Mini 280 - Game Over

[KingPin]

Darn preview/submit screw up!

LML, what makes you think that scum know that you were naive and that DG wasn't?

[LoudmouthLee]

Because, I recieved an innocent result. DG recieved a guilty result. The scum chose to kill him, not me, making me much less of a threat.

I realize that I'm NOT INSANE, because DG is cleared in death. I recieved an innocent on him (and he was the best check, in my eyes), and yes, WIFOM galore, but I don't think the scum would kill DG over me whilst I was the sane cop.

This seems rather cut and dry. If you want to lynch me, lynch me tomorrow. It would be AWFUL if DG was paranoid, and I am Naive. Then, the mod really messed with this town nicely.

I hope this answers your question as sussinctly as possible. I still believe Aelyn is the correct lynch, followed by Draygn. How could I NOT be town? I would like to know where you're going with this. Explain. With reasons. Not with you're patented "because I say so".

FoS: Draygn

[draygn_mage]

Oh don't get me wrong, Aelyn should definitely be the lynch for today, but I believe you should be following. After re-reading your arguments from yesterday, I can see they made no sense. You came out voting for Aelyn yesterday, but once DG came forward as a cop you unvoted and began defending with the claim that you too were a cop. As a scum this is a brilliant move as it gives you a claim that is unverifiable (naive cop) which could be nothing but a townie role. Just too much coincidence and too much convenience in your claim.

The rest of the town can lynch Aelyn, I'm leaving my vote on you all day and if I'm still alive tomorrow it will stay there again till the rest of the town realizes the same as me.

*shrug* or they can lynch me and I get to add to my sig when they finally lynch you.

[draygn_mage]

EBWODP- Hit submit not preview

BTW- nice job of totally ignoring KingPin's question.

[LoudmouthLee]

Oh don't get me wrong, Aelyn should definitely be the lynch for today, but I believe you should be following. After re-reading your arguments from yesterday, I can see they made no sense. You came out voting for Aelyn yesterday, but once DG came forward as a cop you unvoted and began defending with the claim that you too were a cop. As a scum this is a brilliant move as it gives you a claim that is unverifiable (naive cop) which could be nothing but a townie role. Just too much coincidence and too much convenience in your claim.

The rest of the town can lynch Aelyn, I'm leaving my vote on you all day and if I'm still alive tomorrow it will stay there again till the rest of the town realizes the same as me.

*shrug* or they can lynch me and I get to add to my sig when they finally lynch you.

Or, you can get your story straight.

My initial vote, dear sirrah, was on Fiasco.

I implore everyone involved in this game to easily check "all posts by user" and click on "LoudmouthLee". Are you for real?

Your entire point is gone. Try again.

And PS: I thought I answered Kingpin's question well.

[KingPin]

Really, it was just a question. To me, it seems as though your explanation may be right on, except that we would have to assume that Aelyn is also scum. Explanation of that statement:
1. If Aelyn is scum, and DG found him on N0 and you also did your investigation on N0 with a contradictory result, then scum may have exacted revenge or killed the competent cop. That would explain why DG got it last night.
2. We don't know that DG was sane/insane/naive/paraniod. What we do know is that he was a Cop.
3. We would have to assume that Aelyn was scum and DG was sane.

I agree, that lynching Aelyn is a good move for the town today. Obviously, if we did that and he turned up innocent, you would seriously be gone tomorrow. But the town needs to discuss this a little more, before we start voting.

[draygn_mage]

Hrm...

Now, we have a VERY INTERESTING issue.

I'm a cop. I TOO investigated Aelyn. I recieved an INNOCENT result.

How many times did I say Aelyn was NOT the lynch today?

At this point, once although nearly every other post from your first to this one was your defense of your vote on Fiasco. Now that I recall, Fiasco's first vote was on Aelyn, so I guess that is a point in your favor.

[LoudmouthLee]

You said I voted for Aelyn out of the gate, and I didn't.

You're trying to mislead the town. I dislike it.

[draygn_mage]

You did vote Aelyn yesterday, did you not?

[LoudmouthLee]

After much discussion... after both claims.

[vikingfan]

I'm not going to subscribe to the theory of lynching LML- at least not today. Here's why- we're already down a day-vig, a doc, and a cop (sanity unknown). The last thing I want is to possibly eliminate a cop that can actually help us right now. We're at 8 right now and we haven't nailed any scum, so I believe this is an important. Not that we're at lynch-or-lose, but if we don't lynch correctly today, we very could be.

For that reason, I want to leave LML until tomorrow and look at some other suspects, the most notable being mage for promoting the lynch of a cop right now. It's clear now that the scum let Fiasco dig his own grave yesterday- the problem is that it's tough to deduce much from that since just about everyone agreed Fiasco was scummy (way to go, fiasco...most misguided townie ever. Certainly didn't help us any...). Mind you, I'm not at all sure of LML's scumminess or lack thereof, but what I do know is that right now we need to keep our eyes open. As a result, I prefer to leave LML for now(since even if he's scum, he's probably got partners- I refuse to believe his counterclaiming a cop on day one could be a SK gambit) and concentrate on other options. Aelyn still seems like the best play as of now- we DO know that DG was a cop and found him guilty- sanity is the key question here.

Thoughts?

[draygn_mage]

But how is it that 18 mins after you claim cop and and ask how many times you told us that aelyn wasn't the lynch, you are suddenly doubting your sanity and "know how to test it", then 10 mins after that, you drop a vote on Aelyn?

Does this not look like scum trying to distance themselves? Does this not look like you are setting yourself up for a naive claim?

This doesn't even take into consideration that "the scum know who is sane already". At the time, Aelyn claimed un-nightkillable townie. Doesn't that seem like a SK ability more than scum? Scum wouldn't know if Aelyn was the SK at all. But they WOULD know that DG was sane if you were scum false-claiming cop.

I still think that Aelyn is the SK and that is the reason I think he should go first, but I definitely think you should go next.

[Norinel]

Not that we're at lynch-or-lose, but if we don't lynch correctly today, we very could be.

Actually, if there are three scum (Quite possible), and we lynch the SK, and the scum kill goes through tonight, (And there are no vote/daykill/lynch affecting roles) then the mafia wins. So I could see LML as mafia going for credibility yesterday with cop counterclaim, then deciding in the night that Aelyn could very well be the SK, thus knocking out the potentially sane DG in the night and going for Aelyn today for the win. But that's so WIFOM it hurts.

And then when draygn_mage goes and says...

I still think that Aelyn is the SK and that is the reason I think he should go first

It's rather disturbing.

Strong FOS: draygn_mage, FOS: LML, Aelyn

, but I'll wait for everyone before voting.

[Norinel]

EBWOP- As I just posted in V/LA, I'll be gone Saturday to Saturday. Replace/whatever as appropriate.

[draygn_mage]

@Norinel- that makes no sense. If Aelyn is SK and we lynch scum, then there are 2 kills tonight and the town is worse off.

[draygn_mage]

damnit that was supposed to be preview.

The only way that lynching Aelyn could be bad is if he's town. As DG got a guilty on him, I highly doubt that will happen.

[Jaguar]

I'm not sure what to think about last night. DG is dead, making it appear that he was more of a threat to the scum than LML. At the same time, we only have one death from last night, not two as we had N0.

I (still) agree with Nori and vikingfan that lynching LML today is not the best choice yet and

FOS: draygn_mage

for suggesting it. Fiasco being a townie really doesn't help us, as vikingfan said, he acted scummily enough the whole day to throw a wrench in analysing the lynch.

Let the discussions begin. d_m, you saw what wanting to lynch a claimed cop got Fiasco yesterday, do you really want to go down the same path as yesterday and possibly putting the town in a giant hole that may be impossible to get out of?

[draygn_mage]

Sorry, my gut all I have in this game and it tells me that LML is probably scum. Please don't misunderstand me though, I think that Aelyn is the best lynch for today. If Aelyn comes up innocent (not bloody likely) then I'll apologize to LML, but you can't tell me that this doesn't reek of scum setting up a fake claim. (A brilliant attempt I'll admit, but fake nonetheless.)

[KingPin]

So far, I've not heard anyone say that Aelyn is not a good choice today. I think we are all in agreement then that Aelyn is a good choice.

I think that if Aelyn comes up as scum, that LML's claim is completely false. No sanity plea can save him. There is no way he could question his sanity, when we have a cop dead, with no information on his sanity. There is nothing to suggest that we had a sane and insane cop here. Though, it is not good to question the setup. I think we have enough information to move forward today. Aelyn will give the town needed information and will expose, what maybe, a gambit by a scum "cop."

Aelyn is the correct lynch at this point since the Cop got a scum result on him. We cannot question the Cop's sanity since there is nothing to suggest that he wasn't sane. In addition, more information will help the town. When we get a guilty result, we should go with it until proven otherwise. Which is where we were headed yesterday, when Fiasco jumped up and bit us in the ass.

[LyingBrian]

• Vote Count:
  • 1) Aelyn
    • LoudmouthLee
  • 1) LoudmouthLee
    • draygn_mage
  • 6)
    not voting
    • Aelyn
    • Jaguar
    • KingPin
    • Norinel
    • Passdog
    • vikingfan
• Lynch:
  5 votes

[Aelyn]

*shrug*

Vote: Aelyn

There's no way I'm gonna survive the day, short of someone literally saying "I'm scum, I'm a better lynch, guys," and even then it's doubtful.

[vikingfan]

Wow, not even a defense...ok, then.

vote Aelyn

[Aelyn]

Wow, not even a defense...ok, then.

vote Aelyn

How can I possibly defend myself? I know he was insane, but frankly simply saying that ain't gonna make people believe it. I accept that I'm gonna die.

By the way, LML is scum, KingPin is a roleblocker of some nature (I'm not sure of his alignment), Passdog has already lied in a way which can be proven entirely from what he's said in the thread, and your role isn't as good as you think it is.

And now I'm gonna be quiet for a bit.

[draygn_mage]

what? are you claiming a cop role too? /sarcasm

[Passdog]

The best way for you not to be lynched right now is to explain those three accusations/theories. I would be interested in knowing how you deduced all of those. In fact I think that you know this and as a result are using this as a major stalling tactic.

I understand why you think LML is scum, that much is obvious. I think it safer to assume he is a cop though - nothing was proven or disproven by DG's death. As LML himself (i think) pointed out DG's death is very WIFOM. And the mafia are probably using that to confuse us.

Until now I have been thinking that maybe LML was the sane cop. Now that you start pointing fingers like you are I start to see that he may be right in assuming he is naive.

But the others? What does it achieve to lay those accusations out and then stay quiet. Casting suspicion around like that is scummy unless you are willing to back it up.