Mafia v. Wolves Redux: Finally Over!

[Battle Mage]

wow thats harsh. Nonetheless, i like the tradename. I go away for one day, and already we have a reasonably big wagon...
Anyway, as i only just got here, im entitled to what is essentially a random vote.

Vote: Kison

theres Battle Mage Logic for ya!

1) I used random.org

2) Although unusual, how does the "trend" look scummy?

3)

FoS : XReyoX

for BattleMage logic.

[Battle Mage]

BattleMage logic is logic which scum hate, because it so often catches them.

What is BattleMage logic?

[Battle Mage]

Kison, by targetting me all the time you not only make yourself a less valuable townie, but you look very much like scum who really wants to attack someone else. Currently im slanting towards the former, but you havent done enough to get my vote off you yet.
I find myself agreeing with IH here. Reyox is an obvious noob, but it doesnt mean he is scum. Noob scum generally try to keep a much lower profile in my experience.
however, Reyox, if you want to help yourself and the town, please try and make a decent contribution. Even if u get lynched anyway, it will still help the town in the future.

<3 Tom goes to the mayor

The show is horrid.

Vote : Kison

now you've got the wagon.

Thrilling.

I am going to

vote:Kison

and put XreyoX head to head with Kison. Let's see how it goes.

I'd have thought a BattleMage head-to-head with someone would have been more entertaining. He can "find scum" on a bar of soap using an 800 year old invention that he calls "scumdar".

Ok, let's hear the first legit scum-theory and get this game rolling.

[Battle Mage]

lol i find myself agreeing with reyox alot here. Its true that Kison does the same thing with me in all my games too!
im not entirely convinced he is scum, but currently him and OTU look alot worse than anyone else.

[Battle Mage]

well done, you have now put Raffles at -6 lynch.

[Battle Mage]

SV may be lurking a bit, but its also true that he has excused his absence on another game we are both in. I think he will be back full time soon, but a prod wouldnt go amiss.

[Battle Mage]

OTU seems very scummy at the moment-perhaps even more so than Kison. Of the two bandwagons, i think i know where im at.

Unvote, Vote: Overtheunder

[Battle Mage]

are u suggesting that my vote was unfounded?
if so, you are very wrong. Not only did u commit the major scumtell of voting me for no reason, you have also been acting very scummy in this game so far.
BM

No I'm clearly stating that I don't know if you have prior experience with other sites, and games. Therefore saying I'm not sure if it's newb-ish qualities you're showing or if that's what you are trying to do on purpose. The second part is because I believe that you are showing more newb-ish qualities then experienced so it was the more likely situation that it was just newb-ishness showing than you actually trying to confuse us. In reference to Battle Mage's post you just want on a bandwagon, no actual reason? Just to vote me for the hell of it? Interesting.

[Battle Mage]

we arent at the random voting stage now. If your vote is still that undeveloped despite your activity in this game, i suggest you have a look at YOUR playstyle rather than mine.

We were at the random voting stage, if I'm to blame for voting for no reason then so is everyone else because that's what it was, a random vote. If that's the basis for your vote on me then that's sorta weird, and if you're going to say it wasn't then you need to also consider loads of other people to be scum then aswell.

[Battle Mage]

actually, thinking about it, a Mason group is highly likely in this game. Id be willing to bet money on it. Whether or not Reyox is a member is a different story...

no, reyo, FoSing means I think that you're part of an informed minority, be it scum or mason.

[Battle Mage]

woah, calm down dude. Scum arent going to learn anything from this discussion, except that there is a POSSIBILITY that we have masons in this game. Its hardly a big deal.

Hold on people!!! Please do NOT give away your role to the scum! Please think about what the scums know that we do not know!!! Think twice before you post.
If you don't understand, view the past 10 posts in the way the scum would.
I'm very very sorry for what I've mistype my sentences and raise this discussion.
The way this discussion is leading to is causing harm to the town side.

[Battle Mage]

like what? they can eliminate potential power roles, but to an extent Masons are a protown power role.

They can learn more than that.

[Battle Mage]

after your play this game, i think the frying pan should be wielded by me.



[quote="XReyoX"]@BM: if you are a town, I would like to bash you with a frying pan for stupidity.
quote]

[Battle Mage]

wow. This post strikes me as VERY odd. Never before have i seen Kison pass up an opportunity to get me lynched. Either hes finally get the gist of my play, or he is scum trying to suck up to me. For the sole reason that i want to believe it, im going to assume he is the former. My vote also stands.

I'm not feeling the Battle Mage wagon at all. My vote stays where it is for now.

[Battle Mage]

you flatterer.
Its no wonder you have no friends outside of your computer.

wow. This post strikes me as VERY odd. Never before have i seen Kison pass up an opportunity to get me lynched. Either hes finally get the gist of my play, or he is scum trying to suck up to me. For the sole reason that i want to believe it, im going to assume he is the former. My vote also stands.

I'm not feeling the Battle Mage wagon at all. My vote stays where it is for now.

Any time I want to lynch you is because I don't feel we have any other leads to go on. So you're normally next on the list for being near useless, yet still holding the possibility of being scum. So losing you would be no devastating loss of contribution while still holding the possibility that a scum-lynch would be yielded.

Since you act like scum 95% of the time, it's impossible to ever really be sure about you. I don't even mean to be harsh, but just look at what you just said right there. Perfect example.

[Battle Mage]

or of course he was a power role with info to impart.

ALSO

the only way that you can pose strategy through it is if you weren't town.

[Battle Mage]

i think he intends to vote for me. Not quite sure why he hasnt actually..

I apologize, this game dropped off my radar when search went down.

OTU: Good post, but is there any particular reason you're not taking a stand by voting someone?

[Battle Mage]

actually i think it would be safer to claim now. If you arent scum, the scum could easily vote twice in quick succession and you will be dead. If you have a role of any importance, it is best to say so now.

[Battle Mage]

not to mention the fact that your comments almost sound like

instructions to your buddy

Fair enough. It's just that I was slightly ticked because I noted it but was planning on to see how PBuG behaves a bit more.

[Battle Mage]

huh? thats like saying you have to have an IQ of 1000 to work out who got a role pm saying 'Mafia' out of a selection of 12 people. Its not impossible, its just difficult. Nonetheless, the whole point of this game is to try and catch scum. This is what i am doing.

not to mention the fact that your comments almost sound like

instructions to your buddy

Instructions? Unless you have an IQ of 1000. I guess it would almost be

impossible

to figure out scums who are sending out instructions to each other.

[Battle Mage]

as i have said, it is certainly not impossible. Just difficult, and certainly not something you can be certain of. Noobs who are about to die, will occassionally pass on info to their buddies before they go. Similarly, experienced players may be forced to issue instructions to a noob buddy who isnt doing as they should.

huh? thats like saying you have to have an IQ of 1000 to work out who got a role pm saying 'Mafia' out of a selection of 12 people. Its not impossible, its just difficult. Nonetheless, the whole point of this game is to try and catch scum. This is what i am doing.

No. I mean it's impossible to tell if a scum is trying to hide an instruction for his buddy to do something.

[Battle Mage]

if you are referring to the game i think you are, the reasoning behind our failure was that we went under the false assumption that the scum teams would attack each other after gaining a big advantage on the town.
I also agree that the lack of movement on the OTU wagon is very suspicious. Whilst it is possible that the scum dont want to put the last vote on, i think it is more likely that his scumbuddies are trying to avoid the wagon, and the entire other scum group is already on it!
BM

This is my 2nd multi-team mafia game played. In my other game, by page 25 we lynched 3 of our own townies, including a power role that fell asleep with a wagon on him. I think we faulted by not considering how quick the mafia teams would support a mislynch. Knowing that, makes we weary of why OTU is not lynched yet. Either, he’s scum and doesn’t have the votes of his team, or the players in this thread are much more calculated in who they vote for. I haven’t voted him because I couldn’t find much scummy about him, with exception to the already mentioned opportunism.

Right now I’m concerned with PBug and Kison. I had suspicions of Kison on page 8. But, I recently noticed a voting pattern with PBug and Kison.

PBug and Kison combo votes:
Pages 1&2 on XReyoX, after the XReyoX wagon fizzles, page 6&7 hop on Raffles, both attack raffles for his “End of Story” argument on page 7&8. By page 16 both were on OTU, after OTU’s wagon lost momentum, both shifted to Remus 17&18.

That being said, I think either PBug and Kison are extremely aggressive townies, one of them is scum latching onto a townie, or they are on the same team.

Unvote:Vote PBug

[Battle Mage]

answers to what exactly?

Waiting on more answers from people. I'm about this > < far from asking to bail out of this game, if we can't keep up participation any better than this.

[Battle Mage]

i stand by my vote. i dont think anything OTU says will change my mind.
BM

[Battle Mage]

FOS: Zindy

. After OTU has had a big wagon for ages, which stuttered and started more than any other i have seen, you made a conscious decision not to vote. Now the decision has been made without your help, you claim to support it, in the hope that you wont be suspected tomorrow. Its a commendable plan-far more subtle than bussing your scumbuddy, but if OTU comes up scum, i will be keeping a very close eye on you tomorrow.

Gah, I was just writing my analysis. Here it is, unfinished. I'll attempt to finish it before Phoebus comes in. If not, you'll get it in the morning. I'd like to state that, at the point where I am now, I agree with an OTU lynch.

Yea, sure! I'm Yuri from red alert. So don't pick up the phone next time when I call you or you'll be mind-controlled and vote to lynch yourself. ... Wait actually, I'll tell you to lynch your scum-mate and NK yourself. By the way has anyone played the new command and conquer 3 demo. The graphics are

really

good.

Yuri's Revenge was such an awesome game.

The whole XReyoX-wagon at the start of the game seems pretty tangential to me.

Post 42, by al4xz, seems really scummy to me. That's some really bad bandwagon-hopping there. Same goes IH. He should know better.

5 XReyoX (al4xz, IH, Kison, PBuG, Raffles)

Definitely worth remembering.

OMGUS vote: Wizardcat

Dog pwns cats... anyday.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v469/ ... endyou.jpg

(click the link, I shouldn't spam up threads with big pictures)

IH's 92 is bad. 97-99 is odd, explained in 101. IH's 110 is better. OTU's vote on Reyo looks pretty bad. bird's posting is weak. His post 121 shows he's following the game, but he doesn't weigh in. I really don't know what to make of Fuldu's 124. 149 is horrible. Scarecrow, I know you can do lots better.

SV may be lurking a bit, but its also true that he has excused his absence on another game we are both in. I think he will be back full time soon, but a prod wouldnt go amiss.

She, she. My precious voidybuns is a she!

PBuG is being wagony as hell. 173 jumps out.

Fascinating. And yet you assumed there were three per team, that the teams were equal, and that 3 scum on a team would be enough of a scum group in a game subject to crosskills. That speaks of prior knowledge to me.

Vote stands. I'm not feeling the XReyoX bandwagon at all, it looks like scum jumping on the fat kid.

You're right about prior knowledge, but Mafia nor Wolves would know the size of both scumgroups.

Al4xz just decides to jump back in in Post 185. Raffles is being silly in 186. 191-192 jump out again, OTU by scumminess and PBuG by pointing it out. Fuldu is again right in 195.

4 OverTheUnder (DrippingGoofball, Fuldu, Mastermind of Sin, Raffles)
6 Raffles (Der Hammer, Kison, Mr Flay, PBuG, Scarecrow, Wizardcat)

(it must be noted that Der Hammer's vote here was a leftover from the random voting phase)

This is also an interesting vote count to remember. BM's 202 is memorable if Kison is scum.

[Battle Mage]

so you say, however this makes little sense considering your high activity in other games.

FOS: Zindy

. After OTU has had a big wagon for ages, which stuttered and started more than any other i have seen, you made a conscious decision not to vote. Now the decision has been made without your help, you claim to support it, in the hope that you wont be suspected tomorrow. Its a commendable plan-far more subtle than bussing your scumbuddy, but if OTU comes up scum, i will be keeping a very close eye on you tomorrow.

I only started actually reading the thread yesterday.

[Battle Mage]

thats a strong case from Flay.

Vote: Raffles

also note that im a bit wary of xreyox. he seems a little TOO protown for my liking. seems a bit false...
BM

[Battle Mage]

sorry i havent been of much help so far today guys. i find the amount of potential clues in the flavour to be a little heavy. dont worry though, i am here and keeping a close eye on things. here are my ideas of what the flavour could mean:

Most sane people did this.
There are always those, however, who are not quite completely sane, and who have business which is entirely their own.

This bit emphasises the difference between sane and not-sane. in Mafia, of course, this has a slightly different meaning. As far as i know, the only role in which you can be sane or insane, is Cop. This quote would imply that Al3xz could have been an insane cop. This would certainly tie in with him 'having business that is entirely his own'-which suggests he had a power role.

al4xz

was one of those people and he was out and about in the evening. He knew the risks of what he was doing and the risk was what made him do it. A shiver of excitement ran along his spine as he crossed the village green, on his way to the river. He hoped for a rendezvous there, and if that didn't happen, he could always help himself.

This section clarifies that Al3xz definitely had a role last night, which he attempted to perform. He targetted or spoke to someone in particular by the looks of things. The bit that strikes me as odd here is the last phrase. 'He could always help himself'. what does that mean? i doubt this game contains an Insane Cop who can protect himself from an NK instead of investigating. its possible, but unlikely. the fact is, he obviously DIDNT help himself, whether he could or not. The mason theory falls flat at this point-as a mason in the typical sense cannot 'help himself'.

As

al4xz

lay down on the soft grass under the willows which grew along the river bank, another one of those people was flitting about in the shadows. Presently, they went up to

al4xz

and put their hands around his neck.

al4xz

smiled a little, until the hands choked further.
"Uncle." said

al4xz

He was replied by silence.
"Uncle!" he said, a little more urgently.
More silence.
"UNCLE!" was his last word.
Followed by more silence.
Broken only by the noises made by the river as it flows past.
A serene silence.

This passage implies that Al3xz was targetted by someone, but not someone unfamiliar to him. The term 'uncle' has alreeady been discussed a little. Kison suggested that it could mean a term of surrender. this is possible, in which case the killer would presumably be someone that he knew and trusted (someone he thought was just playing around). This is similar to Raffles(?) theory, where the killer IS his uncle. However, neither of those are what strike me as the most likely. it makes far more sense to me if you read his repetition of the word 'uncle' as a cry for help!
He is confident to begin with that his buddy will protect him, but as time goes on he becomes gradually more anxious. I think Al3xz had been expecting someone to save him, but that person hadnt come.

Until it is broken by the scream of a girl, out and about for an early dip.
Always on the lookout for trouble in this days, it is not long until one of the village folk come to investigate the source of the trouble.
They find

al4xz

paler than the girl who found him, his face twisted in a grisly snarl.

Im not sure about the snarl bit. implies that Al3xz could be a werewolf.
it should also be noted that the mod makes very sure to show that the person who found Al3xz was a young pale girl. could be useful to know later.

a search is carried out of

al4xz

's house. It reveals a disturbing assortment of things like ropes, whips, handcuffs, knives and rolls of linen.
A search of the body reveals a card in it with

ESE Member

written on it in blood red colour.

The discovery is grim.
What will you do about it?[/i]

The stuff found in Al3xz house features an assortment of odd items, some of these items for sexual pleasure. i cant think of what else links all of the to be honest, apart from perhaps knitting. lol
ESE could stand for Erotic Sexual Enterprises, or i could be way off the mark

To conclude, Al3xz is more likely to be wolf than mafia, because of his snarling. he was more likely to be killed by Mafia because he was strangled. its possible that he had a scum mason buddy who killed him, but that means 2 missed kills last night, which is unlikely. Perhaps he was part of a cult-1 of whom was also a doctor-hence he expected protection. its possible he was part of a cult-hence he came up as scum, however the Mafia killed him. doesnt explain the snarl, but fits in with everything else.

Anyway im making notes on other peoples views of the flavour, so i can feed em back later and check for inconsistencies.

BM

[Battle Mage]

ooh-something useful to comment on.
if you think my last post was 'throwing dirt', you are very wrong. Fact is, i had barely read either player, and thus the vote was hardly educated. i felt Raffles action at the end of yesterday was scummy, and Xreyox was looking a little TOO protown. do you have ANY other reason to think i am scummy?
BM

First off

unvote, vote Battle Mage

Read his posts in isolation, it's tough to find BM as scum because he always tends to act scummy but his last post makes me think we may have scum BM playing this game. He's looked to join a bandwagon again on Raffles whilst trying to throw dirt elsewhere namely at Reyox. I've no real read on DGB but her lack of participation may just be her style of play.

@theopor_COD, Fuldu, DGB: Are all your reasons listed in my list. Was those all the reasons that made you think OTU was the right lynch?

I'm not sure how yfine

Many

. But these are all the reasons I could find. If I've missed any of the, Pls add them back. Just read. If you think OTU was the right one to be lynch, I guess so are many players in this list.

Theopor_COD

#211. OTU's vote is opportunisitc but again I'd be just as wary as the early ppl on Reyox's early wagon. OTU's assesment on Battle Mage is just as scummy. I don't really like the way OTU has unvoted Reyox and then turned his attention on BM for supposed lurking.
#383. still not sure if OTU's the right lynch, will re-read asap.
#494. I'd guess THIS was a lie? Being as four days have passed since. “THIS = OTU saying -ACK! I had my whole post written up and I closed the window on accident. I'll re-write it in a bit I've gotta go for now.”

vote

OTU's lack of defence makes me think we had little choice. I'm not sure why he didn't at least claim, however with the deadline I think he was likely to be the only possible lynch and lynching someone gives us more information than a no lynch. Yes I wasn't certain of OTU being scum or town but his lack of defence aside from his post attacking BM amongst others was pretty much all he gave us.

Theopor_COD

Post 211 he defends BM some which could indicate partnering.(But, in post 414 he points out BM's scumminess for fishing in 260) He FOS's OTU & Scarecrow and then declares a hunch that MoS is scum. Now that a month is passed, do you still have that hunch and if so, could you elaborate on it? Also, what does the phrase "post some waffle" mean?

Post 414 & 417 He declares Remus to be more scummy than OTU.

By post 494 he's moved back to OTU. Was this from lack of support for the Remus wagon, or did you change your mind?

Post 546, voting DGB(which I agree with), and no mention of Remus.(which XreyoX pointed out) Care to elaborate?

Suspicion of MOS was random, he's not done anything overly obvious to worry me further at present, mind he's a good player so who knows. "Post some waffle" - just means posting rubbish, i.e totally irrelevant, guess it was in relation to WizardCat.

I found OTU relatively scummy whilst doing my re-read he was the leading wagon, so with two scums in the game chances are some pushed his wagon, remus jumped out at the time as being scum suspect number one to me. I'd need to re-read his latest posts to confirm if I still feel like that, but at the time he jumped out at me.

[Battle Mage]

i did read it. didnt memorise it. note that i also said the erotic thingy only applied to some of the items. i couldnt see another connection better. I also pointed out that the flavour is full of contradictions, which is why it took me so long to have the inclination to analyse it. I never said i had an immediate solution, but those are my thoughts. you can think them wrong all you like, but there is no need to reduce this game to childish insults.
i didnt know you spoke for Theo. is that a permanent thing, or is it just when you are scumbuddies?
does make me wonder why YOU havent got your vote on me if you find me so scummy.
fyi-my vote on OTU wasnt opportunistic. i was one of the first people to vote for him, and i stayed on him for nearly the whole of day 1. if you think this scummy, why havent you mentioned those who joined the wagon later?

Unvote

@BM: 1)you obviously didn't read the original deathscene. The sane-insane thingy wasn't there originally. Oh c'mon. rope and knife as sex tools for an insane cop called erotic secual enterprise written in red text? I guess you are the one who is insane. (Or the mod is if this is true). I've said that whether alex is a wolf/scum doesn't matter. He is still a scum in one of the groups.

quote BM "do you have ANY other reason to think i am scummy?"

2) Yes. your opportunistic vote on OTU which didn't provide any useful reasons.

3) Stop quoting a large chunk of text.

[Battle Mage]

Actually, a stalling wagon is usually the sign of a scumbuddy that their partners don't want to throw under the bus, so assuming that lack of lynch = town was either bad reasoning on your part, or a bad attempt to deceive us by making shit up to cover your tracks.

QFT

@Raffles-2 failed mafia kills is hardly surprising. in fact, i recently modded a game where exactly that happened (well there were 2 scum groups and an SK) and with 3 killing groups, no NK was made.

[Battle Mage]

and the only way you could have known that is if you were scum. Raffles, you're making it very hard for me not to vote for you here...

[Battle Mage]

who said that Al3xz tried to recruit a mafia member?
certainly not me.

Vote: xreyox

-you seem to know far more than a protown player would.

I'm going to repeat again.

Al4 being a cult =/= 2 failed NK.

Assuming there are 3 mafia and 3 wolves (like the other game).

both scum group targetted alex has a probability of 14/(17^2)= 4.8%

1 group targetted alex and the other got protected = (17 x 2) /(17 x 19) = 10.4%

*no blocker / immune role included. chance would be higher than 10.4% if these are include.

@BM: use some logic.
if there were 2 missed NK and alx died because he tried to recruit a scum. The chance is
(6/19)(17/(17x19))^2= 8.7 x 10^-2 %.

Its like saying "i wouldn't be suprised if i win the lottery even tho it has one in a billionth chance of happening, because someone win it everyday"

[Battle Mage]

i agree that Raffles story concernijng yesterday doesnt exactly add up, but he seems like an easy lynch really. MoS does look a little panicky though, and the Xreyox vote isnt going anywhere.

Unvote, Vote: MoS

[Battle Mage]

no-i didnt feel your question was of any importance. However, if you insist that i spend bandwidth answering it, here you go:

I think you know more than a protown player should, basically because of your responses to the flavour. You seem to have a pretty good idea of what it meant. for all i know you could be a protown power role, but scum seems more likely.
clearly my vote on you has gone ignored by the rest of the players. this doesnt exactly do you any favours as far as looking protown goes. Nonetheless, MoS DOES seem rather nervous at this stage. I am intrigued to see his reaction to another vote.
The reason i am not voting Raffles, is because i dont think scum-Raffles would have a wagon grwo so quickly on him. on the assumption that the wagon COULD be scum driven, i wont be joining it atm.
question for those who have played with Xreyox before:
Is he this aggressive as scum or town usually?
BM

i agree that Raffles story concernijng yesterday doesnt exactly add up, but he seems like an easy lynch really. MoS does look a little panicky though, and the Xreyox vote isnt going anywhere.

Unvote, Vote: MoS

Are you backing off because you couldn't answer my question?
>>"why do you think I know more than a pro-town player?" and " what kind of info you think I know which a pro-town player shouldn't?"

what do you mean by " xreyos vote isn't going anywhere"
if raffles story is concerning why don't you vote for him?
you think he is scum but he is an easy lynch so you dun want to vote him?
hidden message in your post: "my not a scum so I don't go for easy lynch"
is this what you what us to believe?

[Battle Mage]

well if this is your first game, and you are town, then you are doing very well. Your participation is good, your perceptiveness is top notch. Its probably part of the reason i find you so scummy-the fact that you seem too townie (cue someone bring up the wiki page) lol.

fyi, im not saying your aggressive nature is making the game unpleasant for me atm. Ive taken alot worse in these games
i had genuinely thought you could be scum. I am less inclined to believe this now, and am happy with my vote on MoS.

BM

question for those who have played with Xreyox before:
Is he this aggressive as scum or town usually?

This is my first game. I've said it before. You can take a look at my other game but I'm not dead yet so I can't proove that I'm town with it. Its better to leave that game alone anyway.


I appologise if i appear too aggressive to you and is making this game unpleasent for you. I understand that being interrogated isn't a fun thing. However, I do not want vote/unvote go easy either. This would just benefit the scums and allow them to fester around. If you are town, no matter how hard I push, you won't have anything to panick about.

[Battle Mage]

a justified analysis of me i must say, however if you play with me more, you will know that my games tend to have a 50-50 split:
Those in which i think i know who is scum and attack them like a bull on speed.
And Those in which i have no real clue who is scum, or games that i find hard to get into. This falls into the latter category with both reasons. honestly, its no real tell into my affiliation, but it does give a good indication of how much i care about the game lol.
BM

Aright. My thoughts and stuff on various people/stuff that has caught my eye.

Reyo's town. I'm almost certain of that. Looks very town to me. The early day 1 wagon on him was tosh, but then it was mostly a random wagon. Still, Kison has picked up scummy points for his reaction to it.

Battle Mage feels off to me. Most games I've seen him in (as pro-town) he's got an idea in his head and run with it bullheaded through any walls like common sense or proof that he's wrong that might stand in his way. This game he's much more opportunistic and widening his horizons, which is something I want to watch.

DGB is scummy and needs to contribute.

MoS is not scummy, and DGB's case is rubbish, frankly. Raffles is scummy, but I have a horrible gut feeling he's town.

Scarecrow is so scummy it's not funny. Seriously, look at his posts in isolation, he's not just lurking but casually agreeing with people while trying to avoid garnering any sort of attention. I can't wait to grill his replacement (though Remus wasn't much better, to be honest XD)

Akbar is pretty scummy. Needs to be watched, as is flying under the radar somewhat.
I also don't get how after his long post the conclusion he came to was a DGB vote. He presented in my opinion interesting cases on a couple of the others yet failed to even FoS them for it and also when discussing Scarecrow he provides little analysis but calls him a serial Killer then fails to follow through with a vote or a FoS. Note also early fishing for Reyo's role.

Fuldu has struck me as fairly pro-town, yet there is a connection between him and Reyo which is slightly worrying. If I'm wrong about one of them and they are scum I want to take a good look at the other too.

We need cattle prods of various people, namely wizardcat and ~N9V~, just to pick a couple of severe offenders off the top of my head.

To summarise:

Vote: Scarecrow, Heavy FoS: Akbar, FoS: DGB, IGMEOY: BM

Phew. Also I would note that I don't believe any of this night scene speculation is particularly helpful, and in fact distracting to the oal at hand, namely lynching scum.

Anything else you think I should look at/give my thoughts about/address then let me know.

[Battle Mage]

OR, in light of this comment, it makes you look bad, for blatantly bussing your buddy.

@MoS. How does raffles being a scum makes DGB oneas well?

Because DGB is trying to stir up suspicion against the person that is most proactively attacking Raffles. If Raffles is scum, this makes DGB look pretty bad tomorrow.

[Battle Mage]

Kison i suggest you dont use other games that are still being played. i think i know which one you are talking about, but it really means very little when neither of our affiliations are known...
@Theo-did you read my previous comments. Im finding this game tough going because of all the speculation, and petty arguments we have had of late.

*gives MoS a ritalin* I tire of reading your sporadic condescending posts. I've yet to see another player get so worked up over these

games

.

Back on topic, I accept DGB's answer about MoS hounding XReyoX, although I disagree.

OR, in light of this comment, it makes you look bad, for blatantly bussing your buddy.

@MoS. How does raffles being a scum makes DGB oneas well?

Because DGB is trying to stir up suspicion against the person that is most proactively attacking Raffles. If Raffles is scum, this makes DGB look pretty bad tomorrow.

I hate this kind of logic from the Battle Mage. It really irks me because of how WIFOM it is(he tried pulling this on me in another game). There's a profound difference between what MoS is doing, and what DGB was suspected of doing. If Raffles came up scum, there'd be no proof that MoS was scum BUSing his partner. He could very well be scum, however, in DGB's case, there's plenty of proof that he

did

attempt to sidetrack the Raffles wagon, although we would still be unsure of why, that is where the concern of his reasoning comes in.

[Battle Mage]

what does Raffles have to do with this?
you seem pretty over-protective of him, especially considering I DIDNT EVEN MENTION HIM.
as for the comment itself, it is pretty obvious what game he is talking about-if i know, anyone in that game (a few people here) will also know.
BM

Kison i suggest you dont use other games that are still being played. i think i know which one you are talking about, but it really means very little when neither of our affiliations are known...

a) Raffles didn't say which game, so he's more than allowed to make a comment like this
b) Raffles comment had nothing to do with alignment. It's bad logic regardless of your alignment. He was just pointing out that you have a history of bad logic, since you've done it to him before.

[Battle Mage]

if you'd bothered to read, you would see that this has already been clarified-twice.

BM, if you bothered to read, MoS meant Kison when he said Raffles.

I think you mean Kison...?

Err, yea. Sorry.

[Battle Mage]

@Kison-the fact is your input was really unnecessary. considering it was apparent that all involved parties had resolved the issue.
BM

[Battle Mage]

too late, i already did. 2 wrongs dont make a right. try and stay on-topic from now on

Yea, Kison's got you on this one. You can't put this on him.

[Battle Mage]

too late, i already did. 2 wrongs dont make a right.

try and stay on-topic from now on

Yea, Kison's got you on this one. You can't put this on him.

you not paying attention? i bolded it for you.

[Battle Mage]

you criticise me for error, yet it was your errors that started the whole conversation.
you criticise me for crap logic, yet you are the one who professes lynching a player based on their ability, not their affiliation.
The irony is killing me!

Actually, I think I'm right on topic. Your constant attempts at craplogic and trying to bulldoze error and responsbility off of yourself and onto other people is starting to get really counterproductive. You're not helping the town at all, so why should we keep you around?

FoS: Battle Mage

[Battle Mage]

same old crap arguments. im beginning to doubt that your experience has taught you alot about this game, as you seem to have neglected the basic principles. if you think im that idiotic, by all means ignore me, or, failing that quit the game. you could even invest in a stress-ball for us when you read my comments. However, such an attitude is CERTAINLY going to be detrimental to the town, as it means we lose the majority of your contribution to the game. Still, im happy to sacrifice that, if it means that your comments stick to the actual game. If you want to criticise my logic, be specific and relevant, otherwise just set up a:
"I HATEZ BATLE MAGEE" thread in Mish Mash
believe me, its the latest craze.
NOW, can we get back on topic?
BM

you criticise me for error, yet it was your errors that started the whole conversation.
you criticise me for crap logic, yet you are the one who professes lynching a player based on their ability, not their affiliation.
The irony is killing me!

Actually, I think I'm right on topic. Your constant attempts at craplogic and trying to bulldoze error and responsbility off of yourself and onto other people is starting to get really counterproductive. You're not helping the town at all, so why should we keep you around?

FoS: Battle Mage

I took responsbility for my error and apologized. You continually try to shift responsibility off yourself to make it look like someone else is at fault.

To be honest, regardless of alignment, you are being detrimental to the town. We're getting nothing done because we have to deal with your idiotic comments. Even

if

you are protown, we have a better chance of winning the game if you're dead. The scum can take advantage of you and use you as a distraction to hide from the town and keep us from lynching correctly. We're better of lynching you now instead of leaving you alive to lose the game for us later. And that's only

if

you are protown, which I'm starting to doubt. I find it hard to believe that a person can be this illogical without having some sort of agenda.

[Battle Mage]

man, this is getting increasingly like a conspiracy against me here...
i have only played 1 game with Stoofer, which has finished, so there is no reason not to say anything. If it is the game i am thinking of, i cannot see what you are getting at however.
BM

Trust me on this, MoS: Battle Mage can be that annoying in any game situation, it may have nothing to do with a hidden agenda. Ask Stoofer after the game is over.

That said, BM's craplogic doesn't help us today, but I still prefer Raffles for today's lynch. Where is everyone else?

[Battle Mage]

i hope you dont spend as much effort beating up your wife and kids as you do people over the internet...

This debate is still going on?

*smack Battle Mage*

[Battle Mage]

Unvote, Vote: PBug

possibly the worst escuse for joining a wagon EVER.
also, why do you post in this game, yet in others you have had to be replaced due to inactivity?
BM

[Battle Mage]

*notes PBug joining the largest wagon in the game*
vote stands, obviously.

[Battle Mage]

I don't kick puppies.

your avatar seems to imply differently...

[Battle Mage]

Unvote

the reasoning wasnt great and with hindsight, MoS is far less scummy looking here than in most of his games.
BM

[Battle Mage]

yeh lol. i remembered after i posted it.
Ah well,

Vote: PBug

BM pretty sure you were voting PBug not MoS, getting mixed up are we?

[Battle Mage]

bah, i dont like the part about BM getting lynched, but i DO like the part about PBug getting lynched. its workable-IF we can get enough activity.

[Battle Mage]

to be fair, Kison scum would never miss out on an opportunity to lynch me. The fact that he recognises the lack of logic in those wagons is to his credit...
On another note, i dont think todays lynch is restricted to 3 candidates-2 of whom are on 2 votes...
It would be significantly easier to lynch someone on 0 votes but who looks as scummy as hell, than to force a lynch on an obviously protown player with 2 votes.
Shanba, could you please explain your vote on DrippingGoofBall?

I don't see much of a reason to go for the other two of your candidates.

You're right. Not much of a reason, I agree. Is that some slick attempt of yours to try to derail my attempts to find scum? If the other two candidates are weak, perhaps you would be an interesting alternative. Thanks for showing up and signalling your interest for the job.

See Raffles? We already have an interesting reaction from Kison. Let's shake before we bake.

unvote, vote: Kison

[Battle Mage]

Nice try at making me look bad, DGB, but I already said it.

in general you dont need any help to do this...

[Battle Mage]

your paranoia is becoming increasingly evident...

Nice try at making me look bad, DGB, but I already said it.

in general you dont need any help to do this...

Only to you and your army of clowns.

[Battle Mage]

sorry i must have lost this, but, reasons?

hrm... I've been more satisfied with DGB's recent posts, and I get the feeling she's getting into the game. I'm willing to move back to my original suspect now.

unvote Vote Albert B. Rampage

[Battle Mage]

I don't think it's a particularly helpful exercise though.

I have to agree with this. i'd find it infinitely better if you commented on OTHER players, and, rather than apologising for lack of contributions, make an effort to right the situation.

[Battle Mage]

His "mixed feelings" about BM aren't to BM's credit, if mneme turns up scum.

vote: mneme

i dont like this post atall. Not because it mentions me, but moreso because of the lack of recognition of its significance for DGB herself. IF Mneme comes up town, that reflects VERY badly on you, who, despite being called very scummy, has yet to recieve a vote.
Im not saying Mneme is town (i think i should reread him on that) but i think your post has the air of scumbuddy who wants to plan the next days lynch.
BM

[Battle Mage]

fyi-its my opinion that as scum, it is good to put suspicion on your buddies, but not to actually vote for them.
This could well be what Mneme is doing here. Of course, that is largely dependant on whether or not he is scum, but its my first thoughts.

When a scum points to 3 people they find scummy, I like to look for the "exception" in the lot. I am "très scummy" and raffles is "obvious scum" but he has mere "mixed feelings" for you, BM. This being said, I don't find this to be compelling evidence that you may be scum, at all. Just a tiny tickmark next to your name.

If Mneme's post contained some INSIGHT I would not look for these little details. It looks like he read nothing, and just tossed these little accusations that he thought would not stand out. I bet he's pretty shocked that I jumped on him so quickly, since his post was carefully designed not to offend.

How much work did Mneme really put in to conclude that Raffles, BM and myself are scum? None whatsoever. And if he didn't put any effort into it, and hasn't read the thread with looking for scum in mind, I have to wonder why BM gets a "mixed feelings" break. Since Mneme is out to deceive us, what is his purpose? Distancing - but not downright bussing? But he could also be wanting to cast suspicions on all 3 of us, and simply used different wording to give a fake appearance of variety.

[Battle Mage]

i have no idea. please reiterate it for me.

[Battle Mage]

raffles, answer my question.

[Battle Mage]

err as a note: IM NOT VOTING FOR YOU. There is a reason for that, I AM BY NO MEANS CONVINCED THAT YOU ARE SCUM. I am a little confused as to why you seem to think i am attacking you. I dont even think i have been making assumptions based on you being scum-which is far from certain imo.
im going to plead ignorance here. Please refer me to the actual posts of mine that you are referring to.
BM

[Battle Mage]

i believe a couple of us are voting for him.
response enough?

I'm dismayed by a lack of response for my case against Pbug. Is there anyone out there?

[Battle Mage]

lol Raffles, are you seriously suggesting that because some people didnt ask for a deadline retraction, they are scum. LMAO.
Thats some serious BM Logic u got there...

[Battle Mage]

true, but at this point, there would be no reason for ANY player-town or scum, to not want a deadline, considering that there is only 1 real contender for lynch atm. Of course, IF you were scum, those asking for a retraction are likely your scumbuddies.
BM

....aaaand Phoebus comes in at the nick of time.

lol Raffles, are you seriously suggesting that because some people didnt ask for a deadline retraction, they are scum. LMAO.
Thats some serious BM Logic u got there...

Well if you are a scum, you'd prefer me to shut the hell up and get lynched already. I'm not saying that's a 100% proof, just something that smells strong.

[Battle Mage]

im not trying to convince anyone of anything.
I dont really think Raffles is scum, and as such, i can see that scum could well be pushing his wagon. to this end, there is little reason why scum would decline a deadline retraction, when they know a Raffles lynch is likely anyway.
my vote is on PBug because i think he could be scum. genius eh?

true, but at this point, there would be no reason for ANY player-town or scum, to not want a deadline, considering that there is only 1 real contender for lynch atm. Of course, IF you were scum, those asking for a retraction are likely your scumbuddies.

Why are you trying to convince people Raffles is the only contender but voting PBuG instead? Are you worried your hands will get dirty?

[Battle Mage]

no you arent. at no point did i say that i WANTED a Raffles lynch, but i do think that there is unlikely to be an alternative if it is scum pushing his wagon.

im not trying to convince anyone of anything.
I dont really think Raffles is scum, and as such, i can see that scum could well be pushing his wagon. to this end, there is little reason why scum would decline a deadline retraction, when they know a Raffles lynch is likely anyway.
my vote is on PBug because i think he could be scum. genius eh?

So you think PBug is scum and Raffles is not, but you don't want to convince people to vote someone other than Raffles, since you claim he's the only true contender for today's lynch? Am I getting this right?

[Battle Mage]

i think Bird does need replacing, as he has been replaced in Wolves.
N9V should be around as he just started modding a game lol

[Battle Mage]

hmm, i dont exactly approve of wagonning Flay while he isnt around to defend himself, but from PBuG's reaction, i could see Flay as potential scum.
Has he picked up his prod?

[Battle Mage]

its hard to refrain from quoting in a game which moves so fast...

[Battle Mage]

its difficult to remember to do so, as it is only this game in which such restrictions exist.
Tell me, is it the fact my quotes go above my posts, or is it just quoting unnecessary information that you have a problem with?

[Battle Mage]

DGB-u cant be serious!?
read PBuG's vote again. hes so obviously bussing its funny

[Battle Mage]

lol you are so obviously defending PBuG, its even funnier!
Have you even read the post where he votes?
he actually admits that he will regret joining that wagon later in the game-presumably because he will have 1 less buddy.
i dont blame him for joining the wagon early, when less experienced townies will consider it a fair move.
Oh and in response to your accusation, i would have joined the wagon myself, were it not for you and PBuG acting like conspiring scumbuddies.

Unvote, Vote: DGB

PBuG's vote is the third. He's not bussing his buddy when his buddy has only two votes, with a single player pushing for the wagon, and who plays under the alias "DrippingGoofball."

You are so obviously refusing to bus, it's funny.

[Battle Mage]

dont be stupid. there are obviously numerous ways that his comment can be construed-if questionned, he could easily change the meaning. However, i know what i read, and the way in which i read it indicated scum.
but to an extent, i agree with you. The case on PBug/Flay scumbuddies is strong, but not nearly as strong as the case for you being scum. Your actions have been opportunistic-you seem to have accused most of the players of being scum at some point today...
Not only that, but you have acted uncharacteristically aggressive.
In response to your comments about MoS, i am really beginning to doubt that he is scum. Of the 2 of you, i find him neutral, whereas you are looking completely scummy...

*oh i forgot appeal to emotion as another of your scumtells DGB.

BM

He actually admits that he will regret joining that wagon later in the game-presumably because he will have 1 less buddy.

Geezusss!

Yeah, like an experienced player like PBuG would say he'll regret joining this wagon later, because he is in fact bus'ing his SCUMBUDDY MR FLAY!!! PBuG really hates bus'ing his buddies early on like that, so he's broadcasting his remorse and sadness to the town to make sure we're going to nab him next!

BattleMage, that's preposterous, AND hilarious.

And best of all... if you believe that PBuG is sad because he's bus'ing his buddy Flay, that means that both Flay and PBuG are scum, by your own logic. But then, instead of voting for either PBuG or Flay, you vote for me!

How 'bout that!!!

Tell me the truth. Are you an aspiring comedian?

[Battle Mage]

which is why my vote isnt on PBuG now.

[Battle Mage]

@xreyox-i dont recall the occassion you are talking about, but i assume my vote change would have been based on a strong case against him. i didnt vote for OTU yesterday because he was inactive-i strongly felt him to be scum. i didnt feel quite as strongly about Flay.
BM

[Battle Mage]

first off, please read my comments before you try to reply to them.
i am curious as to why you are so sure that PBuG isnt scum. besides, ive already stated that i find you scummier than either him or Flay, hence my vote is on you.
comprende?

Wait a minute, you little fiend.

First off, your vote isn't on PBuG, it's on me. Link for the skeptics

"The case on PBug/Flay scumbuddies is strong" - you wrote. I beg to differ. PBuG may be scum, but he's not scum with Flay, c'mon. You go figure it out. I am too exasperated with you to explain it again.

You don't even know who you're voting for. You don't know whether you're afoot on on horseback.

You accuse PBuG and Flay of being scumbuddies, yet you vote for a third party, then you insist you are voting for PBUG???

[Battle Mage]

i believe i have already answered that scernario.

[Battle Mage]

yes i know i did. in fact, i told you that here:
"i didnt vote for OTU yesterday

because

he was inactive-i strongly felt him to be scum."
thats not saying that i didnt vote for him, its saying that i didnt vote for him for the reasons you suggested.
BM

[Battle Mage]

@xreyox-i dont recall the occassion you are talking about, but i assume my vote change would have been based on a strong case against him.

^This about sums it up. if you want me to reread the specific instance, so i have a better answer, please direct me to it, and i will do so.

BM

[Battle Mage]

Akbar do you have anything to back up your comments, or do you find it satisfactory to defend your scumbuddies in broad daylight?

Right now, my favorite scum candidates are

Flay

, MoS, and memne. You guys are making it too easy, like shooting fish in a barrel.

(strikethrough by Akbar)
I would add BM and Shanba to the list though. I guess everyone voting you. Right now the town is clearly not in charge of the voting. But, your doing a great job of shaking things up. Just because MoS and his Shanbaflunky voted for you doesn't mean your getting lynched. No need for the doom speech.
In regards to the ESE "clearly not being Mafia, just because its not spelled that way." This game takes place in a town with horse drawn carriages. The mafia don't have to be pasta-eating, cadillac-driving, guidos with tommy-guns. ESE could just be the flavor.

[Battle Mage]

did they? i dont recall that. please explain how my behaviour here is different, and im sure i can reference you to multiple games in which i have acted exactly the same.
BM

Akbar do you have anything to back up your comments, or do you find it satisfactory to defend your scumbuddies in broad daylight?

In regards to you personally or your whole team? Because several people already talked about how your acting different. It just never stuck because Mos was busy leading the charge on Raffles.
Course then MoS changed his position on Raffles and decided to bash PBuG for voting the same person. Now Raffles is "the most informative lynch" which I guess is a quiet way of keeping the vote hop going without appearing too scummy.
DGB is right about Memne's posts. I think there intentionally being written to confuse the readers. I still can't figure out how Memne got the pass on role fishing and then blamed it on the target for "volunteering" information.
Shanba's feigned attack on Memne, followed by the hand shake later, reeks of distancing.
MoS's response to my posts kinda clued me into his partner though. When I mentioned how Shanba was scummy, he jumped down my throat saying he didn't give a f*** what I thought. But, I post suspicions about DGB and it changes to, oh good point, I can see that.
About Flay, I think he's doing it on purpose for Out of Game reasons. He threatened to leave the game if activity didn't pick up. Of course I just gave him an out to use, but if we're hemming up folks lurking, as xReyox pointed out, there's plenty to choose from.

[Battle Mage]

yes i can vouch for SV on this. lol

[Battle Mage]

No Akbar. I want you to prove to me (and everyone else) that i have been acting different in this game to others.

Theo, at the risk of being call opportunistic, i reccommend u reveal the reason for your votes.

BM

did they? i dont recall that. please explain how my behaviour here is different, and im sure i can reference you to multiple games in which i have acted exactly the same.

You want me to convince you that your scum? I don't think that will be useful considering you won't be voting yourself.

Interesting. You've got it all worked out, don't you? I look forward to making you eat your words.

Yes, tonight in fact, right? That's what you'd like to say. At least when my corpse is examined tomorrow, it will show how Shanba showed up and went straight after a townie when no suspicion was on me. Flay's support of Shanba's attack was noted, though I'm not convinced he's scum yet.

@SV Hate to see ya leave, your one of the few people I trusted around here.

[Battle Mage]

nice Appeal to Emotion there, but it doesnt conceal the fact that this is blatantly an ill-considered OMGUS vote.

I could see myself voting for Battle Mage at this point. He's not answering questions, but he himself is asking a lot of what I would describe as "leading questions." When you add all of it up, you begin to see the outline of a scumbag in the fog.

vote: Battle Mage

I believe that's a 4th vote.

[Battle Mage]

why have you put my name above the quote, when it wasnt me who said it?
misrepresentation FTL.

[Battle Mage]

lol kk

[Battle Mage]

huh-was yesterdays death a DayVig or a Modkill?

also, i found the flavour awesome. cheers Phoebus

[Battle Mage]

this seems rather timely, considering Lowell did the same thing to you in another game recently. i recall that most people were willing to believe the claimed cop in that situation. are you hoping that the same thing will work here?

FoS: N9V

[Battle Mage]

no seriously, im in alot of games with N9V, and this same thing happened AGAINST him there. i just have a gut feeling that he thinks the same thing will work here, and he will gain unquestionned protection for a while.
i think if he is a cop, he should reveal his innocent, as the scum are bound to kill him tonight anyway.
BM

this seems rather timely, considering Lowell did the same thing to you in another game recently. i recall that most people were willing to believe the claimed cop in that situation. are you hoping that the same thing will work here?

FoS: N9V

Battle Mage, it's much too early in a game this size for scum to expect to get much out of an unforced cop claim. I'll side with MoS's apparent belief that the claim was foolish and unnecessary, but I doubt that it's a lie.

[Battle Mage]

@BM: According to your theory suggesting n9v is scum, what do you think he is trying to achieve? trading 1 town lynch with his life? not quite profitable for his scum group at this time of the day I believe.

if that happens, he could easily claim insanity. otherwise, its quite possible that hes throwing his buddy IH under the bus, in order to confirm himself. Then he can go on to claim each of his other buddies are innocent.

BM

[Battle Mage]

you forget that N9V claimed prematurely before in a game with 2 scumgroups. in fact, its so remarkably similar, its uncanny!

However, i think his claim can be verified, as there is one person in this game who should know almost certainly that it is true: The Cop who can detect Wolves.

in the meantime, i think an IH lynch is the best way to go.

Vote: IH

@BM: According to your theory suggesting n9v is scum, what do you think he is trying to achieve? trading 1 town lynch with his life? not quite profitable for his scum group at this time of the day I believe.

if that happens, he could easily claim insanity. otherwise, its quite possible that hes throwing his buddy IH under the bus, in order to confirm himself. Then he can go on to claim each of his other buddies are innocent.

BM

He'd have to be really stupid scum to claim right now. If scum are really stupid, they tend to give themselves away sooner or later anyway. Hence, I see no reason not to test his result.

Vote: IH

Also, why is everyone assuming N9V gets nightkilled? Last time i checked, we didn't have a dead doc yet.

[Battle Mage]

no i wasnt trying to defend IH, moreso to raise a valid point AGAINST N9V. The fact that my stance has changed is due to the number of good points made against me, and the fact that his claim needs to be tested.
Nice try though. planning to lynch me tomorrow after you have bussed your buddy?

FOS: Xreyox

@BM: Were you trying to defend for IH when n9v first claimed, went silent to see how the wagon is heading, then now decide to bus him? The change of view from the last one to this one and the time gap between the two looks suspicious.

[Battle Mage]

im guessing this is because i criticised your logic in another game today, after you made some rather silly comments.
OMGUS ALERT.

@Xreyox-post 1289 made no sense. Think, then type.

I guess lynching DGB under LynchAllLiars for claiming that Battle Mage is not annoying can wait.

I will never, never again say that BM is not annoying. I am deeply ashamed of having suggested otherwise.

Take that to the bank. If I am ever in a game with BM, and he survives the night, I am not a vig.

[Battle Mage]

no, Shanba killed DGB.
i agree that IH was almost certainly town, and thus i am certain that N9V is scum. having an insane cop in such a naturally confusing game would just be silly...

i think todays choice is pretty obvious. Didnt N9V say that he could only detect 1 scumgroup?
im willing to wager that he took a gamble here, and guessed that IH was in the OPPOSING SCUMGROUP. thats why he changed his mind about which he could investigate. The way he saw it, he would either buy his buddies another day, or become confirmed cop, and live alot longer.

Vote: N9V

Ok, what the hell? From what I can tell, IH was town. Now, ~N9V~ is either scum and lying, or an insane cop of some sort.

We also know that Shanba killed Mastermind of Sin. So he wasn't lying about being the Vigilante.

We know that Mastermind of Sin killed Shanba. He was a werewolf.

We know that someone also killed Mastermind of Sin. Since our Vigilante is dead, I'm going to guess that it was the ESE?

[Battle Mage]

thats total BS. clinches my vote. N9V is scum.
BM

I have only one good explanation for why IH turned out Scum for me. Mabey he is the counter GodFather type role? Where if investigated, he turns up scum. Cuz all politics are scummy in one manner or another. Also, I couldn't veiw anyone last night, because of 'strange occurences'. I still beleive I'm sane, and Raffles isn't the way to go today.

Also,

Vote BM

Your willing to kill a claimed cop because of some little fight of me being sane/insane. Even so, if I'm insane, I can still contribute lots. I'm beleiving your scum as of now, and thereso, your the play today.

[Battle Mage]

sorry, why isnt N9V scum?

[Battle Mage]

sorry, why isnt N9V scum?

hello?

[Battle Mage]

im still not atall sure we why arent lynching the lying cop?

[Battle Mage]

Right now, my vote idleing between BM and Kison. I don't like how the strange occurences took place last night. But BM wanting to lynch a claimed cop, thats just unremarkably scummy.

Unvote

for now, until I can figure out who deserves my vote more.

im obviously missing something here.
this is what i got:

N9V claims cop.
claims guilty investigation on IH.
IH dies and comes up town.

Now, i must be missing something pretty major here, so please spell it out to me. As far as i can see, N9V's claim has been well and truly disproven, barring a miriad of infinitely unlikely circumstances.

So, why arent we lynching the scumbag?

BM

[Battle Mage]

but did it say 'out and out' that he was a Werewolf or Mafia, or whatever N9V claimed to have seen?
NO.

Right now, my vote idleing between BM and Kison. I don't like how the strange occurences took place last night. But BM wanting to lynch a claimed cop, thats just unremarkably scummy.

Unvote

for now, until I can figure out who deserves my vote more.

im obviously missing something here.
this is what i got:

N9V claims cop.
claims guilty investigation on IH.
IH dies and comes up town.

Now, i must be missing something pretty major here, so please spell it out to me. As far as i can see, N9V's claim has been well and truly disproven, barring a miriad of infinitely unlikely circumstances.

The circumstances are a million miles from 'infinitely unlikely.' IH's death scene was kinda mysterious on the subject of his alignment- good reason to suspect, etc, but no firm proof- it didn't say out-and-out that IH was town.

[Battle Mage]

im finding it awfully hard to believe N9V. typically, a cop who has been confirmed to have lied under such circumstances, would at least recieve some pressure. the fact that nobody has bothered concerns me a little, but the lack of wagon means my suspicions are pretty useless.

[Battle Mage]

err yes. he said IH was scum, IH came up town. thats LYING.
Dont get me wrong, its POSSIBLE that he is insane or something, but it just feels unlikely that a power role who already has a strong weakness (only able to detect 1 type of scum) would also be delusional.
Doesnt sit right with me atall.

still, its not too concerning that im picking up votes. just another reason why i think N9V is scum. I mean, it seems odd from where im sitting, that i am the only 1 to accuse N9V of being scum, and suddenly i acquire a nice juicy wagon

Id have at least expected the opposing scumgroup (to N9V's) to back me up...

im finding it awfully hard to believe N9V. typically, a cop who has been

confirmed to have lied

under such circumstances, would at least recieve some pressure. the fact that nobody has bothered concerns me a little, but the lack of wagon means my suspicions are pretty useless.

THat's it.

Unvote, vote Battle Mage

He has not been confirmed a liar. Repeating it doesn't make it true.

[Battle Mage]

No! It's not! It would be lying if we could prove that IH appeared innocent to investigations, AND N9V is definitely not insane. As we cannot prove either of those things, we cannot say for sure that N9V is lying.

and ive pointed out that imho, both of those scenarios are immensely unlikely. the timing of the claim itself was scummy enough (as me and Kison already discussed) but the fact that his investigation failed is enough for me...

[Battle Mage]

and ive pointed out that imho, both of those scenarios are immensely unlikely.

No, they're not. It's as simple as that.

that would be your OPINION then, correct?
so, enlighten me. Why do you think that me having a different opinion to you about something makes me scum?

[Battle Mage]

It's not that you have a different opinion, it's that you're presenting your opinion as fact and using it to push a course of action that is to the town's detriment.

rofl. how ironic, seeing as you just did the same thing. If you have EVIDENCE to say that N9V is telling the truth, be my guest in saying so, so i can concentrate on the real scum. saying that N9V is so obviously town, and killing him would be bad for everyone, then wagonning a certain townie, is completely ridiculous, and gives you little credibility in my eyes.

[Battle Mage]

WHAT THE HELL???? You want to keep a dubious cop alive indefinitely for at least 4 days!?
it'll probably be endgame by then.

oh and fyi-i would agree with your post 1433, were it not for the fact that surprisingly, N9V has not been called up on his failed claim, making me think that someone is protecting him. I mean face it, if he was town, the scum would have jumped on that claim. the fact that they havent definitely indicates something dodgy...

No, I didn't. I never said N9V is definitely town. This is an obvious and blatant misrepresentation. I said, we have enough reason to think N9V might still be town that it would clearly be a mistake to lynch him

today

. There are positions which fall between 'lynch him now' and 'never lynch him.' Namely, keep him alive for another four or so days, collecting investigations, then if he hasn't been nightkilled by then, we think about lynching him.

Oh, and nice rolefishing.

[Battle Mage]

I think we have to get back to the question about IH's role.

@BM: So are you sure that IH would have come up town when investigated by a normal cop?

i dont know. according to his deathscene, he was town, so i would guess so.

@The Fonz-your logic is ridiculous. You are scared to kill Raffles or N9V because even though it might gain information, they might be town, and then decide to lynch me, who is town, and will probably teach you nothing. Not to mention you will have the same quandry tomorrow, but with less players left to decide.

the fact he has just OMGUSed me, seals the deal.

BM

[Battle Mage]

lol suit yourself. all it means is that the town has 1 less day in order kill the scum. If N9V is lying, he's played you all for fools.
BM

@The Fonz-your logic is ridiculous. You are scared to kill Raffles or N9V because even though it might gain information, they might be town, and then decide to lynch me, who is town, and will probably teach you nothing. Not to mention you will have the same quandry tomorrow, but with less players left to decide.

the fact he has just OMGUSed me, seals the deal.

BM

MY logic is ridiculous? That's a good one, BM. So your reason we shouldn't vote you is 1) you say you're town and b) we'll get less information from it than other lynches.

What the hell makes you think we'll learn nothing from your lynch? We're far more likely to learn more from a new wagon, than from reheating and old one (Raffles). We'll learn even more BY KEEPING THE GODDAMN COP ALIVE!

Also, lynching for information is in general a bad idea. I want you lynched because I'm confident you're scum. No other reason is necessary, or indeed desirable.

As for the OMGUS- you know this is N9V we're talking about, right?

[Battle Mage]

Theo-you'd only be happy lynching me if you were scum.

[Battle Mage]

i cant argue with vibes lol. facts are much easier. what i will say is that my play isnt consistent. i spose that helps make me more difficult to read. other than that, i cant explain your view. suffice to say, you are wrong, and the fact your whole argument for me being scum is based on the possibility of me being scum, warrants further consideration.

[Battle Mage]

i think the fact he is AMAZINGLY far from being proven cop, does discount such theories as evidence.

[Battle Mage]

Heh, well yeah, I think BM id the play today. wanting to lynch a claimed cop (no matter how much you beleive it) is horribly scummy.

no its NOT. Let me reiterate how im seeing this:

Player A claims cop.
Player A claims guilty investigation on Player B.
Town lynches Player B.
Player B comes up town.

thats the short version. now, obviously that doesnt CONFIRM you as scum. Hence you arent going to get lynched today. However, you cant seriously tell me that you are surprised that im doubting your claim?!
i mean, surely you would have expected some criticism, even if you were genuine town. so, dont give me the crap about "dont lynch a claimed cop", because in my mind, your claim has fallen flat on its face. For all intents and purposes, you have been proven to be a liar. at least, there is significant evidence to that fact.

@Kison-i dont know. his activity hs been sub-par. i dont have anything noteworthy to say about him without a reread.

[Battle Mage]

Fine, lets use your little scenerio. I'm scum (not actually), and I say hes scum, to get my group a little ahead. O.K. Fine. Why this early? Why would I do it when there is still tonnes of people left? Shouldn't I do this when there is less people, to make more of a advantage to my scum group. And using your logic, Raffles is scum then. I'm not saying he isn't, but in a game like this, I doubt there is any insane cops.

But see, you just won't even try to accept the fact that IH could've been a miller. Why not? Is'nt there a chance that he could've been one?

lol there is a CHANCE. but what is more likely-a scumbag pretending to be cop, or a miller who wasnt revealed as being a miller when he died, nor was there any indication of him being one?
i think the answer is obvious.
As for why you did it so early, ive explained the potential context already. It wasnt long before your claim, that you were killed elsewhere by a claimed cop. this cop was trusted implicitly. i guess you hoped for the same thing here.
tbh, i might even believe you about the odd timing of the claim, but for the fact that nobody is accusing you other than me. now lets face it, if you were town, the scum would be all over you now. the fact that they arent suggests that they are either not taking a risk of outing themselvs or they want to protect their buddy.

BM

[Battle Mage]

im totally lost in this game now...

[Battle Mage]

lol possibly the most non-existant excuse for a vote ever. :p

[Battle Mage]

Hmmm, I put BM in the lead with 4 votes and Fuldu switches to Bird to make it a tie. Wonder if that's just coincidence.

somebody's jumping at shadows...

[Battle Mage]

That may be the case. But, I was right about MoS. At the moment, you and Fuldu are the best lead I have.

thats fine, as long as you TRY and think objectively when faced with something new. If you are town, and go in with the attitude that i am automatically scum, you may aswell be scum. oh and dont think i havent noticed your attempts to tie me to Fuldu. Common scumtell.

BM

[Battle Mage]

oh and dont think i havent noticed your attempts to tie me to Fuldu. Common scumtell.

BM

Really? Hard to believe you noticed something I blatantly stated at least 3 times already.

Btw, did you just try to say it's a common scumtell to find you and Fuldu suspicious? Do the Mods on this site give you and Fuldu town roles more than other people?

no, i suggested that its scummy to try and invent a connection between 2 players. a tactic frequently used by scum, is to tie their buddies to a townie. its possible that this is what you are attempting to do with Fuldu now.

On another note, i would be concerned about Kisons lack of useful comment, had he not be doing the same thing in other games atm...

[Battle Mage]

ah but there is difference between trying to find ties, and trying to invent them. I suspect Akbar may be doing the latter.

[Battle Mage]

can somebody tell me how to use the watchlist? i have about 15 games running simulatneously atm, and i have to remember them off the top of my head.

[Battle Mage]

ouch N9V is taking more shit than i do...
N9V, just between me and you, do you have a fetish for cop claims?

[Battle Mage]

we have a deadline for tomorrow?

[Battle Mage]

i dont think No-Lynching is a good idea, so i will

Unvote, Vote: Bird

[Battle Mage]

i dont think No-Lynching is a good idea, so i will

Unvote, Vote: Bird

This seems dubious to me. We are already in the position where Bird will be lynched at deadline. Your not voting him wouldn't prevent that. Seems to me more likely you seem particularly concerned with being seen to be on a scum wagon.

bah, i didnt read the full post. :p
still, my vote on N9V wasn't doing any good, and its better to lynch somebody who has a chance of being scum than lynching somebody who is guaranteed town.

[Battle Mage]

Who exactly is guaranteed town, BM?

ME duh. well in my eyes at least. If the only 2 wagons are on me and somebody else who i dont have any strong feelings towards, i'd rather they die than me, obviously.
comprende?

[Battle Mage]

wow, shit. I'm shocked that N9V was ACTUALLY TOWN.
I really don't know where we go from here.
any ideas?
BM

[Battle Mage]

i believe i already explained my reasons for suspecting him.

[Battle Mage]

aww, its nice that Theo chose to hide with me
unfortunately, i recieved absolutely no indication of such an event.

BM

[Battle Mage]

Truth be told I have exactly zero idea what's going on.

And yeah, I know I could read back, but I'd much rather just claim. Much easier for the lazy of heart.

QFAT. I'd request replacement if i didn't think this town was so heavily dependant on my input.
I'm prepared to claim if somebody can explain why now is the time for us to do so.

[Battle Mage]

Sigh. You've almost certainly seen me out all three nights that you've been out (given that I've seen you all three nights you've claimed to be out), and a clever person should be able to deduce what my role is from what's happening in the thread. Do you really want me to claim now?

You're right -- I think I know who you are based on something I saw.

Battle Mage, you were the close second, claim!

that sounds ominous. After my claim, i'd like an 'actual' claim from Thok, unless Kison is absolutely CERTAIN that Thok is town, and can vouch for him 100%.

I think i'm vanilla here, but i'll go and check now.

BM

[Battle Mage]

crap. I've lost my original role pm. I'll pm Phoebus to resend it to me. I don't mind if you want to put a hold on all claims until i have retrieved it. Gives us a chance to hear from Thok anyway.

BM

[Battle Mage]

that sounds ominous. After my claim, i'd like an 'actual' claim from Thok, unless Kison is absolutely CERTAIN that Thok is town, and can vouch for him 100%.

I'm sorry, you aren't the close to confirmed innocent. I'll go when Kison or PBug tells me to go and not sooner.

you are surely aware that massclaims do not only occur when there are confirmed innocents. Rather Kison and PBug have been given the right to choose the claim order. You were asked to claim, and have not done so. Thus i think it is fair to

Vote: Thok

until such a time as you do so.

Fyi, i sent a pm to Phoebus last night. I've ALREADY SAID that its fine for you to wait for him to reply. What does bug me is when i get shit for not having a role pm, for a game i started AGES ago. As it is my inbox is 99% full at all times. I don't usually delete role pms until the game is over, and i've got Townie written down on my list of games/roles, but i figured you'd probably want some flavour to go with that, which fyi, I didnt memorise.

I'm guessing from comments from Kison and Thok that my opinion in this game means jack-shit, but if anybody else gives a fuck, I'd like an explanation for Akbar's vote, which doesnt amount to " he lost his role pm-he must be scum"


(A pi$$ed off) BM

[Battle Mage]

you are surely aware that massclaims do not only occur when there are confirmed innocents. Rather Kison and PBug have been given the right to choose the claim order. You were asked to claim, and have not done so. Thus i think it is fair to

Vote: Thok

until such a time as you do so.

I asked permission from Kison to go later, with a partial explanation on why I should go later, and he agreed to it. Had he chosen to make me go early in the claim order, I would have done so. Moreover, you almost certainly have less information than either me or Kison on this subject. For all you know, Kison may plan on having me go after you claim anyways.

I don't believe you are the play today (theodor's claim is a slight plus for you, no matter what his alignment is), but that doesn't mean I have to listen to you.

tbh, if you aren't willing to listen to people if they aren't absolutely 100% town, you must be a real bastard in small games. lol

You should surely understand that people are going to find it a tad suspicious if, when asked to claim, you make a strange inference that Kison already has evidence of you being town, and then he backtracks, saying that he believes you, with no claim being made.

vote stands for now.

BM

[Battle Mage]

I have already given Kison a damn good reason. If he cannot vouch 100% for your alignment, a claim is required. there is only 1 possible scenario in which i would agree that you claiming is a bad idea, but you haven't so much as hinted at it, and even if you did, i'm not sure i'd believe you just from your behaviour.

I don't really remember anything flavour-wise about my role. All i know is that i do not have any power role, and that i am Vanilla. I'm sure whenever Phoebus turns up, i'll be able to give you a role name or whatever.

BM

tbh, if you aren't willing to listen to people if they aren't absolutely 100% town, you must be a real bastard in small games. lol

No, I'm not listening to you because I don't see any evidence of good logic from you on this subject. You clearly have less information about this subject than either Kison or me (and it's clear you haven't tried to analyze the info I have given.) If you really think that I should claim soon, you should try to convince Kison why he should overrule his better judgement and make me claim earlier.

(As an aside, I'll note that if anybody does have a guess for what role I am, they should keep quiet about it until the claim is over.)

I'll point out that this is not the only time this game you haven't shown good judgement (losing your role PM, voting N9V all of yesterday).

BM-can you at least tell us what you do remember from your role? i.e. you may not have the exact flavor, but surely you remember what sort of possible role powers you have (to some extent).

[Battle Mage]

I have already given Kison a damn good reason.

If he cannot vouch 100% for your alignment, a claim is required.

there is only 1 possible scenario in which i would agree that you claiming is a bad idea, but you haven't so much as hinted at it, and even if you did, i'm not sure i'd believe you just from your behaviour.

The bolded line isn't true. We wouldn't even be having this argument if Kison hadn't asked me to claim first (which IMHO was a mistake by him). What's the difference between him not asking me to claim first, and him asking me to claim first and then changing his mind and him allowing me to claim later when persuaded by my argument?

rofl. you didnt presuade him of anything. supposedly he already had indication that you were town. All you seemed to do was remind him.

BM

[Battle Mage]

ok good news: Phoebus resent me my pm.

I am not vanilla-i am actually a miller (nice rhyming).
thats my rolename, and characters occupation. I am Artur, Miller of Luperi.

The flavour basically describes that i have bad language, and i do some dodgy deals in my spare time, but i win with the town.

Hope this helps.

BM

[Battle Mage]

could somebody please remind me why Kison and PBuG are absolutely 100% confirmed town?

[Battle Mage]

i should probably start the Akbar wagon. OMGUS and all.

Unvote, Vote: Akbar

i think this game needs some prods.

[Battle Mage]

Battle Mage, that vote just broke my brain.

I do agree with the needs for prods. Raffles in particular needs to either post, be replaced, or be modkilled.

i dont see why. Is Akbar confirmed town?

[Battle Mage]

what if the guy i OMGUS is scum?

[Battle Mage]

this game is beginning to bore me. Do you guys want to just lynch me today?
It saves the mod having to replace me, and a lynch might get activity up.
ftr-my main suspects are still Akbar and Thok, though the latter is subject to change depending on his claim, and the former is probably partially due to OMGUS.

Unvote, Vote: BM

[Battle Mage]

try talking to Akbar then. If you value his opinion so highly, i'm sure you will be willing to hear his reasons for voting me.

[Battle Mage]

Now that's the old BM. If you had been playing that way from the beginning, I probably never would have thought anything of it. But, for the beginning few days, you were quiet, courteous, very methodical.

This is my 3rd game with you. I've never seen you act like that before and it seems out of place.

I'm not the only one who mentioned it either. You just keep using the saying "prove it" over and over until folks get tired of repeating themselves and then claim the suspicion is totally unfounded.

by old BM, i assume you mean BM when i was a complete newb?
tbh, i'm not surprised if this game has caused me to generate into a gibbering fool.

Oddly enough, i dont recall playing a game with you in quite a long time. Do you maintain the belief that over long periods of time, newbs dont improve atall?

also,

Request Replacement

.
Sorry Phoebus, but this game is killing me.

[Battle Mage]

You profess suspicion of Fuldu, yet attack me for it when Kison asks if Lowell should claim next, and I express a preference for a Fuldu claim due to my suspicion of him?

If you hadn't claimed doc, I'd be CERTAIN you were scum by now.

A Doc claim is very very weak as a rule. Its a mafioso's greatest weapon.
just wanted to put that down.
good luck guys
BM

[Battle Mage]

'butcher' sounds a bit sinister to me...

[Battle Mage]

hmm, interesting info. I dont think Theo is a good lynch for today. His claim of Hider fits remarkably well with Kisons story, about him only being out last night. Thok is probably town, although i wont be certain until we hear from the final person to claim. need to reread before i vote based on this info though.

BM

[Battle Mage]

ok, call me incredibly thick, but if Akbar was a Doctor, why didnt he protect someone on 1 night? Roleblocking doesnt fit, and i cant really see any other explanation.

FoS: Akbar

[Battle Mage]

lol thanks for that Kison. However, whilst i may be incredibly thick, YOU are incredibly illiterate, as my post said Akbar did not submit an action on ONE NIGHT, not NIGHT ONE.
So my question remains, but this time, please at least understand it before handing out the mandatory insult.

ok, call me incredibly thick, but if Akbar was a Doctor, why didnt he protect someone on 1 night? Roleblocking doesnt fit, and i cant really see any other explanation.

FoS: Akbar

Battle

Mafia

Mage,

you are incredibly thick!

First of all, PBuG and I did not LOOK for anyone night one. We handed out gifts. I assume you assume that Akbar did not protect someone because I did not list his name for night one.

Second of all, Akbar

did

protect someone night one.

The first night I protected SV(now The Fonz). The 2nd night was PBuG. Tonight will be PBuG again.

[Battle Mage]

ok. this ofc begs the question, why would the mod forbid him from saying something? Unless Phoebus made some sort of embarrassing error, i can't see why he would do that. Tell me, did he claim that he missed a night, before or after Kison claimed Watcher?

lol thanks for that Kison. However, whilst i may be incredibly thick, YOU are incredibly illiterate, as my post said Akbar did not submit an action on ONE NIGHT, not NIGHT ONE.
So my question remains, but this time, please at least understand it before handing out the mandatory insult.

ok, call me incredibly thick, but if Akbar was a Doctor, why didnt he protect someone on 1 night? Roleblocking doesnt fit, and i cant really see any other explanation.

FoS: Akbar

Battle

Mafia

Mage,

you are incredibly thick!

First of all, PBuG and I did not LOOK for anyone night one. We handed out gifts. I assume you assume that Akbar did not protect someone because I did not list his name for night one.

Second of all, Akbar

did

protect someone night one.

The first night I protected SV(now The Fonz). The 2nd night was PBuG. Tonight will be PBuG again.

Bah, you're right. But you have to admit, it was weirdly worded!

And yes, he did say that he was unable to protect one of the nights, and that the moderator forbid him to say why. Go check near where he claimed.

[Battle Mage]

^i dont understand this. could you please reword it for a simpleton like me? lol

[Battle Mage]

hmm, interesting info. I dont think Theo is a good lynch for today.

What's interesting is you going from asking for a replacement because you couldn't continue, to doubling your activity when Theo gets mentioned as the strategic lynch.

actually no, the reason i am posting is more related to the fact that i at last have an opinion, and as i have not yet been formally replaced, i figure it can't hurt to voice that opinion. As far as i am aware, i am still being replaced, but i really can't see why you don't want me to contribute in the meantime. If nothing else, it will help you to get a better idea of my successor.

BM

[Battle Mage]

Occam's Razor suggests that the cat and Akbar's mysterious roleblock Night 3 are connected.

Kison, just to clarify, who of you/PBug are going out on the broom tonight? I solely want this information to be public so that Akbar knows who to protect.

so you actually think Akbar is a Doc?

[Battle Mage]

Honestly, I'm being voted why exactly? Because I was out last night and it doesn't fit in with Kison's results. I've explained why that was, we've yet to even hear from everyone with regards claims, which I think we should. I'm pretty confident the real killer is happily sitting back. Raffles has posted everywhere but here lately . . . and yet I'm still prime suspect number one, despite giving a damn good reason for my appearance last night.

Vote for Akbar. If you arent scum, its pretty obvious that he is. simple no?

[Battle Mage]

Sorry, thought I had already voted. However before, I would like to know why BM refuses to vote. If you have a reason to think that Theoper is likely town (or more likely than Akbar, at least) speak now. Do you have a reason to disbelieve Akbar's claim?

well obviously...
He has claimed Doctor, and yet we have certifiable proof that he hasn't used his role every night, which strongly indicates that he is lying. When confronted with this, he brings up the incredibly unlikely story of "The Mod forbade me from saying". A Doc-Claim ofc is always a weak one, as it is an ideal fakeclaim for scum. This in addition to Akbar's general dubious behaviour, make him a much better lynch than Theo for today at least.

Oh and if it matters, i could also see Thok as scum (simply down to his claim of 'Butcher', and his general reluctance to claim originally.

BM

[Battle Mage]

Thok claimed butcher? Not from what I read.

Anyways

vote Raffles

Only because he needs to speak, claim what not. I'm still convinced the killer/s last night appears invisible.

As regards Thok's questions above - I've already indicated why I felt safer hiding last night, it's WIFOM in a regard but with two scum killing groups present I felt they'd attack someone unlikely to get any protection. I wasn't clued up on breadcrumbing when I joined this game, hence didn't do so.

ah sorry, that was Fuldu. My mistake. lol

[Battle Mage]

meh

Unvote, Vote: Theo

On your heads be it.

[Battle Mage]

can someone tell Jdodge to stop pissing about with his alts.

[Battle Mage]

Were you scum?

[Battle Mage]

Afraid not.

dammit. Akbar must be scum then...

in other news: YAY FLAY!

[Battle Mage]

I blocked Fuldu (now celtic) last night. [For a quick explanation of my choice of roleblock, on various rereads Fuldu struck me as the most likely mafia by process of elimination. I'll explain in more detail if people want me to.] The lack of a mafia kill strongly suggests he's Lucius Lovato, the last mafia.

BM and Raffles (now Tarhalindur) are probably both werewolves.

Unfortunately, ThAdmiral can't confirm this (I got an item last night, which means he probably didn't use his broomstick).

It looks like the daykills are a form of werewolf kill.

thats odd, because i too got an item. Apparently, i cant use it until tonight, and i dont even know what it is, but i got a pm during the night from the mod.
Anyway, Theo came up town. As far as i can see, Akbar must be scum, right?
Thok's comments don't make a whole lot of sense to me. I mean, Theo came up town. So from that alone you can ascertain that we are not scumbuddies. Yet why did you then infer that Theo trusting me, suggested that i was NOT FROM THE SAME SCUMGROUP as him?

BM

[Battle Mage]

Thok's comments don't make a whole lot of sense to me. I mean, Theo came up town. So from that alone you can ascertain that we are not scumbuddies.

(Bolding for anyone interested in changing Theopor's lynch results.)

theopor_COD was lynched by the group, including Battle Mage coming back from his sabbatical to jump up and down on the lever of the gallows until it finally gave way.

Good thing

, too, since theo's hands were

dirty as sin

.

ah i see. lol
just not reading i guess. I hate the fact that we cant just have the results posted in red for scum and green for town. But whatever. That indicates that Akbar probably is town. Thus i must look elsewhere. So, why have 2 items been recieved last night?

I dont understand what Thok is saying atall. I also dont see how he can be telling the truth about recieving an item. Furthermore he seems very eager to rush into a lynch without hearing from the relevant players.

BM

[Battle Mage]

well i have to say, it is strange to see Akbar still alive. But anyway, i think the best course of action is for all power roles to claim what they did last night. That really means Thok, who claimed to block Fuldu. This means there is probably a 50% chance that Fuldu is Mafia, assuming Akbar and Thok are town, and is probably the play today.
Other than that, i think it might be potent to lynch the ESE members next. of the claims, those are the only ones that i can discern as potential scum-claims.

thoughts?
BM

[Battle Mage]

The easiest explanation for why Akbar is alive is that I blocked the mafia from potentially killing him, and that BM submitted the wolves nightkill and stupidly thought that Akbar is scum (and consequently BM foolishly thought he could get Akbar lynched today).

Your desire to try to get claimed masons lynched is too much.

vote Battle Mage

I want to get that broom out of the game.

well i cant blame you for trying. Not only did i get 1 EXCUSE for lynching me-i got 3.

1. I think it was made pretty clear yesterday that Akbar probably wasnt scum.

2. Claimed masons my arse. Unless i'm missing something major here, we dont know whether ESE are protown or not. They could easily be a cult or a third scumgroup from where i am standing. Or, Fonz and Greg might not be ESE atall, and are simply claiming it because they think all ESE members are dead.

3. Why do you especially want an item out of the game? I dont know what the broom does, but your orb looks like it could be a 1-shot tracker/watcher. My broom might allow me to take up the podium in place of Kison, and deliver items to people.
Nonetheless, i am intrigued to hear why you particularly see a 'broom' as a threat, when you obviously don't consider your 'orb' to be dangerous.

Another explanation is also required-an answer to the question-why arent you voting Fuldu if you think he is scum?

Oh and 1 more thing i'd like to say ooc: Cut the insults out. Your posts seem to be so laden with propaganda, its very hard to see them as genuine. I dont know why you seem so keen to convince people that my comments are 'stupid' and/or 'foolish', but its not particularly nice. It'd be particularly appreciated if you would stop insulting me based on things which AREN'T EVEN TRUE. Try using facts before smothering me in WIFOM plz.

BM

[Battle Mage]

1. I think it was made pretty clear yesterday that Akbar probably wasnt scum.

If it was so clear, why did you start today by trying to lynch Akbar and claiming that theopor was town? It's clear that it was not clear to you that Akbar was town.

So i misread the death scene. Whoop de doo. Next question please.

2. Claimed masons my arse. Unless i'm missing something major here, we dont know whether ESE are protown or not. They could easily be a cult or a third scumgroup from where i am standing. Or, Fonz and Greg might not be ESE atall, and are simply claiming it because they think all ESE members are dead.

Scum rarely fake claim mason. We also know that the flavor of the mafia is "People at Lucius Lovato's estate", not "ESE members". The flavor of the werewolves is "Werewolf", not "ESE member". We certainly don't have the nightkills to support a third scum group. If they were a cult, they likely would have won by now.

Maybe it is rare for scum to fakeclaim mason, but there again, it does happen. Perhaps this game might be a valuable lesson for you.

3. Why do you especially want an item out of the game? I dont know what the broom does, but your orb looks like it could be a 1-shot tracker/watcher. My broom might allow me to take up the podium in place of Kison, and deliver items to people.
Nonetheless, i am intrigued to hear why you particularly see a 'broom' as a threat, when you obviously don't consider your 'orb' to be dangerous.

I don't want items in the hands of scum. You having an item isn't an argument for you being scum, but it is an argument that among the scum, you should be a higher priority lynch than the others. If ThAdmiral didn't send you an item, I'd probably be pushing for a Fuldu lynch (actually, I probably be discussing what the size of the wolf group would be to assess whether lynching Fuldu would put him in lynch or lose, but I wasn't expecting Lowell to be nightkilled, which mostly solves that problem).

I'm going to lol so much if you turn out to be town. Sadly there isnt much i can say in my defence. Most of the case on me is based on no other lynches looking as appealing.

Another explanation is also required-an answer to the question-why arent you voting Fuldu if you think he is scum?

I think getting the item out of the game before it can help scum is a higher priority than lynching Fuldu. This is a situation where we need to lynch three people in three days, and I do care that we get the order of killing scum correct.

You seem very sure about the number of scum remaining. If you are right, this game is all but over for the town. So lets hope this is BS on your part. I'm also intrigued to ask-how sure are you that i am scum?
Your words suggest certainty, yet FTR, i'd like you to state it again.

Oh and 1 more thing i'd like to say ooc: Cut the insults out. Your posts seem to be so laden with propaganda, its very hard to see them as genuine. I dont know why you seem so keen to convince people that my comments are 'stupid' and/or 'foolish', but its not particularly nice. It'd be particularly appreciated if you would stop insulting me based on things which AREN'T EVEN TRUE. Try using facts before smothering me in WIFOM plz.

My point is that your comments in thread match up with the fact that Akbar wasn't killed last night. You've outright admitted to not realizing that theopor was scum from his lynch scene (and hence thinking Akbar was scum), and it's reasonable to notice that the last two likely wolf kills reflect that fact. (Kison was daykilled rather than Akbar, and Lowell was nightkiledl rather than Akbar).

Using the words, "stupidly" and "foolishly" was probably redundant. But it's obviosu that you didn't realize that Akbar was town.

[/quote]

It astounds me that you dont think commenting on NK's is WIFOM. Its odd that pretty much every IC on the site has told me this, and yet you seem to know better. Still, i guess we'll see whether your logic adds up when i am lynched.

BM

[Battle Mage]

You seem very sure about the number of scum remaining. If you are right, this game is all but over for the town. So lets hope this is BS on your part. I'm also intrigued to ask-how sure are you that i am scum?
Your words suggest certainty, yet FTR, i'd like you to state it again.

If I'm right, the town has a nearly guaranteed win, just by lynching the people that aren't confirmed in the correct order.

I'd put the odds of you being scum around 90%, with the remaining 10% being Phoebus being a bastard mod or there only being two werewolves in the game rather than three. Like you've said, it's more that I'm fairly certain that me/Akbar/Fonz/The Greg/ThAdmiral are protown. Of the remaining three, it's clear from my roleblock that Fuldu (now celtic) is Lucius Lovato, and that leaves you and Raffless (now Tarhadilur) to be werewolves.

90%. ok lol. I simply wanted to get a figure down, so i can quote it when you've cost us the game. Sour grapes and all that, plus the fact that i would expect a better read from a player of your experience and reputation.
Still, it is a shining example of how even the greatest players in the world can make schoolboy errors

BM

[Battle Mage]

Could you tell us the full name of the broom?

I believe I can be of assistance here:
it is a broom of the finest cypress around for miles

that is correct. it does not itself have a name however.

BM

[Battle Mage]

actually i'd have said Thok was more than a 'pretty decent mafia player'. Before today, i'd have listed him as one of the best mafia players on site. Again, this game might either reinforce this view (if Thok is scum) or damage it (if Thok is town).
I dont mean it as an insult, but tbh, i try to take what i see of a player, over their reputation, any day.

Tomorrow, lynching Thok is a must. Fonz makes some good points (i thought we had 2 ESE members dead). Im thinking Fuldu and Thok are the last 2 scum.

BM

BM, this kind of thing is exactly why some people don't like you. There's no need to go with the 'you might learn something' condescension towards a pretty decent mafia player in Thok.

2. Claimed masons my arse. Unless i'm missing something major here, we dont know whether ESE are protown or not. They could easily be a cult or a third scumgroup from where i am standing. Or, Fonz and Greg might not be ESE atall, and are simply claiming it because they think all ESE members are dead.

THINK! If

all

ESE members are dead, then why has only one person come up 'ESE member?' That makes no sense. No-one living has counterclaimed Greg and I, nor has anyone other than Al come up ESE. Therefore, the only logical conclusions are that either Al was the only member of the organisation, or Greg and I are telling the truth.

If we are a third scumgroup, we are one which hasn't attempted a kill in the entire game. Had we been a cult, either one or other of us would have died by now, attempting to recruit scum, or we'd have won by now. That's even before we get to the notion that a cult recruiter might be fairly likely to need to leave his house at night in order to recruit.

[Battle Mage]

The only scenario that makes sense here is a BM-Raffles wolfgroup.

yes because of course, even if i was scum who wasted my time spouting lies, i most certainly wouldnt distance from my buddy. How totally preposterous.

Thok-Fuldu scumpair makes sense. It explains why the former chose to distance from the latter, but didnt take the opportunity to lynch him-instead killing me first. expect Thok to bus Fuldu tomorrow, and then with a few brain cells, you can lynch him on the next day.

BM

[Battle Mage]

(especially since I strongly distrust BM in the late game, for metagame reasons).

Vote: Battle Mage

Ah, at last my death has a purpose. If nothing else, this will be an example to everyone that Stoofer's comment about BM always being scum if i survive past day 3 to be total and utter BS.

I'm happy now.
I'm also hammered.
Kill Fuldu tomorrow-then look at Tar/Thok on the day after.

good luck town!

BM

[Battle Mage]

with hindsight id say Tarhalindur is more likely scum than Thok.

BM

[Battle Mage]

bah.

[Battle Mage]

lol i FRIGGING TOLD YOU Akbar was scum.