Mini 934 - Troubles at Smiths&Catharts (Game Over!)

[Thor665]

TBH, I'm waiting for the Ythan furor to die down and for someone to start looking scummy. And I won't vote for someone who has neither confirmed nor posted.

Why did you random vote then? Do you feel putting out a random vote helps find scummy behavior?

If yes, why not put out a second vote?
If no, why put out the first vote?

[Pomegranate]

I added numbers for clarity.

1.

Claim?

2.

OMGUS?

3.

Ythan voted me?

4.

When did I claim?

5.

I never said "hey I'm town."

6.

I said it prevents town from finding scum, resulting in a loss.

1. Actually I said 'claiming' it's in the Oxford English and has meanings outside of the game of Mafia.

2. Perhaps a slight misuse of the term, I'll concede - I meant it to showcase your vote for him because he had annoyed you; i.e. a personal attack reasoning which alluded to OMGUS in my mind.

3. No, he did not. Please refer to #2.

4. Oxford English dictionary.

5. ...while you're at it, look up redundancy and repetition (besides, I'm pretty sure all of us are implying we're town - are you not?).

6. Ythan's actions might do that very thing (though I personally disagree). However no part of my vote had any bearing on how much I believe his actions do or do not affect town. I do believe your vote was done from a sense of personal annoyance and with an intention of setting up some vague policy that you were voting for Ythan because he spams the thread.

So, to my mind, either your vote is illogical and not worth supporting, or you are scum hoping to ride the wave of annoyance and a policy vote to a mislynch. I'm currently betting that the latter is more likely the truth and am voting with that concept in mind.

I like Thor's posting a lot. Although it didn't really seem like OMGUS to me, but annoyance at the way Ythan plays, which ties in to the policy lynch part. (I agree with you on that one.)

But I think it makes sense to keep in the back of the mind that Scrambles is only 13. (The weird thing about me saying that is that I'm 14, and joined the site when I was 13. But I know that it took me a while to figure things out sometimes, and to adjust to MS, even though I'd played Face to Face mafia before. But that's enough about me.)

FoS: ScramblesTheDeathDealer

.

[Thor665]

But I think it makes sense to keep in the back of the mind that Scrambles is only 13. (The weird thing about me saying that is that I'm 14

Is it a bad time to mention that I support policy lynches on all players under the age of eighteen?

What specifically about Scrambles' play is making you FOS him?

[Inquisitor JL]

While Ythan himself might not post much content - being annoying and such has a very useful side effect of getting reactions. Being annoyed is okay, and there are possible arguments that in the long run it's anti town.

What I don't like about Scrambles is complaining that it gets us all focused on one person, when, if he feels that way he could try to post something about someone else instead. If you don't feel that the discussion is going in a beneficial direction it is your duty to try and get it to what you think would benefit the town, and the same goes to anyone else complaining about him being distracting by being annoying (Cheshire comes to mind).

FoS: Scrambles

@Rayfrost - since when does 'active nonlurking' i.e. posting and 'breaking my mind' sound like serious reasons for a vote?

@Nobody Special - if you don't think Ythan cares about what people think of what he does, then we aren't gonna change it. Depending on how you see it it's either an imparement to deal with or a boon in disguise. Maybe a more thorough explanation of why you find the way he is posting (I believe the example you used was a case of him quoting me with no addition to it) could cause problems?

@ Ythan - like the avatar, it suits you

[ScramblesTheDeathDealer]

But I think it makes sense to keep in the back of the mind that Scrambles is only 13. (The weird thing about me saying that is that I'm 14

Is it a bad time to mention that I support policy lynches on all players under the age of eighteen?

Lol. Don't make me eat you.

And Pom, don't "keep it in the back of your mind," treat me as anyone else. And Inquisitor, Ythan was the only one who stuck out to me, especially this early in D1.

[RayFrost]

@Rayfrost - since when does 'active nonlurking' i.e. posting and 'breaking my mind' sound like serious reasons for a vote?

When I'm exhausted, mentally burnt out, and unable to think straight.

I lost three games of go in a row (IIRC) on the same day I posted that, so yeah x.x Bad brain day.

Anyway, thor supporting policy lynches of those below the age of 18 is evil.

Cuz I'm 15. :/

Also, thor, personal attacks as a method of argument is ad hom, not OMGUS.

Anyway, I am not of the mind to believe that scrambles is scum, yet.

His vote was bad, but it doesn't seem all that scummy to me.

[Nobody Special]

TBH, I'm waiting for the Ythan furor to die down and for someone to start looking scummy. And I won't vote for someone who has neither confirmed nor posted.

Why did you random vote then? Do you feel putting out a random vote helps find scummy behavior?

If yes, why not put out a second vote?
If no, why put out the first vote?

I participate (begrudgingly) in the RVS because it's expected. I despise it, personally; I'd rather go with RQS (but I'm too lazy to start). Therefore, my answer to your question is neither yes nor no.

@Nobody Special - if you don't think Ythan cares about what people think of what he does, then we aren't gonna change it. Depending on how you see it it's either an imparement to deal with or a boon in disguise. Maybe a more thorough explanation of why you find the way he is posting (I believe the example you used was a case of him quoting me with no addition to it) could cause problems?

I tend to spar with him a bit, then just try to walk away. He makes it supremely difficult to get a meta read on him, though.
And I really do NOT want him to explain more about his posting style, or really, anything about himself. I'd rather we play the game.

Cuz I'm 15. :/

This explains

so much.

[RayFrost]

Cuz I'm 15. :/

This explains

so much.

Such as how I'm

so much

smarter than you, I know. Child geniuses are more common these days than in your time.

[Col.Cathart]

Votecount 1.2

With 12 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

If you'll encounter any kind if mistake in my vote count - please point it out.

Ythan (2):

Copper, ScramblesTheDeathDealer

ScramblesTheDeathDealer (2):

TheCheshireCat, Thor665
RayFrost (1): Sotty7
SFG (1): Pomegranate
Sotty7 (1): Ythan
TheCheshireCat (1): Inquisitor JL
Cyberbob (1): SFG

not voting: RayFrost, Cyberbob

current deadline is:

Thursday, 18.03.2010 at 00:30 AM GMT +1 (Wednesday, 17.03.2010 at 11:30 PM GMT, 6:30 PM EST, 3:30 PST).

Looking for a replacement for Cyberbob.

[RayFrost]

Mod: Do typos count as mistakes?

[Col.Cathart]

Mod: Do typos count as mistakes?

SHUT UP! I'm a bit drunk... And no, they do not, unless they're changing something gameplay important (like mistake in the vote count).

If you want to be a grammar Nazi and laugh at non-native speaker, do so via PM.

[Thor665]

Also, thor, personal attacks as a method of argument is ad hom, not OMGUS.

Personal attacks != ad hominem and what Scrambles did was not ad hominem nor do I intend to imply as such. If anything I think he is using a non-cause for cause fallacy, but I'm not sure I'd even go so far as to claim he's using a fallacy at all.

He did state that Ythan had 'annoyed' him and that therein lay part of the reason for his vote. I have issue with that.

[RayFrost]

Then it's him using reasoning that doesn't promote scumhunting or actually find the person scummy but, rather, for non-role/alignment related issues that shouldn't impact scumhunting.

[Pomegranate]

Is it a bad time to mention that I support policy lynches on all players under the age of eighteen?

What specifically about Scrambles' play is making you FOS him?

It seems you have quite a few policy lynches to engineer. Good luck.

The way that all he talked about was how he found Ythan annoying, and voted him for it, which is a stupid reason unless it's page one. Which is still stupid, if it'a actually serious.

And Pom, don't "keep it in the back of your mind," treat me as anyone else. And Inquisitor, Ythan was the only one who stuck out to me, especially this early in D1.

I'll try not to, but I might factor it in to my reads unintentionally. But chill, I'm only a few months older than you, and people do it to me also.

Mod: Do typos count as mistakes?

SHUT UP! I'm a bit drunk... And no, they do not, unless they're changing something gameplay important (like mistake in the vote count).

If you want to be a grammar Nazi and laugh at non-native speaker, do so via PM.

Where's Cyberbob...

[Thor665]

Then it's him using reasoning that doesn't promote scumhunting or actually find the person scummy but, rather, for non-role/alignment related issues that shouldn't impact scumhunting.

I'm having difficulty understanding what you're saying here so I'm going to restate it to what I think you're saying and respond to it as such. If I'm wrong please correct me.

I believe you are saying;
"Scrambles used reasoning that doesn't help scumhunting, but did so in a manner that doesn't suggest what role/alignment he may have."

To which I would reply; Perhaps.

I am personally going with the possibility he actually didn't really feel annoyance and simply claimed as such and then voted Ythan while trying to paint it as a policy lynch. He did so in an attempt to hopefully generate a bit of steam from other players (Nobody Special, Copper) who had already expressed reservations about Ythan's playstyle. In short - he was trying to get a populist wagon rolling that would be easy to stay distanced from if it turned up a mislynch.

[RayFrost]

More accurate interpretation of what I said...

'Scrambles used reasoning that is unrelated to actual scumhunting and is using it to support a lynch rather than using actual reasoning to show that ythan is scum (note that annoying != scum), which makes his vote piggy backing with popular opinions while not giving any solid support - throwing shit into the fire, so to speak'

but yeah.

[Ythan]

While Ythan himself might not post much content

Beg to differ.

@ Ythan - like the avatar, it suits you

Thanks, I was thinking the same thing.

Cuz I'm 15. :/

What.

And guys, it's only ad hom if you attempt to discredit a case by attacking the person. Attacking a person for no reason other than to attack them is ad hom. Attacking someone by attacking their case is not ad hom.

[Pomegranate]

Wait, Ythan's 20?

[RayFrost]

I always thought ythan was about 24.

[Ythan]

I turned 20 on Sunday. And Ray I was sure you were older than 15.

[RayFrost]

I turn 16 this year, if it makes you feel any better.

[ScramblesTheDeathDealer]

He suggested he went to an online (correct?) college, so 20 seems about right.

[RayFrost]

He suggested he went to an online (correct?) college, so 20 seems about right.

well, I am going to an online college, sooo... (senior year, too)

[ScramblesTheDeathDealer]

^@Ythan

[ScramblesTheDeathDealer]

Damn. Ninja'd.