Mini 1150 - There Goes the Neighborhood - Game Over


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Post Post #465 (isolation #0) » Tue May 03, 2011 8:45 am

Post by GreyICE »

Vote: Packbat


Packbat, I've been trying to figure out why not to lynch you the minute LMP mailed me my role PM.

Still wondering.

Jedo, from all of your posting yesterday was a scumread. You could have pushed him in the neighbor QT, pressed him, something. You know, actively scumhunted. 1v1 with someone you thought might be scum. All night to press him.

You posted something lame about not wanting to talk in the QT N0 and posted NOTHING last night.

Nice scumhunting. Good attempt to determine his alignment.
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Post Post #467 (isolation #1) » Tue May 03, 2011 9:33 am

Post by GreyICE »

Packbat wrote:You're saying I'm scum ... because I didn't post in the QT? After
saying
I wouldn't post in the QT? On a night when Jedo the Jedi didn't post in the QT either, at all?

And in case you didn't notice, I dropped my JJ case at #251. So what,
exactly
, is your problem?

Exactly?

Jedo the Jedi

So far, he's been bandwagoning to get reactions - RVSed on Nobody Special, then jumped on Seacore and kryptinen wagons when they were on the upswing. What specifically bothered me was the kryptinen vote post where he suggested he was basically null on kryptinen but bandwagoning her anyway, and that this is not scummy. My problem with it was (a) bandwagons are better if you have reasons and (b) making excuses for yourself I find suspicious.

And that's about it. I think he should have moved his vote by now, being as the kryptinen wagon is at two votes now, but in his latest posts it sounded like he was rereading. I don't think he belongs on top of my suspect list any more, but I'd like to see him either justify his vote or move it. "I'm voting because she hasn't proved to me she's town yet" doesn't cut it.


This is not the read of someone who thinks Jedo is certainly town.

And you had... nothing to ask last night? At all? About anything?

You're damn right that's scummy. I don't really care if you said you wouldn't be scumhunting in the Quicktopics at the start of the game, I don't exactly call that a towntell.
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Post Post #469 (isolation #2) » Tue May 03, 2011 11:02 am

Post by GreyICE »

@Llama - conditional on Fate not replacing into a scum slot, yes.
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Post Post #473 (isolation #3) » Tue May 03, 2011 11:30 am

Post by GreyICE »

kryptinen wrote:This is totally a few hours, shut up.

I stopped suspecting Jedo because he stopped dodging questions and started contributing. I still found parts of his play problematic, but overall it is now more neutral than scum. Yesterday there were many better lynch candidates, so of course I'm steering the lynch to scummy read instead of neutral read.

@GreyICE: Dropping a case does not mean thinking someone is sure town.


I completely agree. I read through this game before replacing in, and based on what I know, I was expecting some major QT activity.

I'm 100% sure that at least one of Packbat, Seacore, or Llamafluff is scum.

Why?

Because no one, NO ONE sees a day that lasts 25 IRL days and hits 16 pages (you realize it averaged under 8 posts PER DAY) goes to deadline with a ton of players going 'oh vote whoever' and then turns around tomorrow and goes "SCUM REALLY CARED ABOUT THOSE WAGONS THEY HAD A REAL OPINION ON WHICH ONE WENT TO LYNCH HUH?!?"

I'll tear apart my wagon until I figure out which one it is.

Seacore is obv coasting. He has no real opinions, no real motives, and no real scumreads. His scumhunting can be summarized as he didn't.

Llama feels the least likely to me, just because I think he's scumhunting.
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Post Post #476 (isolation #4) » Tue May 03, 2011 1:40 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Setael wrote:
Nacho wrote:Why go to Jedo today when you preferred Seacore yesterday? What changed?


I feel like I've made the answer to this pretty clear. Yesterday I was happy with Jedo or sea but there was no momentum to jedo's wagon. Today thats where the momentum is, plus I'd like to see how far Seacore will go with the bus.

Hey Setael.
Jedo was town
I'm town

What now, bitch?
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Post Post #478 (isolation #5) » Tue May 03, 2011 1:47 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Honestly
What makes this so pathetic
Is I know LlamaFluff is a good player, Setael is decent-good, Packbat is good, and Seacore is decent-good.
So all 4 of you can't think that either wagon was scum yesterday.

Llama expressed both were town and is suspicious of half this wagon which makes him inexplicable. Since he's better than that.
Setael is probably scum
Seacore is skimming scum x10
Packbat is scummy.

I actually wouldn't be surprised if the entire scumteam was in you lot. So dance, boys and girls, dance. 'cause I can and will get to the root of this.
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Post Post #479 (isolation #6) » Tue May 03, 2011 1:50 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore says Setael is bussing
Setael says seacore is bussing

Both are avoiding doing much to push the wagon forward. So they're pushing a mislynch while FOSing each other.

Yeah, they're both scum.

Unvote

Vote: Seacore
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Post Post #485 (isolation #7) » Tue May 03, 2011 1:59 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Is I know LlamaFluff is a good player, Setael is decent-good, Packbat is good, and Seacore is decent-good.
So all 4 of you can't think that either wagon was scum yesterday.

GreyICE wrote:I actually wouldn't be surprised if the entire scumteam was in you lot. So dance, boys and girls, dance. 'cause I can and will get to the root of this.


You have a ways to go, GI.

Meh.

Llama's the townie.

The two of them doing this hissing spitting dance with each other while voting for the same wagon (each claiming the other is bussing, of course) is so 'well I lead a scum lynch the day before LyLo/LyLo so I'm town! Feel my town cred, I've been saying this all game!'

Packbat probably needs dead, and WILL be talking in the quicktopic tonight.
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Post Post #486 (isolation #8) » Tue May 03, 2011 2:02 pm

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Llama expressed both were town and is suspicious of half this wagon which makes him inexplicable. Since he's better than that.


JJ wagon behaved exactly as I would expect a scum wagon to behave, grows a bit, but then stalls out before deadline and most of it shifts to the mislynch wagon. Especially since Quar hit like the single biggest VT tell (again, no one really understands how scary accurate that tell is).

While I may not be in love with the members of the current wagon, I want to see what comes of pressure. Also I still have a gut sea-town read, only other wagons im really that interested in right now are Pack, Doom and Set. Those three continue to bug me a little.

You're voting with two of your three scumreads when you said this yesterday?

And what happened to the Vox? He just dissipate? I don't see anything making him all that much more town than yesterday.
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Post Post #490 (isolation #9) » Tue May 03, 2011 2:14 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:
Setael wrote:What momentum? It had been stagnant for days.

Wait, what?
Seacore voted for a Jedo lynch a day before you voted and put him at L-2...

GI, put your big boy pants on and apologize.
About that meme?

Was not meant to be offensive. 'What now bitch' is exactly what that mess deserved. 'cause I'm pure, 100% town, and all of the people voting for me today after the mess of yesterday are not town. No way, no how, not in a million years.

As for the context:

Image

As so
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Post Post #494 (isolation #10) » Tue May 03, 2011 7:13 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Doombunny9 wrote:I don't really like how Grey is saying that he
is
town but both him and Jedo haven't done all too much that suggests to me that he's scummy so I'd be willing to say he's just cocky town.

Yeah but first they were deadline wagons. Second, look at what happened today. At least two of the people on me expressed no strong opinion that JJ would flip scum. Yet a TOWN flip from a DEADLINE lynch and suddenly they're on the JJ wagon on day 2 rather than trying to figure out who the scum was who was pushing two mislynches? Come on.

Setael
Seacore
LlamaFluff
Packbat

AT LEAST TWO SCUM IN THAT GROUP
PERIOD
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Post Post #495 (isolation #11) » Wed May 04, 2011 2:56 am

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:
And what happened to the Vox? He just dissipate? I don't see anything making him all that much more town than yesterday.


I think I just really dislike his posting style more then anything else and am trying to see if its me being bias.


Really Fluffy?
When I saw the claim, this is 100% the type of post I expected scum to make, which is why im fine with a death of Doom or AV since they hit the tell up and down the board. AV gets the spot over Doom due to one certain thing, tomorrow I will know enough to revisit it though.

I dont like AV.

He seems to be way to one track minded here over Krypt, while taking odd stances on other players. For most of the game, he just actively avoided the elephants in the room (NS L-1 vote, JJ wagon) while making some odd stances on a few topics (timetable on Sea turn, interest in lurkers). Now he is back to Krypt that he seems to think there might be momentum in that area. Mostly though I really really dislike his stance on NS and JJ. If AV is scum, JJ has a very good chance to be scum, and NS then becomes town like he already is.

These don't seem like purely style differences if you follow.
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Post Post #497 (isolation #12) » Wed May 04, 2011 3:38 am

Post by GreyICE »

AFAIK Jedo didn't find Packbat particularly scummy. He had a moderately long conversation with his other neighbor which would have actually pretty much confirmed him town to me had he not been confirmed by moderator.

So I find Packbat's stance horribly useless. It's at best straight up Anti-town, and he WILL be talking tonight. One of Setael and Seacore is who I want to lynch though. Packbat is at least doing SOMETHING. Setael is one of the worst cases of 'information over analysis' I've seen (line after line of 'x happened, y happened,' followed by vague conclusions, examples here, here, and here).

Setael is also scum for the miserable vote for Jedo. Seacore knew Quaroaath would flip town so didn't want to be on a town wagon for day 2. So the wagon he was on was... scum?

Or just less likely to go to lynch?

Yeah, Setael needs dead.

Seacore has done nothing but fluff about all game, he screams "BUS ME FOR TOWNCRED" and Setael is doing exactly that. Bus on day 3, lots of towncred, etc. It's like he's TRYING to be scummy.
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Post Post #505 (isolation #13) » Wed May 04, 2011 12:53 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Great, so I'm voting with Packbat and TwistedSpoon.

Unvote

Vote: Setael


Based on something in the old QT with wickedestjr, I'd prefer to not lynch Packbat today. I'll explain tomorrow.
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Post Post #508 (isolation #14) » Wed May 04, 2011 1:20 pm

Post by GreyICE »

You are coasting because you have very little reasoning for town/scum reads outside of me/Jedo. And that one isn't even very firm. Here's a hint Seacore: I'm town. Put that in your pope and smite it, then upgrade reads accordingly.

Set
Jedo
Packbat
Twisted

Setael - scummy because she's not picky about mislynches. Or something. Avoided voting town despite saying they're scummy. You say she's a strong scumread, and you're... not voting her, but voting the person she's voting. Failure, Seacore. Then what when I flip town? Anyone trusts you?

Jedo/Me - scummy because... the wagon fell apart yesterday.

Honestly, that's it. You spend entire posts on why Setael is scum:
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2958766

And you're voting for me. Oh, and Setael is scummy beause... she says that Jedo is scum repeatedly, but doesn't vote for him. Hypocrisy at its FINEST, Seacore. You should be lynched just over that, and if your wagon wasn't scummy as shit, I'd do it.

Twisted spoon - scummy because... uh... yeah. Nice reasoning.

Packbat - scummy because, uh...

Seacore wrote:God damn it Nacho... why are you so convincing.

Okay, maybe I was tunneling Krypt a little, I'll look at all again tomorrow.

Packbat's case on me is stupid though. RVS means nothing, including self votes. I have not defended Jedo, there are actually some things I find scummy about him, but the bandwagoning (the only thing I've brought up) is not among them. And I attacked krypt's scrutiny of the Seacore-wagon because it was stupid scrutiny that suggested she didn't know I was the second person on the wagon.


OMGUS?

Yeah.

Pretty much

You deserve death, and if I didn't feel like lighting some fires under Setael's feet, I'd be pushing you to lynch right now. Your CRAPTACULAR reasoning on her while voting for Jedo (the same reason she's scum in your case) means I have zero confidence you'll flip town. I just need to figure out if you're bussing or if you're pushing a mislynch.
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Post Post #513 (isolation #15) » Wed May 04, 2011 2:12 pm

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:@Grey - Im just conflicted on AV, even with what I put up on him. A few times though, I have caught myself pushing hard cases on someone just because they are annoying me, its why I tend to be successful as scum, I can BS cases on people easily. I can at least throw a little wieght around though on him still.

unvote
Vote AV


Power case. Now.

I would be willing to wagon Set for the sake of getting the game going in a good direction.

Your vote (with lots of good reasoning) used to be on Jedo/me.

Why was it there if that didn't make the game go in good direction? What is the reason AV is now a better direction? What do you think of Setael, Packbat, and Seacore? If I'm town and your town you must know that there is a reasonably low chance that all three of them are town, right? Who isn't town in that pack?
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Post Post #515 (isolation #16) » Wed May 04, 2011 2:40 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Happy birthday btw

Anyway, wagoning people you have a town read on... +10 scum points for you.

But clever if it worked.
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Post Post #519 (isolation #17) » Wed May 04, 2011 6:05 pm

Post by GreyICE »

I was fucking confirmed mod-confirmable friendly townie in that game (and dead as a doornail with role claimed and flipped if someone wants to go check). Just because you chose to flip the town red doesn't make em scum. So I'm not not 'also scum' here.

And again, you've failed massively. I'm scummy because... of how the wagon moved. I'm scummy for the actions of other scum. Period. No scumtells, no scum motivation, nothing.

It's exactly what you're FOSing Setael for... while religiously insisting she can't be the lynch today.

Her red flip condemns you to death.
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Post Post #522 (isolation #18) » Wed May 04, 2011 6:29 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Yep. You're scum.

Unvote

Vote: Seacore


I like how when asked about points that made Jedo scummy you deflected. Twice. In a row.

Apparently the only thing that made Jedo scummy was all the scum jumping on and off his wagon. Which you've done shitall to really find, you've never even bothered to question people, push them, do much of anything.

Well, I'm on a wagon with scumreads. I dun care.

PEdit: LAWLZ third post with no reasoning just more scumplaining about the scum not acting 'right' on the wagon.
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Post Post #531 (isolation #19) » Thu May 05, 2011 1:57 pm

Post by GreyICE »

And neither me nor Jedo has done anything scummy yet. Just 'wagon movements.'

Can you specify which wagon movements? What posts made you think this? What votes?
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Post Post #538 (isolation #20) » Fri May 06, 2011 2:46 am

Post by GreyICE »

AurorusVox wrote:
Grey:

What changed from this post to this post to this post? In the first you declare Llama is scummy, then in the second you say he's townie, and in the last he's potential scum again?

Nothing. If you think a slight townie tone from LlamaFluff is enough to label him 'town' you're quite quite wrong. The man can fake tone better than almost anyone. His actions so far have been scum motivations, and his reasoning for voting is terrible.

OTOH Setael hasn't posted anything useful. Period. And Seacore... seacore needs death. I can't read a seacore post without rolling my eyes and reflexively starting to type "vote..."
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Post Post #540 (isolation #21) » Fri May 06, 2011 3:09 am

Post by GreyICE »

Packbat wrote:
GreyICE wrote:
AurorusVox wrote:
Grey:

What changed from this post to this post to this post? In the first you declare Llama is scummy, then in the second you say he's townie, and in the last he's potential scum again?

Nothing. If you think a slight townie tone from LlamaFluff is enough to label him 'town' you're quite quite wrong. The man can fake tone better than almost anyone. His actions so far have been scum motivations, and his reasoning for voting is terrible.

But "he has a townie tone" isn't what you said. What you said was:
GreyICE wrote:Meh.

Llama's the townie.

I think I explained that one adequately: I don't think the scumteam threw all three of their members behind lynching JJ on day 2. So at least 2 of those are delusional town, and:

OTOH Setael hasn't posted anything useful. Period. And Seacore... seacore needs death. I can't read a seacore post without rolling my eyes and reflexively starting to type "vote..."


I'll circle back to Llama (especially since this seacore wagon is suddenly making me all sorts of nervous) but there's plenty of people who need much more death than Llama.
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Post Post #542 (isolation #22) » Fri May 06, 2011 4:09 am

Post by GreyICE »

Twistedspoon wrote:I'm swish with a seacore lynch
had a small gut read of mafioso since he self voted first post
VOTE: Secore

Right Vox.
Because that vote was totally a happy making vote that makes me feel reallllllyyyyy safe and secure on this wagon.

Then you have Packabat aka wagon #2.

The only thing making me feel good is Setael brazenly not putting their money where their mouth is and voting for their "OMG SCUMREAD" when they posted this:

Happy with a lynch of either Seacore or Jedo. I'm curious to see what Seacore will do if the Jedo wagon takes off.
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Post Post #548 (isolation #23) » Fri May 06, 2011 10:19 am

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:
GreyICE wrote:I'll circle back to Llama (especially since this seacore wagon is suddenly making me all sorts of nervous) but there's plenty of people who need much more death than Llama.


The reason I have a problem lynching Sea is because of our QT. He seemed to encorage me to back down off of AV, and unless its a Sea-AV team, I really cant see scum trying to chase me off a mislynch like that. Just doesnt work well unless we have a scum flip from AV to me.

@AV - Placeholder + your vote was in the wrong spot. As I said, I played a setup exactly like this in mechanics a couple years back, town could only target their neighbors. Also as I said, if I am not vanilla, my role PM is structured in an identical format to his.

MEH

You're subtly confirming yourself here by proxy if Seacore is a mislynch since 'why would I defend him' (it's called a White Knight, they can do wonders).

But I really, really, really doubt you'd tie yourself to a scumbuddy this way. And if you're town, I've already promised not to totally distrust your reads. Fine. We're not doing Packbat because of what Wicked said in the QT, and Setael is just as bad as Seacore. If they're both town, I weep for humanity.

Vote: Setael
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Post Post #552 (isolation #24) » Fri May 06, 2011 2:35 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:
AV wrote:Maybe an example will make my point clearer. Say someone has a guilty result, outs it, and then gets NK'd the next night. Power here can't watch that player because he's restricted himself to ONLY his neighbours. That's perfect for a scum fakeclaim, isn't it?

A One-shot position mover flipped. PR is fairly close to confirmed town for me.


He may be confirmed Watcher.
Confirmed role != Conf. town

That being said I don't read him as scummy anyway, so I think he's another dud wagon being pushed.
Nachomamma8 wrote:
Doombunny wrote:How a Jedo/Grey lynch would give him more information about Set than a Set lynch is beyond me.

Could you link me to where Seacore said this?


Seacore wrote:Set is scummy because of her actions. She's scummy because she uses any excuse to vote for somebody who she has claimed is scummy. Even when that person is a VIABLE LYNCH.

You are scummy, unfortunately for you, for the way Jedo's wagon grew and dissolved. Jumping onto what I view as the scummy wagon that failed as soon as I can and staying there for some time is exactly what I should be doing. Just because Set is bussing you doesn't make you town. My opinion is that Set has decided that Jedo is worth bussing because he was pretty useless and enough people found him suspicious. She's now trying like mad to link me to your inevitable scum flip to try and save herself.
It's unfortunate for you, because you're a little more competent than Jedo and she probably wouldn't want to bus YOU that hard, but that die has been cast.

I want to emphasise this so you can stop pretending it's a scum tell. Finding both Set and You scummy and voting You is not an accident. Get that Set wagon going, I'm all for anybody who doesn't find you scummy to vote for Set and if it gets into majority, I'll vote Set. (*waits for Set to start screaming that I'm trying to jump off the Jedo/GI wagon*)


Actually... why the fuck am I not voting Seacore? His ISO is humiliating.

edit: ninja'd by Doom. Read above,
I find Jedo/GI a suitable lynch on it's own.
I really think it'll flip scum. The fact that my two top scum reads have a clear relationship with each other only strengthens my read

Yes,
you are scummy because of the actions of other scum.
Town Jedo should have been the mis-lynch yesterday. It was easier to do, with no added guilt for the participants, than the Quar mislynch. Neither looked like a stronger town read, neither had soft-claimed PRs. So scum should have been happy to ride Town-Jedo to D1 mislynch.

But they didn't. That's because there was no Town Jedo, there's only Scum-Jedo. So yes, I'm sorry GI, you've been let down by your scum buddies. They've outted you. I can't work out who they all are, only Set seems super obvious. I'm guessing at least one other abandoned your wagon too. So I'll just be satisfied with lynching either you or Set today. Then when one of you flips scum, I'll lynch the other.


*sigh*
God I hope he's not town. Llama,
more reasoning for this town read.
Especially when he's derailing you from someone you ostenably think is scummy. STAT.
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Post Post #556 (isolation #25) » Fri May 06, 2011 3:05 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Setael is just... classic active lurking scum. I almost want to publish her posts and put them in a book.

The worst, by far, is her habit of just dropping questions and forgetting things. If we remove Jedo and (to a lesser extent) NS/Wicked points, Setael is just randomly asking questions.

She doesn't care at all about the answers.

For instance:
@Power - can you address this point? You can't write off Nacho's case as lurking. You said you would comment on the Krypt case and never did and you haven't said much about Jedo either. Plus, I agree with this point about your post 162.


He never responds. No followup.

In fact she rarely pushes much of anyone. He interactions are in a narrow cone - scum looking for mislynches, not town pushing the entire town. Despite this, she's suspicious of a vast number of people.

So basically, Nacho is the only one who moved from Jedo to Power that I don't find suspicious.


So basically, she's suspicious of:
Seacore
AV
Doombunny
Krypt
Quaroth

The only person she's not suspicious of is... the person we have to lynch the day before LyLo anyway?

Oh, and the catchup soons. The catchup soons. My lord, the catchup soons.
19th
Setael wrote:I'm way behind. Will read up and post tonight.

TBF... does catch up... kinda:
Setael wrote:Not quite caught up.


21st (next post)
Setael wrote:Read my post again. "Him" in what you quoted is referring to Jedo, not Power.

And no, I'm not caught up. As I stated.

Setael wrote:OK, caught up. The Quaroth case is solid, but I'd still prefer a Jedo lynch. I need to reread the attention shift from him to Power. Pretty sure scum had a hand in it.


Rides bandwagons to end of D1

==============Day 2================
April 30th
Setael wrote:I'm not caught up. I'll try to post tonight.


Lots of whiny self-defense, then...

May 6th:
Setael wrote:Will catch up and post today.


More defense.
I'm only caught up to that Nacho post. More later hopefully.

:roll:

Setael is coasting BADLY.
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Post Post #561 (isolation #26) » Fri May 06, 2011 6:57 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:
GreyICE wrote:We're not doing Packbat because of what Wicked said in the QT

If Packbat doesn't do his reread by the deadline, I will get him lynched. There's absolutely no excuse for him being able to make all those posts and yet not being able to even start his reread. It's pathetic, and it's not the Packbat I'm used to. I know he's a capable player, and I know he has time to catch up. So, he's going to catch up or he's going to be dead.

:neutral:

I think we'll have better luck with Setael and Seacore anyway. I'm getting a townie vibe off of some of Packbat's posts and I think you're reaching a little here.

Gimme a little townie trust. I mean I know you're not town, technically, but if you don't like my explanation tomorrow, lynch me. This is a fucking dumb gambit for me to be doing to save a scumbuddy.
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Post Post #581 (isolation #27) » Sun May 08, 2011 1:50 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore - you babble and babble and babble but never answer anything. What information do you gain if me/Jedo are town? Tell me right the fuck now.
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Post Post #588 (isolation #28) » Sun May 08, 2011 7:06 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:Oh, look. Packbat doesn't even respond to me.

GREYICE:
Out what Wicked said in the QT, now.
Wicked already flipped position mover.
You're Packscum's neighbor; Wicked wasn't.

No.
Tomorrow.
I'm not handing out aiming info.
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Post Post #590 (isolation #29) » Sun May 08, 2011 7:15 pm

Post by GreyICE »

We are not lynching packbat today.


Get on a real wagon now.

Seacore has found a brand fucking new reason not to vote his "scumread setael" or answer my question.

What do you learn if Jedo is town, seascum?
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Post Post #592 (isolation #30) » Sun May 08, 2011 7:22 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Lol

So you have less reason to vote setael when I flip town?

You are horrid.

Llama you're positive he's town? Because he looks a lot like obvscum to me.
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Post Post #596 (isolation #31) » Mon May 09, 2011 3:03 am

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:Okay GreyIce, what do you learn if I flip town? How does that affect your read on Set?

If you flip town? For one, I learn that you have miserable reads and miserable target priorities, and have little to no reasoning behind your votes - traits that mean you play a lot like scum. Then I shrug my shoulders at your miserable, anti-town play and go back to lynching scum.

Y'see, I don't want to lynch you and setael for information. I want to lynch you two because you're FUCKING SCUMMY. Both of you. The fact that you both claim the other is scummy and yet take every opportunity presented to avoid wagons on one another is just icing on the fucking cake.
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Post Post #597 (isolation #32) » Mon May 09, 2011 3:12 am

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Llama you're positive he's town? Because he looks a lot like obvscum to me.


Of course not. I just dont think he is scum unless AV is scum. If Sea flips scum I would almost be willing to insta-lynch AV the next day given that I see zero way that Sea behaved the way he did as scum if AV is actually town. How often do you see scum meta defend an actual townie from one of the players that normally forces action in a game in private such that no one else notices?

I could live with lynches of AV, Set or Pack right now, with TS and Sea being acceptable, but not quite optimal, everyone else is probably not scum. I think I need to reread Sea over the next few days and try to get past my predisposition about him being town given the way he reacted to the Nacho claim which is why I REALLY fricken hate neutral roles, and think they should be insta lynched with fire. Thats another whole story though. I just dont have bearings in this game to be quite frank, and need to get some more unexpected flip to get anywhere.

I still say at least one scum is going to be in Pack/TS/Krypt though (not Pack-TS though, a scum flip from one 100% clears the other to such extent that I would bet anything on it), I cant for the life of me see this game where all three flip town. The fallout from the JJ wagon depends on Greys alignment. If Grey is scum, at least one of them are town, if Grey is town, I would not be shocked to see all town, but again Set orchistrated that... hmmph. I just keep chasing my tail here and really need to just rip up my reads and start again.

Trusting Grey

unvote


Going to think.


Nacho will be lynched the day before LyLo. He'll fuck LyLo all to hell. Because of that, and how he claimed, he has no hope of winning EXCEPT to lynch every single scum before LyLo. Therefore, at the moment, he's probably the most aggressively pro-town player, since his win condition is basically 'town, except harder.'

Not that I entirely agree with him about everything, but 'lynch the third party' is a bad policy.
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Post Post #603 (isolation #33) » Mon May 09, 2011 12:58 pm

Post by GreyICE »

@Nacho: What are your views on LlamaFluff, Setael, and Seacore?
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Post Post #605 (isolation #34) » Mon May 09, 2011 1:16 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Okay, so we're in the same place. I'm on the Setael wagon because the seacore one is giving me bad vibes and I'm trusting town Llama and almost-town you today. Come on, you know it's where all the cool kids will be hanging.

The seacore wagon built EASY. This one is taking work.
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Post Post #618 (isolation #35) » Mon May 09, 2011 6:29 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Powerrox93 wrote:
@Mod: OP update please!


@Nacho and GreyIce:
Please read post 571

I meant it seemed fairly self-serving because sea defending town-AV and llama defending town-sea are parallels.
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Post Post #622 (isolation #36) » Tue May 10, 2011 5:02 am

Post by GreyICE »

Setael wrote:@Doom re: Seacore
-When I replaced in a bit scummy
-Near the end of D1 more scummy
-Near the beginning of D2 really scummy
-Now definitely scum

Nacho wrote:GreyICE was not trying to remove your posts by calling you a bitch. I figured that little piece of information had already been explained.
I don't really see where he called your posts worthless. Mind linking me?


This:
Grey, ISO 20 wrote:OTOH Setael hasn't posted anything useful. Period.


Grey wrote:The seacore wagon built EASY. This one is taking work.

Still feel this way after 610 and 611?


What you mean after I pushed Nacho for pages and pages?

Yeah. This one takes a lot of work. And I feel comfortable about the alignments of pretty much everyone on it except maybe seacore (and even if you're both scum I don't see how Seacore CAN'T vote for you here).

Also your posts are absolutely full of IoA. All over the place. Lemme do a markup on one of your "analysis posts" to show the town what I mean.

Setael wrote:
Analysis of the shift from Jedo to Power:

Post 163 I put Jedo at L-1 and the wagon was Quaroath, Doombunny9, Packbat, Nachomamma8, Twistedspoon, me.

Nacho is the first to unvote, saying he still thinks Jedo is scum, but wants to wagon Power.
Both of these are information. Anyone reading the thread can find this out.


Nachomamma8 wrote:And, for the grand finale:
Unvote, Vote: Powerrox


I'm still getting a fairly strong scumread from Jedi, but I can't in good consciousness let Powerlurker coast through this >.>


Seacore votes Power, sheeping Nacho and saying he'd have posted the same thing if Nacho hadn't first. If Jedo is scum, this vote looks really bad as an attempt at momentum for the Power wagon and shifting attention away from Jedo. Well, this combined with Seacore's previous defense/sketchy stance on Jedo's slot.

Then AV, Doombunny and Krypt all vote Power.
Information, again.


Doombunny's move from Jedo to Power is the most cautious - he first posts that he thinks the case is good but wants to hear from both Jedo and Power before he thinks about switching his vote, and he asks Seacore about his vote. When he votes Power a bit later he says it's for Power's omgus Nacho vote and then he says "I was beginning to have to have second thoughts on Jedo anyway assuming what he said about playing to his meta is true."
Information


I don't like this - that first of all he feels he needs to give a reason for unvoting Jedo (I think scum who are bussing would be more likely to do this) and second that it's such a weak reason and he's just assuming about the meta.

First piece of real analysis.


So then Quaroth puts him at L-1, giving a vague reason about him giving little content. He mentions Jedo in this post, but just to accuse him of defending Krypt.
Information


Then Packbat unvotes.
Packbat wrote:
In any case, based on his recent posting, I've decided to

UNVOTE: Jedo the Jedi

...because from the way he's approaching it, he really does seem sincere. Comments on the rest when I finally get to the reread.


Don't like this either. Scum can certainly seem sincere.
Doesn't say Packbat is wrong, just that the reasoning doesn't appeal to her.


So basically, Nacho is the only one who moved from Jedo to Power that I don't find suspicious.
Nice analysis.


So then after the watcher claim, none of the Jedo voters go back to Jedo. Doombunny votes Quaroth saying he's choosing between Pack and Quar for posting few opinions or new info. Doesn't mention Jedo at all. Based on his post when switching, Doom would've been the most likely to re-vote Jedo after the watcher claim. Not mentioning Jedo at all here is suspect.
Information.


Quaroth staying on the Power wagon and not mentioning Jedo is even more suspect, since he supposedly still found Jedo really scummy when he voted Power. Quaroth could've been bussing Jedo and doesn't want to switch back for fear of getting late-day momentum on a wagon he never really wanted to be successful.
Information.


Jedo's my #1 scum read. I think it's very likely that at least one of the Jedo to Power swingers is a scum buddy, and other Power voters could also be buddies who wanted to push the Power wagon to get the pressure off Jedo. (Obviously I'm looking at Seacore here.) Granted, this is all speculation until Jedo flips.
FOS like 5 different people?


I will bake cookies for anyone who votes Jedo. Easter shaped sugar cookies. Bunnies and eggs and such.

I'm willing to vote Quaroth to avoid no lynch, but no one will get cookies in that case.



It's a long post, but lemme summarize it:

"I don't like the way that votes quickly moved off Jedo. Doombunny is especially suspicious because he seemed to need reasons to move his vote off Jedo, which is something I think scum would do when unvoting a buddy. Packbat didn't have any good reason to unvote, and that's scummy too. Most of the rest didn't give good reasons, so that's scummy. The only one who isn't scummy is the guy who isn't town."

Yeah. Most of your wall posts boil down to this sort of useless garbage. Doombunny is scummy because he wanted reasons to vote for someone besides Jedo, Packbat is scummy because he didn't have good reasons for voting someone who wasn't Jedo, and so on and so forth.

Long, long, long posts of total garbage.
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Post Post #626 (isolation #37) » Wed May 11, 2011 2:33 am

Post by GreyICE »

And this is why I'm allergic to the words "meta" when making a case.

Setael scum:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... er_sort=Go

Setael town:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... er_sort=Go

How is this town setael and not scum setael, TS?
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Post Post #628 (isolation #38) » Wed May 11, 2011 3:24 am

Post by GreyICE »

Powerrox93 wrote:@GreyICE: Thank you, it helped me understanding what you meant

Twistedspoon wrote:does the speed of a wagon indicate alignment in any way?

Is it only me that think that this is something a townie wouldn't say?


No. Wagon speed and wagon ease can often give you a good idea of people's alignments. Seacore grew 'too quickly.' Packbat was voting me, so was seacore, both presumably believed I was scum. Twisted's vote was MISERABLE. AV was about the only really good vote on the seacore wagon.

Basically, the wagon hit L-2 FAST and with almost no resistance, and it came out of nowhere. That's... a bad sign.
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Post Post #631 (isolation #39) » Wed May 11, 2011 4:32 am

Post by GreyICE »

Twistedspoon wrote:
GreyICE wrote:
Basically, the wagon hit L-2 FAST and with almost no resistance, and it came out of nowhere. That's... a bad sign.

that could be what the scum want you to think

Since you're one of the votes that gave me serious heartburn, do you want to claim scum now and save me some trouble?
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Post Post #634 (isolation #40) » Wed May 11, 2011 5:03 am

Post by GreyICE »

Twistedspoon wrote:no

I'm just saying that i wouldn't dismiss any wagon because of speed

Scumminess of the voters and quality of the votes is a large part of it. I can't help but think that their line of thought is: "Seacore is just going to flip town and then they'll be on the 'wagon Jedo' plan for day 3 anyway!"
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Post Post #635 (isolation #41) » Wed May 11, 2011 5:04 am

Post by GreyICE »

Also the fact that to date not one person has moved onto Setael from the Seacore wagon when quite a few moved from me to Seacore (despite there being no realistic way for me/Seacore to be a scumteam) is good.
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Post Post #638 (isolation #42) » Wed May 11, 2011 6:36 am

Post by GreyICE »

Setael wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Also the fact that to date not one person has moved onto Setael from the Seacore wagon when quite a few moved from me to Seacore (despite there being no realistic way for me/Seacore to be a scumteam) is good.

Hang on. Quite a few? I'm the only one who moved from you to Seacore so how is that quite a few? Also, ISO me to find posts that counter your claim that there's "no realistic way" you and Seacore are scum buddies.

Packbat
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Post Post #641 (isolation #43) » Wed May 11, 2011 8:22 am

Post by GreyICE »

No intent to hammer, Setael is the superior lynch.
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Post Post #645 (isolation #44) » Wed May 11, 2011 11:55 am

Post by GreyICE »

Okay, yeah, case plox.
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Post Post #648 (isolation #45) » Wed May 11, 2011 3:19 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:Also, it's great having three of my scum reads and two V/LA people making up my wagon. Feels good. Now everybody else who is actually pro-town in this game can vote somebody else.

Hi.

I'm not voting for you. 'sup?

How many fucking scum reads do you have this game, and what have you done to push them?
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Post Post #651 (isolation #46) » Wed May 11, 2011 6:11 pm

Post by GreyICE »

What's your feelings on Pack, doom?
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Post Post #658 (isolation #47) » Thu May 12, 2011 4:25 pm

Post by GreyICE »

So yeah sea and setael scum together?
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Post Post #660 (isolation #48) » Thu May 12, 2011 5:31 pm

Post by GreyICE »

No I'm voting Setael because I think Setael has a much higher chance of flipping scum than you.

Her play is tons and tons of information, and weak/nonexistant analysis to justify opinions that seem preordained. Your play is just bad analysis that you seem to actually believe.

But this 'lets all vote the VI' shit is weak.
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Post Post #662 (isolation #49) » Thu May 12, 2011 6:11 pm

Post by GreyICE »

I think I've made a good case on why both of you are scum. Llama is questioning my read, and as I said, I'd be an idiot not to at least listen to him.

See the only information I want when I lynch someone is if they were a mafia power role or goon.
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Post Post #664 (isolation #50) » Thu May 12, 2011 7:15 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:That's cool. I wasn't looking to judge your response either way, I was more looking to lock in your reaction. So when I flip town you can't say "Oh, since Seacore is town, I'll have to rethink my read on Set"

So far, apart from your case on me, which you've admitted is weaker than your case on Set, other people's cases on me seem to be "I didn't like his double vote", and "I didn't like the way he jumped on Krypt"
Both of those things are just dumb, and don't explain why they don't find Set scummier than me.

Your wagon is a radioactive slag heap of only slightly higher quality than mine when I replaced in. It's why I'm not voting you.
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Post Post #667 (isolation #51) » Fri May 13, 2011 4:40 am

Post by GreyICE »

kryptinen wrote:ICE, what do you mean by that? Do you or do you not find Sea scummy? Are you or are you not willing to vote him when the deadline comes?


After this post? No. I'll let the day end in no lynch if you need my hammer for a deadline wagon. Why? Because having you fucks LURK until near deadline then insist that we lynch Seacore is BAD JUJU. And I'm not playing fucking fall guy for the town's inability to post, get off its ass, or do something useful.

You know what's more antitown than me letting the day end in no lynch? This town lurking until we're forced into another deadline wagon situation.

As for why the seacore wagon is as scary as it gets:
Packbat, Twistedspoon, AurorusVox, Setael, Powerrox93


Reads on each of these, Krypt?
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Post Post #676 (isolation #52) » Fri May 13, 2011 11:29 am

Post by GreyICE »

Except that plan A was to lynch Jedo. That being said, I can't imagine seacore being scum with that wagon. It would not shock me if the entire scum team was on it. It's the worst D2 wagon I've seen since Square Enix V.

Plus Setael is scum so etc.
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Post Post #679 (isolation #53) » Fri May 13, 2011 11:53 am

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:Hmmm... Good point.

Still don't find it likely, considering Sea's "NACH I WILL FOLLOW YOU TO THE END OF THE EARTH" ploy, and Set's immediate switch to Sea when shit got hot.

Which is why setael is the right lynch for today ;)
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Post Post #682 (isolation #54) » Fri May 13, 2011 5:35 pm

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:
Unvote
Vote AV


Content to come back to a Set deadline lynch, but I have been talking this out and Set lynch doesnt do that much for my other reads. AV is more of an info goldmine (like krypt/doom/pack are)

Okay so is the info going to be 'he's the most likely player according to your reads to be scum, so the scumteam will be down a member?;

Seriously Llama, wtf?
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Post Post #684 (isolation #55) » Fri May 13, 2011 6:32 pm

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Okay so is the info going to be 'he's the most likely player according to your reads to be scum, so the scumteam will be down a member?;

Seriously Llama, wtf?


He is in a top three suspect for me no second thought and has been for just about the entire game, where he is in the top three is more fluid. What makes him different though compared to someone like Set is that AV is actually tied to a whole lot of pairings in my mind, as opposed to Set who really isnt apart of big wagons. Getting flips on the bigger wagons is usually a very good way to start getting the alignment of everyone else on the wagons.

I would have loved to see a vigged AV last night, he alignment really sheds light on quite a few middling reads. Also I would be willing to say town-AV means town-Sea
Yeah, because AV has been DOING A WHOLE LOT while Setael has been ACTIVE LURKING.

So OF COURSE he's tied to more player's, Setael is functionally a black hole when it comes to useful content. Each Setael post actively reduces the amount of information in the thread .

What is your case on him.
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Post Post #695 (isolation #56) » Sat May 14, 2011 9:08 am

Post by GreyICE »

I'm laughing at how fast your team is gonna bus you after that post :D
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Post Post #702 (isolation #57) » Sat May 14, 2011 4:40 pm

Post by GreyICE »

I do not believe your claim
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Post Post #722 (isolation #58) » Sun May 15, 2011 4:37 am

Post by GreyICE »

So a full doctor is neighbors with a FUCKING WATCHER?

Can someone mail me a hammer?
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Post Post #736 (isolation #59) » Sun May 15, 2011 5:27 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Yeah or maybe the claimed super doc whose role works like no one else's is a fake.
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Post Post #741 (isolation #60) » Mon May 16, 2011 3:58 am

Post by GreyICE »

Watcher watches doctor
Doctor protects watcher

Or maybe they don't!

In any case those two power roles combine to form voltron, the unbeatable team whereby scum just have to kind of sit there and cry.

Also does no one else see the hardcore role fishing in Setael's post?

Setael wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Yeah or maybe the claimed super doc whose role works like no one else's is a fake.


And when you say "no one else" you're talking about JUST Power who isn't confirmed, right?


He flat out asks me if I have a power role that functions similarly to PowerRox's.

Well lynch him.
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Post Post #743 (isolation #61) » Mon May 16, 2011 7:20 am

Post by GreyICE »

Setael wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Watcher watches doctor
Doctor protects watcher

Or maybe they don't!

In any case those two power roles combine to form voltron, the unbeatable team whereby scum just have to kind of sit there and cry.

Also does no one else see the hardcore role fishing in Setael's post?

Setael wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Yeah or maybe the claimed super doc whose role works like no one else's is a fake.


And when you say "no one else" you're talking about JUST Power who isn't confirmed, right?


He flat out asks me if I have a power role that functions similarly to PowerRox's.

Well lynch him.


I absolutely did no such thing. I pointed out that you're basing that assumption completely on ONE claim that isn't even confirmed, which is RIDICULOUS.

@Llama - I didn't consider it until after you pointed out that I could protect power all game and scum wouldn't dare NK him for fear of being watched.


Well yeah, or you'd have claimed something more believable.

If you're TELLING me that there's one claimed power role so that's the only thing I have to base things on, why the question? You're straight up asking if I have a power role that works the same way.
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Post Post #749 (isolation #62) » Mon May 16, 2011 11:15 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Setael wrote:
kryptinen wrote:
Setael wrote:I can see Llama's point, though it would be a nonissue if Power hadn't had to claim.

I'm not sure that I understand what you mean by this.


Obviously if he hadn't claimed I wouldn't have known to protect him.

If he is telling the truth about his role, there must be a scum who can't be seen by a watcher.



=============[] Time
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Post Post #752 (isolation #63) » Tue May 17, 2011 6:47 am

Post by GreyICE »

:goodposting:
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Post Post #758 (isolation #64) » Fri May 20, 2011 7:54 am

Post by GreyICE »

Well damn.

Oh well.

Vote: LLamaFluff
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Post Post #760 (isolation #65) » Fri May 20, 2011 8:08 am

Post by GreyICE »

Dude I'm confirmed town, I just die, so shut up and no no lynch
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Post Post #763 (isolation #66) » Fri May 20, 2011 11:09 am

Post by GreyICE »

Unvote


Why is Seacore town again?

Vote Count 2.11

Setael
(3) -
GreyICE
, Nachomamma8, Seacore
Seacore (5) -
Packbat
, Twistedspoon, AurorusVox, Setael,
Powerrox93

Twistedspoon (2) - Doombunny9, LlamaFluff
Not Voting (1) - kryptinen

Seacore is at L-1.

Now unless the scumteam is TS/AV/Set, then there was a minimum of one scum not voting for Seacore.

Setael was a scum wagon, and an easy slam dunk for who was going to be lynched if Seacore wasn't.

So uh... why didn't someone hammer?

Sure, it'd be awfully scummy, but no one even demanded he claim. Instead he was left to sit at L-1 for a while, until we lynched Setael.

I still buy that the double bus theory is very plausible.

Nacho - I'm a vig. You fuck us out of a lynch. Two mislynches to town loss is fucking shit balance. Why aren't we lynching you as scum?
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Post Post #766 (isolation #67) » Fri May 20, 2011 5:25 pm

Post by GreyICE »

I'm confirmed town you enormous dumbass.

Why is seacore town again? I don't accept stupidity as a town tell.
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Post Post #768 (isolation #68) » Fri May 20, 2011 5:43 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Regfan wrote:
Unvote


I can't speak for anyone else, but I want Llama to fully claim, we've already had 3 town prs dead and a vig claim on top of that, I seriously am starting to doubt the inclusion of any/many more power-roles.

If we have 4 non-town players, I'd believe pretty much anything.

We're one nacho short of the number of nachos this thread needs. He needs to answer some very pertinent questions stat.
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Post Post #769 (isolation #69) » Fri May 20, 2011 5:49 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:I really don't think Llama is scum. He's told me what his PR is, so his soft claim is acceptable. Trust me on that. If he's lying about his PR, he and I are both scum. However, his PR doesn't make him town, it could easily be a scum PR. To me, his play makes him town.

I think the last two scum are Feysal and GreyICe.

GreyICE, I'd like some answers. Who did you lynch? Why? Why not Nacho?

I think GreyICE is scum based on the way Set tried to avoid lynching him on Day 1. Set's entire interaction with Jedo looks scummy. The way he kept saying that my vote for Jedo/GI was weak, the way I knew that "it wouldn't lead to a lynch, therefore it was a safe bus", it all smells like Set and Jedo being buddies.

And I think Feysal is scum because TS was scum.

Happy to lynch Feysal today.
I mean how the fuck is this not a fucking scum claim?

There's absolutely no attempt to do any sort of scum hunting whatsoever. I just claimed Vigilante. There's a packbat corpse. How the FUCK do you come to the conclusion that I'm scum there? Yes, a scum Vigilante in a mini normal, that's really good. Totally legit. Logical reasoning.

And then there's this paragraph:
I really don't think Llama is scum. He's told me what his PR is, so his soft claim is acceptable. Trust me on that. If he's lying about his PR, he and I are both scum. However, his PR doesn't make him town, it could easily be a scum PR. To me, his play makes him town.


This paragraph is illegal in twelve countries, that's how awful it is.

Vote: Seacore
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Post Post #773 (isolation #70) » Fri May 20, 2011 7:56 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:
Regfan wrote:
Powerrox was telling me that she was having a conversation with Seacore over their suspects throughout the night, why the fuck would he discuss suspects with someone he was going to shoot?


I'm not scum for a variety of reasons, but this right here is a terrible reason to think I'm not scum.

The fact that I think I was the first person to call Set out. That right there is a good reason that I'm not scum.

GreyIce, if nobody else counterclaims your Vig, then fine, I'll let you be town. But until then I'd like to hear my questions that you didn't answer. Why did you shoot packbat? Why didn't you shoot nacho?
Shooting Nacho would have guaranteed us an extra day.

However, at this point I don't need to scum hunt. TS was scum. Therefore Feysal is scum. That was proven yesterday, happy to kill him now.

If I'm scum, why would I step in and defend Llama? If Llama is my scum buddy, holy shit I'm doing a terrible job at distancing.


Man I hope power roles in this game don't have anything to do with who your neighbor is lolololololol
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Post Post #774 (isolation #71) » Fri May 20, 2011 7:57 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Also seriously white knighting apparently no one has heard of it or something.
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Post Post #775 (isolation #72) » Fri May 20, 2011 8:13 pm

Post by GreyICE »

The early push on the Setael wagon was a mess:

Seacore wrote:Sigh, I love how Set is granting me psychic powers. Each time I vote for Jedo, despite my rhetoric in asking people to vote for him, I somehow know people won't do it, so it's a safe place for me to bus.

Anyway, I'm happy to sign on as Nacho's sheep for a while.
Unvote. Vote Packbat

Way to get your scumread lynched... I mean town, not scum.


GreyICE wrote:What do you learn if Jedo is town, seascum?

Seacore wrote:
My scum read on Set would lessen, so too my scum read on TS but to a much lesser degree.
And I'd start looking at people who have been defending you, looking for a white knight.

But we both know that's not going to happen.

So he wants to lynch me and if I flip town then his scumread on Set lessens a lot, and on TS a little.

YEAH HE'S NOT LEAVING ANY EXIT HOLES HERE.

Seacore wrote:Some people are cool with lynching me, other people aren't
Some people are cool with lynching Set, other people aren't

Accepting that your first choice may be one of the above two, is anybody not okay with lynching Twisted today? Does anybody have a shred of townread on the guy?
I'm just noticing an absence of activity, and it seems I'll end up being the deadline lynch unless we start discussing compromises now.


LETS NOT LYNCH ME OR SETAEL LETS LYNCH TWISTED SPOON

OH SCREW IT
I CALLED IT THE FIRST TIME
DOUBLE BUS FOR TOWN CRED

HE CAN JUST DIE
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Post Post #776 (isolation #73) » Fri May 20, 2011 8:18 pm

Post by GreyICE »

I DON'T NEED TO REEVALUATE!
I MEAN I VOTED FOR THREE PEOPLE AND FOSED A FOURTH YESTERDAY. AND TWO OF THEM ARE FUCKING
CONFIRMED TOWN
. BUT NO I MEAN MY SCUMREADS ARE OBVIOUSLY GOOD AND STUFF I DON'T NEED TO DO ANYTHING PRO TOWN LALALALALALALALA

"YOU GET TO BE TOWN" FOR BEING A VIG. NO SHIT, SHERLOCK, I'M FUCKING TOWN AS IT GETS.

YOU AIN'T.
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Post Post #781 (isolation #74) » Sat May 21, 2011 5:50 am

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:Just ignore GreyICE's posts. He thinks he's good at this game, but a cursory glance at his past games reveals otherwise.

If I'm "white knighting" then I'm doing it extremely. As I seem to be defending anybody that gets close to a lynch that I don't want lynched, and when I do actually get a lynch I want (ie Set) they flip scum.

A brief perusal of your ISO suggests that being called bad at this game by you is probably a compliment.
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Post Post #783 (isolation #75) » Sat May 21, 2011 7:11 am

Post by GreyICE »

Seacore wrote:Just ignore GreyICE's posts. He thinks he's good at this game, but a cursory glance at his past games reveals otherwise.

If I'm "white knighting" then I'm doing it extremely. As I seem to be defending anybody that gets close to a lynch that I don't want lynched, and when I do actually get a lynch I want (ie Set) they flip scum.

Or me... wait, I'm confirmed town.
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Post Post #794 (isolation #76) » Sun May 22, 2011 2:53 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Unvote

Vote: LlamaFluff
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Post Post #813 (isolation #77) » Mon May 23, 2011 11:23 am

Post by GreyICE »

I like it. If nothing else, it narrows down the odds of nacho being a survivor rather than scum.
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Post Post #822 (isolation #78) » Mon May 23, 2011 1:50 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nachomamma8 wrote:
GreyICE wrote:Why is Seacore town again?

Easy. Look at Setael-Seacore interactions after they were called out for being scumbuddies. When something like that happens, usually both parties either back off (they didn't), or both parties intensified their attacks. Double bussers never ever ever keep things in the middle ground; they are too eager to make it look like something it's not. Setael intensified her attacks on Seacore as IF she was going for the double bus, but Seacore returned the attacks half-heartedly, then jumped off and started sheeping me. The decision to switch tactics is not something scum-Seacore would do since it was apparent at that point Setael-Seacore was going to be lynched, and that move would completely do the effort of the double bus.

Grey, did Packbat claim commuter to you?

Yes, he claimed commuter last night when I asked him for a claim, to make sure I wasn't shooting a mason. He also said it's why he didn't talk in the QT N2, and the 'I'm not going to use the QT' was a gambit to explain why he wasn't using it when commuting.

Overall, it did nothing to confirm him town to me, and the volume of catch up soons is stunning (one of the last posts in the QT is a promise to do some ISOs), and shooting Vox would be full fucking retard after the amount he talked to me in the QT and the detail of his reads. It doesn't prove him town, but it was a damn sight more town than Packbat. I have no regrets.
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Post Post #839 (isolation #79) » Tue May 24, 2011 4:02 am

Post by GreyICE »

Twistedspoon wrote:
set's in this. Oh boy I'm dead :/


Setael wrote:
Scum vibes from TS' post 104. He asks AV if he's happy with his Kryp vote and what he thinks of the other 2 wagons when I definitely can't tell you what TS thinks of anyone except maybe NS.

not true

Twistedspoon wrote:
My 'legitimate philosophy' is to vote those I find scummy.
VOTE: Jedo

and

Twistedspoon wrote:
and I'm watching krypten, but not feeling strongly enough about his case to vote yet

are just a couple of examples

If you want more of my reads I can say that my top town are DB, Packbat and AV

catching up this page now


Jesus why are people voting for TwistedSpoon?

Twistedspoon wrote:
set's in this. Oh boy I'm dead :/


Setael wrote:
Twistedspoon wrote:
kryptinen wrote:
@TS what good does a "secret" reason do? If it's such a secret why are you telling us you have one? If you have caught something scummy, please share with the rest of us. Just tangling it in front of our noses does not make it look like you have something new to say when you don't

nevermind

ignore it i was in an odd mood at the time. I gave 2 reasons and that satisfies the question


TS wrote:I stupidly held something back, but I still gave 2 other reasons to satisfy the question

I'm confused. If you regret holding something back, why are you still holding it back?

Twistedspoon wrote:
Setael wrote:
I'm confused. If you regret holding something back, why are you still holding it back?

I'm not

I just made something up to try and provide wifom for the scum or something like that, but it turns out it's just town wifom

Ignore it, I had no 3rd reason


Feysal is fucking confirmed town.

LlamaFluff looks bad. WickedString may have been obvtown, but he had three Mafia reads - Glass, Powerrox, and Quaroath. Obvtown with horrible reads is NOT your night 1 kill. He was backing off Glass after Llama replace (I can confirm this, although he seemed chattier with Vox than Jedo... not much of a surprise tbh).

Combined with everything else, and Nacho making some good points on Seacore, and Llama being one of the four people riding Jedo's case lamely after day 1, well...

Vote: LlamaFluff


Nacho: If they don't night kill me tonight, they have to ride with confirmed town into day 4. This means I die. Unless you're an innocent child, now's the time to pop any gambit surprises.
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Post Post #847 (isolation #80) » Wed May 25, 2011 2:43 am

Post by GreyICE »

Regfan wrote:
AurorusVox wrote:But if
you
think its true, that means that last night's kill could have
only
come from you or Seacore; if you read Seacore as town, then why are you even considering this as a possibility?

I never stated I believe it's true however considering the fact I've never played in a setup such as this before and GI stated he has I'm intersted in hearing other peoples thoughts on the matter.

LF has specifically.

If you truly believe that the mafia can only kill neighbors, that means you MUST vote for Vox. Me and Vox were Wicked's only neighbors, and I'm confirmed town.

We can evaluate Vox's reaction to this theory to evaluate how likely it is.

My thoughts? He didn't even consider it "proved him scum," meaning either its false because he's town, or its false because he's scum and knows it's false.
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Post Post #853 (isolation #81) » Wed May 25, 2011 7:39 pm

Post by GreyICE »

I remember a statistics thread on day 1 wagons. Town wagons had two very interesting things. One was the 0 scum wagon happened far less than statistically likely (and it was already around like 4% on random). The second was the three scum option happened far more than statistically likely - around 30% I believe.

TLDR? Three scum mislynches happen more than you think. However with the counterwagon being town, I don't see any incentive for scum to push quaroath. Therefore, one of seacor/llama is scum - because two if the four people who saw "Jedo wagon d2" ain't town. It's such a bad town mindset.
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Post Post #870 (isolation #82) » Sun May 29, 2011 7:36 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Ugh recovering from going home for sister's graduation. I thought I'd have more time this weekend, but phone posting inbetween moving my sister back home and all this other stuff kinda blows.

Anyway, I see town-Feysal has made awesome post where he votes awesomely.

Vote: Seacore


YES WE CAN
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Post Post #871 (isolation #83) » Sun May 29, 2011 7:40 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Also, mass claim? Yes. Period. Order:

Seacore
LlamaFluff
Krypt
Regfan
AurousVox
Feysal
Nachomamma8
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Post Post #889 (isolation #84) » Tue May 31, 2011 8:39 am

Post by GreyICE »

SoS town claimed three days before LyLo. That's the WRONG FUCKING TIME TO CLAIM.

The day before MyLo with a claimed third party and confirmed town is EXACTLY THE RIGHT TIME TO CLAIM.

The third party means the town has to be more powerful than normal. That means we can fairly evaluate whether Nacho's claim is likely-true, or likely-false.

I'm already voting for you seacore, so I'm quite happy to keep doing it.
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Post Post #890 (isolation #85) » Tue May 31, 2011 8:42 am

Post by GreyICE »

@Mod: Feysal is voting for Seacore.

Fixed. Good eye Grey. Thanks.


@Everyone else: we need 5 seacore votes.
Last edited by LimMePls on Tue May 31, 2011 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #892 (isolation #86) » Tue May 31, 2011 2:46 pm

Post by GreyICE »

LlamaFluff wrote:@Grey - Who the hell is Seas partner? I dont really see one outside of AV, who is Krypt is lynched and flips town is nearly confirmed scum. And if that happens we deal with it when we get there.

No we have a claimed third party. Either you or AV is a good third, Setael and Seacore avoid seriously mentioning both of you like you're on fire. I like seeing seacore dead. You are using the same information excuse that Seacore loves.

I don't want information, I want dead scum. Seacore deciding his magical role is too good to claim AGAIN is icing on the bloody cake. I want him dead, dead, dead.
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Post Post #894 (isolation #87) » Wed Jun 01, 2011 4:13 am

Post by GreyICE »

I on the other hand have NO ISSUES lynching unclaimed power roles. Or power roles in general. I'll link you to plenty of games where it was successful. Yes, there's times when it wasn't, but overall that's often as much a fault of the player as the role.
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Post Post #896 (isolation #88) » Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:14 am

Post by GreyICE »

Regfan:

Doombunny9 wrote:
Set wrote:I haven't heard a convincing reason given by anyone who unvoted him.


Have you been reading the thread? Power claimed watcher. Watchers are easily confirmable. Now put two and two together.

Doombunny9 wrote:
Set wrote:Read my post again. "Him" in what you quoted is referring to Jedo, not Power.

And no, I'm not caught up. As I stated.


Alright, I suppose that makes sense. Anyways, the reason for my unvote was that it seems to match up with his meta somewhat (Not perfectly but still enough to give it a pass) and it seems to work sometimes. The only issue I'm having with him now is that he kept it on for so long.

Llama continues to give little explaination for his reads but ah well, he's still rereading which I suppose is acceptable, just as long as we get more reasoning when he's finished.

Doombunny9 wrote:
Set wrote:I don't like this - that first of all he feels he needs to give a reason for unvoting Jedo (I think scum who are bussing would be more likely to do this) and second that it's such a weak reason and he's just assuming about the meta.


How is it weak? If someone was playing overly well except for on thing that was part of his meta, would you still find them (as) scummy? Sure I still don't like that he kept his BW vote on for so long and I'm still looking closely at him but other than that, he seems to be playing pretty town-like. Secondly, from some games on here, he already proved (to a point) that it was his meta that caused him to bus.

Set wrote:Doombunny votes Quaroth saying he's choosing between Pack and Quar for posting few opinions or new info. Doesn't mention Jedo at all. Based on his post when switching, Doom would've been the most likely to re-vote Jedo after the watcher claim. Not mentioning Jedo at all here is suspect.


I don't find him so scummy anymore. Sue me.

@Set- Other than the long bandwagon on Krypt, do you have any other reasons for thinking Jedo is scum?

I know that its a joke, but something seems off about his begging for Jedo votes. Eh, its probably nothing.

Doombunny9 wrote:
Set wrote:
Please elaborate. What do you find town-like about his posts?


His posts seem to come from a pro-town stance. His defenses of himself are complete and do make sense and more recently, he is beginning to do more and more scumhunting sch as his case on Twisted that is full and detailed (Which is more than I can say about some people) and he seems to be wanting and trying to catch scum rather than just sitting out in the background hiding from any more pressure.

@Quar- Who are your top 3 scumreads and why? Have you noticed anything in the thread that was interesting that no one has caught on to yet?



Jesus I can go on. He's unlikely scum with Setael.
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Post Post #902 (isolation #89) » Thu Jun 02, 2011 5:07 am

Post by GreyICE »

Bah, okay, Nacho sheeped me yesterday, and good things happened (okay, Packbat SHOULD have been scum, which WOULD have been awesome, but nope).


Vote: AV


ISO #41, wagons he pushed were lame, and Setael avoids mentioning him like the black plague. Plus Vox just feels off. Yes I'm sheeping Llama's opinion.
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Post Post #943 (isolation #90) » Sun Jun 05, 2011 5:44 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Nacho, if that is scum, you are so getting the Calcifer treatment.
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Post Post #947 (isolation #91) » Mon Jun 06, 2011 2:28 am

Post by GreyICE »

AurorusVox wrote:I have nothing fancy to claim.

Vanilla Townie


I
can
tell you that it will be interesting to see what Kryptinen claims.
Maybe it will make clear why I've been somewhat tunnelling her all game.

Wait what you can't have any inside information on Krypt you aren't a neighbor with her.

Explain.
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Post Post #950 (isolation #92) » Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:00 am

Post by GreyICE »

Yes I fucking do.

Too much power floating around.

Especially in 10:1:2

I'm going to
Unvote
because there is too much power noise. Now strongly tempted by Krypt wagon. AV-scum has no reason to rolefish krypt when I'm alive.
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Post Post #953 (isolation #93) » Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:24 am

Post by GreyICE »

Regfan: You got scummier just by asking that.

Like... 0.5%... maybe.
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Post Post #954 (isolation #94) » Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:25 am

Post by GreyICE »

Will vote for one of these two wagons before deadline.
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Post Post #956 (isolation #95) » Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:35 am

Post by GreyICE »

1) If Llamafluff was scum, he'd know that someone on the scumteam needs to claim VT in order to avoid the 'pseudo-confirmed VT' syndrome that's cropping up. 4:4 PR:VT with weak roles would NOT leave me this unwilling to lynch a VT. The setup is now becoming extraordinarily confusing. If he's partners, he's only partners with Vox, as the 'one VT, one PR' works there.

2) Read Llama's early game interactions with Krypt. VERY natural.

3) This team suggestion is pants.

Bad Regfan, go back to start, and collect +10 scum points.
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Post Post #960 (isolation #96) » Mon Jun 06, 2011 10:37 am

Post by GreyICE »

Llama is now on the 'information lynch' wagon again. Why don't we try lynching scum, Llama darling? You could have lynched Jedo for information yesterday, but Setael was a tad better, yes she was.

Mass Claim WILL FUCKING HAPPEN TOMORROW and everyone better be claimed to their neighbors by now. If we don't sort out the power roles, then things are bad.
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Post Post #982 (isolation #97) » Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:34 am

Post by GreyICE »

Vote: Krypt


Do better than this tomorrow town.
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Post Post #984 (isolation #98) » Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:41 am

Post by GreyICE »

Deadline is approximately 10:00am EDT June 7.


It's 8:41am EDT, 79 minutes to deadline.

Not sure what productive conversation is left kthx.
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Post Post #986 (isolation #99) » Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:00 am

Post by GreyICE »

79 minutes to deadline?

No, hammer falls.
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Post Post #991 (isolation #100) » Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:41 am

Post by GreyICE »

GO TOWN!
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Post Post #1164 (isolation #101) » Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:55 am

Post by GreyICE »

...

Nacho.

Bad.

V. Bad.

V. Bad Nacho.

Don't do that.
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Post Post #1166 (isolation #102) » Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:10 am

Post by GreyICE »

Well played AV. I was wondering on and off, but you did a good job of just sounding really town the entire time.

PEdit: *sigh*

No, no you didn't. I owe you pain for that. Why Nacho and Seacore were doing their best to make me think they were scum remains completely incomprehensible to me.

Oh well, only thing I'd done differently had I been alive would have been mislynch Nacho yesterday. He needed to die v. bad.
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Post Post #1178 (isolation #103) » Thu Jun 30, 2011 11:27 pm

Post by GreyICE »

Yeah, you need much more complex shenanigans to pull off fakeclaiming a NS as VT.
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