Can mods expect certain things from multi-heads?

[xyzzy]

Which of the following can mods expect of players in multi-headed games?

I. Confirmation of a list of who is in the game under a particular account.
II. Confirmation from all players on the account that they are in fact on the account.
III. Guarantee that the game will be discussed in a location completely unavailable to any non-members.

[Guardian]

1-3 definitely seems reasonable.

And I think it is mod's prerogative to allow multi-heading at all.

[armlx]

Which of the following can a player in a multi-headed account expect from the mod?

I. That their actual identity will not be revealed.
II. The mod will actually trust them to follow the basic rules of the game.
III. That the mod will not single them out and try to debase their presence in the game based on personal reasons.

[Porochaz]

I agree with you but I feel that posting the list up of the players publicly is wrong, which you dont have an option for.

[scotmany12]

This thread fails...

[Brutal Assassin]

Context wins.

[Ether]

I & II should be completely obvious, and yes, the names should be public knowledge. (I might be biased here; I'm in the anti-alt camp.) III, not really. I've had access to the QuickTopics of scum in at least one game I didn't belong to--I myself was not playing, obviously. And rantbuddies aren't exactly an underground movement--I mean, Patrick has a title for all the emotional support.

If a mod made a specific request over III, sure, I guess, but it seems arbitrary.

By the way, I think 10-player hydras are ridiculous and wouldn't consider any mod a square for banning them.

[Megatron]

Honestly if you can't expect all 3 then you should not allow multiheading

[Xdaamno]

The mod should make sure all players in the hydra are aware no other players should be involved in their discussion, even if it's just a quick IM in scumchat. The other two should automatically be expected.

EDIT: Though, for the poll, I chose I-III. While I still believe the mod should remind the players of this, I feel it should be expected, too.

[MichelSableheart]

I & II aren't necessary for the mod to know, as long as the list mod knows. There is absolutely no reason why a mod should know the true identity of the heads of a hydra, because they can prod the hydra itself. The listmod however needs to know to be able to ensure that no site rules are broken. All the mod needs to know is that the player is a hydra (because hydra's are a violation of the 'don't discuss this game out of thread rule', the mod needs to give his permission beforehand).

III should definately be expected though. The gamerules of most games state that the game can't be discussed out of thread. A hydra, being a single person, can obviously discuss the game with itself, but discussing it with other players is, IMO, a big no-no.

[armlx]

I & II aren't necessary for the mod to know, as long as the list mod knows. There is absolutely no reason why a mod should know the true identity of the heads of a hydra, because they can prod the hydra itself. The listmod however needs to know to be able to ensure that no site rules are broken. All the mod needs to know is that the player is a hydra (because hydra's are a violation of the 'don't discuss this game out of thread rule', the mod needs to give his permission beforehand).

III should definately be expected though. The gamerules of most games state that the game can't be discussed out of thread. A hydra, being a single person, can obviously discuss the game with itself, but discussing it with other players is, IMO, a big no-no.

I endorse this product or service.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Sorry for being ignorant, but can someone explain multi-headed/hydra to me?

Thanks,

Vel

[Rogueben]

Multiple people playing as one person in the game, often using a new account. There are several games that have encouraged multi-heading (mith's California trio for example), usually because of higher than usual posting requirements.

[Mr. Flay]

I. Confirmation of a list of who is in the game under a particular account.
II. Confirmation from all players on the account that they are in fact on the account.
III. Guarantee that the game will be discussed in a location completely unavailable to any non-members.

All are acceptable, and in fact should be required.

And I think it is mod's prerogative to allow multi-heading at all.

Absolutely!

IV. That their actual identity will not be revealed.
V. The mod will actually trust them to follow the basic rules of the game.
VI. That the mod will not single them out and try to debase their presence in the game based on personal reasons.

IV is negotiable. V is an extension of II and III. VI is absolutely correct.

(I renumbered armlx's to make the thread easier to follow)

By the way, I think 10-player hydras are ridiculous and wouldn't consider any mod a square for banning them.

True enough (an extension of Guardian's point, essentially).

[Cybele]

Weep not for me, for I am dead.

[Mr. Flay]

Furthermore, I would make hydra-headed accounts agree that if ANYTHING the role account does breaks the rules of the game/site, ALL players behind it will be punished equally, unless there is consensus on who is directly responsible for the offending post/action.

There should be no "oops, sorry about that; we've kicked Soandso out of the hydra, now the rest of us can continue".

[Xdaamno]

We need a wiki-page article for multi-head.

[Glork]

I & II aren't necessary for the mod to know, as long as the list mod knows. There is absolutely no reason why a mod should know the true identity of the heads of a hydra, because they can prod the hydra itself. The listmod however needs to know to be able to ensure that no site rules are broken. All the mod needs to know is that the player is a hydra (because hydra's are a violation of the 'don't discuss this game out of thread rule', the mod needs to give his permission beforehand).

Wrong. Wrong. Couldn't be more wrong.

Like most things around here, the concept behind alts -- whether they are piloted by a single individual or multiple players -- rely on a very distinct honor system. And some mods (such as myself) do not allow multi-heading in their own games. Thus, it is an absolute necessity that the identities behind a given hydra (I

really

like that term, by the way) be made public. How can you possibly argue that the identities behind a hydra can remain hidden when that public knowledge is required to ensure the integrity of a mod's preferences?

III should definately be expected though. The gamerules of most games state that the game can't be discussed out of thread. A hydra, being a single person, can obviously discuss the game with itself, but discussing it with other players is, IMO, a big no-no.

I'm undecided on this one. What makes it different than ranting to an out-of-game friend on your own?


As such, I haven't voted yet. I will vote either I/II or all three.

EDIT: ZZ, by "non-members," do you mean "players who are not hydra-heads" or "anybody not in the hydra-head, regardless of whether they are in the game or not"? The answer to this question will directly determine my own response to the poll.

[Simenon]

The moderator does not have a right to know what the specific accouts are in a multi-account. The moderator does have a right, however, to block that account from playing in the game.

And if you want to seriously play, satisfying the demands of the moderator is recommended.

[The Fonz]

I & II aren't necessary for the mod to know, as long as the list mod knows. There is absolutely no reason why a mod should know the true identity of the heads of a hydra, because they can prod the hydra itself. The listmod however needs to know to be able to ensure that no site rules are broken. All the mod needs to know is that the player is a hydra (because hydra's are a violation of the 'don't discuss this game out of thread rule', the mod needs to give his permission beforehand).

Wrong. Wrong. Couldn't be more wrong.

Like most things around here, the concept behind alts -- whether they are piloted by a single individual or multiple players -- rely on a very distinct honor system. And some mods (such as myself) do not allow multi-heading in their own games. Thus, it is an absolute necessity that the identities behind a given hydra (I

really

like that term, by the way) be made public. How can you possibly argue that the identities behind a hydra can remain hidden when that public knowledge is required to ensure the integrity of a mod's preferences?

Well, your argument appears to be that some mods don't like hydras. Which is fair enough, don't allow hydras. I don't see why knowing precisely who is in a hydra is a prerequisite, unless a mod has banned specific individuals from their games or something.

[Yosarian2]

Which of the following can a player in a multi-headed account expect from the mod?

I. That their actual identity will not be revealed.
II. The mod will actually trust them to follow the basic rules of the game.
III. That the mod will not single them out and try to debase their presence in the game based on personal reasons.

Eh? Since when was the identity of a group of people in a multi-headed game supposed to be secret? If that's a part of the game as designed by the mod, that's different, but there's no reason to assume that "multiheaded=secret identities"

[Xdaamno]

Which of the following can a player in a multi-headed account expect from the mod?

I. That their actual identity will not be revealed.
II. The mod will actually trust them to follow the basic rules of the game.
III. That the mod will not single them out and try to debase their presence in the game based on personal reasons.

Eh? Since when was the identity of a group of people in a multi-headed game supposed to be secret? If that's a part of the game as designed by the mod, that's different, but there's no reason to assume that "multiheaded=secret identities"

Yeah, I don't get this. armlx and Brutal Assassin are apparently of the opinion that the point of hydras is to combat metas and have fun finding out who the players are, but I don't recall a single multi-head where the identities weren't revealed.

[dahill1]

i didn't mind that xyzzy knew who was in the multi-head, but it bothered me that he revealed them publicly. he then went on to say that he probably wouldn't have done it if we were less hesitant in giving him the names.
aka it was a dick move

[Yosarian2]

Uh, again, what's wrong with revealing them publicly? Since when are multi-heads supposed to be secret? Especally since MeMe wanted to have listed, in THAT THREAD, who was playing.

[gorckat]

Barring an explicit theme game for them, isn't multiple people on one account sort of cheating?

Isn't the game of mafia a majority with less info than the minority battling wits to see who wins? Even if you "nuke" ten townies at once, aren't they, possibly, able to generate more info than a lone townie in that same role based on all those eyes and minds?