Mini 611 - Troy, Meet Helen (Game Over)

[farside22]

Still not random voting, although putting one in for Charter

is

tempting. [= There's a 1/16 chance that Hadhfang would get mafia both games, assuming the number of mafia hasn't changed for this game. That's 6.25% chance he's mafia. Just sayin'.

Farside and Lord Gurgi have already matched the input from Near last game, so that's a good sign.

I didn't read the last game except the last 2 pages. What did Near do?

[Macavenger]

Random voted me. That was about it, really.

[CF Riot]

@Charter, just a guess. It could've changed since last game but three seems

far

more likely than anything else. Didn't you just assume the same thing?

BB called everyone "biotches" in his post, which shows resentment. That boosts him up to a 3.0001 on my scale.

@Farside, absolutely nothing. Random vote, blah post, unvote. You've passed him now. (Unrelated, I've been reading SSW:II from the beginning 'cause I wasn't in any games when it started. Very interesting game.)

[ShadowGirl]

Vote: Hadhfang

The dragon in your avi reminds me of Puff the Magic Dragon.

[Netlava]

Vote: CF Riot

Misleading statistic + talking about voting Charter while applying said statistic to hadhfang

[charter]

All about the Riot wagon!

[charter]

Wow I can't spell

All aboard the riot wagon!

[Netlava]

Oh yeah, FOS charter for questioning the assumption that there are 3 mafia in the game while making that assumption himself.

[Lord Gurgi]

I'm just going to throw it out there that in a 12 player game, there are usually either 3 scum or 3 scum and 1 SK, depending on how powerful the town is.

As a result I am going to

Unvote: ShadowGirl, Vote: Charter

for not only triple posting, but flipping between ideas between posts, also we can't be sure how many anti-town we've got, so it's probably best to play it conservative and assume we have 4.

Also:

Mod: Can you clarify about a rule:

6. Deadlines may be implemented if I feel that discussion is lagging. At deadline, the person with the most votes will be lynched. In the case of a tie, the person who was voted for first is lynched.

Does this make the determining vote the last vote placed against a person, or the first vote placed against them?

[Macavenger]

What does assuming that we have an SK gain us? It shouldn't matter much for Day 1, and should be pretty obvious based on the night kill(s) by Day 2.

[Hadhfang]

Gurgi, looking at it I would assume hte person voted for first would be the one lynched. Also, it is possible there is a 3rd party role, but that doesn't have to be a SK.

[farside22]

I'm just going to throw it out there that in a 12 player game, there are usually either 3 scum or 3 scum and 1 SK, depending on how powerful the town is.

As a result I am going to

Unvote: ShadowGirl, Vote: Charter

for not only triple posting, but flipping between ideas between posts, also we can't be sure how many anti-town we've got, so it's probably best to play it conservative and assume we have 4.

Also:

Mod: Can you clarify about a rule:

6. Deadlines may be implemented if I feel that discussion is lagging. At deadline, the person with the most votes will be lynched. In the case of a tie, the person who was voted for first is lynched.

Does this make the determining vote the last vote placed against a person, or the first vote placed against them?

This seems like a big leap voting someone for not being sure about anti-town. Yes typically 3 scum is the norm. If charter is talking to just bring things up it is better then laying low.

unvote:
vote: LG

Bringing up the idea there could be a SK first is bad, mmky

[Battousai]

^Not if he's talking about GENERAL 12 player mafia games. What he wrote wasn't trying to distract the town or hinting at his own alignment...

Vote: Farside

[Macavenger]

Eh, LG's vote there is fairly weak, in my opinion. He has a bit of a point about how charter flipped his ideas around a bit, but he's also setup-guessing and I'm not sure what that triple posting thing is about.

Not really seeing your issue with farside here.

[Battousai]

It's my first real post in the game so I made it into into a random with a bit of information.

I don't see what LG wrote is setup guessing, at least any more so than the 3 or so other people who said there are 3 scum in the game.

[Macavenger]

Three scum is so completely standard for a mini normal it hardly counts as guessing. LG is speculating on whether or not we have an SK, which is pretty unnecessary at this point in the game.

[Battousai]

Ok, let's agree to disagree here. I don't think he was saying there was a sk in this game, only the fact that there's a chance of a sk in mini normals.

Now why is it bad to speculate about a sk early in the game, what makes it scummy?

[charter]

The person who first brings up a SK is more likely to be the SK supposedly.

[Macavenger]

The person who first brings up a SK is more likely to be the SK supposedly.

It's a possible, though very weak, tell in this direction, yes. Also setup speculation is considered scummy in general because it's appearing to be helpful for the town, but actually not, because you're not really helping find scum based on it.

It's all fairly weak tells - I'm not ready to join farside in voting LG over it at this point - but I don't think going after farside for attacking a could weak tells this early in the game is a great idea, either.

[Mizzy]

Also:

Mod: Can you clarify about a rule:

6. Deadlines may be implemented if I feel that discussion is lagging. At deadline, the person with the most votes will be lynched. In the case of a tie, the person who was voted for first is lynched.

Does this make the determining vote the last vote placed against a person, or the first vote placed against them?

Example:

Deadline approaches:

Person A gets 1 vote.
Person B gets one vote.
Person A gets 2 votes.
Person B gets 2 votes.

Assuming they are the only players with votes on them, player A gets lynched because the second vote was placed on him/her first.

[farside22]

The person who first brings up a SK is more likely to be the SK supposedly.

It's a possible, though very weak, tell in this direction, yes. Also setup speculation is considered scummy in general because it's appearing to be helpful for the town, but actually not, because you're not really helping find scum based on it.

It's all fairly weak tells - I'm not ready to join farside in voting LG over it at this point - but I don't think going after farside for attacking a could weak tells this early in the game is a great idea, either.

It's not much of a tell in general, but whether what he is doing is a town or scum action it is a talking point. On general idea's though. Most people don't talk SK till N1 has been done and they know what they are up to. Speculating about a SK is useless, hence my problem with LG

[Netlava]

I think what LG meant was that both Charter & CF Riot did something that was suspicious (at least at this point in the game) but do not appear to be on the same team.

After much thorough deliberation, I have concluded that Charter's act was the scummier of the two.

Unvote, Vote: Charter

@ CF Riot - you do realize that your stat is inaccurate, right?

[Walnut]

Hilarious- we are starting off pretty much the same, with CFRiot and Charter getting stuck into each other

I have to say that while I can see the argument for game setup discussion being a scumtell, it can be useful, and to just pounce on anyone who introduces it is a mistake. People make assumptions based on their experience or "the way it always is", which are not necessarily right in every game. It may need someone else raising the possibility to get others thinking about it. The trainwrecked version of this game was a good example of messing with the meta, in that yes, there were three scum, but there was also a sibling pairing, so it was not quite as straightforward as might have been expected.

[CF Riot]

It's my first real post in the game so I made it into into a random with a bit of information.

Doesn't look random to me. There you go being shifty again Batt.

@ Netlava: Yes, yes, I understand the whole idea that no matter how many times you flip a coin in a row and it comes up heads it's still 50-50 on the next flip. Personally though, I don't think like that. I've been to casinos and I'm the guy gets up from his slot if it draws dead a few turns in a row after a winning streak. And if you want to get

really

technical about it, I said "a 1/16 chance that Hadhfang would get mafia

both

games," which is true.

Also,

LG meant was that both Charter

& CF Riot

did something that was suspicious

Doesn't make you look scummy but where did you get this? I don't think he even mentioned me.

@ Walnut: It's so fun this way though!

[charter]

I don't believe this. I think of something right after I post (twice) and now I'm scum.... I'd say this is an even weaker case than you guys brought against me last game.

Riot, casinos are rigged so that you lose. Trying to justify your faulty statistic with useless trivia? Tsk tsk.

Anyhow, I say we lynch Had just in case he's mafia again (sarcasm) Also, I'm sad Netlava isn't on my team anymore