Mafiascum.net

In post 1920, goodmorning wrote:
I wasn't questioning him to win an argument. I was questioning him to clarify his stance on TSO. I wasn't questioning him to build a case on him. I was questioning him to attempt to read him.

If you find this valuable, asking people lots of questions to help attain a read, why have you not done this with anyone else?

In post 1920, goodmorning wrote:
You're kidding me. The rolefishing set is aimed at a single newb newb newb player _{(who actually tried to rolefish)}. The second set is thinking of a hypothetical reasonably experienced set of Scum _{(who are apparently not taking the "lynch Boonskiies" action)}.
Of course I'm thinking on different levels - one of them is labelled "Inexperience Challenged."

So, what you actually asked a newbie was: Why would a hypothetical reasonably experienced set of scum try to lynch PR's?

How is a newbie supposed to know what reasonably experienced scum do or don't do?

I don't think that is what you were asking.

In post 1923, Thor665 wrote:@Garmr - have you ever played with scum Pere?

Hi Thorsie

I have

@Slandaar - would you like to talk about it then? I'm here and open.

In post 1925, Slandaar wrote:

In post 1920, goodmorning wrote:
I wasn't questioning him to win an argument. I was questioning him to clarify his stance on TSO. I wasn't questioning him to build a case on him. I was questioning him to attempt to read him.

If you find this valuable, asking people lots of questions to help attain a read, why have you not done this with anyone else?

In post 1920, goodmorning wrote:
You're kidding me. The rolefishing set is aimed at a single newb newb newb player _{(who actually tried to rolefish)}. The second set is thinking of a hypothetical reasonably experienced set of Scum _{(who are apparently not taking the "lynch Boonskiies" action)}.
Of course I'm thinking on different levels - one of them is labelled "Inexperience Challenged."

So, what you actually asked a newbie was: Why would a hypothetical reasonably experienced set of scum try to lynch PR's?

How is a newbie supposed to know what reasonably experienced scum do or don't do?

I don't think that is what you were asking.

Wait, what newbie was GM asking a question of?

I honestly had no problem with either question. And I would have classified GM's 2nd line of questioning differently than you did. But what's your definition of a newbie?

@GM, same question, how do you define newbie?

In post 1923, Thor665 wrote:@Garmr - have you ever played with scum Pere?

Also, what players on his wagon do you dislike and why?

Finally, you say you liked his thought process earlier...do you still like it now?

1. nope not that i can remember

2A.Muffin-I can see him buddying script a bit and I don't know if anyone's used this as a scum tell but he seems to be leeching you. If a strong player is pushing a wagon just jump on and throw down a few points and don't provide anything to really push it. I think the closet thing to a push is saying come join the wagon and oh look at the history of events in the way I paint it (521)

2B.Scriptian-The town cred thing in a lesser extent and the jump onto the pere wagon in a bigger extent. It didn't feel natural to me.

OrNot2B.Davey- quotes gm says she feels towny and doesn't give a reason why those quotes feel towny. Plays a devil adovocate like role in the thors and pere argument and then gives a meh reason to vote pere (667.

I originally disliked more players on the wagon but I been rethinking them.

3 they were similar at the start (not the same) but they steered into different directions. I don't agree with some of his reads/reactions but I can see how he got there with the way he thinks.

In post 1924, davesaz wrote:This is how I play. I prefer to read the thread and decide who is scum by what they post. I have enough time to post a few times total per day across all my internet activity, everywhere. Deal with it.

I have no idea how my criticism involved your activity so okay I will deal with it

More examples of Dave saying how much he loves gm and hugging up to her. Why don't you just marry her dave?

PV is just less colourful as scum, just is, he has less of a presence, it's meta but it's the only way I can read PV because I used to for several games always think hes scum so I just ignore his reasoning mostly because I never agree with him.

He posted meta showing why he believes what he believes it completely backed him up, you can't make that up, he obviously believes that you(royal you) shouldn't be assuming it's multiball in this sized game and his experience backs this argument up. It's not a good argument but meh, I don't really find his arguments good ever so whatever that is pretty moot.

Why didn't he accuse others? don't know, don't really care. Maybe because he thinks you specifically shouldn't think it's multiball.

In post 1931, Garmr wrote:More examples of Dave saying how much he loves gm and hugging up to her. Why don't you just marry her dave?

Try reading 1632 and 1803. I'm following a line of questioning here. It's subtle, but you have to be subtle with certain targets.

In post 1928, davesaz wrote:Wait, what newbie was GM asking a question of?

Csareo is the person in question.

In post 1928, davesaz wrote:
I honestly had no problem with either question. And I would have classified GM's 2nd line of questioning differently than you did. But what's your definition of a newbie?

Why does this matter?

Try just answering please. Explaining the why would contaminate the question.

Someone who is new to the game.

How about something more specific than that. # games? # months? Behavior?

In post 1933, davesaz wrote:

In post 1931, Garmr wrote:More examples of Dave saying how much he loves gm and hugging up to her. Why don't you just marry her dave?

Try reading 1632 and 1803. I'm following a line of questioning here. It's subtle, but you have to be subtle with certain targets.

I didn't see those ones but after isoing you and searching goodmorning I just noticed you seemed to start getting suspicious of her around 1219. That changes things a little.

@Thor what do you think of some of the weaker vote on your wagon like dave's and boon's?

In post 1937, davesaz wrote:How about something more specific than that. # games? # months? Behavior?

Don't know really. It's not a set thing and somewhat depends on how quick a learner they are/how applied they are to the games. Lets just say 2 games because that is what the site suggests.

In post 1859, Garmr wrote:

In post 1853, AxleGreaser wrote:

In post 1851, Garmr wrote:
Because Tso is being Tso.

Do you have specific game to refer me to that will make your point clear? (so that I can see it for myself)

I expect that to be way harder thing to do as TSO is more experienced player with larger palette of previous play styles as town or scum.

Also I do argue he is better lynch that PereV, or Thor, who I have said I dont want to lynch D1.

This for instance is self described on wiki "Bah. I played fucking shit here."
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=29163
and he does not seem to do the anti town stuff I am talking about there.

Wait you ask me for examples as why tso is being tso but it's ok that annienen didn't provide an example how boon is self conscious as town and your fine with that? (even through i do think his town now.) That's kinda bs and hypo fucking critical. I'm going to show you a game where tso is acting similarly to what he is now except he used no hard cases at all, mini 1510 . He also got into one of his pushes on majiffy like he did with ane this game and it lasted till a majjify lynch if i remember correctly.

This game also shows my 2nd scum tick which i only had 4 times before this game
1.my first normal with banksy flareon
2.that game on grimgrove (tso counter pushed me on this one day 1 i so could of got him lynched but then again i fucked up end game.),
3.Regefan in mafia in space(ffery told me to shut up about regefan because she was in a foul mood and he was her number 1 town read I was right she was wrong instinct vs theory)
and 4. a game with Beelzebub in georgetown(yuck belzefail).

Axle you are my 5th to trigger this instinct in a strong enough manner.

I'm having a difficult time understanding what you're trying to say here. Care to explain what the point is?

In post 1939, Flubbernugget wrote:@Thor what do you think of some of the weaker vote on your wagon like dave's and boon's?

So Flubbernugget... I've noticed that damn near every post you make is a poke like the ones you were sending my way, or weak questions like this. Observations but no analysis. I'm starting to think you're scum trying to skate by.

In post 1929, Garmr wrote:1. nope not that i can remember

Does that concern you in an attempt to comment that his play here looks townish? You appear to have no frame of reference, yeah?

In post 1929, Garmr wrote:2A.Muffin-I can see him buddying script a bit and I don't know if anyone's used this as a scum tell but he seems to be leeching you. If a strong player is pushing a wagon just jump on and throw down a few points and don't provide anything to really push it. I think the closet thing to a push is saying come join the wagon and oh look at the history of events in the way I paint it (521)

2B.Scriptian-The town cred thing in a lesser extent and the jump onto the pere wagon in a bigger extent. It didn't feel natural to me.

OrNot2B.Davey- quotes gm says she feels towny and doesn't give a reason why those quotes feel towny. Plays a devil adovocate like role in the thors and pere argument and then gives a meh reason to vote pere (667.

I originally disliked more players on the wagon but I been rethinking them.

I will point out, firstly, your point on Dave is weak considering Dave's playstyle. Seriously, go do research and come back and talk to me on that one. Also, Dave in isolation is reading really townish to me right now, you're not getting any of that?

I also don't see it on Muffin unless he's super buddying me - because he did choose to go into that dustup with GM about me also, which, at least suggests he's willing to take a lead stance on a case if he's so inclined even if he's scum in this game.

I mildly see the point on Script - but, meh, I townread him myself, and even if you don't 1-2 questionable votes hardly a bad wagon makes at this wagon size.

In post 1929, Garmr wrote:3 they were similar at the start (not the same) but they steered into different directions. I don't agree with some of his reads/reactions but I can see how he got there with the way he thinks.

This is frustratingly vague.
I would actually say in the early game he was doing almost anything *but* offering reads and thoughts.
I would also say that, since moving away from me, he hasn't done anything either.
In fact - besies his press on me, i would dare say his ISO barely has anything one could call scumhunting in it.
And I have people calling him town or agreeing with his thoughts.

Do you think I'm crazy to have those beliefs? Like, specifically, that besides comments about me Pere has done nothing this game?

In post 1932, Slandaar wrote:PV is just less colourful as scum, just is, he has less of a presence, it's meta but it's the only way I can read PV because I used to for several games always think hes scum so I just ignore his reasoning mostly because I never agree with him.

You find him colorful in this game? Becase the only color he showed, in my opinion, was when I forced him to engage me. Other than that he has very much struck me as a sit back and do nothing player.

In post 1932, Slandaar wrote:He posted meta showing why he believes what he believes it completely backed him up, you can't make that up, he obviously believes that you(royal you) shouldn't be assuming it's multiball in this sized game and his experience backs this argument up. It's not a good argument but meh, I don't really find his arguments good ever so whatever that is pretty moot.

You're falling into his trap here.
It doesn't matter whether or not he believes games are or are not likely to be multiball.
The question is - would he find it *scummy* that I thought it was likely. (or, more specifically, a safe presumption)
Why did he think *that* was scummy.

It doesn't matter whether or not he thought it was or wasn't likely, it mattered that he called it scummy to think otherwise.

In post 1932, Slandaar wrote:Why didn't he accuse others? don't know, don't really care. Maybe because he thinks you specifically shouldn't think it's multiball.

Okay.
Why should he think this? (also, I think you should care - why don't you? We're talking about a read on pere here, I would think that aspect would matter, yeah?)

In post 1939, Flubbernugget wrote:@Thor what do you think of some of the weaker vote on your wagon like dave's and boon's?

I was asked this five days ago and answered.
I was asked it again like, five hours ago or something and noted that I had already done it.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p6302950
There.

What are your reads, currently?

Still limited access today- but I'll try to read up.

My goal is to be 100% caught up by the end of the week.

@Mod - I understand the deadline is currently suspended - but could you clarify what it will be once replacements arrive?

We're at 80 pages and haven't managed L-4 yet on any wagon.

In post 1710, PeregrineV wrote:Still can't see what everyone is so enamored of. I want his gift for all my scumgames.

Vote: Scripten

Why haven't you been able to articulate why Scripten is scum?

The only thing I can see is the "town cred" thing from like 65 pages ago. Which posts, specifically, demonstrate scum motivation from scripten?

Thor - because I feel my vote is more fruitful where it is.

I'm not particularly townreading Peregrine like I was and he could be scum, I guess, because I usually townread Peregrine when I ISO him in isolation and that really hasn't happened this game. Maybe that's indicative for Peregrine being scum. Maybe it's indicative of him having an off game. I don't know. At the moment I don't really care either because I don't have enough time for this game in general.