...and they all lived happily ever after

[Tamuz]

The boll weevils may not destroy your crops in one summer Seol, but if you do not get rid of all of them, they will just pop-up again the next summer and come back for all your crops. Malignant tumors are always deadly, regardless of if they are growing or not.

So as to scum.

[Yosarian2]

I don't like the "happily ever after" stuff created by this situation (and similar situations). I think no lynch should be removed... there's no real flavour reasons for it to be removed, but it just strikes me as

off

. Then again, a similar argument could be made for forcing the mafia to kill every night

I just don't think it's good sportsmanship to turn mafia games into games of chicken, especially over merely improving your chances.


As I think about it, I think giving the mafia freedom and forcing the town to lynch is the best plan. The mafia are supposed to be the deceptive ones, so I think they should be given the chance to deceive townies by no-killing... town no-lynching is kinda weak imo.


Problem is, without a flavour justification for disallowing no-lynch I'm not comfortable with that idea either

(shrug) Mafia is to some extent a numbers game. One of the thing that makes it interesting is that there are different stratagies one can follow, including no-lynch. It adds more options to the game, and that's especally interesting when you have someone arguing for or against a plan you think is good for the town; are they scum who are trying to get the town to make a wrong choice, or do they just disagree with you? I think the no-lynch option really adds to the day-game, which badly needs as many different options as is practical in order to keep it interesting and to give people things to argue about.

[Turbovolver]

Here's the way I see it -

The only reason the town want to kill all the scum is so the scum stop killing them - the town are fighting for survival. If the scum decide to stop killing the town, then the town have achieved what they need - safety from the invading force.

Therefore... it's arguable that "happily ever after" should be seen as a

town win

.

That works for me... it forces one of the sides into budging and hence prevents stand-offs. I would prefer if it was the town who was forced to budge and not the mafia, but this way has flavour justification and all

[Seol]

The boll weevils may not destroy your crops in one summer Seol, but if you do not get rid of all of them, they will just pop-up again the next summer and come back for all your crops. Malignant tumors are always deadly, regardless of if they are growing or not.

So as to scum.

Not if the scum put down arms for all time. That's effectively what the draw is - the game is over because the scum decide they will nevermore be a threat. In this particular example, the scum

asked the mod

about a draw, it was't imposed.

[Yosarian2]

So Don Lloyd went soft on us enh? Couldn't pull the trigger? Cooperating with the Feds? In the witness protection program in Santa Clara? Possibly thinking of cutting a deal?

I'll have the hit squad on their way.

He shall not bring shame to the family!

Neah. Heat just got to be too much, he just needed to lay low for a while. Don't worry, though; once everyone calms down and forgets about this crazy lynching stuff, he'll finish the job.

[Mr. Flay]

Meh, he just wants to say that the game ended in a first. We'll probably hear about it for quite a while.

Quoted for Truth. "Wanting to be the first draw" is not a good reason to base your in-game decisions in, in my opinion. The mafia WILL kill again, or else they're not scum. And if they're not scum, then they have no place in a Newbie Game.

If my "town" in Res. Dogs had chosen to run when there were still "scum" (undercover cops) left, they'd have LOST the game. I'm beginning to wish Stoofer hadn't intervened.

[Yosarian2]

Meh, he just wants to say that the game ended in a first. We'll probably hear about it for quite a while.

Quoted for Truth. "Wanting to be the first draw" is not a good reason to base your in-game decisions in, in my opinion. The mafia WILL kill again, or else they're not scum. And if they're not scum, then they have no place in a Newbie Game.

If my "town" in Res. Dogs had chosen to run when there were still "scum" (undercover cops) left, they'd have LOST the game. I'm beginning to wish Stoofer hadn't intervened.

The way I see it is, it's like a perpertual check draw in chess. Sure, the game COULD end eventually, but so long as both players just keep moving back and fourth, it never will. At some point, if moving back and forth forever is the optimal play for both sides at each step of the way, one can just assume that they would keep doing so forever given the chance and call it a draw.

At least, that's the way it works in chess. (shrug)

[LoudmouthLee]

How did *I* miss this thread?

Nominate Lloyd, to be partners with Thok, for the nickname "Disgrace to scum everywhere."

This, Lloyd, is a mockery of the game. Yes, you play for fun, and we all do, but when you sitch the rules around and say...

What if we just have a gigantic tea party instead?

Then we can call this place LiptonScum. Or NesteaScum

Until them, the mafia should kill. I can see them not killing out of strategic play (a la Vis in Newb 195), but to "force a draw".

Ugly.

[Commodore Amazing]

How is it that I always end up in games where the bad guys disgrace themselves? I should try to find a game I've been in where the town has performed disgracefully for the trifecta.

[Turbovolver]

How did *I* miss this thread?

Nominate Lloyd, to be partners with Thok, for the nickname "Disgrace to scum everywhere."

This, Lloyd, is a mockery of the game. Yes, you play for fun, and we all do, but when you sitch the rules around and say...

What if we just have a gigantic tea party instead?

Then we can call this place LiptonScum. Or NesteaScum

Until them, the mafia should kill. I can see them not killing out of strategic play (a la Vis in Newb 195), but to "force a draw".

Ugly.

Why should it be the mafia that have to kill and not the townies that have to lynch? I agree draws are pretty lame, but why is it the mafia that is the disgrace and not the town?

[LoudmouthLee]

Why would the TOWN lynch if the mafia wasn't killing? THE DOCTOR WAS DEAD!

[Turbovolver]

OK. So yeah, I think in the "happily ever after" scenario, the mafia has stopped killing and so basically you've got a town win. The last mafia person has basically become a townsperson...

[LoudmouthLee]

QED:

That newbie game will hereby be known as Teaparty.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

*slaps Lee with a huge trout*

What's wrong with a Teaparty!?

[Kelly Chen]

Which game is Thok famous for?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Married to the Mob

[Lloyd]

In this particular example, the scum

asked the mod

about a draw, it was't imposed.

I disagree.

The draw scenario was initially proposed by the mod, a game-day before it actually happened.

[Lloyd]

Nominate Lloyd, to be partners with Thok, for the nickname "Disgrace to scum everywhere."

Are you upset because we make it too easy for you to hunt down Mafia and Serial Killers?

[Lloyd]

LoudmouthLee,

To add onto your list of Serial Killers who claim SKs...

BrianMcQueso claimed Serial Killer in post 8 of Mini 294 - Post Restriction.

[LoudmouthLee]

Ugh.

(BmQ is now on my people to kill list)

[Cubsfan4ever]

I think it's pretty lame that Lloyd chose to throw away a game he had a good chance of winning just so his first aftergame post could be "we made history everybody."

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Amb just reminded me that this has happened on the GL, the very Master Himself, Mith managed to Jedi Mindtrick Ambscum into accepting a draw when there were only 2 people left(him and amb) after the previous day tricking Amb into killing his coScum(Pooky).

Yes Amb could've just gone to night and put a bullet in Mith's head but when faced with the awesome mental assault from Mith, Amb could only lay down his weapons and agree to a draw.

[Turbovolver]

I claimed SK when I was an SK in Mini 275, but only after my fake claim was debunked. I don't get to make the list, do I...


Is there a link for that game Pooky? Sounds like good reading

[TBuG]

I think draw = no win, no loss. You could say the mod was wrong to declare a draw, but in all honesty, the mod can do whatever the frack they want. Anyone who disagrees hasn't ever seen CES mod AIM Mafia XD

[Cubsfan4ever]

hmm.... this happily ever after concept seems to have been explored long before any of this sort of talk ever occured in this post: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... &start=178