Team Mafia: White Flag Mafia

[Equinox]

EBWOP: Scratch the second paragraph of that, seeing as I forgot to remove it during preview.

[DemonHybrid]

Vote Equinox

Very unrandom. There is no backing to an IP wagon as herp-derping is not a scumtell, just a competence one. Equinox is pushing it more then "random wagon" on something like this being a tell.

Other good votes are marble and Klazam.

You're denying that meta's important in a variation of mafia like this? Meta couldn't be more important, and especially in RVS. I know that's taboo to say, but 90% of the comments so far have been on meta, strengths and weaknesses because teams can choose their roles. It may not be valid in the future, but it was the quickest way to get out of RVS.

[Klazam]

Vote Equinox

Very unrandom. There is no backing to an IP wagon as herp-derping is not a scumtell, just a competence one. Equinox is pushing it more then "random wagon" on something like this being a tell.

Other good votes are marble and Klazam.

Why am i a good vote?

3. Question for you: Why focus on IP and not other players with strong scumgames who Llamarble mentioned? Sotty, DGB, Thor and mith (from what I recall) all have strong scum games and you hadn't really focused on talking about them.

How do I say this... It wasn't so much InflatablePie's preference for scum games -- as I wasn't aware of that -- but

more something I picked up that led me and my team to conclude he may be scum in this game.

I chose to not mention people with strong scum games like Llamarble because I do not play like him, and I'll eventually get reads on those people without naming them.

Cold you enlighten us all to what the underlined above may be?

[LlamaFluff]

LlamaFluff, read the above and then read Thor665's comment, and connect the dots. That was not a random wagon at all.

So not random? Partially random? Secret tell? Why your random wagon over another?

@DH - A better way to get out of the RVS is to vote someone who has done something scummy. Which has happened already. You can give it to Equniox for trying to bait someone into hammering if you want to transcend the aformentioned points of trying to run up IP as a random wagon. Super cool part of all of this? Equinox-IP is already out as a scumteam.

[LlamaFluff]

Why am i a good vote?

Because of this post

Equinox/Thor: The only possible “scumtells” I can see about IP at the time you guys voted him is that he was the second to last to confirm, and he didn’t post a regular confirm.

Sorry for being dense, but I think Mith is just as good a wagon as IP is.

......
BUT, I think sarcasm is a valid scumtell. So Equinox/Thor: congrats. You get your vote.

unvote, vote InflatablePie

You seem to downgrade what people are trying to make you wagon him for, then follow along with a vote of IP afterall for being sarcastic (why is this a tell?). Something about that really just puts me on edge and be happy with pressure.

[DemonHybrid]

I'm not denying that Equinox could be scum, however, it's weird that you believe that it's an Equinox-IP team due to Equinox's behavior, yet you won't vote for or mention IP and instead debunk the wagon. Why?

Also, if the point of RVS is to leave it, why is it better to discount meta? RVS ends in other games due to meta all the time, why is this time any different?

[Equinox]

Klazam, it has to do with team composition and... etc. I'm gagged.

LlamaFluff, the InflatablePie wagon was not random, and I thought that should have been apparent when Thor665 sheeped me on it with his reasoning. Instead, all I saw was, "mith mith mith mith!" Clearly RVS wagon over an obvious non-RVS serious wagon? Yeah, no thanks.

[LlamaFluff]

I'm not denying that Equinox could be scum, however, it's weird that you believe that it's an Equinox-IP team due to Equinox's behavior, yet you won't vote for or mention IP and instead debunk the wagon. Why?

Already out, as in its not happening.

Also, if the point of RVS is to leave it, why is it better to discount meta? RVS ends in other games due to meta all the time, why is this time any different?

Meta in this game is hard to pin down if you want to get into it. There is game prefrence and alignment prefrence. For instance there is absolutely zero way I would have played in drams game, I would have replaced out instantly if I needed to be put there, I dislike his games that much. I cant really remember many RVS that ended in meta though in my games, usually someone just harping on a smaller tell, which is far more benificial in the long run.

Anyways, you agree with me about Equinox. Wagon up?

@Equinox - So why try to bait people into hammering him? Last post you had before vote five was trying to get a large amount of people to join you, without mentioning your percived L-2 of him.

[InflatablePie]

BUT, I think sarcasm is a valid scumtell.

Wow, that's completely valid and sane reasoning.

How do I say this... It wasn't so much InflatablePie's preference for scum games -- as I wasn't aware of that -- but more something I picked up that led me and my team to conclude he may be scum in this game.

Ahh. One of your team members knows me? Or am I reading this wrong? DH is right - I do have a slight preference for scum. However, I'm obligated to mention that you are mistaken.

Regardless.

Unvote, Vote: InflatablePie

L-1.

Your move, Equinox.

[InflatablePie]

I'm going to bed. On the offchance I am lynched:

Equinox is town.
Klazam is scum.
LlamaFluff is probscum.
DH is probtown.

[DemonHybrid]

Anyways, you agree with me about Equinox. Wagon up?

What? No, I said I wasn't denying the fact that he

could

be scum.

FoS: LlamaFluff

[Equinox]

I'm wagoning someone I strongly believe to be scum. Am I not allowed to get people to stop pulling unreadable crap like, "Hey, mith is here; let's vote him for lulz!" and be accountable to a wagon? Besides, I was not baiting hammers; if you'll notice, I didn't bait votes after Klazam's. Sorry if I don't like posting threshold warnings.

Edit: ...what the hell? I did not sign up to bash my head in, you dolts.

Unvote, Vote: LlamaFluff

[DemonHybrid]

EBWOP: *she.

The avatar.

[Klazam]

I made that post because i did not see what reason they had. I hit preview, and then i saw a scummy post from IP, so i voted him for that. Completely different reason than Equinox/Thor.

Equinox- I'm not sure how useful team meta information can be because you cannot discount the possibility for a team getting all town or all scum.

--

Why sarcasm is scummy: Sarcasm is a basic psychological mechanism for deflecting attention off oneself. Something pretty useful in mafia, and one i see in IRL mafia all the time.

--- (I'm slow)

PEdit: IP self voting? that is scummy, indeed. I'm starting to like where my vote is.

PEdit 3: GAAH STOP POSTING

[InflatablePie]

I lied. Refreshed after checking Facebook.

If you strongly believe me to be scum, Equi, why switch off now?

PEdit: lol Klazam's trying to push a hammer on me after I call him scum, that's cute.

[Equinox]

Equinox- I'm not sure how useful team meta information can be because you cannot discount the possibility for a team getting all town or all scum.

True. However, things start getting fun when you aggregate all available information and then discuss it with 3 other sets of eyes. That's the sort of thing I was working with.

If you strongly believe me to be scum, Equi, why switch off now?

It's page 3, and we have people who have yet to post. Besides, I'm chasing after a different skirt now; sorry, man.

[LlamaFluff]

I'm wagoning someone I strongly believe to be scum. Am I not allowed to get people to stop pulling unreadable crap like, "Hey, mith is here; let's vote him for lulz!" and be accountable to a wagon? Besides, I was not baiting hammers; if you'll notice, I didn't bait votes after Klazam's. Sorry if I don't like posting threshold warnings.

But you are in a very active game trying to get multiple people to vote someone who you think to be at L-2 by specifically addressing three people?

You are fine trying to shut down a random wagon in the place of a "legitimate" one, but when you refuse to say why its a random wagon instead of just saying that someone is scum because of 'secret reasons', you arent going to get any backing, or at least shouldnt. The fact that you DID get backing makes me think the IP wagon is a great spot to look for scum. The arguement of "IP should be lynched due to alignment prefrence" is weak, and doesnt hold any water too past a RVS stage, and you need to actually bring that information to light, BEFORE you think someone is hammered, to have it qualify.

Why sarcasm is scummy: Sarcasm is a basic psychological mechanism for deflecting attention off oneself. Something pretty useful in mafia, and one i see in IRL mafia all the time.

I never have found this to be the case, usually I see it more of a frustration with a player response.

[InflatablePie]

Not sure if I buy that just yet, Equi.

Unvote, Vote: Klazam

Actually off to bed now.

[DemonHybrid]

I'm wagoning someone I strongly believe to be scum. Am I not allowed to get people to stop pulling unreadable crap like, "Hey, mith is here; let's vote him for lulz!" and be accountable to a wagon? Besides, I was not baiting hammers; if you'll notice, I didn't bait votes after Klazam's. Sorry if I don't like posting threshold warnings.

But you are in a very active game trying to get multiple people to vote someone who you think to be at L-2 by specifically addressing three people?

You are fine trying to shut down a random wagon in the place of a "legitimate" one, but when you refuse to say why its a random wagon instead of just saying that someone is scum because of 'secret reasons', you arent going to get any backing, or at least shouldnt. The fact that you DID get backing makes me think the IP wagon is a great spot to look for scum. The arguement of "IP should be lynched due to alignment prefrence" is weak, and doesnt hold any water too past a RVS stage, and you need to actually bring that information to light, BEFORE you think someone is hammered, to have it qualify.

Why sarcasm is scummy: Sarcasm is a basic psychological mechanism for deflecting attention off oneself. Something pretty useful in mafia, and one i see in IRL mafia all the time.

I never have found this to be the case, usually I see it more of a frustration with a player response.

I noticed you didn't even pretend that "You totally agreed with me on Equinox, now vote her" statement didn't even exist. I expected a response.

Unvote, Vote: LlamaFluff

. Maybe this will convince you.

[DemonHybrid]

EBWOP: Didn't even pretend that it existed. It's late and I worked today bussing tables sooooo

[LlamaFluff]

I noticed you didn't even pretend that "You totally agreed with me on Equinox, now vote her" statement didn't even exist. I expected a response.

Thought it was more of a rhetorical statement.

You saying "Im not denying he could be scum" sounds like "I dont think he is town" which means "He is scum". I like people agreeing with me, even if its just in my head.

[DemonHybrid]

I noticed you didn't even pretend that "You totally agreed with me on Equinox, now vote her" statement didn't even exist. I expected a response.

Thought it was more of a rhetorical statement.

You saying "Im not denying he could be scum" sounds like "I dont think he is town" which means "He is scum". I like people agreeing with me, even if its just in my head.

What kind of excuse is that? I thought my terminology was very clear.

Oh, and a townie would have noticed an FoS and explained him/herself on the get-go instead of needing a vote prompt. I even bolded my FoS, nice and clear, so that you could get the hint.

[Equinox]

LlamaFluff, are you scum? I'm having a very hard time believing you would completely miss something of this magnitude. Fine, me being unable to say anything doesn't help matters any, but you're still on this whole "Equinox was baiting votes" thing when I was getting people to explain why they were ignoring the wagon in favor of voting mith, a wagon so full of lulz that I felt was not going to launch this game anywhere out of RVS.

Accountability was all I wanted, and I selected the people on the mith wagon who I felt were questionable: SocioPath because I wanted to hear from him for :meta: reasons, DemonHybrid because he just sheeped it onto the mith wagon, and Klazam for essentially the same reason as DemonHybrid.

[LlamaFluff]

LlamaFluff, are you scum?

Nope.

I'm having a very hard time believing you would completely miss something of this magnitude.

Dont get me wrong, I love RVS wagons. Best way to get the game moving, but you never gave reasoning for yours yet continued to operate under the illusion that there was some and we are all supposed to shut up and sheep you, which doesnt fly in a game where more information is the best thing that can be accomplished.

The first time it was mentioned past a "hey its a tell" was post 49, after my vote for you. You called a tell, Thor agreeded with the tell, marble did too after a little, yet you all never said what the tell was, so im damn sure going to push on you to get the tell out instead of going "secret random wagon lulz". What was the justification behind not saying it? Also im not going wiki hunting to find reasoning if you are going to say look there. If its not in my meta, it doesnt exist is the rule I play by.

Fine, me being unable to say anything doesn't help matters any, but you're still on this whole "Equinox was baiting votes" thing when I was getting people to explain why they were ignoring the wagon in favor of voting mith, a wagon so full of lulz that I felt was not going to launch this game anywhere out of RVS.

Probably the same reason I was confused is why they were on the mith wagon. There was no PUBLIC justification for the IP wagon, it was just an inside tell or something like that. When there is no public justification, you really cant expect people to be listening to "sheep my RVS wagon over yours". Hmmph... change places! Also IP is still town, that wagon can go away now please.

Unvote
Vote Klazam

Why is self voting scummy? Can you give me a nice concise case on IP?

[Klazam]

Nice and concise?

Sarcasm is a way to deflect attention when youre not sure what the reason why you are being voted are. Scum doesn't like attention.
Self voting is scummy because IT OPENS UP A HUGE CAN OF WIFOM.

Thats it.