Open 539: Stacks on Stacks (This is Game...Over.)

[TvK]

VOTE: ABR

Die scum die!

[TvK]

Shoot ABR, look at the pressure I put on him and he couldn't even come up with a response because he know I caught him as scum. You could also shoot christovo017, because scum tend to have numbers in their names.

[TvK]

UNVOTE: ABR
VOTE: Acidic_Taco

[TvK]

Really what would be nice is to ask if anyone has played this setup. Basically getting to what mafia powers does everyone think are most/least valuable?

I've never played this setup before. I think if I was scum I would pick one or maybe two modifications at the most. Probably role cop and/or daytalk.

I thought I was onto something with Umbrage but that last unvote looked town.

Wait, how did that unvote make him look town? I voted Taco for the exact same reasons as him. Is unvoting Taco because he doesn't know what he did wrong, even though he did something wrong, townish?

[TvK]

Fuck this, someone hammer this prima donna and be done with it. Waaaa.... people are voting me in a FUCKING GAME! I'm taking my toys and going home.

I'm almost inclined to actually do so, but I'll give Venrob one more post to unvote himself and get his stuff together. I'd very much not want to end the day this early and just lose our IC overnight.

[TvK]

I'm sorry, seriously meta me and look at my day 1. I hate day one and i generally get all of crap-all accomplished on day 1, special setup mechanics aside.

EDIT:

then i saw the next page and didnt hit submit before seeing it.

Okay,

Vote: Albert B. Rampage

.

You asked me to vote someone.

Do you have a reason to do so or is this really just a vote to have a vote out?

Also, @Taco, why didn't you have anything to say about the Venrob situation except for "calm down bro"?

[TvK]

I don't get that angry unless I'm being lynched... Oh, say on page 3.

Then i get that angry regardless alignment.

As scum, save for an early lynch like that, i tend to get more flustered than frustrated. For instance, see Open 428: Double Day Unlimited. My first completed game, and a scum game. Near the end i got a bit overeager and am surprised i still won, but absta was an idiot that game....

Strange how you point out yourself that it is very much possible that you would have the same reaction as scum...

Not meta, just scummy. In one game a cheating mod had me replaced before 48 hours to respond to prod and he replaced me (470). Got back in cuz mod cheated, and that is town meta anyway.

Self-voting means Jester or scum imo.

Thus my vote.

This is probably totally unrelated to what you're trying to explain about your aspergers, but you still say this about self-voting. Do tell me, how can we believe that you are town if you call self-voting scummy yourself? And please don't use your autism as an excuse to contradict yourself.

[TvK]

Do you still mind getting lynched now?

[TvK]

VOTE: anorway
Just seems to me like you're either trying to protect Venrob if hes scum or just bide time for something scummy.
Just doesn't smell right.

What do you mean with something scummy? Waiting for the next wagon to kick off?

[TvK]

Bard, who is your biggest scumread at the moment?

[TvK]

Venrob without any doubt. Anorway's #98 feels town to me. Venrob feels so incredibly strange. I have troubles with reading strange people, because I tend to call them scum too quickly. But that aside, Venrob's reasons to vote you are stupid. It's like he's saying "look I convinced myself, so I must be right". If anyone else is interested, I wouldn't mind at all to put some votes back onto him.

For others, Taco's vote on Anorway feels so scummy. He's just hopping onto the wagon he thinks will move the fastest without any reasoning except for "it doesn't smell right".

And Formerfish' last post doesn't feel good at all. He just admitted that he wants to see Venrob hang because of his AtE and self-vote. I agree that that's incredibly annoying, but I won't follow him if he doesn't convince me of Venrob being actual scum.

[TvK]

No, its like saying "game just ended, red has new scum meta! He's matching it very well! lynch him!"

FTR i thought he was town in both games by analysis, but had a gut feeling he was scum... But the meta is a match. Anyone want to make a town case on Red? because that would be good if someone could show him as town.

I'm sure I'm reading this wrong but you just said "No I'm not doing it because of my own personal convictions but my own personal convictions say that hes scum."
I really am not liking your posts, they just hurt my head and smell of scum.

I'll read it over and over later to make sure I understand your meaning before I change my vote however.

Albert, let's build a wagon on this. Taco has just bought himself a free ticket for the next time a wagon on Venrob starts off. "Look guys, I said x pages ago that I had to understand his meaning. I understand it now, he's scum."

[TvK]

No, its like saying "game just ended, red has new scum meta! He's matching it very well! lynch him!"

FTR i thought he was town in both games by analysis, but had a gut feeling he was scum... But the meta is a match. Anyone want to make a town case on Red? because that would be good if someone could show him as town.

I'm sure I'm reading this wrong but you just said "No I'm not doing it because of my own personal convictions but my own personal convictions say that hes scum."
I really am not liking your posts, they just hurt my head and smell of scum.

I'll read it over and over later to make sure I understand your meaning before I change my vote however.

Albert, let's build a wagon on this. Taco has just bought himself a free ticket for the next time a wagon on Venrob starts off. "Look guys, I said x pages ago that I had to understand his meaning. I understand it now, he's scum."

So me saying I want to make sure I'm not fucking it up by reading something wrong makes me scum? Dude I'm tired and don't want to vote at the first thing that smells like scum this early in the morning. Or if I'm reading that wrong then please excuse the fact that I'm a dumbass.

You say you are not liking Venrob's posts at all. They smell of scum. Yet you don't vote him and you leave your vote on someone else who happens to have the most votes on him. And that vote was justified by "seems scummy, just doesn't smell right"... That reasoning seems a lot less convincing than what you're trying to say about Venrob now.

@RC, no I am not suggesting that. I'm not too much looking at interactions yet, I just need to find a first scum before I start doing that.

[TvK]

Scum found

Albert B. Rampage is scum. Intentionally antagonizing someone who is allready pissed off seems like scumtactics.

VOTE: Albert B. Rampage

I guess you never played with Albert before...

Do not lynch Venrob, he is just an agitated townie. Also don't replace him. Him selfvoting is giving the town alot of info. For instance there is guaranteed scum on his wagon.

No, this guarantees that a lot of people hate his play and would really want to policy lynch him. His self-voting says nothing about scum or no scum on his wagon.

Taco is more likely scum than ABR. Join the train, thank me postgame.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Acidic_TACO

Bard, being an innocent child means that you're confirmed town. It does not mean that you're confirmed right and you should vote anyone who disagrees with you.

[TvK]

What made you put anorway as null? I thought you were scumreading him day 1?

[TvK]

Ok, those reasons Taco is trying to fabricate to jump on Desperado are bad. Split between him and Shockwave at the moment in terms of where to put my vote. I guess Shockwave's next post will decide where I'll put it.

[TvK]

Also I find it a bit weird that the only ones that said they townread or got a town feeling from me was the ones I said I think were town in 98.

What exactly are you trying to say with this? That those people should actually be scumreading you?

[TvK]

Wait, how did that unvote make him look town? I voted Taco for the exact same reasons as him. Is unvoting Taco because he doesn't know what he did wrong, even though he did something wrong, townish?

It's that he removed his vote when no one was calling him out for it. And that he said "that isn't a good tell at all," when scum aren't particularly concerned with the quality of the tells they use as long as they provide an excuse to make their votes.

UNVOTE: VOTE: Venrob. Yeah he went into too much detail with that unvote. Also failed to answer RedCoyote's question.

Vote: Venrob

Let's do this. L-2

And Venrob's flipout seems more angry than upset, which is a scum reaction.

Hell, the more I think about it, the more I think my gut is right.

VOTE: Venrob

It's the speed that worries me. Players usually only lose their cool like that after a fair bit of pressure. They have to get pushed to that point. Venrob was ready to pull the claim/self-vote card right from the get-go.

Will read thread soon
for now
VOTE: Venrob
because he didn't react nearly as bad in my last game with him when he was pressured in a similar fashion, from what i've seen skimming this thread

Forget about a replacement, I'm going to hammer him now.

Unvote, vote Venrob

Good riddance.

Ok, Tacobro, guide me through your logic. These are all examples of people jumping on the Venrob wagon. Do tell me, how is Desperado's specifically the most scummiest of all of the people that voted Venrob (except for the fact that he is the easiest target right now because others are voting him as well)?

[TvK]

His reasons were next to zero. Thats what I keep saying. He just voted just to vote from my point of view.

Then what do you classify Shockwave Rider's, Don't Vote Me's and Albert's votes under?

[TvK]

Why would would Taco be making a case on Desp in this manner if they're buddies.

Because playing against win conditions is op.
Umbrage seems to just be off his rocker...

Are you seriously calling bussing playing against your wincon?

[TvK]

I've got a really good feeling about this wagon, except for DVM. I hope he's actually going to do something from now on. Anyway, yeah, I will declare intent to hammer, even though it's pretty obvious that everyone at L-1 in an Albert B. Rampage game should claim asap.

[TvK]

Claim time already?
I'm a body guard for town. The one that dies when he uses his power successfully.

I don't believe this at all. You should have bodyguarded Bard last night, there is no excuse for that.

[TvK]

VOTE: Acidic_TACO

Sorry if anyone else wanted the hammer, but we've got all we wanted to know.

[TvK]

VOTE: Shockwave Rider

[TvK]

Shockwave, I voted you because you did close to nothing the first to days. You just let the mislynches happen and you didn't do anything to try and stop them. Now you just come in and say that the people that lead these lynches are scum. Yeah, I don't buy that. You look a lot like coasting scum.

Anyway, I don't buy a single bit of anorway's claim. He just happens to claim when he got himself a few votes. This feels an incredible lot like scum who just realised it was MyLo and tries to quickly push through for a final lynch. And, my God, he visited two people last night? Try again, mate.

UNVOTE: Shockwave Rider
VOTE: Anorway

L-1, finish him someone.

[TvK]

UNVOTE: Anroway

I need time to think.

[TvK]

I was thinking that too. But town gets 2 PRs on top of the amount of powers they choose. With 3 having flipped, it is possible that there town has two more, if scum chose 3 powers. It is very possible that one of the two actually is our tracker.

[TvK]

Mod, is it 5 to no-lynch or is it only 4 votes needed?

[TvK]

TvK, who do you think are the 3 scum?

I think that either Desperado or Anorway is scum, I can't see anymore how they both would be. Shockwave Rider is a big scum candidate for die hard coasting and literally doing nothing at all. Same could be said about DVM, but I feel a bit better about him. Looking at interactions, the third scum could be Formerfish for his really weird interactions with Desperado, but this would only fit if Desperado indeed is scum (I'm not sure here yet). I don't think we should be looking at 2 scum + traitor anymore. We now know that town has at least 4 PRs, so I think mafia definitely chose to recruit the traitor as one of their powers.

So my best guess at this moment would be:

Shockwave Rider
Desperado
Formerfish

[TvK]

My god we had the worst PRs possible. I was the goon cop btw, so I could only have got a positive result on the recruited traitor. I guess you were the original traitor, Albert?

[TvK]

Bah, I investigated Taco and Don't_Vote_Me. I was really convinced that Taco was scum because there were so many faults in his play. Night 2 was a toss-up between DVM and Shockwave. Well, I would've got negative results anyway. I should have pushed for Shockwave so much earlier, but Venrob ruined an entire day and Taco totally threw me off.