NY Mafia 155 - New Age Mafia II - Game Over!
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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In post 27, umoms wrote:*yawn* slow start.
Not digging the wagon on someone who hasn't even posted yet.
Why is an RVS wagon on someone who hasn't posted worse than the larger RVS wagon on me?-
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GASP!
Obv survivalistic scum! diesuckdie
FoS: Shea
Would also lynch Bella to get all the menfolk for me and me alone.
PEdit: Damn you OGML the top of page was all mine.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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It was anything but 'pack mentality'.
1) It's ridiculously fun.
2) It's useful.
A quicklynch threat on D1 catches players off-guard. It generates reactions that can be studied later with a couple of flips And I woulddefinitelyhave hammered that wagon if he had been at L-1 by the time of my vote; among other things, analyzing who came after me on D2 would be gold.
(Channeling Glork-scum? You betcha.)-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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In post 120, Thestatusquo wrote:Not only is there no reason to think Umoms is scum, but the person who is in my book most likely to be scum is hanging on the back end of that wagon.
Tierce, my comment on bellas posts were tongue and cheek, yes, but they were also an attempt to try to steer the conversation in a more productive direction. Izzy's answers to those questions mattered to me. The fact that you blew them off doesn't necessarily read as weird to me on its own, but it does sort of give the impression that you're attempting to stay in randomness. Like, a sequence of
Person A: statement, joke, etc.
Person B: Somewhat serious question with a slight hint of joke.
Person C: HAHAH QUESTION DOESN'T MATTER LETS JUST KEEP VOTING RANDOM PEOPLE.
is suspicious to me. I also don't like how aggressively you jumped on the back end of the umoms wagon with no justification for it.
Unvote, Vote: Tierce
Of course I jumped on aggressively--that was thewhole point. Push a quicklynch/quicklynch threat on D1, see where the pieces fall and mine the reactions garnered from it on later days. I've already explained this on #98. If I had hmm'd and haw'd about it we wouldn't be having these kind of developments; I wanted to take a decisive stance, to push the dominos one way or the other. People started scattering like frightened chickens, and with a few flips, we're going to have a better understanding of the interests behind this wagon and the reactions to it.
How did I 'blow your questions off'? My impression of Izzy's vote and comments about you was that they were RVS+jokes, and that you were overreacting in a weird manner and trying to fish too deeply for motivation. It felt like cheap posturing. This is not 'blowing questions off', this is "I find your Post 36 scummy", period.
Yes, my own vote at the time was still RVS, I made another RVS joke in the same post (about Bella) and could have shifted to you; I chose not to because, after Glork's #47, I had a plan of action re: the next quickwagon that developed--push it to L-2, L-1 or hammer it.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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I missed this gem.
Considering 1) Glork-scum is far more protown than most players and 2) it'sIn post 139, nhammen wrote:In post 98, Tierce wrote:(Channeling Glork-scum? You betcha.)
How can you think that there is any pro-town benefit to knowingly channeling a player's scum meta?fun, why not tackle D1 in such a manner?
Let's double this one back on you: do you think channeling another player's scum meta is scummy? If so, why?-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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...you do realize my playstyle is mostly a half-conscious cobble of the games I read, right? I lift some behaviors more or less in full.
The comment was in the sense that this was your D1 attitude in Space Monkey Mafia, and that despite your alignment there, a similar play could be useful here for town. Admittedly, I didn't think it through a lot in terms of post-event analysis.-
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I'm giving those observations as I have them and see fit to share them.In post 164, JDodge wrote:I want your opinions and observations on this game, right now. Drop the act, tell us what you really think.
What makes you think that Space Monkey, a game build entirely around being a bit of a mindfuck for the players, is a good place to lift behaviours from for a large normal game?
It was one behavior, and it was hardly specific for that game--it's disingenuous of you to try to associate those two things, since they are independent. Whatever act you say I'm doing has been dropped already when I explained what and why I was behaving like that.
Hai Staeg. Whenever you feel like playing with us, go right ahead.
iaun--I think you replaced out from that game, but do you remember what was your slot's alignment in kiwieagle's Cookie Mafia? It was eaten by tigers, but I remember some things from there and I'm matching pieces together.
I'm good with massclaim.
Why add a vote yourself instead of voting JDodge, then, if you're 'exploring' JDodge's behavior?In post 192, Rhinox wrote:
redff is dumb for sure. But mostly I'm just interested in exploring why JD seemed to overreact to one vote on red.In post 153, Quagmire wrote:
dumb? or scummy?In post 145, Rhinox wrote:In post 133, JDodge wrote:Also, this redff wagon is bad and people should feel bad.
wow what a wagon.In post 135, OhGodMyLife wrote:redFF: 1 (Flameaxe)
unvote, vote redff
See below.In post 192, Rhinox wrote:
So would you say your post shows evidence of looking for my motivation, or shows how, if ever, my actions further the scum cause? >.>In post 155, Tierce wrote:I don't see any evidence of Rhinox looking for motivations--he's jumping on actions and declaring them scummy without showing how, if ever, said actions further the scum cause. He's more interested in criticism than in finding scum.
I don't know what you mean about more interested in criticism than finding scum. I think umoms is scummy and I've explained why. What part do you have a problem with? Can you show me examples of what you're saying I'm doing here?
I've been trying to get actually responses/discussions about things because thats how I play. When people react with "what the fuck is this shit" or "you're just making things up as you go" - that stuff is just useless rhetoric meant to look like you're doing something when you're not doing jack shit. "what the fuck is this shit" says nothing about what you think the problem is or why. "you're just making things up as you go" isn't even trying. Unfortunately this is the type of play thats the acceptable and "cool" way to play in the current meta. Its just not how I play.
Why is this more likely to come from scum than town?In post 35, Rhinox wrote:For serious though, I'm not liking umoms complaining about a slow start while not doing anything to fix it, while also complaining about something that actually *could* speed up the start of the game (aka the agar wagon)
unvote, vote umoms
Why does his lack of reaction to a quickwagon make him scum?In post 91, Rhinox wrote:
A good start might be to actually address the reasons people think you're scummy.In post 84, umoms wrote:What exactly am I supposed to be reacting to? I couldn't really give less of a shit about a page 3 lolynch wagon.
It was not OMGUS. He analyzed the wagon of people voting him and went for the person he believed was opportunistic scum. Would you call OMGUS if umoms voted anyone else in that wagon?In post 101, Rhinox wrote:nice omgus
And neither do you.In post 106, Rhinox wrote:
I don't know, what the fuck is it? You didn't actually say anything about it at all.In post 105, AGar wrote:What the fuck is this shit?
Your one point was that he acted lazy at the beginning of the game. Again, why do you think this is scummy?In post 108, Rhinox wrote:What do you think about the point I brought up about umoms?
Why are you having an issue with JDodge not clarifying stuff when you don't clarify stuff yourself?In post 117, Rhinox wrote:
nah man he whined and omgus'd me without actually addressing anything. Idk where you're coming up with this wifom you think happened but I didn't chalk anything up to wifom ever.In post 109, JDodge wrote:
you brought up a point about umoms? i was under the impression that he called out your bullshit and you chalked it up to wifomIn post 108, Rhinox wrote:What do you think about the point I brought up about umoms?
More importantly, why are you answering for agar?
Or if you really feel the need to answer you can at least say why you think my point was bullshit. You asked me to clarify my comment which I did. Were you not interested in the answer?
This is an example of the pointless snippiness and lack of explanation. You are railing against JDodge's description (why, even if it is inaccurate? Why is this wrong descriptor worthy of 'exploration'?) and voting redFF... why?In post 145, Rhinox wrote:In post 133, JDodge wrote:Also, this redff wagon is bad and people should feel bad.
wow what a wagon.In post 135, OhGodMyLife wrote:redFF: 1 (Flameaxe)
unvote, vote redff-
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In post 287, Quagmire wrote:My scumlist hasn't really changed over the past few pages. Tierce hasn't posted anything since her fake-ass case to deflect attention/show off she's town...and has gotten away with it. Also she claimed VT so if she's telling the truth and gets lynched day one....oh well we just won't have any townies trying to channel scum play.
It's a massclaim. I'm purposefully pausing my play, in case that's what you are wondering.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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That is against the spirit of the game.
I either want the mod to have proof that Quagmire read his role PM, or I'm replacing out. This is not a threat or a bitch fit, this is a flat-out refusal to play in a game where someone deliberately chooses to act in a way that invalidates D1 scumhunting.
This is an honor system; it's enough for me to have Quag state he read his role PM--if he actually hasn't, hell, that's something against him on an ethical level. But I will not play in these conditions, where a player says he's doing something that will affect the spirit of the game and is allowed to get away with it.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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@mod: Replace me, please.
JDodge, if you think I'd rather replace out than play, you really don't know me. I could have not signed up, I could have replaced out at any time. I'm choosing to cut myself off this game because I think this is a moral issue that cannot be overcome and would taint my enjoyment of the game.
Good luck.-
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Alright then.
Staeg and associates: my reaction to Quagmire has everything to do with game integrity and nothing to do with my alignment. I can provide evidence of similar reactions both as town and as scum. In fact, I can provide proof of similar reactions to a situation I wasn't even involved in. Any speculation on whether I'd do this as alignment X or Y dies here, as this is not something I'd pretend about.
Suggesting I'd replace out to gain towncred on a slot I'd lose attachment to is several levels of absurd; you'll note I couldn't be bothered to follow up with JDodge's plea. JDodge, by the way, belongs in the townbin by sheer virtue of Giving A Damn About The Game.
I don't particularly care whether or not it'd be protown from Quagmire to act the way he did, AGar--if everyone did so, the game would lose meaning.
With that said, I'm not interested in any AGar lynch today. (Fact: I thought it was Rhinox who had posted the alignment-null commentary about my reaction, and was coming here to ask Glork whether they have daytalk, because that would totally be something I could see Glork, who knows me best out of anyone in the game, could discuss with Rhinox and might invalidate the way Rhinox-AGar acted here. Had my scummers mixed up.)
I'm very tired and this was rather draining; I don't like seeing my integrity brought into question. ('Butthurt scum'? No, that should read 'player with a moral code'.) I need more nap time and have other things to address in the dead of night before paying attention to this game.-
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...and? Since it's an alignment-null issue, what I was doing before has nothing to do with my decision. I was in the middle of a roleplaying session, saw someone admit to what I think is major unsportsmanlike (pretty word) behavior, acted on it ASAP--because in my eyes, that is bigger than wincon. I would have done the same if I had drawn scum and Quagmire was listed as my buddy. I've quickhammered as town when someone tried to play a trust-tell (and threatened doing soas scum), this isn't that different.
It seems you're agreeing with AGar that what I did was independent to my alignment. He says he has other problems with my play, and you quote that post saying I wasn't doing anything before because...? I've explained why I wasn't, I chose not to interfere with the massclaim. If we're going to cut that short, I'm resuming play as normal--once I nap+other stuff.-
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redFF's tone reeks of "boy oh boy we caught a pseudo-scumslip party time". Look at how he addresses nhammen. Why is he apologizing for stringing him up? If he was THAT cheerful as town, he would be keeping it up, delighted that he had found a legitimate slip and would see someone flip scum very soon. He knows the slot is going to flip town.
And frankly, the number of situations in which this happened/didn't happen is not statistically significant, IMO.
As for you, I don't have a read yet. (Though thinking back that reaction to my vote shows a different mindset from redFF's, so town points for you I guess. I have to analyze this further.) And you're not going to get reads on 'everyone' on D1 of a large from me.-
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Jesus, people.
It's Psyche. This is the guy who made the An Analysis of Accusations of Flailing thread and is coordinating the The Science of Mafia - Central Thread stuff. He commented on that idea because he is interested on analyzing it later. Lay off.
redFF and McStabmoms need to die.-
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First things first: I have no idea who scooby keeps referring to as 'Koffing'. Granted I've been mostly ignoring scooby, but inquiring minds etc.
Second, you have no idea how exhausted I am. If this post devolves into stream of consciousness, I'll attempt to fix it come morning. ('Morning', well. My sleep schedule is bonkers and I slept about 8 hours total in the last 48.) Also JD if you ever see me saying I'm bored in scumchat tell me togo sleep.
Anything past the top of page 18 is off the top of my head/grabbed from ISOs as I go along. At this stage, this is all I can do--it's 11 pm and I really can't brain, so time to catch up on sleep. Will continue tomorrow, but Staeg needs rope already so please have a wagon waiting for me in the morning.
Hoopla, why is singer's claim more important to you than the fact that Quagmire has refused to claim?
I had a kneejerk reaction to Quilford's comment here:
I wanted to vote itIn post 245, Quilford wrote:I suppose. My initial reaction to the claim was that it was town, but it's faded. I'd feel like a bit of an ass jumping back onto Rhinox though, so I'll wait.
so badly. But the crux of the matter is: scum would feel like what Quilford is saying, but they wouldn't express it in words. They'd just shut up and do whatever. Quilford is showing a level of transparency that is unlikely to come from scum.
Hey Stag--why is BBM town? Why Quil? Why was UT scummy? You're spewing reads onto the thread and I've yet to see some decent reasoning for them. (Side note--as I go through this, I end up scrolling down to see JD making pretty much the same questions. More townpoints for JD etc.) Also also also--what I just found in your ISO, all your references to me:In post 142, Staeg wrote:I pretty much always have scumreads on people with nhammen's playstyle but not here.
Tierce may or may not be scum.
unvote
Vote: tierce
everything else seems largely irrelevant.In post 372, Staeg wrote:uggggh now tierce is probably scum, tooIn post 407, Staeg wrote:
Wellll the problem here is pretty much exactly what JD said, she didn't do ANYTHING before said fit.In post 403, AGar wrote:
Tierce's fit felt legitimate - I feel like she actually was pissed off that Quag didn't read his role PM without thinking it through, whereas Quilford was just upset because scum were distinctively at a disadvantage in that situation. I've got other problems with Tierce's game so far, but I feel like her fit was alignment independent.In post 402, singersigner wrote:AGar, if that's the way you feel about Quilford, how do you feel about Tierce?In post 409, Staeg wrote:No, tierce, that's not what I said - I'm pretty sure you know I would expect you to replace out in these circumstances. I'm saying, you were doing nothing and then some and suddenly popped out to replace out.In post 418, Staeg wrote:In post 415, Quagmire wrote:Jesus, you guys. Tierce is scum so hard. How do you not see it?
I'll be having that case you promised, thanksIn post 453, Staeg wrote:
But not because of the claiming - it's because of the stifling of all discussion that happened due to the claim and how long it took. So, if you're here, there's no reason not to claim (well, at least no reason that anyone has brought up).In post 451, singersigner wrote:He's admitting it's bad in a LARGE game. Which it is.
P-edit: tierce, no, bad tierce.You're not scumhunting.You can hardly remember what you said about me whenever you make a new post. You keep flopping back and forth on me, and not in a way that makes it look like a fluid read or a read you are uncertain of. It reeeeaaally looks like an excuse to coast and wagon when it's advantageous for you, and now you're doing the same with singer.
UNVOTE: redFF
VOTE: Staeg
Flameaxe--why singer over red?
Note to self to look up some BBM games. Has been a while--I want to see if the laconic style with no stated reads is typical townplay or not.
Would vote singer, bv310, scooby, all three by sheer strength of being utterly useless so far. However, there is a caveat on singer--she pulled pretty much the same uncooperating BS in Mafia Behind the Maiden. Glork has alluded to this. She can be obnoxious, obstructive and stubborn, but that doesn't make her scum. Worse than that--singertown doesn't react to pressure to step it up. That's a stupid compromise wagon that is likely to hit town. Votes on Staeg please and thank you.
As for redFF, if wishes were guns. Hoopla says red is showing an attitude he wouldn't as scum; how familiar are you with red's games, Hoopla? Can you provide evidence supporting this?
Would totes lynch Izzy. <3-
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He's not in my group of solid townreads; I'm short on time for analysis, which means anyone outside that group is a lynch I can live with. Frankly, at this moment I just want to sheep Hoopla and JD because brains + rationality + actually giving a damn, so if they are pushing a viable wagon at deadline, I'll pull a Katsuki-wagonhop.In post 576, Glork wrote:Tierce, considering how close we are to deadline (less than 72 hours by my count?), is it safe to assume that you consider Nhammen to be definitively protown? You literally haven't talked about him other than to say you are "interested" to see how Red reacts to him early on, and then to say that discussing the "I claim" tell "doesn't make him scum." Considering he is one of the main wagons of the day, it sounds an aaaaaawful lot like you really want to avoid the subject altogether. So, gun-to-head: Would you lynch him today or not? Why or why not?
It's going to be way closer to the deadline before I actually have time to further go through the game, this weekend is geocoinfest time for me. I'll be back after midnight.-
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VOTE: singersigner
Wouldn't have expected yesterday's second wagon to hit scum too and the investigation target is odd, but I believe Psyche. The way that singer jumps on someone who is obviously town (Primate-Psyche kill makes sense from scum who were afraid of being targeted) and calls him a liar seems forced. She spends too many words saying it can't be a real result instead of actually claiming her role, and I can't believe that someone who has limited internet access would be that obstructive on purpose. Yes, singer is obnoxious as town, but this level of it seems contrived. She's not even considering a Framer, which is Normal.
And come to think of a Framer, why would a scumteam that doesn't include singer think "she was the obv-counterwagon to our goon, let's frame her because the cop is obviously going to investigate her!"? This makes no sense, most cops wouldn't bother with singer and she would be considered town for a few days due to the wagon.
tl;dr: While "you can't possibly have a guilty on me" can come from town, the "there is no way you actuallyinvestigatedme seems contrived." Her reaction is terrible, and she is a very unlikely Framer target. Are you investigation immuneandtown? If so, why not claim it yesterday, since that can fuck with cops?
JDodge: Frankly I don't have proper reads atm, I didn't read the game during night. Will get to them today/tomorrow, but from memory, several of the late votes on nhammen seemed quite town, I don't see much reason for a bus at that stage.-
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JD, kindly bugger off, I've posted what reads I had when I had them. I don't really care if that's not enough for you. Being chided over playstyle was irritating enough, I won't have you calling me useless. I promised more tonight, you'll have more tonight.
Yes, I realize it's counterproductive, but the more you push me for stuff, the less willingness I have to do it. This is a game, it's supposed to be fun, and you're turning my favorite role/game approach into achore. While I appreciate that you're actually trying to push the game forward, my days haven't exactly been spent in front of a computer (wooo!) and I do things in my own time. It's 24h into Day, take a chill pill.-
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Actually, scratch that. Dealing with a migraine and even adjusted screen color isn't fixing it. Will reread tomorrow.
As I said, I liked those late jumps on the nhammen wagon, but this changes if singer is mafia too, especially if she is a scum PR; it could be scum taking the lesser of two evils and hoping for towncred + belief that singer-scum wouldn't be investigated/would gain a few days when nhammen flipped scum.
I want to pay attention to where the VT pool was voting during the day. I'll see what else comes to mind in Stuff That Needs To Be Checked and poke at it tomorrow.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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Just got home, haven't read up but this caught my eye:
Don't you dare question my integrity like that, Rhinox. I don't fake V/LAs, that's lying to the mod. I was busy with geocoinfest, a geocaching event that lasted Friday-Sunday.In post 714, Rhinox wrote:tierce also went on kinda sorta VLA til just before deadline (still stalling hoping for a different outcome to the day?)
Will catch up on this after dinner.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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I haven't even looked at the rest of your post beyond the barest of skimmings; I'm a shameless attention whore and saw your post because I have an active search string for my name in the forums. I don't see a difference between declaring V/LA in-thread and editing it on the profile options, as it's equally visible for a mod who goes through Activity Overview.
I actually think that kind of lying is unethical regardless of alignment (and you can probably find this stance from me in MD, iirc), and tbqh there is evidence on the internet that I was busy then, since the event was logged and my presence listed. Either way--I'll address the rest of your points and y'know, actually bother rereading the game when I have time tonight; I was reminded I have a game session from 2 to 6 am (damn you, timezones) and need a nap before that. It's slow enought hat I can play and read at the same time, so I'll do that then.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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That's my point; it makes no sense to go after scooby for a claimed roleblock on him when we're not even certain if there are multiple killers in play aside from AGar. He can be scum, but that'd be a weird reason to vote him.In post 737, JDodge wrote:As easily explainable by two anti-town parties killing the cop on N2 and the cop not dying on N1 due to successful roleblock. I still think it reasonable to assume that there's another potential killing party on the cards but think it's unreasonable to act on that line of thought until tomorrow night now that the obvious NK targets have exhausted themselves (with the potential exception of Stag-if-town).
And having seen Staeg's play as scum in scumchat the other day, honestly, Staeg-scum derping this badly wouldn't surprise me. We know he didn't roleblock Psyche night one (and presumably not bv if bv is town), but actually doing so would be a tremendously stupid pick as scum after claiming roleblocker. He blocked two VT claims; we have no way of knowing whether or not he's an actual roleblocker.
That said, why would Staeg-scum announce a block on me and not on another of the VT claims? That makes little sense and I think he would have gone over it with his remaining buddy(ies).
However--scooby's reads are the cheapest thing.
- For someone who was trying to push a lynch on me, he had a very lame excuse to jump off when I said bv cleared me--instead of dropping it due to bv's gunsmith result, he dropped it because ofmy reactionto his vote? Why was my 'cocky' reaction to being cleared a townie reaction?
- His Simenon read is also scummy, because he is reducing Simenon's reads to three posts when there is a lot of inbetweens--between the first and second read were 100 posts, between the second and third 220 posts. Simenon is allowed to change is mind and compromise on the best lynch of the day.
- Finally, the JDodge townread--asking why someone doesn't suspect them is now a townie thing? I've seen scum and town repeatedly doing so, it can be a level of whiteknighting.
His reads are simplistic in general and his townreads weak; he does not feel like someone who is actually looking for towntells on people's posts, but seems to be using the general townreads in the thread to build his own with bullshit reasoning, because he's scum edging away from people who clearly will not be lynched at this stage.
It's odd that he was not aware that I was gunsmith-cleared, but I've seen scum distracted to the point that they didn't know someone was a mason even after a round of night play; this makes scooby-bv unlikely to be buddies, but doesn't decrease the likelihood that scooby is scum.
VOTE: scooby-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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The quote stripe walls need to die a fiery death. And this is coming from me, which is of itself rather hilarious. Will read that madness later.
Not sure if I buy Quagmire's claim. On the one hand, it's a stupid scum claim, on the other hand, it's a good scum claim because of exactly that--people assume it's too stupid for scum to make it.
Quagmire, when did you do this "[going]back on day one"? And why didn't you have an issue with bev's claim, after there was a claim from a cop as well?-
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Whoever did that, it wasn't scooby. He only mentioned nhammen once before hammer, and it was to say he would read him and singer both and reach a conclusion--which took like... 8 minutes or something?In post 772, Simenon wrote:Also loved how you hammered nhamman, providing now explanation, after your only previous comment on him was "don't get the nhamman hate"-
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No, that's exactly my point--they were both scum, they were both goons, it makes no sense for Simenon-scum to favor one over the other. I was just confused with the application of 'egregious'. (Admittedly, I woke up 5 min before I posted. ) I mused a bit over the final nhammen votes once Psyche claimed a guilty on singer, as it would make sense for scum to protect singer-PR over nhammen-vanilla (or a better player over another, but singer isn't a spectacular player either way), but with both of them goons, that theory makes no sense--as you've seen, though for a different reason.
On a somewhat related note, this also gives you townpoints; you had the same gut reaction I had, revulsion at the singer lynch when she started acting obstructive and emotional, due to the similarities with Maf. Maiden. Your behavior doesn't seem contrived, it was a "ew, no, been there done that this slot is town BAD LYNCH BAD LYNCH" from someone who thought they had gone through the same scenario recently.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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Apparently one that you aren't, since one of the gunsmith innocents is in your lynch list.
What is the part of the quote that you're disagreeing with? Did I slip to Portuguese again while I wasn't looking?
I was explaining why I don't think Simenon's reaction to the nhammen/singer wagons on D1 is scummy, unlike what was proposed on early D2 by Glork; there was no reason for Simenon-scum to push hypo-singer-town over nhammen-scum, given that singer flipped scum too.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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"Once Psyche claimed a guilty on singer[on D2], I mused a bit over the final nhammen votes[on D1], as it would make sense for scum to protect singer-PR over nhammen-vanilla[on D1][...]"
That's how it should read for easier parsing.
As for the rest--I'm baffled. How and when did I try to get Quagmire lynched?-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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I haven't read New Age Mafia I. Yes, I know I should. Two claims of the same PR usually contradict each other. I've been burned badly for accepting both can be town; in Mafia Behind the Maiden, there was a town nation-cop and a scum rolecop, and both claimed nation-cop. I believed them both, ended up voting the wrong one and that led to a scum win that day. As scum, in Paranoia,Idid the "this is too stupid a gambit to come from scum, so it's coming from town" counterclaim silliness, so I've been on both sides of the play.
The doubled roles wouldn't be atypical in this game due to New Age Mafia I, so I'm proceeding as before. I don't particularly care if voicing a doubtful opinion gives you an itchy finger.-
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Rhinox is town. He's trying to shoehorn a scumread in, regardless of night results that make his theory outlandish--he's not afraid to present them. I've been in that position; scum don't really do Wild Mass Guessing, it's something town do because town is not afraid they'll be laughed at. The extra information scum have on who their buddies are and what power they have (especially in this setup) means they're not too likely to make this kind of insane speculation, because it would simply be too out of left-field and they think it would be dismissed with laughter.
With a lot fewer players, when the game is on the line, it's a different thing, but the fact he's doing it now says town.-
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