Cyclic Experimentation Set x01 - [Game Over]

[Parama]

I already passed the bomb (the VIRUS as it's called, but bomb sounds better). Each player has to pass it to another player withing a set number of posts (which I am NOT revealing, thank you very much).
And of course it kills me. Or whoever has it.

EC, that's the weakest RVS I've ever seen. Congratulations

[AntB]

VOTE: EU3248724 (EtherealCookie) for being the best SK

@curiouskarmadog
Who? First I've known about it...

[WrathChild]

I was thinking something similar to what pops said. Essentially,

today we nominate someone scummy

(separate from the lynch). Tonight,

everyone with an ability that will hurt the town in the long run gives it to our nominee

. The next night, assuming there's at least one vig ability in the game, whoever has that vig ability shoots the nominee. It has to happen the next night after everything is passed because of the action resolution order. Downsides: there are several ways it could get screwed up (target getting passed a bulletproof ability, mafia getting passed a doctor ability, some kind of bus driver moving everything to someone else).

Another thing I was thinking is that we might be able to just massclaim on day two. Mafia won't be able to kill anyone with a useful power role, and it'll give us some insight into what's in play. Oh, and any investigative roles can claim results without risk of their abilities being lost. I think it would also help the town more than the mafia because the mafia can share what roles they've gotten between each other, so they'll already have info about what's in play.

Also, a fullclaim from me is probably inevitable. But we'll see.

Ok, several things:
#1: Hi guys, I'm new here, so forgive me if I don't know the meta or joke-phase protocal, so...
#2: I'll skip right over joke-phase and get down to business. So did Implosion just suggest we give every anti-town role to the person we find scummiest? With the Vig factor in or not, this is a HUGE gamble and bound to be detrimental to the town.
#3: It's gonna take me a bit to wrap my head around all the new names here, so bare with me.

[The Eruci]

---

//Loading Subjects
//....Loaded: 25
//Status: Commence
//Chamber: x679
//Cycle: 1
//Sequence: Day

//EXECUTE --N

---

:: VoteCount 1x0 ::

LynchMePls (2) -

Narsis, muh316

RedCoyote (0) -

MagnaOfIllusion (0) -

themanhimself (0) -

TheLonging (0) -

WrathChild (0) -

curiouskarmadog (0) -

Helghast (1) -

RedCoyote

Powerrox93 (0) -

quadz08 (0) -

chkflip (1) -

themanhimself

Nero Cain (0) -

Narsis (0) -

AntB (1) -

curiouskarmadog

q21 (0) -

diddin (0) -

muh316 (0) -

popsofctown (0) -

danGR (0) -

I Am Innocent (1) -

q21

UnofficialRulerOfEveryone (1) -

quadz08

Parama (1) -

EtherealCookie

Implosion (0) -

EtherealCookie (1) -

AntB

Saint (0) -

Not Voting (16) -

LynchMePls, MagnaOfIllusion, TheLonging, WrathChild, Helghast, Powerrox93, chkflip, Nero Cain, implosion, diddin, popsofctown, danGR, I Am Innocent, UnofficialRulerOfEveryone, Parama, Saint

With 25 Alive, it takes 13 to lynch.

Due to this being the holiday season, I am postponing instating a deadline until after the beginning of January. Please note that many people may be V/LA over the next week.

[popsofctown]

I was thinking something similar to what pops said. Essentially, today we nominate someone scummy (separate from the lynch). Tonight, everyone with an ability that will hurt the town in the long run gives it to our nominee. The next night, assuming there's at least one vig ability in the game, whoever has that vig ability shoots the nominee. It has to happen the next night after everything is passed because of the action resolution order. Downsides: there are several ways it could get screwed up (target getting passed a bulletproof ability, mafia getting passed a doctor ability, some kind of bus driver moving everything to someone else).

Another thing I was thinking is that we might be able to just massclaim on day two. Mafia won't be able to kill anyone with a useful power role, and it'll give us some insight into what's in play. Oh, and any investigative roles can claim results without risk of their abilities being lost. I think it would also help the town more than the mafia because the mafia can share what roles they've gotten between each other, so they'll already have info about what's in play.

Also, a fullclaim from me is probably inevitable. But we'll see.

No, cyclings resolve after nightkills. Our nominee would have to have started the game with any bullet proof abilities. Protown thing to do in that circumstance might be to say so, for the nominee, probs.


Oh, right, it is dangerous to give anti town roles to the person we find scummiest. Maybe we do this for the person we find towniest? And there's always roleblocks.
Please do not reveal your role unless it's best for the town. Please don't get into the "omg funyay normal game IMJESTER ojk but I dont have a trackin ability I pinkyswear MAWFIA IS FUN" mode that I see people do in large games.

>Best Mafia Performance

Bomb him now!

Joking aside, I'm confused with the plan of nominating someone scummy and passing all anti-town abilities to him. The scum will see our discussion, and know who we are passing it to. If they have the ability to do so, they can disrupt our plan of killing the player. Furthermore, if we're passing it to whoever seems the most scummy, and they are actually scum, and manage to survive, then we've given them a bunch of anti-town abilities that they'll be able to use. We could end up severely screwing ourselves over. Why would we want to do something like that?

Vote: Parama

RVS vote.

The mafia's nightkill doesn't give them any ability to screw with this.
Only things they can have are a cyclable busdrive or a cyclable doc protect. And it depends on how that cyclable busdrive works, if the cyclable busdrive busdrives ALL the things that come at that players slot, then the kill would be redirected and the bad powers would be redirected, so some poor soul will drag those powers to the grave with him.
If you want to imagine horrible power roles ruining this plan, imagine good ones too. Tracker figures out who docs or busdrives the target, eh? (he'd have to sort it out from the vig, but it shouldn't be so hard.)

Also, if the mafia screw with this process, we just do it again. Mafia are forced to cycle their abilities away, making it very unlikely that they have a doc or busdrive ability both N1 AND N2.

To quote

The Score

, "This is a very big pay-off for very acceptable risks".

[WrathChild]

PS
What's an RVS vote?

PSS
Oh, I see it was Pops with the suggestion of vigging a townie, which then turned into Implosions suggestion to give all anti-town roles to scum.

FoS: PoPs and Implosion.

[implosion]

RVS = random voting stage. An RVS vote is a vote during the RVS, generally for very weak reasons.

Anyway... part of the reason I like this plan is because my ability won't help mafia

at all

if it's eliminated in this way.

In fact, I'm claiming because there's no reason not to, and it's likely inevitably going to happen at some point today.

I have a treestump ability. For today, I'm voteless and can't be lynched. I'm worried that if this survives to lylo, it could screw everything up if a townie has it. Or if a mafia member has it for that matter. However, mafia having it for one day wouldn't really affect anything.

The more I think about it though, the less merit I think the plan has. Just because we don't know what roles are in play, so there are a lot of possibilities for error, and there are likely some negative roles that mafia could use if eliminated like this. Plus, I'd guess that most abilities in play are positive for the town. Those with such abilities obviously shouldn't claim them until tomorrow - but there are probably things like investigating/protection/vigging that are in play. I think the best thing to do might be to just pay attention to who has abilities like this, and make sure that at some point the abilities get eliminated. It might be a bit trickier with mine since it can't be gotten rid of through lynching.

Discuss.

[popsofctown]

Figuring out how to create advantage within the setup is part of theme games, even normal games somewhat. Where's the spirit? You keep mentioning vague "bad things will happen, for sure, i just don't know what they are or why they will happen", and that's your only argument.

I'm assuming these abilities are forced-use. If not that's why we're not on the same page, but that's the impression I got from Implosion. If it's a forced use ability, it matters very little whether it passes to a scum or a townie. It's still going to screw things over, but its targetting when used by a townie will slightly soften the blow. The possibility of permanently removing a negative force-use ability from the game permanently greatly outweighs the chance it's directed a little more darkly for one night. And that's just if the guy somehow dodges a N1 nightkill and a N2 roleblock. And is scum, none of us are perfect scumhunters.

I only briefly considered the possibility of doing this to a townie, it definitely should be passed to an antitown player, who should subsequently be removed from the game along with those bad abilities.
Aren't you folks trying to win?

And come on now WrathChild, it looks like you're skimming the thread right off the bat.

I

originally had the idea of nominating scummy players and vigging them, Implosion just repeated it to flesh it out.
The concept of vigging a protown player was a direct response to your suggestion that giving the antitown roles to the most antitown player is like giving the Joker a tank. (it isn't though.) It wasn't a response to Implosion, I skipped quoting you.

[popsofctown]

RVS = random voting stage. An RVS vote is a vote during the RVS, generally for very weak reasons.

Anyway... part of the reason I like this plan is because my ability won't help mafia

at all

if it's eliminated in this way.

In fact, I'm claiming because there's no reason not to, and it's likely inevitably going to happen at some point today.

I have a treestump ability. For today, I'm voteless and can't be lynched. I'm worried that if this survives to lylo, it could screw everything up if a townie has it. Or if a mafia member has it for that matter. However, mafia having it for one day wouldn't really affect anything.

The more I think about it though, the less merit I think the plan has. Just because we don't know what roles are in play, so there are a lot of possibilities for error, and there are likely some negative roles that mafia could use if eliminated like this. Plus, I'd guess that most abilities in play are positive for the town. Those with such abilities obviously shouldn't claim them until tomorrow - but there are probably things like investigating/protection/vigging that are in play. I think the best thing to do might be to just pay attention to who has abilities like this, and make sure that at some point the abilities get eliminated. It might be a bit trickier with mine since it can't be gotten rid of through lynching.

Discuss.

Traditionally town has more PRs.

[I Am Innocent]

I'm here, guys. I haven't consulted with Vi, yet, so I'll keep this brief.

Too sane for the Furc I know.

vote Saint

[WrathChild]

What I recommend we do is remove your ability from the game, implosion.

We can suggest that someone in the town is a 'good target' and hope a vig or somesuch kills him.

You cycle the town-destroying ability to that same antitown 'good target'. Unless an antitown faction has control of a protection ability for tonight, that guy has a pretty good chance of dying the same night you kill him, so your bad-for-town ability goes away night 1 instead of bouncing from player to player and causing us harm.

I see a fullclaim of your ability as an antitown thing, scum know more about the setup and will be able to manipulate the ability's mechanics more easily than we can .

Highlighted section is where you suggest vigging a townie that I referred to.

[WrathChild]

EBWOP: I think Pops may have missed my PS and PSS post as well.

[Nero Cain]

We should so lynch UnofficialRulerOfEveryone.

vote:UnofficialRulerOfEveryone

[TheLonging]

>Best Mafia Performance

Bomb him now!

Joking aside, I'm confused with the plan of nominating someone scummy and passing all anti-town abilities to him. The scum will see our discussion, and know who we are passing it to. If they have the ability to do so, they can disrupt our plan of killing the player. Furthermore, if we're passing it to whoever seems the most scummy, and they are actually scum, and manage to survive, then we've given them a bunch of anti-town abilities that they'll be able to use. We could end up severely screwing ourselves over. Why would we want to do something like that?

Vote: Parama

RVS vote.

I actually agree with this, although your RVS vote sucks.


Also whoever claimed tree stump: why?

[WrathChild]

We should so lynch UnofficialRulerOfEveryone.

vote:UnofficialRulerOfEveryone

Shark Bandwagon!

VOTE: Unofficial Ruler of Everyone

(RVS, new terminology GO-GO-GO!)

[implosion]

Also whoever claimed tree stump: why?

Why not? Look at my first post. Then look at the vote count. Notice a lack of my vote being there. If I didn't claim, at some point someone would have noticed this and said "implosion, are you voteless?" As it would be dishonest and misleading to simply say yes without mentioning the unlynchability aspect of my role, I just claimed now. Also, knowing what it is helps us get rid of it.

I mean, an unlynchable townie is a good thing... but voteless

and

unlynchable is just a burden. And if mafia get it in a crucial situation, it's game over.

[popsofctown]

What I recommend we do is remove your ability from the game, implosion.

We can suggest that someone in the town is a 'good target' and hope a vig or somesuch kills him.

You cycle the town-destroying ability to that same antitown 'good target'. Unless an antitown faction has control of a protection ability for tonight, that guy has a pretty good chance of dying the same night you kill him, so your bad-for-town ability goes away night 1 instead of bouncing from player to player and causing us harm.

I see a fullclaim of your ability as an antitown thing, scum know more about the setup and will be able to manipulate the ability's mechanics more easily than we can .

Highlighted section is where you suggest vigging a townie that I referred to.

that's vigging a player, not vigging a townie

[popsofctown]

anyway, there's the antitown role isn't nearly as bad as i thought it was.

The cycling mechanic alleviates most of the pain in an endgame situation. You cycle treestump to the guy you dont feel like lynching. He'll be unlynchable. Oh, unlynchable doesn't matter because you refuse to vote for him and it's hard to get votes in endgames. You guys go lynch scum if it's anything but LyLo.

[popsofctown]

Vote: implosion

. No harm in confirming this.

[WrathChild]

What I recommend we do is remove your ability from the game, implosion.

We can suggest that someone in the town is a 'good target' and hope a vig or somesuch kills him.

You cycle the town-destroying ability to that same antitown 'good target'. Unless an antitown faction has control of a protection ability for tonight, that guy has a pretty good chance of dying the same night you kill him, so your bad-for-town ability goes away night 1 instead of bouncing from player to player and causing us harm.

I see a fullclaim of your ability as an antitown thing, scum know more about the setup and will be able to manipulate the ability's mechanics more easily than we can .

Highlighted section is where you suggest vigging a townie that I referred to.

that's vigging a player, not vigging a townie

"Someone in the Town" is not "Player"

[curiouskarmadog]

oh fucking sweet...i think i know how to beat the system and catch scum quickly.


but before I get into it...Para, your "potato"...how long does the person get to hold before it kills them...AND can it be passed multiple times in a day?

if you know where I am going with this (please dont comment yet).

[muh316]

somebody just gave me the hot potato.......

[implosion]

@pops, I'm not sure what you're trying to "confirm..." if the majority of votes are on me, it proceeds to night as if there was no lynch.

Also, at lylo, the most worrying thing isn't a possible unlynchable mafia (because you could pass it to a townie) - it's the fact that a townie could be voteless. So lets consider a hypothetical 5-way lylo, with 2 mafia in the same faction and 3 townies. If a mafia member has the treestump, then the town has to lynch the other mafia or they lose. If a townie has the treestump then (assuming there are no vig/doc/etc abilities left) the town will only control 2/4 votes and will lose. At 3-way lylo, it wouldn't even matter who had it. If it's a townie, the mafia's vote makes it impossible to gain a majority. If it's the mafia, then well the mafia is unlynchable.

[popsofctown]

Is that the way unlynchable mechanics are normally handled? It sounds rather convenient.


Im aware that it ruins LyLo implosion, but this is a large game, and the ability has little drawback UNTIL LyLo. Im not sure if the ability is bad enough to try to remove it from the game, there are some risks involved.


@muh: Look on the back of the potato, it says "come play mafia with me". Make some real posts.

[muh316]

I'm actually serious. Somebody just gave me a bomb. My definition of a real post means that I write something and press the submit button which I am clearly doing.