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As someone that has mained support since season 1, I would be very upset if it were removed.

I enjoy everything about the role and the champions in it (except bard, fuck him). I would not prefer to main something else. I play other things well: my top lane play is of a similar level to my support play (if not better, given my 60% winrates across most of my top laners), and I could learn to mid or jungle at similar levels if I put in the time. ADC is too stressful for me.

Also, if you think about it the majority of players aren't all siphoned into one role. The majority do not play mid. The majority do not play top. Or adc. Or jungle. The population's too large for popularity to shift the weight of things that way.

And I hear tons and tons of complaints from people about every single role for different reasons. Let me list some of them.

ADC feels useless because itemization and mobility creep, bad supports ruin their influence, they take too long to ramp up to be useful, it's stressful having to avoid getting killed when everyone wants you dead.

Top feels useless because it's too far from the rest of the map so if your team does badly you can't win the game, it's an island until the enemy team comes to shut you down and then you get three man roamdove and it's awful because nobody ever wants to help you, it's too snowbally and just one kill completely ruins the lane, even if you win lane the teleport meta means they can just catch up and nullify kills that you do since they don't lose any cs (panzer's personal complaint).

Mid feels bad because it's impossible to handle being camped due to immobility, as soon as a lane loses that means everyone comes to your lane and you can't cs or do anything as your team takes all the farm and the enemy team destroys your tower, if the enemy gets blue buff you simply lose lane from the huge advantage if your jungler is selfish or needs blue, as a mage you can't carry as easily because you rely on burst damage and can't burst everyone.

Jungle feels useless because if all your lanes are losing you can't go anywhere and gank or you'll just get counterganked and make things worse but everyone yells at you if you don't and then yells at you when the countergank happens as if everything is your fault, it's impossible to influence the game as much as the enemy jungler as soon as they get ahead and so you end up losing control or even access to the game as they take your jungle, gank your lanes and control all the objectives, farming jungle is boring.

Supports feel like they have no impact if the team isn't doing well, it's hard to make up for a bad adc, everyone blames you if there's not enough vision at the exact moment and place they want it, you get none of the positive feedback from the team when things go well in bot lane, just sitting in lane and keeping another guy alive is boring.

I love how your jungle complaint is simply "If all my lanes lose i can't do shit"

I mean that applies for every other role, just everyone is going to blame you because they can't win lane, jungle is probably the best when it comes to dealing with the RNG of shitty team mates.

It's the most consistent complaint I hear: "I can't influence the game easily, if enemy jungler gets a lead, I'm useless"

None of these complaints come from people who main these roles.

Virtually none of these complaints come from people in the higher elos (plat+). Higher you go, the more respect you have for the influence each role has in the game.

For me, support is the best role for me to minimize the impact of teammate "rng." Because it's what I'm best at. For you, a jungle main, jungle is easier. For hiplop, it's adc. For radiant cowbells, annie is the best role for him to minimize the impact.

I prefer Jungle over support because I like the map-wide presence and sneakiness of the jungle If I play in a lane, I'm largely bound there unless I roam for 10+ minutes. If I jungle, I can avoid laning (which I'm generally bad at) and have an impact wherever I want with a surprise attack. Not because I hate playing support.

In post 802, RayFrost wrote:It's the most consistent complaint I hear: "I can't influence the game easily, if enemy jungler gets a lead, I'm useless"

None of these complaints come from people who main these roles.

Well quite clearly, the only reason a jungler shouldn't be able to do anything, is if they are a 6 dependant jungler, and somehow all your lanes have fed 2 kills to the enemy laners, and even then, most 6 junglers can still get off a half decent gank.

I do somewhat agree that it can be hard if all your lanes are losing, but that shouldn't really ever be a case.

How ridiculous these complaints about your main role seem to you should emphasize how ridiculous each of the complaints about the other roles seem to people who main those roles.

I prefer midlane because it's pretty much the only lane with champs meant to burst, but really I'm cool with everything.

Top lane - you can go offtank and still kinda burst
JG - you can go a bursty jungler
Support - you can reverse burst with soraka by fucking out healing DPS
ADC - well it's not really bursting, but when you get fed the enemy team starts to really fucking flame, as if it's not your actual job. So it's fun either way.

you can see my league goals are small.

I find top lane helps minimize the impact of shitty RNG because I usually pick bullies, take their outer turret early then go mid to kill or teleport bot

playing zac sort of doesn't feel fair

In post 795, PJ. wrote:

In post 792, Draynth wrote:The 'vast majority of players' not missing the support role is completely different to 'most support mains' not missing the role.

I would argue that most support mains, are such because SOMEONE has to support, not because they actually want to be a support. Even ani admits to wanting to jungle rather than support. Most supports would rather be something else. Why do you think you have such a large pool of "support mains" in lower elo that are just auxillery mid laners and not actual supports?

But that's mostly just gut.

The fact that support isn't directly impactful and that the vast majority of players will not play it are both objective facts.

To be fair this doesn't apply to everyone, I main support in Silver and play Thresh, Ali shen pre-work, and Morgana with a proper support build and not full ap with a 25 minute RoA finish.

In post 788, PJ. wrote:And can you even really disagree Maestro? Doesn't Klazam support in the vast majority of your games?

Draynth already mentioned the difference in the terminology you're using (e.g. "vast majority of players" vs. "most support mains" or whatever), but also what specifically was referencing was that it's kinda clear most people in this thread disagree that the support role is "worthless" (and IIRC, that was your original point), so how can you extrapolate that the "vast majority of players" agree with you, when this sample size would indicate otherwise? It was a half-joke, really.

RE: the point quoted above, given that you use "vast majority" again, no, he doesn't. He definitely doesn't like ADC (and he's worse than me at CSing on Marksmen, I believe, but he can drop his $0.02 here), so if we're duo botlane he supports me, but we don't do that nearly as often as we used to and WHEN we used to it was more me supporting him...

Not sure what your point is though RE: Klaz and me?

Shit there might've been another page I didn't read but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

In post 810, Maestro wrote:RE: the point quoted above, given that you use "vast majority" again, no, he doesn't. He definitely doesn't like ADC (and he's worse than me at CSing on Marksmen, I believe, but he can drop his $0.02 here), so if we're duo botlane he supports me, but we don't do that nearly as often as we used to and WHEN we used to it was more me supporting him... Sivesh 2014

this is true.

In post 797, PJ. wrote:

In post 796, Ankamius wrote:None of it makes any sense because support-style playstyles are always the least popular ones. Even then, the fact that most people don't want to play them has no bearing on whether they want them to be in the game or not.

This isn't true. Support is pretty wildly popular in Overwatch. I'm pretty sure medic is played a ton in TF2 as well.

support is the least played role in overwatch too

In post 800, RayFrost wrote:As someone that has mained support since season 1, I would be very upset if it were removed.

I enjoy everything about the role and the champions in it (except bard, fuck him). I would not prefer to main something else. I

can

play other things well: my top lane play is of a similar level to my support play (if not better, given my 60% winrates across most of my top laners), and I could learn to mid or jungle at similar levels if I put in the time. ADC is too stressful for me.

Also, if you think about it the majority of players aren't all siphoned into one role. The majority do not play mid. The majority do not play top. Or adc. Or jungle. The population's too large for popularity to shift the weight of things that way.

And I hear tons and tons of complaints from people about every single role for different reasons. Let me list some of them.

ADC feels useless because itemization and mobility creep, bad supports ruin their influence, they take too long to ramp up to be useful, it's stressful having to avoid getting killed when everyone wants you dead.

Top feels useless because it's too far from the rest of the map so if your team does badly you can't win the game, it's an island until the enemy team comes to shut you down and then you get three man roamdove and it's awful because nobody ever wants to help you, it's too snowbally and just one kill completely ruins the lane, even if you win lane the teleport meta means they can just catch up and nullify kills that you do since they don't lose any cs (panzer's personal complaint).

Mid feels bad because it's impossible to handle being camped due to immobility, as soon as a lane loses that means everyone comes to your lane and you can't cs or do anything as your team takes all the farm and the enemy team destroys your tower, if the enemy gets blue buff you simply lose lane from the huge advantage if your jungler is selfish or needs blue, as a mage you can't carry as easily because you rely on burst damage and can't burst everyone.

Jungle feels useless because if all your lanes are losing you can't go anywhere and gank or you'll just get counterganked and make things worse but everyone yells at you if you don't and then yells at you when the countergank happens as if everything is your fault, it's impossible to influence the game as much as the enemy jungler as soon as they get ahead and so you end up losing control or even access to the game as they take your jungle, gank your lanes and control all the objectives, farming jungle is boring.

Supports feel like they have no impact if the team isn't doing well, it's hard to make up for a bad adc, everyone blames you if there's not enough vision at the exact moment and place they want it, you get none of the positive feedback from the team when things go well in bot lane, just sitting in lane and keeping another guy alive is boring.

also this is in the top 5% of posts in this thread tbh. Really good and accurate

In post 802, RayFrost wrote: None of these complaints come from people who main these roles.

Virtually none of these complaints come from people in the higher elos (plat+). Higher you go, the more respect you have for the influence each role has in the game.

You should hear me complain about adc.

To be fair though, most of my complaints stem from the role not being fun for me anymore and less about its game impact.

In post 813, hiplop wrote:

In post 797, PJ. wrote:

In post 796, Ankamius wrote:None of it makes any sense because support-style playstyles are always the least popular ones. Even then, the fact that most people don't want to play them has no bearing on whether they want them to be in the game or not.

This isn't true. Support is pretty wildly popular in Overwatch. I'm pretty sure medic is played a ton in TF2 as well.

support is the least played role in overwatch too

No way, I feel like I always have one on my team, except for when I play with you

In post 816, PJ. wrote:

In post 813, hiplop wrote:

In post 797, PJ. wrote:

In post 796, Ankamius wrote:None of it makes any sense because support-style playstyles are always the least popular ones. Even then, the fact that most people don't want to play them has no bearing on whether they want them to be in the game or not.

This isn't true. Support is pretty wildly popular in Overwatch. I'm pretty sure medic is played a ton in TF2 as well.

support is the least played role in overwatch too

No way, I feel like I always have one on my team, except for when I play with you

You have a support in your team basically every single game in League.

So my opponents have selected Karma and Cait... and then my last pick ADC picks Vayne... wtf

There's nothing wrogn with that. Unless you're in diamond 3 it's more important to play the champs your'e comfortable with than care too much about counterpicking

(unless you're picking something genuinely dumb like lee sin into akali or heimer into syndra)

Lee sin literally counters akali

Vayne literally dies to caitlyn karma

whoops I meant akali into lee sin

and its ok to play vayne against cait karma if the vayne and sp are good

In post 817, Randomnamechange wrote:

In post 816, PJ. wrote:

In post 813, hiplop wrote:

In post 797, PJ. wrote:

In post 796, Ankamius wrote:None of it makes any sense because support-style playstyles are always the least popular ones. Even then, the fact that most people don't want to play them has no bearing on whether they want them to be in the game or not.

This isn't true. Support is pretty wildly popular in Overwatch. I'm pretty sure medic is played a ton in TF2 as well.

support is the least played role in overwatch too

No way, I feel like I always have one on my team, except for when I play with you

You have a support in your team basically every single game in League.

This isn't true. I very very very often do not have a support on my team.

I have a friend who doesn't count mage supports as actual supports.

If you arent a sustain support into cait karma youd be getting shit on regardless of the adc probs