PIRATES v. NINJAS! Game Over!

[cicero]

Substantive post this weekend. Sorry, life is hectic at the moment.

Meantime, please don't just assume Thesp and Ooba as role cleared. Thanks.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

No.

[Lawrencelot]

Primate (replaced JordanA24)

Notably, Mgm asks him Day 1:

You've slipped up. You're a ninja, aren't you?

On something relatively minor. I think this is actually the info he's dropping. I think it's worth exploring.

I thought it was RogueBen who used the same quote to conclude that Primate is not a ninja. But RogueBen was a pirate...

[The Fonz]

I'm going to

Vote: CES

There a a few promising angles today, but CES stands out as a potential scum because of his reaction to the 'I am town and want all scum groups to lose' bit. It could have been town just joking around; but it's equally possible CES was a scum, who had worked out Mike's role and realised he couldn't risk actually lying there.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Do you doubt that I think pirates are awesome?

More importantly:

# Xtoxm (replaced Sir Tornado) - Bruce Lee (Ninja Protector) - Lightsabered Night 2
...
# Thok - Gandalf (Goblin Protector) - arm cleanly sliced off and skulled bashed in Night 3

[The Fonz]

What does MBL killing Xtoxm have to do with you being innocent, CES?

[cicero]

I know what it has to do with. Say it out loud, CES.

[cicero]

and Fonz, you're gonna want to unvote.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Why the hell wouldn't I just kill mike if I were scum rather than risk drawing attention to myself, Fonz?

[cicero]

CES: do you have some reason that you don't want to say out loud that which you just blatantly inferred?

[The Fonz]

Scum did kill mike?

[The Fonz]

OIC, cicero.

unvote

[cicero]

I'm glad you see but I'd really like him to say so he can't say later that we misunderstood. The opportunity for the counterclaim needs to be there.

CES, there's no reason not to say it out loud unless you're trying to be slippery. Please let me eliminate you formally as a suspect.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Oh snap. I totally didn't mean to suggest I was the pirate protector. I was just showing, that if I were scum, I could kill with impunity.

Fonz, the point is that if I had been aware of mike's role as lie detector, I would've had nothing to fear as I could just kill him at night. At that point I would surely comply with his request, no?

[The Fonz]

Well, the night two kill came before the request to state pro-townness, which for me was the biggest hint of his role. (You may notice I drop my prior suspicion of MBF subsequent to that). So him not dying night two doesn't mean you didn't subsequently work it out.

Goblins killed Twomz night three, the Goblin Finder. It's quite possible that was their priority, then they got Mike the next night. It's also possible, since you didn't actually lie there regardless of alignment, that he wasn't a particularly big threat (I'd say this is less likely, but not implausible).

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I forgot about Twomz. That is a fair point. But I still think complying with Mike's demand would be a far smarter move for scum.

[The Fonz]

Hmmm. Not really. Y'see, since two of the protectors were dead, Mike couldn't demand people comply without giving the game away. Since lying is risky, and killing him means leaving Twomz alive, I'd have thought brushing it off with a joke would have been the optimum goblin move there.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Mike would only get one night to investigate me though. I'd describe lying as less risky here.

[The Fonz]

You may be right. But then, no-one mentioned your 'joke' again until now. It slid by pretty much unnoticed.

Can I ask you something, CES? Did you guess Mike's role before he died? If so, when?

[ooba]

You guys know what a lie detector role specifically does? i.e You've seen it somewhere else?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I did not, Fonz.

ooba, I think it's a safe assumption he can detect lies. As in, hey mod, is this a lie? I'm fairly certain I've seen it before, but I don't have a clue where.

[ooba]

Ok did an analysis of Mike's posts. I'm guessing at a role which allows him to quote stuff from the previous day to get a result of truth/lie.Here is what i got when i tried to guess what choices he made :

--> Night 0 : Obviously no choice as there were no posts yet

--> Guardian : "I'm Samwise Gamgee. I am a tracker."

Good morning, and praise the Lord! This brisk morning breeze has left me refreshed and renewed. Let us commence in killing the scum, my children.

vote: Guardian

--> Guardian : "we have 2 members (me + one other) so plz try not to find him/her, we were pretty disadvantaged from the start and then I effed up."

I would like to quickly add that I trust Guardian's statement about there being only one other redcoat 0%.

--> Iammars : "I'm a Vampire Finder (Abraham Van Helsing)"

I think I'm going to drop my case against Iammars for now.

So I do not think mike dropped any other hints which we could have used right now ..

[The Fonz]

I did not, Fonz.

This is interesting, since you stated firmly yesterday that mike was town. I assumed you'd seen the same thing Mars and I did.

[Kison]

Meantime, please don't just assume Thesp and Ooba as role cleared. Thanks.

Are you referring to Rosso Carne avoiding that lynch, or something else?

[cicero]

I'd like Ooba to answer this question: Did your own ability cause your predecessor to survive that lynch or was it something outside your control?

As for Thesp: He did a Daykill not a Dayvig. He himself has admitted that his daykill does not confirm his alignment.

I am not saying these two players are scum. I am saying it is a mistake to assume they are confirmed town. I am reserving judgement. If I find them town it will be more based on their play.