Mafia 88- Return to New Catania- Game Over!
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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The flaw in his reasoning could have been an honest mistake, but there's also a good possibility it wasn't (its very easy for scum to jump on a standard anti town tell such as voting no lynch), and its light years better than a random vote. The random voting stage does exactly zero for forward momentum.Shanba wrote:
Yeah, but is that actually scummy?OhGodMyLife wrote:Oddly enough, I agree with BM. GC undermined his own argument in the process of writing it.-
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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Level of noobness had nothing to do with it. This isn't the road to rome, we don't have to mollycoddle anybody here.Ectomancer wrote:His join date is November 2008 though...are you really truly thinking nub scum or are you stirring the pot? He didn't really sound like a true nub to me.
But I like how you're practically coaching him into playing the newb card to defend himself.-
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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This is a very astute comment.SensFan wrote:Hoopla seems to be avoiding saying anything, letting the bigger dogs fight over the debate he supposedly purposefully started, which is something I really don't like.
However, I really don't like the way Sens is basically playing five pages behind and picking up only scattered information from whats going on in real time.
Also, lurking will not be tolerated for much longer.-
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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It doesn't have to be Sir T if he doesn't think Sir T warrants a vote, but I get a bad feeling when someone sits back and doesn't vote at all.Ectomancer wrote:
Why are you rushing him? Why would his lack of a vote on SirT at this juncture be scummy?OhGodMyLife wrote:Yos, hurry up and put your money where your mouth is before you start looking scummy.
Why did you feel the need to make note of my comment, but not Shanba's similar post?-
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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I didn't forget any previous convictions, but the sir t wagon doesn't, it seems, have any legs, and I like having my vote somewhere that it does some good.militant wrote:OhGodMyLife wrote:I'm not protecting lurkers, I already found scum, and thats more important.
Before hand you were very adamant and confident that you had found scum and you vote was where you wanted it on Sir Tornado but as soon as a bandwagon comes along you seem to totally forget about your previous convictions and jump on said bandwagon. Why the sudden change of heart?OhGodMyLife wrote:Unvote, Vote: Tubby
This bandwagon has some legs.
Criticising me for joining the bandwagonyouare on makes me think you might already know its a bad wagon.-
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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I don't think its a bad wagon, and I would like it to either result in a lynch or bring tubby out of his shell so that I can get a better feeling for his alignment. At this point, I think there is a greater than average chance that tubby is scum, so I would not oppose this wagon going all the way to a lynch.
As for a wagon having legs, what I mean is exactly what you said, that the tubby wagon is going somewhere i.e. it has momentum, whereas the Sir T wagon did and does not seem to have any momentum.-
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Cases that end with "until I get answers to these outstanding questions" are really flimsy. That dawned on me recently.Hoopla wrote:So until I get a few more answers, particularly about the Sir Tornado vote, I'm going to:
unvote, vote: OhGodMyLife
To answer Vollkan, yes I'd be willing to carry the tubby wagon through to a lynch if necessary.
Hoopla, I'll get back to you.-
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OhGodMyLife Silent But Deadly
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Maybe you shouldn't say your vote is "until you get some answers" next time.Hoopla wrote:
Maybe it's me giving you an incentive to tell me your reasons, but I'm actually a bitch and have little reason to change my vote!OhGodMyLife wrote:
Cases that end with "until I get answers to these outstanding questions" are really flimsy. That dawned on me recently.Hoopla wrote:So until I get a few more answers, particularly about the Sir Tornado vote, I'm going to:
unvote, vote: OhGodMyLife-
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On Sir T:
Post 98
This is what originally drew my attention and vote. His reason for the FoS is total bull, and the fact that he FoSes when he hasn't got a vote out is something I find really scummy, in that noncomittal, don't want to leave a paper trail sort of way.
Post 125
Specifally, this line
Admits he hasn't really got anything on Seraphim, but is happy to use the fact that Seraph hasn't responded as an excuse to do nothing himself.Sir T wrote:There really isn't any reason strong enough for me to actually vote for Seraphim. And, he still has to answer that question.
Post 157 and Post 158
Defends his move onto the Hoopla wagon in 157 based on a total falsehood, then corrects himslf in 158 regarding the facts but seemingly doesn't think this should change his defense in the slightest. Also, note this line from 157:
Its so convenient for scum when someone doesn't answer a query of theirs, they get to just sit around doing nothing all day long except repeating that they're waiting for something.Sir T wrote:(still waiting for your answer Seraphim)
Post 404
Lets look at some details.
Unabashed buddying up to CKD.Sir T wrote:1) I am convinced CKD is town. His attack on Sensfan seems to be very righteous and passionate.
This is an incredibly ridiculous reason to attack BM.Sir T wrote:3) However, I am not so convinced about BM up to this stage though. I am noticing an overwhelming lack of smileys from him, which I think he puts a lot of when he is town, not sure if this is a general change in his posting style though.
Wow what an awesome excuse for scummy play, you're "trying to be ambiguous" so you don't get nightkilled. I call shenanigans.Sir T wrote:I do play distinctly different as scum and as town usually, but the play style in this game is deliberately supposed to be a bit ambiguous because I was being sick of being NKed, especially after being NKed on N1 in my last game (which I was really starting to enjoy).
Post 407
Again its all in the details
Wait wait wait, didn't you just make a sidelong attack on BM yourself forSir T wrote:
INatirasha wrote: At least try.
unvote, vote: BMreallydon't like this vote. Do you think BM gains anything from not posting? If he did, would he be going on posting at a rate he was going before Shanba's request? Utter crap.
What I said to Natirasha.Der Hammer wrote:yawn,,,,Vote:BMnot using enough smileys?I don't think there can be anything more utter crap than that, yet here you go attacking people who attack BM. Thats really strange.
You explained it based on a false premise, then you quickly corrected yourself in regards to the premise but did not correct your explanation.Sir T wrote:I did explain it, I think. I voted Hoopla because I found his no lynch vote scummy, but as the game progressed, I came to the conclusion that it was not scummy. I believe I stated this somewhere.
lulzSir T wrote:Also, I vaguely remember waiting for someone's answer to something I asked.
Post 412
It should be clear by now that Sir T and tubby216 are scum together.
Post 469
Epic lulz
Post 477
Finally, finally votes for Seraphim, I guess he felt that he had left enough "waiting for your answer" posts to point back to later if this vote was ever questioned.
Post 494
Then pulls this sudden switch to voting xyl, playing follow the leader with BM, the guy who he, let us not forget, attacked earlier for not using enough smileys. But then shortly after that, heChainsaw Defends BM by way of attacking Natirasha and Der Hammer for their BM votes. How strange.
I think that does it.
Unvote, Vote: Sir Tornado
FoS: tubby216-
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I voted tubby for the softclaim, which I find to be very scummy. After catching up and putting together my thoughts on Sir T I found the weight of evidence against him to be heavier. Tubby's lurking and "lack of context" (by which I assume you mean lack of meaningful contribution) is, yes, also vote worthy.farside22 wrote:OGML: Why did you vote for tubby then go back and read and make a case against Sir T? Did you notice the wagon on tubby was mostly for his lurking and lack of context is that vote worthy in your opinion?
Tubby:
You seem to have gotten really, really worked up over my statement that I see a connection between you and Sir T. This only makes it more likely in my eyes.Tubby wrote:This?? This is how you tie me to Sir T? come on the only thing connecting me to Sir T is that there is nothing to connect us together,,
So my question to you is, Grasp at straws much??
Do you have anything game related to say? I make a point about an aspect of your play I found to be scummy, and you counterattack by claiming I made things personal. Thats just stupid.Tubby wrote:Did I used to date your sister?? What’s with all the hate??
What about BM and Xyl make their opinions on your post more valuable than anybody else?Tubby wrote:BM, Xyl thoughts??
This is the entirety of tubby's tactic to get the wagon off of himself, which to me looks like a softclaim in the form of a threat, like "you don't want to do that because I might be a town power role."tubby216 wrote:nope still don't,,, there is nothing of substance to be had anywhere,, so yah lynch me if you want its ok by me although i would sugest looking elsewhereTubby wrote:3) i highly doubt i will get lynched today but if i do thats ok to i just hope everyone is paying attentiontubby216 wrote:dear hoopla,
all will be revealed, just have faith,,,tubby216 wrote:no but i assure you yos all will be revealed soontubby216 wrote:prior to my lynch captain impatience
Saying you think someone is town is a far cry from calling their attack on another player "very righteous and passionate" and using that as the basis for your conclusion.Sir T wrote:You obviously don't know I make comments like this frequently in mafia games. Also, I'll keep this in mind whenever you say you think someone is town later on.
You're defending yourself almost entirely through meta, and yet you state that you've deliberately changed your meta in this game to seem "more ambiguous," also known as more anti-town. I agree with Xyl on the theory aspect of the debate you two have been having about it, and I think using that in your own defense here in this game makes you leagues more likely to be scum.-
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I believe I mentioned how strange it was that, after working over the course of a solid number of posts to lay the groundwork for a Seraphim vote, you dropped it altogether to play follow the leader with BM in his inane attack on Xyl. This added to the whole picture. And how does no one questioning the vote then make my argument about it now invalid in any way?Sir Tornado wrote:
Ok, but you fail to mention that I unvoted Seraphim on that very page. So, enlighten me, why would I trying to develop a false and weak reasoning to vote Seraphim for 15 pages, vote him (so that I could have enough "left him questions" posts later on to point to) and then vote someone else on the same page? No one actually questioned that vote between me voting him and unvoting him either, so how does that fit into your theory?OhGodMyLife wrote:Finally, finally votes for Seraphim, I guess he felt that he had left enough "waiting for your answer" posts to point back to later if this vote was ever questioned.-
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It makes you an idiot for playing in a deliberately anti-town fashion, thereby drawing a wagon which forced you into the position of softclaiming in the first place. On that note, I think you should full claim.tubby wrote:what if i have a power role what then?? does that make you a scum hunter or a role fisher??-
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I changed my mind.farside22 wrote:
Then why did you say you were against a lurker lynch then a few post later vote for tubby for lurkering?I voted tubby for the softclaim, which I find to be very scummy. After catching up and putting together my thoughts on Sir T I found the weight of evidence against him to be heavier. Tubby's lurking and "lack of context" (by which I assume you mean lack of meaningful contribution) is, yes, also vote worthy.
Why are you so concerned with my opinion on tubby, but have nothing to say about what I wrote on the topic of Sir T except to comment that it came at the expense of a vote for tubby?-
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I believe it would be beneficial for him to do so before this game goes to night.Shanba wrote:I am against tubby fullclaiming. I do not believe he is danger of a lynch yet. And, to be frank, I can see the softclaim as equally characteristic of poor power-role play. OGML, I am surprised that you would try and pressure tubby into claiming before gaining the consensus of the town. Why did you do so?
Thats a very strange turnaround for someone who was willing to follow me into voting Sir T with no voiced basis whatsoever.Shanba wrote:And I don't think the attack on Sir T is productive.-
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I was not insinuating anything, I was remarking that it was a strange stance to take for someone who voices agreement on at least a general level of Sir T being scummy to think pressure against Sir T is unproductive.Shanba wrote:Please. Don't sit there insinuating at me, voice it outright if you want to accuse me of being scummy. But more to the point, I've already explained that I do not agree with your reasons for attacking Sir T: I do not agree with Xyl's reasons either. Yet I still find him suspicious, some of the reasons for which I have articulated (well, ok one of the reasons for which).
Unvote, Vote: tubby216-
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Thats a copout.Xylthixlm wrote:
Honestly, my ability to find scum in a large game on day 1 is pretty weak. Nobody has done anything scummy enough to make them a better lynch than a lurker, aside from tubby who is giving inconsistent reads.OhGodMyLife wrote:Xyl, aside from lurkers, who do you find the scummiest right now and why?-
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Tubby needed a wagon to straighten him out.
As for Sera, I'll join the suggesting vig strategies party and say he'd be a pretty optimal vig choice. Recently, he's done a lot of wagoning lurkers and nothing.-
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Basic sense of decency, huh? Jesus Sir T, nice ad hom.Sir Tornado wrote:
It's about having some basic sense of decency to respond to someone who is trying to respond to your accusations of him being scum. If the town doesn't care about OGML not having it, then I don't care about what happens in this game anymore. Do whatever you like.Yos2 wrote: But...there's no reason for you to do that, Sir T. The reason no one is too worried about OGML's case on you right now is because it dosn't really have anything to do with the only issue pro-town people should be worried about now, which is "who do we lynch today before deadline?".
If you don't replace out, since you just said you want to keep playing, then we'll talk about it tommorow. Right now we don't have time to waste on side issues like that.-
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Why do I feel like you were planning on laying the blame for Sir T´s death at my feet long before you made this post?Xylthixlm wrote:The Fonz wrote:Final Votecount: like the previous one, but with added HAMMAH!
OhGodMyLife (2): farside22, Sir Tornado
Why are you not surprised that SirT was killed? He seems like he would have been good for scum to leave alive if you're town.OhGodMyLife wrote:I´m not terribly surprised that Sir T went down. I am pretty surprised that there was only one night kill.
And if you´re trying to imply that if I were town there is no way Sir T town would have died, just come out and say it. That backdoor "seems like" bullshit is not going to fool anyone.
Unvote, Vote: Xyl-
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Multiple people were vocally suspicious of him, making him a plausible pro town kill.Xylthixlm wrote:
Please answer the question. Why are you not surprised that SirT was killed?OhGodMyLife wrote:
Why do I feel like you were planning on laying the blame for Sir T´s death at my feet long before you made this post?Xylthixlm wrote:Why are you not surprised that SirT was killed?
His death throws obvious suspicion onto me, as you so underhandedly pointed out, making him a plausible scum kill.
So either way I'm not surprised he took a bullet.-
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