Open 127 (Lovers Nightless -- GAME OVER) before 761

[Empking]

Day 1 is for getting information. If a "random" lynch (such as guardian's) is what's needed then that's what we should do. If you're talking about agreeing to lynch someone and then rolling a dice, then hell no.

Also, as I'm pretty sure it will help the town. If Mith is put on L-1, I will hammer.

Vote: Zwets

- I like RVS.

[Empking]

I know we're not scum buddies. If I say that then everyone else should also know that. Which when we go to day 2 presuming we're both alive it should reduce the possible scum pairs from 8 (from town PoV) to seven.

[Empking]

Its similar to what Sensfan tried.

[Empking]

I meant Mith. Remember, that we still get info if scum put Mith into L-1.

[Empking]

I chose Mith as I thought it was better to do one person rather than everyone. I picked Mith at random.

[Empking]

I chose Mith as I thought it was better to do one person rather than everyone. I picked Mith at random.

but that doesn't prove anything. You could still just be saying that in order to prevent us putting mith at L-1, and are really lovers with him. It's too wifomy.

Do you want me to stop it?

[Empking]

Yes.

[Empking]

Put him onto L-1 then.

[Empking]

Mith: You may have forgotten 4?

Well, I know only one of them are possible and of course we also know that you might be scum and that there are also many more positive things. Every single action, no matter how pro-town has at least three bad possibilities connected to it.

[Empking]

The negative is the first one and that requires a stupid town. I do not think the town is a stupid own so there are no negatives that you have given that are true.

There are positives: We gain reactions to the plan, we get your "he's going to vote me, I better vote him first", we get more information from L-1, we make it impossible for me to be non-gambiting scum with you.

[Empking]

Mith: I've seen people suggest that we're not scum, at least on the face of it. And nobody has come out and said thaty they think we're scum buddies.

Mith: The plan is to get information, reactions is and example of information. If the plan gets more day 1 info than it loses then its a good plan in my eyes.

Mith: I still know that only one of your opinions is possible and I still stand by it requiring a stupid town in order for it to be a negative.

Plum: Do you think Sekinj is the scummiest?

[Empking]

The plan's purpose was to generate information it wasn't like the Texas Justice where it wins you the game straight away, it was a plan to generate information, which is what day 1 is all about.

[Empking]

Empking, you've already said that at least twice now. I understood it, and responded. Let's try one more time:

1. What information do you feel has been generated? What does it tell you?
2. Is it or is it not a bad idea to hammer an arbitrary chosen-in-advance player?

People's reactions. It tells me you're most likely to be scum with the information so far.

2. Are you talking in this game or as a general rule? Are you talking about after announcing it or just deciding and keeping it secret?

Unvote
Vote: Mith

[Empking]

a.Yes
b. Depends if the town know you're hammering a specific player in advance.
c. If the situation presents its self I'll hammer.

[Empking]

As it makes a pair (that isn't right) less likely to be believed.

Day 1's purpose is (IMO) is
1. To catch scum making a stupid mistake where they'll be lynched day 2 (see Sens)
2. To eliminate pairs so you have a better chance to work out the right pair and force the scum pair to reveal themselves as a pair.

[Empking]

If somebody puts you on L-1 when I'm not voting you should be treated like they hammered you. It also means that I unvoted you and the way this is going I doubt that.

The three main things are:
You seem to be ignoring everything else.
You repeatedly ask poor questions despit knowing they're poor.
You post large posts in oder to make it look like you're right by sheer amount of words.

[Empking]

The fact that I have repeatedly needed to ask for clarification suggests that they're unclear.

[Empking]

Empking, you've already said that at least twice now. I understood it, and responded. Let's try one more time:

1. What information do you feel has been generated? What does it tell you?
2. Is it or is it not a bad idea to hammer an arbitrary chosen-in-advance player?

People's reactions. It tells me you're most likely to be scum with the information so far.

2. Are you talking in this game or as a general rule? Are you talking about after announcing it or just deciding and keeping it secret?

Unvote
Vote: Mith

I think that counts as asking for clarification.

[Empking]

[Insert Eye-roll Here]

Yes, you asked for "clarification" there, but (apparently) not because the question was unclear - you were asking whether I wanted a general or specific response. Then you answered the questions (well, sorta answered - your response to b. was "Depends", with no explanation of what it depends on and what the answer would be in each scenario). Then on follow-up, your reasoning was completely unrelated to the question you answered.

And that's five posts you made since I've asked you to elaborate on your reasons for voting me. I know you understand *that* request.

Why was I asking if you wanted a general or a specific response? Because the question was unclear.

I'm pretty sure that last part is a lie because I've had two posts since saying why I'm voting you.

[Empking]

If I thought you were referring to both I ewouldn't have asked you to clarify. By other Players, do you mean Sekinj?

I've done a brief meta on your recent games and I've seen much shorter posts.

[Empking]

Yes, I do and it can by making me and you being scum together less likely and otherwise increasing the amount of information given.

[Empking]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... highlight= - First game I saw. He posts a large number of short posts with some

large

posts neither one anywhere near to the exact size he does here.

[Empking]

PLUS - he has the same tone in that game as he has taken in this game. you've just proved yourself wrong emp.

Tone doesn't matter. At all. I don't see how you screaming something as subjective as tone proves me wrong.

Sekinj: In that game he posts small posts with very large posts in between. In this game he mostly posts large posts.

Mith: Why are you so sure you're going to be lynched?

[Empking]

There's a plan. The plan has two parts. The plan has a goal. That goal is to make me and you ruled out as a lover pair. If you're not hammered then the first and most important point should still help rule us out.

[Empking]

but your plan does not accomplish your goal.

Out of 100, how likely do you think that me and Mith are scumbuddies.

BTW Town, I'd like to point out that Sekinj has been defending Mith all game.

[Empking]

You think there's at least a 50% chance that Mith is scum. Why aren't you voting him?

[Empking]

If I follow through with it and your scum: Town wins
I don't follow through with it and you're scum: Town wins
I follow through with and you're town: I don't know
I don't follow through with it and you're town: Scum wins

[Empking]

I don't follow through, you being on L-1 is lynched. Then I'm lynched because I lied and because I was afraid to face the negative consequences of hammering.

[Empking]

Plum: No, I hadn't. I told him to do that because I didn't beleive he honestly felt that way and as such wouldn't put him on L-1.

[Empking]

Yes.

[Empking]

In night games suspicion lists help the scum make a more informed kill descision.

[Empking]

Pairings (Most to Least likely):

Mith/sek
Mith/Plum
Mith/Orto
Mith/Zwet
Plum/sek
Sek/Zwet
Plum/zwet
orto/sek
orto/Plum
orto/zwet

Suspicion (Most to Least suspect):

Mith
sekinj
Plum
zwet/ortolan

Now Ort.

Mith: On day 1, I like to get my meta from short mini theme games. You only had one so I checked it.

[Empking]

Wow tripple post, two of them being completely useless and one asking a pointless question.

[Empking]

Pointless, I've played enough games that you can meta me if you want that sort of information.

People say those things because Dejkha or someone will say "Empkingh is an easy lynch" and then they'll think "Empking is an easy lynch". That's why they say that. So no I don't care what they say at all plus most of the people saying that are either horrible people or horrible mafia players.

[Empking]

Emp - is it really more reasonable to think all of those other people are united in some conspiracy against you, or that you, an individual, are the one who is mistaken on how your playstyle comes across?

I never mentioned a conspiracy.

Mith: How would me telling you my age help you?

[Empking]

then forget the wording. Is it more likely that 100 people are wrong or that you are wrong?

The number of people that have called me an easy lynch (when I'm town) doesn't even come up to 100.

It'd hurt me as I don't like giving my age.

[Empking]

you are missing the point, as always.

Am I or are you giving too much weight to 1% of the MS population?

[Empking]

Why? And why didn't you just say so in the first place, rather than wasting our time with your previous responses?

Just don't. Because its still a pointless question that doesn't help anyone.

[Empking]

I think it is because I don't think metas change that much.

Mith: Why does Plum play the way she does?

[Empking]

I don't think I've been given feedback after a game about my playstyle.

Do you think her age has anything to do with how she plays?

With your counter examples, I'm seeing play very similar to the play in the game I linked to.

[Empking]

Wow. That post looked incredibly pro-town.

Unvote

- Until I see his scum meta.

[Empking]

Mith: Can you post a game where you were scum?

[Empking]

Yeah, I didn't see anything approaching that last post there.

[Empking]

Yes.

[Empking]

Yes.

SWell more like 90.

[Empking]

? Doesn't that technically mean that you're going halfandhalf with Emp? I'm getting a Plum/Emp connection, as both are fabricating percentages and numbers.

No, it means my view on Mith hasn't completely changed so I think he's town.

Mith:
Sekinj
Plum
Mith
Zwet
Ort

[Empking]

Plum: Its a post that I'd expect from town and it isn't consistant with how he plays as scum.

[Empking]

I think Ort is acting in a pro-town manner because he seems like he's trying to help even if he's not perfect at it.

[Empking]

do you think he is your scum partner?

No.

[Empking]

I'm getting a definate Sekinj/Plum link but...

Zwet: Why did you vote plum?

[Empking]

Vote: Sekinj

- For the crowd pleasing hammer.

[Empking]

vote: emp

for going after the easy target

Going after the legitimately scummy target whether easy or not is not a scum tell.

[Empking]

I don't think scum can quick lynch that fast.

[Empking]

Sek/emp pairing anyone?

Vote: Emp

We're not but if that's the pairing you like can you swap your votes.

[Empking]

So the scum team is Zwet and Sek?