I'm going to re-read and see what the hell is going on. Try to wait. I'll be able to have re-read the entire thread by Saturday or Sunday.(I get Monday off, though, so, if I am running late, I'll definitely make it by then) Until then, try to hold off on whatever is going on atm.
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I'm going to re-read and see what the hell is going on. Try to wait. I'll be able to have re-read the entire thread by Saturday or Sunday.(I get Monday off, though, so, if I am running late, I'll definitely make it by then) Until then, try to hold off on whatever is going on atm.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Alright, not done with my re-read but I want to know what's going on so I can pretty much make sure I know some things when I'm done.
1. Do we have any idea of the numbers on the scum team?
2. Are we at MyLo?
3. Why are we voting NL?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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You worked out my reads based on 3 posts?
Also, vollkan, how the hell are you still alive? All throughout D1, people have called you a pro-town read. Btw, still not done reading but Im over halfway and should be done by late Sunday.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Not yet. Still reading. Don't worry, it's most likely going to be done late tonight. If not then, definitely tomorrow. I've been reading for a couple hours. We've got till Wednesday so it shouldn't be that much of a problem at this point.
Also, what do you guys think of pursuing a lynch? Ever since I joined this game, I've felt we should save our no lynch and put our money on hitting scum. I think we can lynch right today if we just add the info from the past 2 days up. I know it's a gamble, but I feel it's now or never. I mean, being at LYLO for three days in a row is going to be intense. Especially with scum controlling a higher percentage of the votes than they do now.
Also, vollkan, that "Why are you still alive" question was a serious one.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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I am not really interested in possible speculation(s). I am not going to engage in it either because, if you ask me, it's useless and distracting. What I want to know is: Why do you think you're still alive?
In other news, almost done...finally.. I only decided Id stay up the entire night and finish instead of going to bed at a regular time. I havent been preparing awalltl;dr post because, seriously, it's fucking 50 pages. If you guys want to know something specific, ask me when I give out my reads.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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.....after that D2, I can say I'm up for a NL. Im not as confident as I want to be or as I should be. I think talking this over with my neighbors is necessary so I can get a better grasp of my reads. I'm not going to lie, even I think they suck. Anyways, with that said, Im done with my re-read.
Nicolbolas is probably scum for me. I feel this slot has been on cruise control the majority of the game and has just been around. The replacements of his lurked the hell out of this game. Then Nico, who attacks Tasky D1,(While he's still here) and then goes for vezo D2, and later Tazaro/No Lynch D3. I feel like he's riding the majority coattails. Not once does he introduce anything that I'd say new. Also, each of his votes are placed on someone who's attracting attention but is not necessarily producing scumtells.(At least from my point of view)
Vollkan is slight town. I'm still intimidated by "Best Mafia Performance" but I liked his D2 play. I also saw some towntell in a post I read. I'll look for it in his ISO if asked but, right now, screw that. I just finished 50 pages. Don't feel like revisiting that atm.
Parama is null, I think town, not sure, though. Apparently, Tazaro was pretty sure he was scum since he asked every single one of his QT's about Parama.
Andrius is pretty null. He hasn't been around much of D3. I wish he was our D2 lynch simply for the information his lynch would be bring. Right now, I don't think he's very likely to be scum.
VV is...wtf are you VV? You came into a game and defended Andrius like a beast. Either you're scum getting town points or you're town hoping very hard it wasn't a mislynch. Trying to figure out which is pointless. This is part of the reason I wish Andrius was the D2 lynch. His play largely changed in D3 when he was talking about quicklynches and such. I don't like it. Now that I think about it, I think this slot is scum.
Xite is town. I was thinking scum for some part of D2 but his QT play was easily pro town intent.
Twomz... superbly null. I don't like his play because I can't get reads from it. I feel like he's just been here but hasn't been impacting the game that much.
....I still can't believe I read all of that. I should've pulled an RC and tunneled on my most likely scum suspect. without bothering.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Xite, I'm pretty sure vollkan isn't scum. His play in this game doesn't have a scummy intent at all. D1, he goes for Tasky but switches to Sando. The two people who were attracting the most attention. Sando is lynched. D2, he goes for vezo, who is definitely attracting more attention than all the other players. D3, he goes for no lynch and asks the person who he views as a noob to replace out. That's arguably the most pro town thing I've seen from his play. I'd oppose his lynch, especially at MyLo/Lylo, which we're at. Maybe after a scum flip, I'd be willing to reconsider but, right now, vollkan isn't a guy you want to put your money on for flipping scum. If vollkan is scum in this game, then just kill me post-game because I'm pretty positive the man can't be read if he is.
I think the more important parts of your 1v1 debate were the responses people had to it/how they reacted.
For example, VV says you're both town.
After that, Andrius argues that it isn't town vs town and is looking like he's ready to sheep Xite.
Another thing I liked from that WoT debate is seeing Nico say he's going for Parama over Twomz. This means I may be right to say that Twomz is looking pretty suspicious right now with his superbly null un-readable self. The thing I want you to look at, though, is how he puts Parama > Tazaro because Tazaro replacing out is "either scum or town" which doesn't say anything. On the page before that, even after Tazaro asked to replace out, he was "ready to put his vote on Tazaro, if the majority of the town agrees". He's also asking Andrius about voting Tazaro. But, as I mentioned a little bit earlier, he goes for Parama on the next page and ignores Tazaro, who he was pushing so hard, because Tazaro is "either scum or town". Am I the only one not buying this?
Twomz, why do you want to vote Tazaro/vollkan in your 1093/1094? You didn't give much reasoning asides from "theyre on the wagons of the two mislynches".
Parama, why does Twomz saying he is looking at two players you're looking at make him town?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Why would you break a trend of going for the person attracting the most attention when you had "good reasons" to go for them if you're scum? As scum, you would only want him replaced to get uber town points but it probably wont work because we're near end-game anyways. As town, you'd think Taz is newb but might not have a good read on him so you ask him to replace out. I'm pretty sure vollkan made it clear he works his reads out based on reasons for voting and Taz failed to provide that. I don't see vollkscum at all.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Now this is where it gets tricky. The VV/Andrius thing is a mindfuck. I reread some of D3 and VV's #1122/1123 made me want to take back my read of him. I like Twomz as a second lynch candidate. I am not very sure about a third but I'd go Andrius because both NK's supported his lynch and he still hasn't really performed the best scumhunting I've ever seen.
I am pretty sure people would have questions about my reads. Hammering and ending the day when we have plenty of discussion time is just stupid.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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...Xite, my part of our plan isn't going to work with some some lurking like they are.
Andrius, what changed overnight? D3 you were all for going NL.
If the scum want to not NK, I'm fine with NL'ing again.
Vote: No Lynch
My QT's are with Xite, Nico, and Andrius. I targeted Parama last night since he was the only person below me who I wasnt already in a QT with. Lol@vollkan. Why would we want to lynch you for that?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Excellent slip on a QT partner. Im done no lynching. Parama, you can suck it if you don't want to lynch in MyLo. First this guy mentions lynching lurkers at LyLo to Xite, then he defends Andrius to the brink of warfare, and now he gets his night targets messed up. I originally wanted to wait yesterday, and even today. Now I'm done waiting. I know who I think is most likely to flip scum and my opinion won't be changing much.VasudeVa wrote:Actually it's, Andy, Xite, NicolBolas. Screwed that up.
Note to self: Don't post while you're doing something else.
Unvote; Vote: VasudeVaFirst they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Well, I can't neighborize tonight. And I highly doubt my reads are changing after our night talk. If you can convince me why no lynching and letting a townie die instead of going for the guy I'm probably going for tomorrow makes sense, I'll consider it.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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No. The actual question is: how do we know there are lurker scum? I see no reason to go for lurkers when they could flip scum or town. I'd rather go for active scum first and make connections to the buddies later. This is MyLo. You don't decide it's time to lynch lurkers and lose us the game.VV wrote:Okay, Hindu. When DO we lynch lurker scum? How can we win if we don't lynch lurker scum? Hmm? D1? Oh dear, it's not D1 is it?
Yes, it's great to make a town call and narrow your chances of lynching scum. What I'm concerned with is you made the call D1. That's like "Yep, confirmed town" before that much info is even around to make a proper call. Scumbuddies, manipulation by either player, or the best player knowledge I've ever seen. I'll just let you know I don't believe the third option to be very likely.
Making mistakes is a null tell. I can't really pursue you for this but you're my top suspect as scum and, as great as this reasoning sounds, I don't think the mistake wasn't true.
@Vollkan
1. Scum QT buddies
2. For me, it's a fine strategy. I am not ready to see more town die off. It's great that the NK can generate info and all, but unless VV dies, I still see his chances of being scum highly likely.
3. Xite answered that, yeah.
4. You don't think considering someone confirmed town since D1 to MyLo, possibly LyLo, is scummy at all? If they're scumbuddies, it's the equivalent of never having to bus him.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Because Twomz/Nicol are the only ones lurking? In that case, who was the lurker you were looking at. I have a QT with Nicol and he talked to me during the night so I can answer some questions that I asked him overnight.VV wrote:Oh right, and how sure are you that the non-lurkers are scum too at MyLo?
You're scum for defending Andy, tbh. I can see a guy replacing into his friends scumbuddy slot and defending him based on a "town read". You can use your friendship/past experience with him as an excuse for defending him.
So you defended him...but you weren't sure if he was town or scum?VV wrote:I didn't actually say Andrius was confirmed Town, I said he was probably Town based on his actions/our conversation in the QT.
Mod: V/LA until late Sunday or MondayFirst they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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I hadn't read the Twomz part that you mentioned later. As for your scum being a lurker, why go for Twomz instead of one of your more active suspicions? At least you can verify your read on him then?VV wrote: thought you knew that I was suspicious of Twomz? Why are you suddenly asking me about who I'm suspicious of?
>_>VV wrote:Evidence? Quotes? This is a baseless accusation. Yes, I could do that as scum but unless you have evidence that I AM actually doing it, you're just hypothesizing and not proving anything.
Well, once again my logic is shot down. I feel like I'm only holding this vote because VV is making more sense than I am in an arguement, which is not scumhunting.Unvote
At this rate, we're all screwed, town. Time to pray for a miracle.
Also, I'd rather not hammer. It'd be better to wait for Nico's replacement to come in. I dont want to be short one player when we're in LyLo.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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It's a 50 page game. Chances are the slot will not be replaced into anytime soon. I want to wait for it.Xite91 wrote:
Uhm, considering that we're all null on him and another player would just bring in another perspective and probably help us find scum? They totally could hammer the guy getting replaced. Why would it be likely for scum to not nk him?Hinduragi wrote:...you seriously think scum will NK the guy getting replaced? Dude, you're out of your mind. This is exactly why NL shouldn't be hammered.
Actually, a modkill of the slot would be good as long as it didn't result in us losing the rest of the day.
As for modkilling it, would you rather want info off a NK or have a possible scum/possible town dead? Those are the only 2 viable options at this point. I would rather have info off the NK tbh.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Actually, I think VV/Andy might actually be town. It'd make sense. When looking on D2's NK, I bet scum were betting on Max being a PR even though it was apparent VV/Andy were going to confirm/regard each other as town. Scum would want a PR over masons, or the equivalent of masons.
Andy/VV, can you two say who you suspect again?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Parama, he already said why he's going for you.Charlie wrote:Hinduragi's #1260 is a good because we know where he stands on things, and we get fresh content to boot. The last comment was comedy gold. Okay, his case on why vollkan is town seems logical, but my gut says he isn't town. I can agree to hold off on his lynch for Today, but vollkan being vollkan being impossible to read is a threat. Definitely a worthy lynch, but we might not have any to spare... final decision to follow at the end of my read.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Dude, I'm not even voting you so chill. Instead of unreadable AtE, post a case on who you think is scum or something. Voting NL isn't something I want to do right now.In fact, I seriously doubt there's going to be a lynch today. I just don't see it happening but I could care less for NL. I read his vote as an honest one because I didn't and still don't want to vote vollkan for the exact same reasons. That's why I don't agree that he's being scummy. I can see you're frustrated but it's not like I'm not. . This game is full of bad reads and second guessing stuff. Our first game together was bad in terms of being friendly and whatnot, I'll admit, but some of your posts here have been like those from that game and some are entirely different. As far as I'm concerned, if you're town, you should know damn well to not call me fail town when you're saying I'm scum. I'm trying but it's not like I can pull scum lynches out of my ass and present the scumteam to town on a platter. If you're town, present a case on someone or do something so that it's easier to read you.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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That's because I think I have 3/4 of the townies found and we may have been right all along. Working on the last one now.Parama wrote:Hindu's suspicions are basically what the town as a whole had been saying the day before... aka generic and thoughtless.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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OH LOL...
I would quote if I could but oh well, you're going to have to trust me.
In our QT, Xite said that if Vollkan neighborizes with him and he's the NK, to lynch him fast. He said the same goes for Charlie. I'm not even sure why he said that but he was my last town read. I don't know who is town/scum but, hell, I will believe the only guy who I know is town at this point.Vote: vollkan
Parama, if you're believing Twomz and still thinking I'm scum, you're really going to have to re-read this thread. Look, I'm not scum, even if you think I am. I dont give a shit about Vote analysis right now because I just lost a game as VT where the LYLO town made me lose when I KNEW who was scum purely because scum gave a vote analysis where they bussed a buddy to l-1 in an instant scum-loss game. In the last message I got from Xite, he said you were telling Andrius lies about what Xite told you. Care to explain?
I don't even have a fucking case but I can trust my gut and the only pro-town advice I have received. Look, if you're town, tell me why he said to lynch vollkan/charlie because, frankly, he never told me why but he did say something about giving me and his town reads a piece of his "analysis" and then he changed his mind and said I was the only one getting it and then he never gave it to me. (If you're reading this, xite, tell me why post-game)First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Xite, Andrius, VV, and Charlie told me they would lynch him if they could in my QT. Xite is town, I'm town, and I think there is 1/3 town in those three so I'm pretty sure it's not a scum mislynch.Parama wrote:But something is saying that having him at the top spot in 4 lists either makes him scum to every town or a popular scum mislynch. Seeing as how he wasn't under any pressure prior to today, I'm leaning towards the latter.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Parama, if you have some god-given glory of scum reads in this game, I'd appreciate them. Mine, they're weak as shit, mainly based off of process of elimination because of my town reads. I'm going with Xite, because he had QT analysis and shit going on and apparently had a better grasp on the game than I did.
It's the same thing you said yesterday when they were voting you.Parama wrote:This isn't convincing at all.
That's the entire reason you switched your vote.Parama wrote:I didn't even mention voting analysis.
Xite said he told you something and then you lied about what he said to Andrius, who then apparently asked Xite about it.
I'm trying to figure out why Xite would want vollkan dead, besides the fact that he looks like someone who is avoiding a neighbor.
And what about the other two?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Twomz's post was a voting analysis... unless he was just summing up people's popular lynches? ...Idk, but it's almost the same thing even if it is a popular lynches thing.
Sigh, I guess we can wait for Andrius to clarify then? I wasn't told much about what you did. It was a one-liner message.
Xite/VV being the other two you didn't mention.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Parama wrote:This is the Twomz post I keep referring to. I thought he was doing something else with his vote on me :/
That's the one I'm referring to.Parama wrote:Hmm, maybe Twomz did nail it!
Yeah, the 4 person grouping. The connotation of Charlie/Andrius seemed like you thought of them both as scum. Xite was town. Since you're voting me, I must be your third scum so one of the others have to be town out of those mentioned.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Yes, my reads are that bad. I know it sounds like a scummy excuse to have my vote but if Xite said lynch him fast, then I'm confident he had good reason to do so, given how much analysis and input he had on the game.vollkan wrote:So, at LYLO, you are casting your vote based on something that Xite said which, by your own admission, you don't actually understand?
Why'd you target Xite, specifically?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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You didn't suspect, with people calling him obvtown and town or saying he's a town read, that he would be NK'd? Seriously, I was 100% that one of three things would happen last night: No NK, Xite NK, or me NK. With Xite NK being the leading one due to scum seeing that a lynch was coming so no NK would be bad for them and a me NK bad for them because Xite would protect me.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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You may not realize it yet, but since I've entered the game, instead of getting scum reads, I've been looking for town reads(Because not having good reads after a 50 page reread is pretty bad), and I've been doing it by making irrational, weird, or slightly stupid calls in order to get conversation rolling. This let me get my town reads. Here's what I've gotten since I joined the game:Parama wrote:Hindu: You are either stupid or scum if you're going to lynch based on one silly thing Xite said.
Town:
Myself
Andrius
Vasudeva
Last spot here is between Charlie/Parama
Scum:
Twomz
Vollkan
Last spot here is between Charlie/Parama
Parama, yes, I was hoping Charlie would comment about it since it is LyLo and he should be defending himself. Anyways, I'm pretty damn sure that Twomz is mafia. If you guys are ready to end this, I'm going to hammer.Also Twomz, wtf, you're L-1 in LyLo and that's your defense? "Scum can and will try to force a mislynch" Ironic because both my suspects are suspecting me and I know I'm a mislynch. Charlie, if you've seen our QT, you will notice I've been on the edge about Parama then yesterday murdered that but with you neighboring with Xite, I am against lynching him for now.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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...Oh, I misread votes. >_>Parama wrote:Nobody's at L-1?
Unvote; Vote: Twomz
I've got QT's with both my reads. I should be able to finish reads on them by tomorrow.(Unless Parama doesn't reply to me in our QT like he did last night)
As for the LyLo thing, I thought this was LyLo?
Also, Twomz, you're forgetting that the scum team is basically outed at this point, so voting for scum is completely acceptable. I know I'm town, but the guy on my wagon could just as well be fail town, so that's null. Include possible bussing and you don't have much.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Well, before Andy died, I had decided I would put what Twomz went out doing together so I would know where I wanted to go today.
Town-VasudeVa (1): Parama
Town-Andrius (1): Charlie
Town-Hinduragi (2): Vollkan, Twomz
Null-Charlie (2): Vollkan, Parama
Null-vollkan (2): Charlie, Hind
Town-Twomz (4): Andrius, VV, Parama, Hind
Null-Parama (5): Andrius, Charlie, VV, Twomz, Hind
Town (8): Parama, Charlie, Vollkan, Twomz, Andrius, VV, Parama, Hind
Null (9): Vollkan, Parama, Charlie, Hind, Andrius, Charlie, VV, Twomz, Hind
Taking Twomz out.
Town (7): Parama, Charlie, Vollkan, Andrius, VV, Parama, Hind
Null (8): Vollkan, Parama, Charlie, Hind, Andrius, Charlie, VV, Hind
Taking town-reads out.
Town (4): Parama, Charlie, Vollkan, Parama
Null (4): Vollkan, Parama, Charlie, Charlie
Note that the above three are my lynch choices. I told Charlie the scumteam had to be VV/Andy or him/vollkan as well in my QT. Killing Andy would basically mean I'd go after him/vollkan. Also, his one scumread on my town-read was NK'd, meaning he had to go for a person I thought to be scum today. In light of this, I don't think Charlie is scum.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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This will probably make me sound even scummier if you didn't like my votehop before.
I explained to Andy in our QT the same list so I thought he would've told you about it already. Basically, I had to decide between you/Andy scumteam and a Charlie/Parama/vollkan scumteam in our QT. You're going to love this next part. Because he said you were town based on meta and gut while using XD, I decided to trust him. Based on his personality, I didn't think scum Andy would lie to me while using XD. I'm willing to risk the game on my read, yes. He also said you guys concluded a while ago you were in a mountainous game. Idk about his read on me because he never gave me reads, but I'm thinking he thought I was town since he asked who I thought was scum and put vollkan's name with a question mark under that.
Believe it or not, though, my votehop was just me trying to get reads.
The list is Twomz's list of who everyone wanted to lynch. I put town next to the people I had townreads on.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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No. I took this listVV wrote:@Hindu: Am I reading it right that, again, you are using other people's cases?
where he called a Hind/VV/Andrius scumteam and made my own conclusion of the NK and who I thought would be scum based on that NK off of that. In our QT, I told Andy you/me/him all had even chances of being the NK. Parama, I thought I was L-1 too, but I'm not. I'm L-2. Anyways, whoever's town, we should start putting all these reads together. I know some people's reads have changed since yesterday, given the NK, so let's offer them up.Twomz wrote:VasudeVa (1): Parama
Andrius (1): Charlie
Hinduragi (2): Vollkan, Twomz
Charlie (2): Vollkan, Parama
vollkan (2): Charlie, Hind
Twomz (4): Andrius, VV, Parama, Hind
Parama (5): Andrius, Charlie, VV, Twomz, Hind
1. Charlie is town
2. Andy told me that, if he dies, VV is probably scum. Though I'm not aware of who he told this to so scum may've killed Andy on purpose to frame VV. Largely null tell read here. VV's reaction to that list doesn't help this much.
3. The scumteam is in Parama/VV/Vollkan.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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1) I had a town read on Nicol from our QT. The only reason I doubted Charlie was because of what Xite said. The NK on the town-read I had that Charlie thought was scum died last night.
2) Town can use poor reasoning; I've seen them use it. For example, when I voted you based on what Xite said. Although that had a different motive from a normal vote, it was implied to each of you as poor reasoning.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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Only if your win condition involves mafia outnumbering town.
1.
2. Yes, you voted me in LyLo based on a list you thought I stole from Twomz. Town voting in LyLo that fast without thinking it through = does not compute.Me wrote:Note that the above three are my lynch choices. I told Charlie the scumteam had to be VV/Andy or him/vollkan as well in my QT. Killing Andy would basically mean I'd go after him/vollkan. Also, his one scumread on my town-read was NK'd, meaning he had to go for a person I thought to be scum today. In light of this, I don't think Charlie is scum.
3. And this is why I didn't say "Yo, VV is def-scum, time for him to die". I also want to know if Andy told anyone else this in a QT.First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.-
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Hinduragi Jack of All Trades
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