Pikmin Mafia - Game over

[Shamrock]

Hi! Reading.

[Gorrad]

As stated, I blew up the person with the second most votes. Happy?

[The Jester]

Hey. I'm on page 15 right now, then went out to eat and I come back (actually left, still had the whole time) with a headache. I will finish reading hopefully tomorrow.

[skitzer]

Unvote, vote Greasy Spot

The reason I voted sonickid was because he defended Greasy Spot. That is why I am changing votes.

[armlx]

Unvote, Vote Kison

.

I've definitely come around to Jdodge/JtP's point of view on this. The blatant opportunism is astounding.

[Kison]

I find it hilarious that you have the nerve to call me opportunistic considering JDodge was on seven people(BEFORE he unvoted some) at the end of yesterday.

5 Greasy Spot (windkirby, PyroDwarf, Gorrad, Xdaamno, skitzer)
5 JDodge (windkirby, Kison, Gorrad, PyroDwarf, JamesThePhox)
5 Sonickid (

JDodge

, UROE, Gorrad, skitzer, Claus)
3 Gorrad (UROE, Claus, Greasy Spot)

<---He was on this one

3 JamesThePhox (GhostWriter, armlx, Kison)

<---He was on this one

3 Kison (

JDodge

, GhostWriter, JamesThePhox)
2 GhostWriter (Claus, JamesThePhox)
2 Claus (UROE, Blazerunner)
2 Blazerunner (hasdgfas,

JDodge

)
2 Pyrodwarf (Greasy Spot,

JDodge

)
2 hasdgfas (GhostWriter,

JDodge

)
1 windkirby (JamesThePhox)

<---He was on this one

1 Xdaamno (

JDodge

)
1 skitzer (

JDodge

)

In any event you really need to do your homework. First is that JDodge voted me because he disliked how I went after GS for his slip(again, no vote involved but rather the typical loving pressure you apply when someone potentially makes a slip that you can explain both ways). But I will not rejustify this because if you want that, you can again do your homework and look through our debate from D1.

Secondly, JtP voted me for my D1 "opportunism." There was no opportunism in any of my Day One votes. Again, my first two votes were random :

Vote : Greasy Spot

Unvote

Vote : Shin Hatsubai

Both placed on the same day. I just swapped them around, and neither lasted very long. Sue me. My only remaining vote was on JDodge, and that was here :

You have not proven equal validity.

Proven? No. Presented an argument? Yes. Have you refuted that argument? No. Have many others shown indication that the second interpretation is logically valid? Pages 2 & 3 suggest yes.

And you know damn well what I meant by "you don't have an excuse for not getting it"

I already said I didn't :

So please, tell me what I'm not getting, because I'm utterly confused at this point.

As much as you don't seem to want to believe it, playing dumb wouldn't benefit me. So you pretty much have two options:

1) Clarify the statement you made, and I'll respond.
2) Refuse to clarify, and keep on picking at this dry bone of an argument you have here.

Your choice.

It's a lie, yes. It's a perfectly explainable through logical reasoning lie. Why are you ignoring

that

?

Here's your justification :

Ha.

Knew you'd attack that instead of going after the actual argument.

Glad to see that worked so well. I'm more sure that you're scum than you are that anyone is, frankly.

And I know you were never certain that he was scum.

- Pointing out

a blatant lie

isn't even scummy in the first place. I'm going to do that either as town or as scum.
- I presented the second response moments after you responded, foiling your supposed trap(which, again, is complete crap) that you were

so sure

would work .
- You still haven't even explained how singling that out is scummy - I've seen people do it as town and as scum all the time, so until you show proof that it's more commonly done by scum, your supposed plan is pretty much unfounded, and therefore a rubbish excuse for what you did.

Unvote

Vote : JDodge

Lying = scummy.
Lying with claimed intention of doing so and poor justification = very scummy.

<3

Sorry but when you make something up to justify your vote then pretend like it's some grand masterminded plan after being called out for the invalidity, I'm going to vote you for it. Why? Because

that

is opportunism. I'm actually bothered that you dismissed the sloppiness of his play, and find it convenient that you wait until JDodge flips Town to go after me, Armlx. You steered very clear of our fight with a comment here and there. Only after you saw JDodge gathering votes did you start to oppose the votes on him, which in my opinion he did more than enough to deserve. Why the passion all of a sudden?

Unvote

Vote : GhostWriter

He picked up his prod. I'm ready to pick up the discussion from yesterday.

[Kison]

That is definitely worth my second vote.

Vote James the Phox

Just wondering, is there any specific reason you are hesitating on JtP?

I feel you are letting your view on Kison bias your view on JtP too much.

What triggered this change of heart? You

just now

decided you are going to agree with the exact same thing you voted JtF for?

[armlx]

I find it hilarious that you have the nerve to call me opportunistic considering JDodge was on seven people(BEFORE he unvoted some) at the end of yesterday.

I don't see your point. I'm not denying his voting practices were questionable at times, but what does this have to do with you?

In any event you really need to do your homework. First is that JDodge voted me because he disliked how I went after GS for his slip(again, no vote involved but rather the typical loving pressure you apply when someone potentially makes a slip that you can explain both ways).

You continuing to do so was opportunism.

Secondly, JtP voted me for my D1 "opportunism." There was no opportunism in any of my Day One votes. Again, my first two votes were random :

Vote : Greasy Spot

Unvote

Vote : Shin Hatsubai

Both placed on the same day. I just swapped them around, and neither lasted very long.

And both happened in response to building pressure on that person and you kept attacking both for an easy lynch. That is the definition of opportunism

[armlx]

That is definitely worth my second vote.

Vote James the Phox

Just wondering, is there any specific reason you are hesitating on JtP?

I feel you are letting your view on Kison bias your view on JtP too much.

What triggered this change of heart? You

just now

decided you are going to agree with the exact same thing you voted JtF for?

My vote on JtP yesterday had little to do with his view on you and more how he just hopped on the Jdodge wagon.

[armlx]

Also, your application of LAL to Jdodge is sketchy at best.

[Kison]

I find it hilarious that you have the nerve to call me opportunistic considering JDodge was on seven people(BEFORE he unvoted some) at the end of yesterday.

I don't see your point. I'm not denying his voting practices were questionable at times, but what does this have to do with you?

It has to do with you and how you chose to ignore it. You considered JDodge to be someone who did not warrant votes :

This is the issue with multivote days: I see no reason for Claus or Jdodge to have votes right now.

...yet he was committing the same "crime" that you are now voting me for, to a much larger degree, flinging his votes around like one dollar bills in a strip club. Your viewpoint is therefore inconsistent. So again, what caused this change of heart? Why are you bending the rules for me and at this time in particular?

In any event you really need to do your homework. First is that JDodge voted me because he disliked how I went after GS for his slip(again, no vote involved but rather the typical loving pressure you apply when someone potentially makes a slip that you can explain both ways).

You continuing to do so was opportunism.

Me continuing to do what? I pressured him for a very short time. It wasn't to get the guy lynched, otherwise I'd probably have had my vote back on him(and didn't until the next day for a completely different reason). I let it go once I realized there was nothing there.

And both happened in response to building pressure on that person and you kept attacking both for an easy lynch. That is the definition of opportunism

Sorry, but my GS vote was not in response to anything he did. Whether you choose to believe that is your call. My 2nd vote was a light vote for something worthy of it at the time. It would be opportunism if I actually pressed for him to be lynched. I didn't.

My vote on JtP yesterday had little to do with his view on you and more how he just hopped on the Jdodge wagon.

I concur with JDodge's case on Kison. Kison, early on, seemed to take many opportune votes, switching between bandwagons.

I would rather see more pressure on Kison than GS.

Unvote: Greasy Spot; Vote: Kison

...two posts later...

That is definitely worth my second vote.

Vote James the Phox

...He didn't vote JDodge until the next page...

JDodge makes a good point.

Vote: JDodge

So your initial vote on JtP was placed because of his vote on me. Perhaps, as you say, his later vote on JDodge reinforced it, but again his initial vote on me "was definitely worth" your 2nd vote. All of a sudden you now agree with the very same logic that was "definitely worth" that vote.

[Greasy Spot]

As stated, I blew up the person with the second most votes. Happy?

Sounds like an obvious claim.

vote: Gorrad

[armlx]

Those knowledgable with the game, any enemies that could blow someone up like that?

[Kison]

In addition, yellow Pikmin can be thrown higher and farther than the other two colors, and also can carry explosive bomb rocks to attack enemies or destroy obstacles.

No I did not edit Wikipedia.

[armlx]

K, that doesn't really help but ok. Unless there's some enemy that can blow people up I see no reason Gorrad isn't confirmed town.

[Kison]

This is ugly but it lists some of the enemies. Not seeing any explosive ones just yet : http://faqs.ign.com/articles/390/390580p1.html

I don't know much about this game.

[armlx]

A quick search for explode, bomb, and blow shows nothing.

[Gorrad]

Make sure there's no enemies in the OTHER game with asplosions.

Unvote, Vote: Greasy Spot

. May as well pick up where we left off.

[windkirby]

As stated, I blew up the person with the second most votes. Happy?

Sounds like an obvious claim.

vote: Gorrad

Well, I was going to vote for James, but what the hell is this? Name a scenario in which Gorrad is scum that would explain JDodge's death.

unvote, vote: GreasySpot

As far as I am concerned, Gorrad's role is confirmed. There are few enemies that can use bombs in the Pikmin game: Volatile Dweevils (which are ruled out because they self-destruct upon explosion), and the Dirigibug (which is hardly an enemy prominent enough to warrant a role) are the only ones that come to mind (please correct me if I'm missing one), and so I believe Gorrad's claim completely.

My theory is that there is a group of traditional, non-elemental enemy scum (of which the Puffy Blowhog was a part), as well as, as has been suggested before, a Titan Dweevil serial killer who can choose which element to kill with (although it seems poison has been discluded), although that isn't to say I would bank on the matter.

[mikeburnfire]

Mod Note: I have added a link to the GALLERY OF ENEMIES in the first post. Every scum in this game is on that list.

Vote Count!
With 14 alive, it will take 8 to lynch.

3 Greasy Spot (skitzer, Gorrad, windkirby)
2 GhostWriter (GhostWriter, Kison,)
1 Gorrad (Greasy Spot)
1 Xdaamno (Xdaamno)
1 JamesThePhox (JamesThePhox)
1 PyroDwarf (PyroDwarf)
1 Kison ( armlx)
1 Blazerunner (Blazerunner)
1 Claus (Claus)
1 The Jester (The Jester)
1 Shamrock (Shamrock)
0 No Lynch

[windkirby]

The list confirms my previous statement: there are only two enemies with bombs, and I personally don't feel that either of one of them could be in this game. I

suppose

there could be a Dirigibug SK, or possibly that there is a Dirigibug partnered with non-killing Snitchbugs, but since there was no bomb kill Night 1, I feel that this possibility is extremely unlikely.

[JamesThePhox]

My theory is that there is a group of traditional, non-elemental enemy scum (of which the Puffy Blowhog was a part), as well as, as has been suggested before, a Titan Dweevil serial killer who can choose which element to kill with (although it seems poison has been discluded), although that isn't to say I would bank on the matter.

Yes, I did suggest a Titan Dweevil as a potential SK, but it seems like there's another kind of type of enemy. hasdgfas got eaten, which was a different method of killing than I expected (yes, I know that most enemies in the Pikmin games ususally just consume, but then the Pikmin immunities could be rendered useless if there is an enemy that can consume, unless Purple/White Pikmin are immune to consumption?).

In any case, the Puffy Blowhog lynch seems to confirm that at least one group of Blowhogs, the group decides which Blowhog does the kill, etc. Maybe the Titan Dweevil (SK) can consume along with all it's regular powers? If not, the consumption seems to suggest that the staple Pikmin monster exists: The Bulborb. So a third killing party?

Question to everyone: Is it also safe to assume that opposing anti-pikmin killing groups are immune to each other? This would suggest why a third death didn't come up and confirm that Gorrad was, in fact, One-shot Bomb Rock Yellow Pikmin.

GS seems suspicious because of sonickid's protective-ness along with GS' sudden eagerness to vote the one who claimed One-Shot Bomb Rock Pikmin. (I considered it as a fake claim as well in Day 2, since Bomb Rock Pikmin seems pretty easy to claim, but last night's results seem to suggest Gorrad was truthful)

But the fact that so many Yellow pikmin died also suggests this: If there are a lot of killing groups, would the chance that there are multiple One-Shot Bomb Rock Pikmin be high? And if so, maybe hasdgfas was one and killed JDodge at night with his Bomb Rock. However, I feel that if Gorrad were mafia, it would be very chancy to gambit claim that he killed JDodge at night, when there might be other Bomb Rock Pikmin in this game, who might've killed JDodge at night.

In any case,

Unvote; Vote: Greasy Spot; FOS: Kison

[JamesThePhox]

EBWOP:

Unvote; Vote: GS; FOS: Kison

[GhostWriter]

Okay, I did pick up my prod. Read my sig. Kison, could you please, to make it a bit easier on me, ask me what it is that you would like me to answer?

[Kison]

Yeah, I'll make it easier.

Who are the scum?

Hint : It's in your role PM.