Mini #1004 - Popularity Mafia (Over)

[RayFrost]

If you have any urgent questions you'd like me to answer, let me know.

Quick thoughts:

I agree with max on the issue of neighboring - free choice on that is better than forced.

I've so far skimmed through the thread, and xiti felt like a newbie that was stretched thin while trying to be helpful more than scum making lolbad cases.

As for tasky, I'm neutral - I find his postings to be a bit swingy in nature, so my read's really shaky. I'd like it if the people voting him could give a

brief

summary of the case against 'im for ease of reading (I don't do as well with reading walls of text as I used to).

As for RC - I agree with prana, but don't feel it's vote worthy... yet.

Want to see moar from:

RC

BV

CSL

thelonging

confidanon

Dislike sando's dodging of the question made by max regarding

why tasky is scummier than [insert every other player in the game]

.

Dislike max's lack of promised posting.

Vollkan / Max:

Thoughts on players OTHER than sando would be appreciated.

[RayFrost]

Oh, friend was voting tasky.

Unvote: Tasky

That aside...:

Unvote, Vote: Sando

I feel that the Tasky wagon isn't going anywhere, and Tasky's been doing well on his own. I'm leaning town on him, but would be willing to vote him at deadline.

When is deadline, Llama?

Sorry for not providing much. I'll get back into the game soon; I'm in the midst of posting catch-up posts everywhere. lol

I really, really, really, really dislike this post. You unvote him based off of "the wagon isn't going anywhere" and then also say you are now leaning town on him while being willing to vote at deadline.

Let me list off what I don't like:

1. If the wagon isn't going anywhere, you reiterate your case, etc. I also dislike the fact this comes after I asked for a brief summary of the tasky case. Feels like a dodge and also jumping off a wagon as it loses steam (a la lack of conviction)

2. You say tasky's been "doing well on his own" without much explanation. It seems like a very generic way of excusing your previous suspicion. In addition, it's something that would (hypothetically) make me feel that you, as scum, were trying to bus. (he's doing well on his own kinda implies you were trying to improve his situation with the vote or some such, could be wrong on my interpretation)

3. You vote sando without giving

any reason whatsoever

as to why you are. It really is looking like you are just jumping on the most popular wagon without really justifying why. Coattailin' anybody?

Vote: Andrius

[RayFrost]

^5 sando.

I'll read tasky's claim and comment on your analysis (still gotta read through the thread fully after the skim)

[RayFrost]

I notice everyone has avoided actually looking at Tasky's claim or commenting on my analysis.

I saw it. I chose not to comment on the claim. Foreign exchange students are pretty popular at my school, but that isn't going to make this game any different, so I kept my mouth shut.
An OMGUS vote and a sudden case out of nowhere? I'm entertaining the thought of Tasky/Sando, or Sando/

Friend

RayFrost.

Woohoo for lack of reasoning! Go andri, go andri, you're scummy!

Seriously.

You aren't giving any reasoning as to how tasky / sando is realistic, why sando is scummy, or how I am scummy, or how sando / me is realistic.

Do so. Now. Preferably with pringles as a gift. Everything is better with pringles.

[RayFrost]

I can always smell a good wagon a mile off.

Unvote; Vote: Andrius

I can always smell a person that I find scummy a mile off...

SoS (slap of suspicion): Reaper

POST SOME DAMN CONTENT.

[RayFrost]

I was "entertaining the thought" which is nothing more than me thinking about it for a couple seconds. A passing trend, if you will.
Pringles do not motivate me.
Wait, who are you?
Err, that is, who are you replacing? Friend? Hm.
But I don't want to do work... I just want to be lazy...
I'll work on the reasoning when I'm not popping pills, ok? Thanks.

"I was 'entertaining the thought' which means

nothing more than me thinking about it for a couple seconds

I shouldn't have posted it, since I don't really have any support, and I'm now trying to back away from my statement in fear of getting called out on this further."

Yeeeaaahhh, not working for me. The above quote change shows why I don't feel its working for me.

You throw something out there without really actually having any support for it and then try to excuse it as but a random idea with no support when called out on it and then still don't provide any content. Pill popping or not, I want reasoning. If you can't give reasoning while popping pills, you shouldn't be posting at those times.

[RayFrost]

Also, I'm working on a sort of mega post or something, so yah... expect something long from me later at a random time even while I'm posting these to explain what I'm doing and smack down / respond to everything going on.

[RayFrost]

Ok, here's my 2 cents.
One of Xite/Friend is probably scum (if Tasky isn't).

[Reasoning Needed]

Between you two... probably Xite. Especially if Tasky flips scum. There's no way he would be putting pressure on you with him at L-1, if you're his scumbuddy.
But I will Neighborize Xite, so we'll see where that takes us.

[See Above]

I'm feeling temporarily tired of the Tasky case(Although he is a fine deadline lynch.) and I want to see where a Friend wagon would take us. Plus the Tasky wagon reeks of scum, possibly 2 of them in here(Right now, I'm thinking its Sando and Friend.). And I do not see anyone(bar me, as of this post) defending him.

I'm not a fan of forced dichotomies (The 'Between me and xite who is scummier') which I see as a possible attempt to get Andrius on his side of the argument, and the back and forth vote hopping to two lynchbaits (Tasky and Xite.). I actually think that Town would just ignore Xite, but the 'between me and xite' post (and maybe the tunneling accusation) makes me think he's fearing the pressure.

Plus he's totally buddying with his username and avatar. /sarcasm

Vote: Friend

Reasoning for friend / sando being scummy, go! (also, just noticed this and realize that Andri is likely piggy backing on VV here for the whole sando/friend idea, just sayin')

I don't see how asking andrius who he thinks is scummier between two alternatives that he listed is a forced dichotomy on the part of friend. Andrius said (IIRC) "one of xite / friend is scum." Why wouldn't friend want to know who andrius finds more likely? And, if town would just ignore xite, then wouldn't andrius be the more scummy player, as he's the one that initially brought it up? I find the inequality in your application to be suspect.

Good posting by tasky.

THIS IS NOT GOOD POSTING. Sure, you state the completely obvious, and there's not really anything wrong with that. But then you try and force people to consider only two possibilities without any personal analysis of it. This, in of itself, is suspect.

Your lack of analysis isn't helping at all either, so call it even.

Sure, it's possible, so is what PD said. I don't like the fact you also fail to consider the possibility that... *suspenseful pause* ... the case is bad. You seem to assume that he's either scum or the scum are already on him. Now, naturally, 2.a could encompass lolbadcase, but you don't discuss that part of the scenario... nor do you really discuss anything.

I find the vollk vs sando debate to be tiresome and of minimal value.

Well, this really wasn't much of a mega post when compared to my old posting, but it really sums up my current focus point(s) and doesn't ramble, so I'll leave it as is...

[RayFrost]

VV's right, but andrius is still scum.

re friend scum reasons:

Buddying implied in his playstyle...? I don't even know where to begin to ask you to explain what you mean.

re Sand's attacking lynch-bait:

Hmmm... I can see that, but I find him not attacking RC (clear, easy, simple, and justified lynch to get, imo) as well to contradict it slightly, which makes me feel more lenient (and he's actually giving some content + moving off of tasky even while the rawrkilltasky hate was still present, may have misremembered the moving off timing, though).

Also, opinion of Andrius' play. I'm fine with your pranarawr, but I want some andriusexplanation too.

[RayFrost]

VV - 2

Prana - 0

Argument just makes Prana seem more like the innocent young newbie that I once new... aka frustrated town that misinterprets others.

[RayFrost]

Vollkan.

Why are you ignoring me?

Answer mah questions, please.

[RayFrost]

As for tasky, I'm neutral - I find his postings to be a bit swingy in nature, so my read's really shaky. I'd like it if the people voting him could give a

brief

summary of the case against 'im for ease of reading (I don't do as well with reading walls of text as I used to).

Vollkan / Max:

Thoughts on players OTHER than sando would be appreciated.

I know you've changed your vote from tasky already, but I'd like a brief case still.

And your thoughts outside of sando.

[RayFrost]

Oh, and do you still think tasky is scummy and that sando is scummier or do you think tasky is neutral/town/etc?

[RayFrost]

@ Sando:

I don't see any problem with vollk having an issue with RC. Why do you?

[RayFrost]

I really think the shenanigans between vollk and sando are just that. Shenanigans. Seriously. Drop it. Your argument isn't getting anywhere and it's essentially just both of you going "no u!!" in a more convoluted manner. Either come up with some new points or drop your argument entirely. It's distracting while not providing any real value.

[RayFrost]

Oh, though I do like sando's analysis at the end of his post.

[RayFrost]

Max:

Thoughts on players OTHER than sando would be appreciated.

[RayFrost]

Hey andrius, I think you are missing a few points

THIS IS NOT GOOD POSTING. Sure, you state the completely obvious, and there's not really anything wrong with that. But then you try and force people to consider only two possibilities without any personal analysis of it. This, in of itself, is suspect.

Your lack of analysis isn't helping at all either, so call it even.

Sure, it's possible, so is what PD said. I don't like the fact you also fail to consider the possibility that... *suspenseful pause* ... the case is bad. You seem to assume that he's either scum or the scum are already on him. Now, naturally, 2.a could encompass lolbadcase, but you don't discuss that part of the scenario... nor do you really discuss anything.

[RayFrost]

Sure, it's possible, so is what PD said. I don't like the fact you also fail to consider the possibility that... *suspenseful pause* ... the case is bad. You seem to assume that he's either scum or the scum are already on him. Now, naturally, 2.a could encompass lolbadcase, but you don't discuss that part of the scenario...

nor do you really discuss anything.

I don't think the case was bad. I voted him, remember?
There's scum on almost any given wagon, so I'm right there. Err, correct there.

Main point of contention in bold. Conveniently ignored.

I really, really, really, really dislike this post. You unvote him based off of "the wagon isn't going anywhere" and then also say you are now leaning town on him while being willing to vote at deadline.

A lynch is better than no lynch. I'd be willing to vote anyone over a No Lynch, given its D1. (Assuming they don't claim a PR, *insert good reason here*, etc.)

Then that'd make the comment moot, besides, you should not be willing to vote somebody you think is town at deadline - it's better to vote somebody you DO NOT think is town. The issue is willingness to lynch a town read.

1. If the wagon isn't going anywhere, you reiterate your case, etc.

I also dislike the fact this comes after I asked for a brief summary of the tasky case. Feels like a dodge and also jumping off a wagon as it loses steam (a la lack of conviction)

Is the first line what I did or what I should've done?

The first line is what you should've done if you still felt the case was good.

2. You say tasky's been "doing well on his own" without much explanation. It seems like a very generic way of excusing your previous suspicion. In addition, it's something that would (hypothetically) make me feel that you, as scum, were trying to bus. (he's doing well on his own kinda implies you were trying to improve his situation with the vote or some such, could be wrong on my interpretation)

Yes I did. I'm assuming the other people are reading the thread to see what Tasky's been doing. If they don't agree, I can debate it.
That's what I thought, so take it or leave it.

"I assume others are reading the thread, so I don't have to explain myself" ~= what you are saying here, imo... and it's horrible reasoning.

3. You vote sando without giving any reason whatsoever as to why you are. It really is looking like you are just jumping on the most popular wagon without really justifying why. Coattailin' anybody?

Well, it was me being lazy and me liking the case on Sando and other stuff. It wasn't the most popular wagon (I think), I'm pretty sure Tasky was still #1. Not coattailin'.

[/quote]

A wagon that "isn't going anywhere" is hardly #1. Especially considering there were two very active players attacking sando (max + vollkan = lethal combo, imo). The fact that you are just giving a generic "I like the case and other stuff [that will not in any way be discussed or explained by me]" is actually reinforcement of the coattailing idea. You are giving a blanket agreement with two highly active and semi-aggressive players while pretending to give a semblance of actual content while not really doing so. (note: VV attacked PD on this issue but not andrius). I'd also like to note that vollk was on the tasky wagon and was then moving to an attack on sando. You were on the tasky wagon and are now moving on to sando. If this isn't playing "follow vollkan" I really don't know what is.

[RayFrost]

Oh, and for clarity regarding the VV note...

My issue is more that VV attacked PD while also not really agreeing with the andrius wagon - he doesn't want andrius lynched, but he can't disagree with the points is a vague way of avoiding the wagon while still not arguing against it. The form of fencesitting that I really, really don't like.

[RayFrost]

To answer vollk's question, I'll quote the analysis to help others know what I'm talking about

Rayfrost/Vollkan: I have a problem with the general attitude of Vollkan to the Andrius wagon. He agrees with one tiny part of my case, gives Andrius a few scumpoints, then questions (I think attacks, you can decide on the wording) one of the supporters of the wagon. It's like he realises that he has to comment on the wagon, but wants to get back to other things straight away and attempt to throw it in a weak light. Ray, it's not that it's RC, I understand you dislike RC, it's how he went about going after the weakest link of the wagon.

Also, noting that 2 people have been attacked over the wagon very quickly, one for agreeing and basically paraphrasing before voting, one for not paraphrasing and then voting. This is despite noone actually coming up with any counters to the case(s) put up. I'm more and more convinced that Andrius is scum because of this and being defended by a buddy. At this point I think it's Vollkan.

The reasoning behind this makes some sense to me and doesn't feel like a contrived case on somebody. It's not so much that the analysis is

spot on awesome

so much as

the motivation behind it seems townish

.

RC's not a weak link of the wagon so much as a scummy individual on the wagon. It's not like vollk's attacking a real supporter of the wagon - RC's a tagalong that isn't giving anything of value.

I also agree about andrius scum and I do lie the fact he's pointed out nobody has come up with a counter while supporters of the lynch are still being attacked over it. I don't agree with the end conclusion, though. vollk seems town.

[RayFrost]

I already explained why the very notion that I 'attacked' RC is ridiculous (to recap: asking somebody to state their reasoning is not 'attacking'). And you seem to share my concern with the way RC joined the wagon.

How then is it not "contrived"?

I do share it, yes.

I've played with sando before (me-scum, him-town), and he had a proclivity to misinterpret the stances of other players (nearly got him lynched, IIRC) and act in a hyper-reactive manner when attacked.

Despite his misunderstandings, he has an undercurrent of

absolute conviction

that is hard to break through. His frustrations and extreme reactions are palpable to me.

[RayFrost]

Is his behaviour in his argument with me consistent with what you saw meta?

Verily.

His arguing often enough ends up repeating the same argument without realizing it... like what's happened with you.

I may have misremembered, though, so link.

[RayFrost]

Ah yes, that game, I had forgotten that. Yes, I will react in a hyper-reactive manner to people attacking me and attempt to tear their arguments apart, especially as town. I've tried to modify this to a great extent in not finding people who attack me necessarily scummy. However when I find myself misrep'd by someone who obviously understands or has the capacity to understand what I'm trying to say, I react very badly.

How am I misinterpreting Vollkans stance? If you simply say 'you said attacking' I'm going to get the shits btw.

You said attacking. This is clearly wrong!

Seriously, though... it's the whole "Attacking the weakest link" thing. I believe your perspective on it is off - finding somebody scummy for mindlessly wagoning on a good case is a natural reaction. I also feel that vollk has explained why he isn't on board with the wagon itself (he has other suspects of greater scumitude from his PoV). The fact it's because he feels

you

to be scummier might be coloring your view a bit. That and you like the andrius lynch as much as I do - you are very passionate about who you think is scum (reference the underlying current of absolute conviction comment).

[RayFrost]

Can you just reconcile this for me please Rayfrost:

I believe your perspective on it is off - finding somebody scummy for mindlessly wagoning on a good case is a natural reaction.

This is what you think is a 'natural reaction for Vollkan, yet Vollkan said this in relation to wagoning:

FOr the same reason that random-wagonning is often done, it's just sometimes good (no matter what your alignment) to create a situation that throws up people's reactions.

And Vollkan has made it pretty clear what he thinks of tells that both scum and town do, they're not tells. So it seems to me that Vollkan disagrees with what you think is a 'natural reaction' for him.

Oh, I missed that. Yeeeaaaahhhh... vollk will have to explain himself on this one.

[RayFrost]

0_o

...

*sadface*

Give content.

Both of you.

[RayFrost]

*cough*

...

...

I'm very close to wanting to kill you. You are absolutely worthless and dead weight.

[RayFrost]

I'm a RayFrost alt. That should explain it.

But seriously though... yeah I'll begin to help in a few days when I have time.

If you don't have time, get some. I don't want to see another worthless post out of you until I see some valuable insight or reasoning or something actually game-related that is in any way useful. Got it?

[RayFrost]

Last I checked, vollkan was voting sando.

[RayFrost]

Vote: Sando

^---- still not posting content

[RayFrost]

I agree with sando.

Still prefer andrius.

[RayFrost]

I am strongly against the Andy case and here is why:
I do not detect any malice from this guy.

There is a total lack of a scum mindset in his play

and everyone still voting him should be ashamed of themselves. D:. Seriously, ISO him in Greek Mythology and Trader Mafia and compare his ISO here. It's WAAYY different from his play here. He's like extremely malicious with his votes and his attacks as scum, and is constantly trying for a lynch. I don't see it here plus

he is playing with a very Townie mindset and I have a feeling it's genuine.

Examples needed.

[RayFrost]

and it looks like Friend was replaced by RayFrost so I mean that vollkan, Rayfrost, and Sando are the scum.
I am on page 9, I feel no need to read anymore, I have seen enough, but I'll read on anyways.

You need to at least read pages 13 and on.

[RayFrost]

...

The sando aggression started

way

before I replaced in. My attack on andrius was based in solid logic - saying that it was a chainsaw defense is stretching at best.

Also note that your own chainsaw defense argument can be used to explain vollk / max

just recently

voting sando to provide a counterwagon, considering the arguments against him started long before the wagon started and the wagon began soon after I went after andrius... :/

Your logic is very loose.

Also, all your logic on me seems to be a result of friend without much regard for my own posting - that's fine, but are you ignoring the meat of my posts?

[RayFrost]

Sando wagon started before Andrius wagon, I just read that, don't lie about wagon orders. You went after Andrius after his jump onto the Sando wagon, in fact.
I like your posting better than Friend's, but if Friend was scum, then you're going to be scum as well, regardless of the differences in your posting. You are your predecessor's role.
Also my predecessor was a moron.

Also Sando you really think that's my argument? Did you read my post?

oh, ugh. I blame bad memory. I'm getting up in the years.

A fair point.

[RayFrost]

RC: Yeah, well I explained my Town read on Andy a few posts ago. Do you disagree? Why?

because of 463.

These?

[RayFrost]

*tear* Parama's grown up so quicly...

[RayFrost]

We're not policy lynching RC on D1.
We need to lynch the scum (Sando, Ray, vollkan)

At least 1 / 3 of this list is wrong.

Parama, do you feel that andrius / RC are not scummy?

Would you mind making some points to break down the arguments for their lynches?

[RayFrost]

It's not that Andrius isn't scummy - I don't like his hop onto the Sando wagon, especially.
But I don't think Andrius and Sando are scum together. And Sando is my #1 pick for scum. So by that logic I have no reason to want an Andrius lynch right now if I feel my #1 suspect cannot be scum with him.

RC is just useless, always.

Okay on the first bit...

and if RC is ALWAYS useless, does that mean you are unable to ever get a read on him in the first place?

[RayFrost]

RC is just useless, always.

and if RC is ALWAYS useless, does that mean you are unable to ever get a read on him in the first place?

[RayFrost]

whoa I'm not voting?

vote: Sando

Ray, the only other game I was in with him, I had no need to read him because I was scum. I can read players independent of their stupid meta stuff because meta is useless and scumhunting with in-game content and good tells works.

Okay, so you think RC is just a worthless VI that should be ignored? Or do you just feel that it doesn't matter because he's such a contentless player that him-scum or him-town will eventually be lynched anyway so you don't need to worry about it? Explain your view-poit of RC further for me, as I'm not sure I understand what your thoughts are on

his alignment

.

[RayFrost]

Sando's right, VV's wrong. VV + Andrius scum team. Calling it now.

[RayFrost]

VV, it was the fact you were using

a counter to your own defense of andrius

to explain how sando was scummy for his word choice, when that was dictated by the fact he was responding to your own posts.

This kind of circular attacking method seems like an attempt to make sure sando's scummy regardless of the result while making a fake defense of andrius.

[RayFrost]

Posting to keep myself awak...

fail

No content.

[RayFrost]

You are the only one that's posted a lot

without

content.

And the only one that's stated they won't provide any.

[RayFrost]

Ah, I must correct you there.
It is not utterly meaningless to me.

And now you have two choices:

a) follow Reaper's schnoz for the win.
b) spurn Reaper, and be ready to eat your hat when we lose to andyscum.

your choice.

[RayFrost]

RC is anti-town/scummy, but I honestly feel that it is better to get activescumthatmayslipfromgrasp over nonactivescumthatwilldoabsolutelynothing.

Basically, andrius is the former, RC is the latter, clearly better to lynch andrius.

[RayFrost]

RC is anti-town/scummy, but I honestly feel that it is better to get activescumthatmayslipfromgrasp over nonactivescumthatwilldoabsolutelynothing.

Basically, andrius is the former, RC is the latter, clearly better to lynch andrius.

I'm confused. RC's definitely more active than me? Y/N?
I fail to see how he's non-active.

Non-active means not contributing anything at all or even trying to pretend to. It's a lack of proactive action or, really, any action whatsoever.

Between RC and yourself, I feel that RC is less beneficial as a lynch in so much that I think both of you are scum but I think your lynch would give more information as to who the scum buddies are than RC. RC's an

extremely

easy lynch, so there'd be almost nothing to gain from watching the lynch happen while a lynch of you has the benefits of people taking sides and arguing about it for future reference.

Both are scum, but one scum lynch gives more info than the other.

[RayFrost]

I would definitely support your lynch. And Ray don't you agree that it'd have to be a pretty hard bus, to be calling for his lynch so soon, and without doubt of his alignment.

Kill Andrius and I will find your next scum.

You switched to sando soon after, so not a hard bus... besides, sando and I made good cases on him before you showed up, so it's, again, not a difficult bus to pull off.

Outside of that, andrius, try to remain civil.

Calling people "moron" an sich is against the rules and I'd hate for you to have to suffer punishment.

That aside, deadline was extended by the mod until the 3rd, I think. We should be lynching soon, though.

Vote: Andrius

for emphasis.

[RayFrost]

AND HOW CAN YOU FiND SCUM WiTHOUT READing THE THREAD MORON?!?

well

I found

I followed the two cases that were against you sooooooooooooooo yeah.

Fixed.

[RayFrost]

You are missing "andrius" in that line up.

[RayFrost]

Sigh. I hate being on the other side of the world. T_T. Any attempt I make at playing F2F mafia here fails hard because of some language issues and our uncooperative slacker culture. D:.

@Sando: Andy seems 'lost' since is totally directionless with his actions in this game, plays follow the leader and is posting a lot of fluff. Being 'lost' and being 'malicious' sort of contradict each other. I find that players of Andrius' archetype are extremely scummy and malicious D1 and onwards.

soooo...

not posting content and following the most popular wagons and decisions is lost and not scummy at all.

Amazing.

I'm awestruck.

[RayFrost]

I see no value to anybody claiming who they neighbored with at this time:

1. Let's say two town players got neighbored that are avid scumhunters, yadda yadda yadda. In this instance, claiming it would give scum more information as to who to target, yes? I think the information should be kept secret until the town's gotten some information from it.

I don't feel afraid to claim that PD neighbored me because he's

dead

expelled.

I also distinctly recall that we agreed not to follow the "one below you" popularity plan. It limits scumhunting of those in the higher rungs of popularity through their power.

[RayFrost]

Tazaro, if you're concerned that vezok skipped over Rayfrost to neighborize you, why did you also do the same thing to neighborize with ShiftyWhip?

I'm concerned about the issue of what vezo's

reason

for skipping RayFrost is. I neighborized with ShiftyWhip because I do NOT want to talk to Andrius or Parama who are suspicious to me due to Sando's flip as town. I do not want to run the risk of being propogandized/swayed by scum.

Wouldn't it be better to be able to yell at your suspects during the night in order to strengthen a read on them?

Your reason for dodging is dodgey.

[RayFrost]

I targetted Tazaro and it worked. Yoohoo.
Also volkann targetted me.

MOD: CAN YOU COPY PASTE MY NAME. IT'S THE 3RD TIME I SEE YOU MESS IT UP

Anyone wanna tell me what happened ?

Also

Mod: Can we use the QT only during night time?

If you are going to claim who you targeted, explain why.

As I said before, I'd prefer it if people didn't claim their targets - the information is counter-productive at this point. No info has been gained from the targets, so claiming them only helps scum

[RayFrost]

Here you go

Popularity List:
1. Max
2. PranaDevil
3. VasudeVa
4. bv310
5. vollkan
6. Sando
7. ReaperCharlie
8. RayFrost
9. Tazaro
10. Andrius
11. Parama
12. ShiftyWhip

New and improved.

[RayFrost]

Can Max claim his rolename?
I mean I wanna know who he is.
I have no idea why mascot is before me.

Rolename is unimportant. Max, please don't answer this question.

Stop commenting on the flavor.

Now give some analysis, who do you think is scum? town? neutral reads?

Opinion of the game so far?

Did you approve of the chosen lynch?

Why? Why not?

[RayFrost]

I got RayFrost as scum.
I don't agree with the lynch cause it ended in a townie death.
Param is a little suspicious.
I didn't read the game too much.

Reasoning is tech.

Without that knowledge, would you have agreed with the lynch?

Reasoning is tech.

I suggest you do so.

[RayFrost]

@vezo, Why is RayFrost scum? Why did you neighborize with me, vezo?

I already asked those questions, and now I'm going to ask you some questions...

Who do you think is scum? Why?

Why aren't you voting them if you think they are scum?

How have your reads changed from the flip(s)?

What is your opinion of parama's play? Do you feel the way that parama's set up an easy way to go on both easy lynches (if sando isn't scum, andrius is!) is scummy or sincerely the result of scumhunting?

Do you feel that VV's defense of andrius was coming from a sincerely town-sided motivation or that he was doing it for an ulterior motive?

[RayFrost]

I am a master at seeing Parama scum and Parama town. Let me read the thread and I will share .

In the meantime, also explain your other claimed reads. Gut isn't worth a damned thing.

[RayFrost]

RayFrost is scum based on Friend's meta.
He is rolefishing hard at the beginning. He doesn't do things.

Now I will read tasky/Parama. This should be easy.

:/

Okay, so you are doing iso reads, then. You clearly lack the context for friend's posts, and you clearly feel that nothing I've done is so townish as to counteract it... for some reason, it sounds awfully similar to what parama said...

hmmmm...

[RayFrost]

Sando has made a couple of posts that people jumped over for no real reason, and apparently is due to be lynched despite being nowhere near as scummy as Andrius, let alone RC.

Parama decides to blatantly lie about having a day cop role to try and get Sando lynched, and thus far, nobody has actually questioned him on this point.

Quick comment...

the comment by prana was towards an obvjoke that was in no way serious, even I could tell, so point nulled

[RayFrost]

Anyways I know you're wrong on me and your tell for Ray is unfair because it's based 100% not on his play. So I refuse.

Considering you did the same thing for considering me scum earlier, I'm not really certain that you making this point makes me feel any more solid about your play.

Although I think andrius is scum, I find the fact Parama set up the ability for him to

easily slip on to either the sando or the andrius wagon

on consecutive days to be scummy. It seems like scum trying to adjust the odds so that they can support both of the most popular lynches.

@ iiiiiiq:

Thoughts on the game. Now.

@ Max:

Feelings on who is scum?

How has/have the flip(s) changed your reads?

What do you think about the point I just made regarding Parama?

[RayFrost]

vezok + andrius scumteam with vezok failbussing.

/prediction

Vote: vezokpiraka

andrius is more likely to be useful for later in our finding scum through his links, though both of them are scum

[RayFrost]

Andrius wagon < vezok wagon

Go go go.

Lynch the mofo.

[RayFrost]

Andrius wagon < vezok wagon

WHy?

Vezok's scum.

So is andrius, but vezok won't provide any connections, andrius will. So andrius-scum that's alive = scumconnections, while vezok-scum that's alive = none, both are scum, but there's a preference.

[RayFrost]

Wagon on me.
RayFrost sees me scum everywhere.
I stil support a Parama wagon or Ray Frost wagon. Or even Andrius.

"lolnotdefendingmyself.
lolweakmetabasedoffofvirtuallynothingandanattempttodiscreditthepersonwhofirstputupthewagon.
lolflailingandtryingtoavoidmyownlynchwithoutgivingreasoningfortheothers"

translated.