because it pretty much implies viking is LOOKING for the vig/SK and that he is not it.

Which implies mafia to me... because town would not know to look for a second killing role at that point.

I'm not sure I am thinking about this the right way. So anyone wants to chime in here, be my guest.

[windkirby]

PP - Am I correct that your hypothesis hinges on the first night kill being that of the vig/SK's?

At any rate, I'm still not that suspicious of vikingfan right now, because as PP said, that would be some rather funky breadcrumbing. Still, I haven't ruled him out.
My main concern is still QF, who has continued played mute... Hoping she'll start speaking up.

[Akonas]

I really really really want to hear what vikingfan has to say.

[Talitha]

I think it fails because it pretty much implies viking is LOOKING for the vig/SK and that he is not it.

Which implies mafia to me... because

town would not know to look for a second killing role at that point.

I'm not sure I am thinking about this the right way. So anyone wants to chime in here, be my guest.

I bolded what to me is the important part.

As far as town is concerned at the point Viking said this, it was most likely a game of mafia vs town, because we only had one kill. I can't prove it, but reading between the lines of that post it just really feels like Viking knows there's more than one killer.. could be either because he's a lone killing role, or because he's mafia and targeted someone who didn't die on night 1.

[QuantumFruit]

I'm back if that's any consolation. Sorry.

Hmm...viking theories are interesting. I'll think about it. Sorry I'm not really into this right now.

[Crub]

Seeking a replacement for vikingfan.

[darkdude]

Is it possible for me to replace? I was vanilla townie so I didn't know anything that he shouldn't know, and I'm still up to date with the game so I don't need to read 30 pages...

[Crub]

darkdude replaces vikingfan immediately