NY 168: (GAME OVER) The Mod is Dead, Fire and Ice Edition

[evilpacman18]

confirm

[evilpacman18]

Prod recieved. It's the week before finals, bear with me. I'll probably be able to read tomorrow

[evilpacman18]

I can't remember the last time I slept more than 4 hours in a night but my the period of pre-finals hell is over I think. I'm starting my reading now.

[evilpacman18]

thoughts

JKLM looks really scum on page 3. Bulbazak is probably town conversely, 65 is a good post.
I don't remember mastin being so unbearable.
JKLM continues to look bad, 79 looks like he was just waiting for Yuni to post more before springing into action and getting on the wagon.
aptil appears to be feigning interest with questions with conclusiveness of questionable importance to him. That sentence doesn't make sense. aptil looks like he doesn't care about the answers to his questions.
I still wanna know what mastin's self-professed town slip is.
I also was concerned with the yungchicago wagon, probably 2 or 3 of the back 4 votes are scum. JKLM, PV (whose posts 39 and 96 caught my eye but not enough to label it leaning scum), maybe Yiley. Bulba looks town to me though.

that's up to mid page-6. I'm tired, it's 3 AM. Be back when I wake up tomorrow afternoon lol.

[evilpacman18]

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

[evilpacman18]

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

Do you think his lack of defense is related in any way to the fact he doesn't have one?

Do you think not having a defense is scummy?

[evilpacman18]

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

Do you think his lack of defense is related in any way to the fact he doesn't have one?

Do you think not having a defense is scummy?

A defense, or a good offense. My wagon sucks because____________. These are the scum on my wagon because ________________. Let's talk about my reads which are ___________________ because _____________________.

Stuff like that.

That's kind of there though. At least the "Let's talk about my reads" stuff, which I think it's very town when people don't lose this part of their posts even after the pressure on them is great.

Oh God, you didn't catch his softclaim?

No and isn't the point of softclaiming that any town who notices specifically doesn't react by saying "hey look at that softclaim"?

Well 365 is horrible and makes me regret defending Dry-fit
Almost reflex voted Slandaar for 367 and I hardly ever have the urge to reactively vote.
Just checked his iso: Slandaar is avoiding posting anything by complaining about other peoples' posts. JKLM can wait

vote: Slandaar

They're probably scum buddies though, I could see Slandaar being the sneaky fool that RVS votes his buddy. Especially considering the "eagerness" with which he started the game.
And then 372: "someone get off now" as if someone being put to L-1 is a horrible thing, meanwhile ignoring anyone who's participated in his getting to L-1.
Slandaar's been around, Slandaar's been posting, but he hasn't a problem with the rise of this wagon until he gets the chance to pipe in and white knight: "LOOK AT WHAT A TOWN HERO I AM, I AM BEING CAUTIOUS ABOUT A LYNCH"

[evilpacman18]

either is fine.

vote: JKLM

[evilpacman18]

Yeah. Unfortunately it's not scumposting.

[evilpacman18]

Bulba you are tragically bad at reading me.

Yeah I'm always useless day 1 so I can't blame you all too much for voting me

I've really got nothing much to say. I hate day 1.

Meta defense and AtE, solid.

[evilpacman18]

Yeah. Unfortunately it's not scumposting.

Why?

It just seems far too bold, you probably hate the "too scummy to be scum" argument but I believe in it quite a lot because most of the time I think the case is more "too decidedly ignorant and aggressively anti-town to be scum."

[evilpacman18]

Pacman because he laughably suggested I was white knighting in a multi-ball game (hes scum not on Dry's team and assumes I am not hence white knight - it is the only way to come to that conclusion)

I meant to ask, how do you define white knight?

[evilpacman18]

aptil is scum probably, especially with that willingness to OMGUS and I didn't like him yesterday anyway. Still wanna see Slandaar and JKLM and get some of my null reads headed in a direction before putting a vote down though.

[evilpacman18]

Has it really been 48 hours already? I'll be in after dinner.

[evilpacman18]

mod: are you sure that wagon isn't on aptil?

That's why I had too different wagons for Yuni! Thanks for catching that one ~JS

[evilpacman18]

Pacman because he laughably suggested I was white knighting in a multi-ball game (hes scum not on Dry's team and assumes I am not hence white knight - it is the only way to come to that conclusion)

I meant to ask, how do you define white knight?

Well lets look at this another way; my definition doesn't matter because white knighting only works when the defendant is town. I cannot know this in multiball (know) this means I read the situation correctly and acted accordingly In a pro-town manner. This apparently means you think I am scum but why wouldn't I act in a pro-town fashion as town? I am curious.

I think you also meant to say what I was avoiding posting my opinion on.

Yeah see we definitely define it differently. I might be wrong on how I think of it, cuz it seems like nobody agrees on the term so I should probably just stop saying it but white knighting to me is generally faking one's interest in the good of the town. People who preoccupy themselves with attacking anti-town instead of scumhunting. It's been so long and I've been so out of this game that I don't even remember what you did that I accused you of white knighting for though. I'll have to go back later.

[evilpacman18]

Yeah see we definitely define it differently. I might be wrong on how I think of it, cuz it seems like nobody agrees on the term so I should probably just stop saying it but white knighting to me is generally faking one's interest in the good of the town. People who preoccupy themselves with attacking anti-town instead of scumhunting. It's been so long and I've been so out of this game that I don't even remember what you did that I accused you of white knighting for though. I'll have to go back later.

So, if I were scum I wouldn't know if Dry is town or scum, so how can I fake the interest of the town?

I still want you to tell me what I wasn't posting my opinion on too, you probably should refresh your memory about that when you check what you said I was white knighting.

oh! yes see it doesn't matter what Dry flipped, I'm talking about the opportunity you took when he was at L-1 to feign concern and appeal to someone authoritative:

L-1

Someone get off now.

Mastin I am looking at you.

be back later tonight with other stuff.
I'm still down for a JKLM wagon but has he even posted this day?

[evilpacman18]

I'm in the process of rereading the whole game, I'm paying attention to Maxous and the second time around the "JLKM feels town" comment in 83, with no explanation and at a time where JKLM was putting out some really grimy-sounding posts that made me want to lynch him, it's incriminating.

In fact I'm feeling Maxous, Slandaar and JKLM fire scum team. See the relation between 91 and 94 for instance. ("clearly I was sleepy this morning" is some bullshit)

As far as other scum on that early YungChicago wagon, I'm thinking Yiley. Everyone else on that wagon I'm reading null to town (Garmr, Bulbazak, PeregrineV look town, Desperado idk)
A lot of people early in the game were reading Slandaar as town apparently, idk why I got so shut down when I made the same call a bit later.
Right, I was scum reading aptil, he must be ice. Along with Yiley? Don't remember seeing anything I thought were connections between the two.

I'm not gonna re-review the whole game, just the parts I was more absent for. On to the end of D1…

Yiley, JKLM, Desperado, and PV are notable mainstays of both the Yuni and Dryfit wagons yesterday. Of the four, I'm reading the first two strongly scum, and the latter two weakly town.

Slandaar had one reason for considering me scum, (it was OMGUSy) and I already dismissed it as a difference in the way we define what I accused him of. He is now more certain that I am scum than before. That's pretty backwards and so I will go forward in saying I am more certain he is scum than before.

AH HAH. 487 is just the kind of connection between aptil and Yiley I was hoping to run across.

So we have tentatively
Fire:
Maxous
Slandaar
JKLM

Ice:
Yiley
aptil
????

Bulba, what are you seeing in Yuni? Do you think aptil and Yuni are scum buddies?
mastin might be scum… it's interesting that he seems to have forgotten he's already labeled himself conftown from that "townslip" in his first post
Also Slandaar going after TSO who actually HAS townslipped several times irks me. 536 and 538 have sooooo much of him putting words in TSO's mouth, assuming intentions that can't be rightly assumed, and strawman.
Garmr is doing the Lord's work in 581, I'm glad we see the same relationship between Maxous and JKLM. do you have an idea of teams yet? and how do you feel about Slandaar?

vote: Slandaar

[evilpacman18]

I have more time to put into this game now, I think next I'll probably go back and iso all my scum reads and make a post with specific cases.

[evilpacman18]

woah deja vu

either is fine.

vote: JKLM

vote: JKLM

[evilpacman18]

After that near quicklynch yesterday I'm pretty convinced Yuni is town. Yiley is the read I'm most open on other interpretations with so I'll consider it. Slandaar... well he'll really have to step it up while we deal with lynching JKLM for that read to change.

[evilpacman18]

anything

Was this unclear?

[evilpacman18]

You can't be town and this thick, the obvious question then isn't "what specifically am I avoiding?" That's very obviously NOT WHAT I SAID. "To avoid posting anything" is clearly a generalization about lack of content. You're setting up a straw man argument by settin up a question that has no answer as if forcing me to concede to you will help your "case" along.

[evilpacman18]

sigh.

in between about 154 and 403 you complained or made snide remarks about a bunch of posts without much indication at all that you were attempting to find reads. Then all of a sudden in 403 you had a list placing every single player in the game. I don't see the progression there and when I pointed out that you weren't actually saying anything, I was getting at the point that you showed no indication of progress made towards placing the game. It makes your whole list seem really arbitrary too... that arbitrariness is aggravated by your main scum read being TSO, who has townslipped multiple times, and the pointlessness of this "question" you refuse to get over when I've already explained that it isn't the right question at all and has no specific answer.

[evilpacman18]

multiple

Let me take a different angle on this. How is that a town slip?

A different angle because your first attempt to pin me with some fake bullshit failed? nah, scum

[evilpacman18]

I agree with T S O April isn't neccesarily mafia just for a hammer. We need to go on the attack and not be reflexively defensive.

aptil, it was just a weird defense that sort of fits into what else I was thinking, given I have scum reads on both of you and don't really see space for either of you Maxous' team. So this isn't something that I would work off specifically for obtaining reads, but it helps reinforce what I was thinking. Also I think someone else said this but that second sentence doesn't actually make any sense and so providing it as an excuse for his defending you makes me think he has other reasons to want to defend you

[evilpacman18]

boooooooo
sports

[evilpacman18]

Is it time to start playing this game again?

[evilpacman18]

Currently Yuni is going to be lynched today.

If you think she is town you need to step up and defend her.

There you go white-knighting again, jumping in to say that sounds like you have the town's best interest in mind when you're not actually doing anything to help.

What purpose does it serve if you, who are voting Yuni, ask for defense on her? If you were actually concerned with hearing a case, which cases concerning her towniness have been posted by myself and others, you would wait until after hearing something to decide where to place your vote. As it stands, you've already decided, so what's the point?

can we have a votecount

On it - City

[evilpacman18]

how is anybody reading Slandaar as town god damn

[evilpacman18]

This is pretty obviously a distraction to the good wagon on JKLM slot. Slandaar of course is part of the problem but Desperado looks bad too. Bulba is just misguided because of not believing in wagon speed and timing being relevant. Looking at the VCs, Yuni can be determined town without ever reading one of her posts. -_- I'll have to rethink teams. If anybody wants to talk compromises, I'd go for aptil or even Mastin before letting obvious town get lynched

[evilpacman18]

He's had the same reads all game and everything he posts is contrived and fake.

[evilpacman18]

P_A had hardly said anything when I wrote 744. She looks better than JKLM, I suppose, but seems to eager to make these sweeping generalizations before having even interacted with anybody. as far as her read on me, I also didn't like that she specifically ignored the "probably" following "is" gives it the same effect as "looks," essentially, and the possibility that my town read on Bulba could be stronger than my scum read on JKLM. Or anyone really, town reads are much much easier to come by.

Which leads me to my next point, Yuni is obviously fucking town and p_a came on posturing right from the start in preparation to take the easy Yuni lynch. I could say the same thing here, isn't it convenient that her read on Yuni, who's got a wagon about to complete on her, is "quite possibly town" where everyone else is "scum lean."

Matias: Yuni not addressing you is another indicator that she's more concerned with scumhunting than her own survival.

She's really clearly town here.

I took a look back at the VCs, Desperado looks frikkin terrible, he's probably scum. Yiley probably needs lynching too.

[evilpacman18]

TSO: Initial reaction to it is that basing a scum case on non-association to flipped scum (making her half as likely to anyone reading her as scum yesterday to still be scum) is wrong. Right off the bat. The gloating seems more like pride about a read, not about a kill, which makes her more town for being attached to her reads like that. And as far as I can see, she doesn't seem non-committal at all. Scattered, maybe, but it's multiball.

Matias: My initial thought was that fire team was Maxous, Slandaar, and JKLM, and aptil and Yiley are ice, but with the new Desp scum read and mastin possibly being one of my reads that I'm wrong about I haven't thought about teams as much. Desp seems from what I remember, I'll have to go back and look, more likely to be on Maxous' team. Maybe Slandaar is ice and I was just wrong about the connection I was seeing between him and JKLM. I don't really know as much as I felt I did last time I made a projection. Shrug, a few more flips will probably help, especially if we lynch scum (read: not Yuni)

[evilpacman18]

Ya dun goofed

[evilpacman18]

I just have to say that I'm offended that Bulbazak thinks we were trying to hit scum with the Matias kill, he was pretty obviously town.

vote: evilpacman18

[evilpacman18]

shrug

[/b]vote: Desperado[/b]

[evilpacman18]

vote: Desperado

[evilpacman18]

This sucks, I was playing a pretty decent game too.

[evilpacman18]

btw fire guys, aim for town, we will too, cross-kills hurt us both right now.

vote: evilpacman18

[evilpacman18]

Out of a 13-3-3 set-up, it'll be 8-2-2 at the end of this day.

Assuming two town deaths and a mislynch, Town is at 5-4 and basically doesn't control the majority. Meanwhile the game comes down to scum taking potshots at each other.

I'm sure that appeals to the Fire team.

well thanks but I don't really need help finding the best way to cripple town. 5-4 is obviously the best outcome for us and fire so yeah kill town tonight. thank you. good bye.

[evilpacman18]

No I am still trying to peg peeps in this game I dont play in a lot of large games, and it always takes me a while to figure everyone out, especially since this is multiball that makes it even more complicated.

feel pretty good about PA and Slaan being town.

not so sure about some others though.

obviously I see EPM as ice based on the cop call.

What about the fact that I've told everyone I'm ice. Does that influence what you see me as?

[evilpacman18]

Really you feel good about the cop who claimed a result on me accurately being town? Lol

[evilpacman18]

ICE 4 LIFE BITCHES