Open 646 - Semi Nightless - Game Over (D6)

[Luna Fox]

Are you making the claim that your method never results in a miss-lynch?

No, but it has a high success rate so far.

[Luna Fox]

The only time i've ever voted for someone without finishing PoE is if the day's gonna end and compromise is needed, and even then, i wont vote someone im townreading.

[karnos]

You are pushing this inane theory that you are really good at town-reading people but really bad at scum reading them, which doesn't pass muster.

I would agree.
Especially since I never said anything like that.

You are correct, you didn't say anything like that, I was just interpreting your post and reading between the lines, and taking into account the game state.

But now you seem to be pushing the idea that Io can interpret my posts, read details that were unsaid and you fully support her, while here you are arguing that your posts can only be taken literally.

It's a bit of a contradiction in your logic.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

What you or I think about the purpose is irrelevant, since you have already shown that you will use it as an excuse to push a lynch.

It's not, but OK.

Given that knowledge, and knowing that ignoring the RQS has no ill potential, it just sounds like fake scum hunting, busywork essentially. It's like when someone enters thread, asks a few pointed questions, and then never follows up with them.

But you answered the question anyway. I'll explain why it's absolutely relevant.

My RQS was intended to get a better feel of the players I'm up against – I want to know how they think and approach the game. From what you answered, I felt that poking you for a reaction might be a good place to start in strengthening my reads.

49 is a very weak vote. Like Thor said, it's tryhard and I even called it an RVS vote. Is this the type of vote you see when someone is pushing a serious lynch on someone? Yes, I agree that you shouldn't call a vote a "pressure vote" or weaken its effect, but I made the vote with a hilariously low amount of information. You hadn't even made any AI posts (besides the RQS) at the time, do you really think I would be advocating for your lynch because you phrased a joke awkwardly? My previous post, 47, hurt my own credibility, too! I said I wasn't good at tonal readings, why would I say that if my RQS's purpose was to push lynches with?

The fact you're concerned about how you think I'm using the RQS to push your lynch and how you've been trying to draw negative attention onto Thor (as in post 70) tells me your main concern is in how other people are reading you. That's pretty basic scum motivation. You say you're scumreading Thor and Io, but your interactions with them don't seem like scumhutning to me, it's just redrawing attention onto them.

Also, the lack of powerroles in this setup gives very little reason for a town-aligned player to be concerned about how others are reading them. I asked that other question in #150 because I was still deciding if the way you are reacting is town-indicative like other players have suggested or if I should continue poking at it. I think you're blowing your wagon out of proportion and that that's coming from a scum mindset.

So, in a nutshell, the way you're reacting to your wagon doesn't look that good to me.

---

I also really dislike that shade you threw at me in the end of the post I'm responding to, just because I ask some questions and don't poke around at the answers doesn't mean they're bad, I'm just trying to get a better feel for what the gamestate is from other people's perspective.

Karnos, what is your read on me? You mentioned you had one and I'm curious.

[karnos]

The fact you're concerned about how you think I'm using the RQS to push your lynch and how you've been trying to draw negative attention onto Thor (as in post 70) tells me your main concern is in how other people are reading you. That's pretty basic scum motivation. You say you're scumreading Thor and Io, but your interactions with them don't seem like scumhutning to me, it's just redrawing attention onto them.

Again with post 70. You refuse to read it as written, instead adding in assumptions about it's motivation. Saying Thor was the only one who hadn't answered questions is a lie. You had not answered your own questionnaire. Several players who were not active had not answered it. Perhaps players in a prior game didn't answer it. As I said in a prior post, in the only other game I played with a questionnaire, one of the players who refused to answer it flipped scum. You can keep trying to twist 70 into an attack on Thor, but that doesn't make it true.

I don't feel the need to share a detailed read of you right now. You aren't a top scum choice, I have no intention of voting you today, based on the current game state, but if I tell you exactly what behavior of yours is townie and what is scummy I am just inviting you to adjust your play and fool me further if you actually are scum.

[karnos]

. A defense from him wouldn't have even been that hard to make as all he would have needed to do was to explain how I was interrupting his intentions wrong.

FYI, your accusations are based on lies, or "false interpretations" if you prefer.

It's like answering the age-old question "Have you stopped abusing your kids yet?" There is no correct answer.

[Killthestory]

townhunting is a tool just like scumhunting

use both

[Thor665]

You are pushing this inane theory that you are really good at town-reading people but really bad at scum reading them, which doesn't pass muster.

I would agree.
Especially since I never said anything like that.

You are correct, you didn't say anything like that, I was just interpreting your post and reading between the lines, and taking into account the game state.

But now you seem to be pushing the idea that Io can interpret my posts, read details that were unsaid and you fully support her, while here you are arguing that your posts can only be taken literally.

It's a bit of a contradiction in your logic.

Well, first off - you're dodging.

Second off - my post wasn't actually open to your interpretation - because I explicitly stated what I meant, and you then ignored that and inserted a different concept.

Third off - you're actually ignoring that I kind of started on your side in that debate until I looked it over long enough to decide I agreed with Io's stance, so clearly my initial stance is you shouldn't really try to interpret much, and I think what she chose to interpret makes sense, and, as even you have said, it was an attack on me - your only disagreement is whether it was a directed attack on me - which means she's not interpreting much.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

. A defense from him wouldn't have even been that hard to make as all he would have needed to do was to explain how I was interrupting his intentions wrong.

FYI, your accusations are based on lies, or "false interpretations" if you prefer.

It's like answering the age-old question "Have you stopped abusing your kids yet?" There is no correct answer.

I'm not basing the fact that I think you've been discrediting Thor on what Io said, so I suppose that I have the same ""false interpretations"".

As written, the post was written in such a way where it could have only been referring to Thor. Inactive people can't refuse to answer questions, and I said that I was going to answer once Thor cleared up his vote. If you were paying attention to the thread, then your question is essentially a vague way of asking "What do you make of Thor's refusal to answer your RQS?" It was a perfectly valid question, which is why I answered it, but the way it was written gave it a less honest-seeming motive.

You saying that in another game with an RQS, one scum member was found because they were like Thor in not answering the RQS also does not help your case, also really seems like you want me to scumread Thor when I don't think I have the information I want to make a meaningful read on him.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

also i don't see why you couldn't answer my question with a simple "town" or "scum" or even "null", it's not like i'll know why you read me that way and I'll change whatever it is you suspect me for.

I don't even understand why anyone – town or scum – would want to change their playstyle and way of posting mid-game. It'd be obvious if they changed their playstyle and look scummy.

[karnos]

You are correct, you didn't say anything like that, I was just interpreting your post and reading between the lines, and taking into account the game state.

But now you seem to be pushing the idea that Io can interpret my posts, read details that were unsaid and you fully support her, while here you are arguing that your posts can only be taken literally.

It's a bit of a contradiction in your logic.

Well, first off - you're dodging.

Second off - my post wasn't actually open to your interpretation - because I explicitly stated what I meant, and you then ignored that and inserted a different concept.

Third off - you're actually ignoring that I kind of started on your side in that debate until I looked it over long enough to decide I agreed with Io's stance, so clearly my initial stance is you shouldn't really try to interpret much, and I think what she chose to interpret makes sense, and, as even you have said, it was an attack on me - your only disagreement is whether it was a directed attack on me - which means she's not interpreting much.[/quote]

1- Dodging what? You asked a question, I answered. I am not going to point by point respond to every line in your post, if there is one line in particular you really want me to answer, let me know and I will.

2- Your post was certainly open to interpretation. You said you only had a town read on giga. The question is WHY. At least 4 players had scum reads, and were voting on them outside of RVS AFAICT. You are apparently bad at hunting scum, otherwise you would at least be on par with those other 4 players. The fact you didn't have a scum read when several other players did seems to indicate that.

3- You mean your fake change of heart, mid post? If you changed your mind before hitting submit, you know you can go back and edit the start of your post. I find that posting style to be weird, like you are trying too hard to show you are working from a town thought process. And it was an attack on giga, you, and every non-active player in the game, and players in prior games who skipped out on the questionnaire. Your very selective interpretation that it was only about you is plainly wrong.

Can you just explain to me what the scum motivation would be to "attack you" without using your name, without voting you, and while questioning a player other than you?

[karnos]

Well, first off - you're dodging.

Second off - my post wasn't actually open to your interpretation - because I explicitly stated what I meant, and you then ignored that and inserted a different concept.

Third off - you're actually ignoring that I kind of started on your side in that debate until I looked it over long enough to decide I agreed with Io's stance, so clearly my initial stance is you shouldn't really try to interpret much, and I think what she chose to interpret makes sense, and, as even you have said, it was an attack on me - your only disagreement is whether it was a directed attack on me - which means she's not interpreting much.

1- Dodging what? You asked a question, I answered. I am not going to point by point respond to every line in your post, if there is one line in particular you really want me to answer, let me know and I will.

2- Your post was certainly open to interpretation. You said you only had a town read on giga. The question is WHY. At least 4 players had scum reads, and were voting on them outside of RVS AFAICT. You are apparently bad at hunting scum, otherwise you would at least be on par with those other 4 players. The fact you didn't have a scum read when several other players did seems to indicate that.

3- You mean your fake change of heart, mid post? If you changed your mind before hitting submit, you know you can go back and edit the start of your post. I find that posting style to be weird, like you are trying too hard to show you are working from a town thought process. And it was an attack on giga, you, and every non-active player in the game, and players in prior games who skipped out on the questionnaire. Your very selective interpretation that it was only about you is plainly wrong.

Can you just explain to me what the scum motivation would be to "attack you" without using your name, without voting you, and while questioning a player other than you?

edit/repost to fix.

[karnos]

also i don't see why you couldn't answer my question with a simple "town" or "scum" or even "null", it's not like i'll know why you read me that way and I'll change whatever it is you suspect me for.

Typically, if you are scum, my read on you might help you decide whether or not to nightkill me. Now in this particular setup this is less of a concern, but I don't feel like changing up my strategy at this point because I don't see the benefit.

[karnos]

As written, the post was written in such a way where it could have only been referring to Thor.

Pretend for a moment that Thor did fill out the questionnaire, and I still made that same post. Are you saying it would be grammatically flawed?

No, there is still a valid interpretation for the post: I was asking a general question.

[gigabyteTroubadour]

I answered it as a general question, so of course it's a valid interpretation, but I can't help but think after reading 141 that you were trying to cast some sort of suspicion onto Thor (and myself, as it seems you keep bringing up the fact I was withholding my answers for a little bit). I didn't really read it the way Io was and I was trying to understand where she was coming from in post #105 with pretty much all of her suspicion on you, but after seeing more posts from you, I ended up coming to the same conclusion as her after rereading your ISO and the thread.

[Kcdaspot]

my apologies

[Kcdaspot]

here i am and YAAAAAY no quicklynch

gonna do a read straight gansta style yo

[karnos]

I answered it as a general question, so of course it's a valid interpretation, but I can't help but think after reading 141 that you were trying to cast some sort of suspicion onto Thor (and myself, as it seems you keep bringing up the fact I was withholding my answers for a little bit). I didn't really read it the way Io was and I was trying to understand where she was coming from in post #105 with pretty much all of her suspicion on you, but after seeing more posts from you, I ended up coming to the same conclusion as her after rereading your ISO and the thread.

I agree, my iso probably looks like crap, but every time I look at this thread there are 2-3 new semantic arguments picking apart my choice of words. Instead of arguing that you know what I meant better than I know what I meant, why not explain why I am scum?

Why would scum!karnos go to all this effort to throw suspicion on to Thor? Why would I be so elusive and sneaky about it, while I come right out and call Io scum and vote her? Wouldn't I just vote Thor, if I wanted him lynched?

And WTF is your logic now about 141. You know posts are made in consecutive order, right? Post 70 was Friday afternoon, Io's responses to it occurred later Friday, and then post 141 was Saturday morning. Does your theory include a time travel device? Otherwise, you can't reverse cause and effect. If 141 caused you to view 70 as a scummy post, that still doesn't explain Io's attacks that occurred prior to it.

Anyway, just answer me this if nothing else: whats the scum motivation? Taking your assumptions, not mine: If I have seen scum ignore questionnaires in other games, and I pointed out Thor was ignoring it here to attack him, maybe, if anything, you have proven I am scum hunting. Why does that make me scum, and not town?


Meh. This is a big waste of time and not getting us closer to finding scum. My iso looks bad because I am making posts like this to respond to nonsense attacks and I don't really have much time to look at anything else going on in the game.

[Kcdaspot]

STREAM OF CONSCIOUSNESS

top page 2 thor is third on the first wagon. Dont do this to me papa smurf. ya did it once thats all you get dont do it dont be scum.

Why hello luna fox shall you be my opponent today?

Or shall it be killthestory calling for a lynch by page 5?

RQS is dumb. becuase there is no way the questions are random in the first place and i question the the results of such a thing. its a less effective RVS.

and yet karnos gave a very questionable answer to it... hmmmm

GT is wieird mmmkay

page 3 and KTS is a heavy ping for my scumdar

Post #64 NONONONONONONO DONT YOU DARE THOR DONT DO IT THOR MAN I HAVE PTSD

Io for anti town at least. maaaybe scumteam with KTS ive yet to see them comment on each other.

KARNOS I LIKE MY WINE THAT I HAVE IN FRONt OF ME DO NOT EFFING START SWITCHING IT AROUND NOW

all of page 4 is karnos being bad... and scum

tis the sillyest exchange between transcend and luna.

#104 looks weird.

Thooooooooor.... doooont..... ppleeeeaaaase.

rosske joins with s gut vote on thor IM NOT ALONE GUYS

THOR FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP IM FREAKING OUT.

why in the fuck is luna PoEing on D1 any fucking way? BTW i am going to curse, its not going to be like a sailor (until i catch scum then HOLD ON TO YER BUTTS) but i do curse if thats a modkillable offence then w/e

oh thank god, 156 is sensable BREATHE KC BREATHE

KTS if thats a wall im dolly parton and im not dolly parton P.sure of KTS scum now.

@tenshii who the heck are you and where did you come from?

phantom: WE DONe WITH THAT YO GET OFF OF THAT AND START READING YA LAAAAA ZEEEE

@thor re 195: i did put forth in a game that Large D1 walls are scummy so that POV is ok. whats not ok is the context there is no planet that these walls are large enough to confuse or slow town down.

and the top of page 9 and THOR IS TOWN YHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSS PRAISE THE aLL MIGHTY


Note: i read everything i just wanted to comment on some the posts and happenings.

[Luna Fox]

Or shall it be killthestory calling for a lynch by page 5?

Oh noes!
be careful coz Transcend is now gonna scumread you for "defending" him!

[Kcdaspot]

with that based on what ive seen its karnos and KTL for the scumteam secondary scummy reads on luna and GT (gut mainly)

ANNNNNNND

VOTE: KTS

We real now

pedit: now that you mention that and transcend is not far off of making the list either.

[Kcdaspot]

if either KTS or karnos is town then luna and co go under the microscope like im trying to cure cancer.

[Kcdaspot]

POST MORE TENSHII GODDANG

[Luna Fox]

Also i never mentioned i expected to have my PoE list finished in D1, where did you get that idea from?

[Kcdaspot]

PoE in of itself is scummy broseph. the fact you trying it D1 is PAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH