NY 164: Maniacal Street Mafia (Anticlimatically finished.)

[Amethyst Kitty]

Bacde, I'm hesitant to move you to my town pile this game. You have been playing like your town-self, though but there's something else there. Should Nacho flip scum though, it'll probably be enough to comfortably call you town

~Mara

[Amethyst Kitty]

If you were at all paying attention. Mara and I are using Skype to communicate.

@Mollie:

I know Bacade is a town read for you. I just get paranoid when someone makes the whole NK comment. The only ever time I'm okay with it is when someone replaces in the night and haven't read the thread because they were afaird of being killed.

I have to talk to Mara before giving out reads, tbh.

~Mala

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

I understand thinking that someone is town or scum due to meta, but that is as useful by itself as gut is, good enough to suspect someone as scum and perhaps vote them, but not good enough to base an entire case on and convince other people to vote. I currently have Nacho as a null read, and I'm not going to just blindly jump on a wagon when I have many strong scum reads I can vote for, some of which are pushing the Nacho wagon.

I also have Nacho as a weak scum read, independent of Mollie's read on him.

Mollie and I play with Nacho

a lot

. And to top that off, Mollie is a

very

strong meta player. Knowing her alignment, I can safely say that if she's calling Nacho scum, he's very likely scum. So if you think I'm town, you therefore must thing she's town. Ergo, you should probably trust her on Nacho.

I know Bacade is a town read for you. I just get paranoid when someone makes the whole NK comment.

Bacde is also a strong town read for me.

[Oversoul]

I agree with Nacho, activity is not a town tell?

If you don't want me to town read you, be my guest and tell me. Should I have a reason to not town read you?

How does OM/HD's high activity make him town? I would think scum would want to blend in and be active rather then lurk and gain attention on them. Activity isn't indicative of an alignment.

Why did you ask this question when two other players made similar comments?

[EddieFenix]

Hey OverSoul, mind answering my question a few pages back?

[Oversoul]

I will get around to it but if you want a response now for time reasons I'll answer it if you quote it.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

hey nacho there is this game you are ignoring

[EddieFenix]

Hey Oversoul, answer me this.

Before the reveal of your "gambit", what reads did you have/gather?

There ya go OS.

[Oversoul]

I am going to catalog the reactions to my claim as rejected it, supported it, ignored it.

Rejected it:
Nacho
CTD
Nero Cain
Cephrir
fuzzybutternut
Bulbazak

Supported it:
ArcAngel
Om the Destroyer
Red Ryu
DLG
Thor
Seanald

Ignored it:
BeautyandtheBeast
Slandaar
Desperado
ActionDan
Amethyst Kitty
Bacde
EddieFenix
Mac
Baby Spice

---

I'd like the people in the ignored section to explain why they didn't comment on the mass claim.

---

I'd like to know why Bulbazak and Sry were okay with voting the same wagon that I was voting, despite thinking that I was scum for my claim.

---

Looking at Fuzzy's early early game posts I don't really think he is town. Looking at his activity after the early early game it gets mildly better but not enough to warrant a town read without extensive meta; he doesn't really seem to be scumhunting either. I question, sternly (yes I am looking at you), where the AK hydra got that town read on fuzzy.

If you are curious as to why I don't think fuzzy is town it is for posts like these

So that list is in no order then?

Why did you claim. OS?

If we do that, we're popcorning.

Really, Sland?

Cool.

Multiple Personality disordered. LOL


VOTE: Oversoul

His iso is notably void of any scumhunting whatsoever.

Upon my reskim (yes I stupidly went page by page instead of iso, I don't know why) of the thread I didn't realize that the support for my slot mainly came from one player, Arcangel. I had not realized how much she was buddying me and calling my wagon bad.
Not to mention she expressed the newb scum fear of "that wagon grew fast, careful of quicklynch!" that I think is typical of newer players still working out the kinks on how to play scum.

I can't read Arc for shit either way, but that is just something I want others to note as it took me by surprise.

I guess I over exaggerated my "support" for the claim when answering CTD mainly because of this fact, but I didn't get as much heat for it as I would like.
I blame the fact that some players were slow starters. Even then, some players, Seanald for example, did go back and comment on it whereas others simply completely ignored it. Some were even close in proximity (by page) to the claim itself, such as Slandaar.

Townies are going to be able to look at the same information as you and come to different conclusions, even if you are town. Welcome to mafia. Welcome to earth. You are not the standard for objectivity. This is patently obvious. Not to mention, guess what? Scum can piggyback on a townie's opinion because they know it's one that came from a townie and therefore a legitimate conclusion that someone could have reached! "He agrees with me": Not a towntell since ever.

I am also interested in Cephrir since he has acted awkwardly with regards to my wagon.
He votes me after attacking my reasoning for the claim and similarly parroting Nacho's reasoning that the town would have the information my Informed status would give them.

Then in the very next post he makes, he considers the possibility that what I said was true, but he views it in a skeptical manner as if he *doesn't* think there are going to be multiple killers. He uses the potential for multiple killers as a way to fence sit on the overall idea of a massclaim in general.

If there are indeed multiple killers in the game, massclaim could lose us a lot of PRs quickly. But it might also result in said killers killing each other more. Conflicted. I do think mods generally account for the possibility, and there were, after all, a million reviewers.

Not to mention he parrots information that *I* said when referring to the fact that "a million reviewers" reviewed the game.

I wouldn't go that far (@283). I'm not stubborn enough to refuse to claim if it's going through anyway, but I'm pretty sure I'm against it. I suppose Oversoul's information was useful after all, because I would abstain otherwise, lulz.

Here he legitimately believes the claim despite everything saying that it influenced his decision to be against the mass claim in general.
If he believes it, his reasoning for the vote on me doesn't apply anymore. Why does he continue to vote me then at this point in the game?

Wow, that's a ridiculously self-centered viewpoint. By that logic anyone who suspects you is scum.

Welcome to my scumlist.

Well don't just sit there like a lump on that boring old Oversoul wagon!
Help me push this! It'll be fun, fruitful, and lynch a scum!

~

Good point. It's not like I actually want to lynch Oversoul.

Unvote, Vote: BeautyAndTheBeast

Here he only votes BatB because of Om the Destroyer's prompting even after stating they had just made his scumlist and that their reasoning for the town list is self centered.

That doesn't look like a townie thought process at all in my opinion especially considering he then explains the reasoning behind his vote without ever so much as attempting to do that with my wagon.

---

Red Ryu wagon, I ... don't know why I voted Ryu when the game started. I think it was something that I thought was odd during pregame but I can't be certain. I honestly don't remember.

Red Ryu seems to legitimately believe in my claim asking for further clarification on it as if there was information to be gathered from it.

Tid bit, I have actually seen Red Ryu play on his home forum. I dabbled a bit there and Ryu is a moderator. I didn't remember this until he linked back to it. I considered Ryu to be a good player there but his play here just seems different, almost dumber (I don't mean this an insult Ryu). It doesn't seem like he realizes things that I think he should be.

I think his response to Nacho in 423 is fairly town. It has that townie bravado at the end and shows continued to support for the claim on the basis of the claim itself.

I guess this is also where I get I impression that I had a lot of support because Ryu is supporting me a lot like Arc. I hadn't noticed that.

Red Ryu

, would you be willing to explain the justification for the activity post in 864?

Oversoul town if role is legit

I am curious to know what my standing is now.

Hey Oversoul, answer me this.

Before the reveal of your "gambit", what reads did you have/gather?

Admittedly not much. I hadn't really put much thought into this game other than the reads that I felt while the gambit was still going on.

For posterity sake, that was town: Thor, Om, CTD, BatB. Scum: Nacho, and fuzzy for their actions regarding my wagon.

I'm currently just waiting on a few things before I start to make waves.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

how on earth do you have us as a town read for the reasons that you have just posited for your other reads. it looks like you are trying to do a poe estimation but it does not add up

[Oversoul]

I'm currently just waiting on a few things before I start to make waves.

---

I'd like the people in the ignored section to explain why they didn't comment on the mass claim.

That's you mollie

[Baby Spice]

Hmm.

I would put Slandaar's early game as scummy. Nothing stood out and if I noticed one thing about town Sland in Street Racer, you knew he was in the game.

More recent though is the opposite. He is here.


Will need to check back into the first day of Street Racer to be sure, but leaning town on past history, and leaning town on calling out on the mass claim idea. Ie: Nacho.

My god, ninja'd by the great wall of China.

By the time I was reading it I figured the suggestion would already have been shut down and that anything I said would be empty comment on a dead subject

[Oversoul]

My god, ninja'd by the great wall of China

This is a Mastin game, afterall

<<< Pfft, Oversoul's wall is only a .3 at most on the Mastin scale. >>>

[Bulbazak]

I'd like to know why Bulbazak and Sry were okay with voting the same wagon that I was voting, despite thinking that I was scum for my claim.

Because I also believe that Ryu is scum.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

I'd like the people in the ignored section to explain why they didn't comment on the mass claim.

Because I was busy gathering reads based

on

it.

[Oversoul]

Do you think I am bussing Ryu?

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

Because I also believe that Ryu is scum.

I have you both as fairly strong town. Stop trying to eat each other so that we can lynch Cephrir, CTD and Nacho.

[Oversoul]

I don't agree with you on the CTD front.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

That's a damn shame.

[Oversoul]

And you aren't going to try and convince me?

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

No. Mollie's preference is Nacho, my preference is Cephrir. All my other scum reads can take a back seat until those two are six feet under.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

Of course, if you've been reading the thread, you should already be well aware of why I think CTD is scum. I've not kept it any secret.

[Oversoul]

Those were both answers I was expecting to be honest. My faith has been restored.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

Right. You on the Nacho wagon, then? Otherwise, get on it. He's been deliberately avoiding this thread; posting elsewhere and didn't even bother to check in here.

[EddieFenix]

@OS

I did react to the mass claim during that time it was being discussed. It's in one of the posts where I went back and forth with Bulba on. I said NO to wanting to mass claim, just to save you the trouble of looking (if you'd like to ISO me for confirmation, it's post #691 or ISO #13)

Unless you were discussing my reaction to the "gambit" claim.

So, my next question is, why was there not a whole lot of change in your reads from pre-gambit reveal to post-gambit reveal? Was it because the players attitude stayed the same? Their play style stayed the same? What...?