Open 671: Greater Idea - OVER

[-Grey-]

843 is the TL; DR of my case.

I see your case, but reading bang's iso with no preset alignment and making no assumptions about

correctness

, it looks reasonably towny to me.
I'm willing to go back to the "red flags" in context to see if a scum motivation is more apparent in that light.

Dude, he straight up admitted playing to his scum playstyle, lol.

[bangthemafia]

I think scum's agenda is this.
Push for a lynch on grey on the pretext of it being favourable for town. Get him converted to town. Kill him at nighy. Push for a mislynch on spade the next day. This should be easier the next day with grey dead.

What are you saying, mate? Right now Grey is a scum. For scum, pushing for his lynch and then killing him is like wasting 2 possible opportunities of taking down townies. Instead preventing his lynch (what you are doing now, keeps their numbers high and also gives them chance to take down 2 townies. My guess is scum will keep Grey from getting lynched for as long as possible. When they cant prevent it, they will kill him next night OR when the numbers are about to reach equivalent of LyLo next day, they will kill him previous night.

@bang if you can clearly explain how exactly a grey lynch is beneficial for town, am willing to support it.

As above Plus-
From night 1 result, I feel there is only 1 killing faction or max 2 if a kill failed or a faction has only one or no kill. We dont know the number of scum. They know. So its better to convert Grey as early as possible. Who knows when town number will come down to their numbers?

Else i think it is best one of us gets lynched today. Thw flips would help town.

I am almost certain you are anti town the way you are preventing Grey lynch, trying to build my wagon even when i m V/LA.

Pedit: Grey, i m still thinking you are a blinded self complacent townie happy with your shitty reads on me. Dont push me to thinking you r not.

[-Grey-]

Dont push me to thinking you r not.

You were doing SO WELL with your post until the little threat at the end.

I don't respond well to threats.

[bangthemafia]

You still haven't addressed my case.

For that you need to be considerate and sensitive enough to realize i m still in V/LA. But forget it. Whats your case? The #841? Will try to respond to it tomorrow. But just mark my words. Be prepared to eat your words and the inflated ego oozing from your signature with it once I flip. For someone who knows this game better than me, you are just not ready to see the point.

And by the way scum defended me, I feel he is a townie too.

I don't even know wtf you're saying here.

It was a typo. I meant-
And by the way NM defended me, I feel he is a townie too. Same is true for daves now and alban.

Still I have to find time in next 2-3 days to ISO each one and decide whom I am gonna vote.

My plan is- scummiest player > Grey > Spade. Only problem is right now Spade is scummiest for me!

@ Mod,

1. Does saulus get converted to townie even on a night kill? Or is it only lynch?

2. Is it compsory to play by one's CURRENT wincon? If yes, hows Grey offering him for a lynch?

Guys, if mod's response to Q 2 is "its recommended but not compulsory" (I expect this answer else how is he allowing a saulus with scum wincon to offer himself for town conversion), I have a plan. If others also find Spade suspicious, why cant someone of us who has a night action (I dont have any, else I would hav definitely done this) target Spade. If they turn cult, they can reveal this to town since they were originally townie, i assume their loyalty will be with town. If nothing happens to them, we know Spade is a fakeclaiming scum. What do you guys say, please opine.

[bangthemafia]

EBWOP-

You still haven't addressed my case.

For that you need to be considerate and sensitive enough to realize i m still in V/LA. But forget it. Whats your case? The #841? Will try to respond to it tomorrow. But just mark my words. Be prepared to eat your words and the inflated ego oozing from your signature with it once I flip. For someone who knows this game better than me, you are just not ready to see the point.

And by the way scum defended me, I feel he is a townie too.

I don't even know wtf you're saying here.

It was a typo. I meant-
And by the way NM defended me, I feel he is a townie too. Same is true for daves now and alban.

Still I have to find time in next 2-3 days to ISO each one and decide whom I am gonna vote.

My plan is- scummiest player > Grey > Spade. Only problem is right now Spade is scummiest for me!

@ Mod,

1. Does saulus get converted to townie even on a night kill? Or is it only lynch?

2. Is it compsory to play by one's CURRENT wincon? If yes, hows Grey offering him for a lynch?

Guys, if mod's response to Q 2 is "its recommended but not compulsory" (I expect this answer else how is he allowing a saulus with scum wincon to offer himself for town conversion), I have a plan. If others also find Spade suspicious, why cant someone of us who has a night action (I dont have any, else I would hav definitely done this) target Spade. If they turn cult, they can reveal this to town since they were originally townie, i assume their loyalty will be with town. If nothing happens to them, we know Spade is a fakeclaiming scum. What do you guys say, please opine.

[bangthemafia]

Dont push me to thinking you r not.

You were doing SO WELL with your post until the little threat at the end.

I don't respond well to threats.

This is why you harm town. Come out of ur attitude and tell the town if u agree with me on something just the way you took pains to create that loong post to make a case on me.

[-Grey-]

For that you need to be considerate and sensitive enough to realize i m still in V/LA.

I'm good with waiting as long as I know it's coming bro.

You were posting, so I mentioned it.

[-Grey-]

Dont push me to thinking you r not.

You were doing SO WELL with your post until the little threat at the end.

I don't respond well to threats.

This is why you harm town. Come out of ur attitude and tell the town if u agree with me on something just the way you took pains to create that loong post to make a case on me.

You don't get to claim the moral high ground after threatening me.

[bangthemafia]

Sorry about the signature part. Either you changed yours or it was someone else's.

[bangthemafia]

Dont push me to thinking you r not.

You were doing SO WELL with your post until the little threat at the end.

I don't respond well to threats.

This is why you harm town. Come out of ur attitude and tell the town if u agree with me on something just the way you took pains to create that loong post to make a case on me.

You don't get to claim the moral high ground after threatening me.

Not claiming anything. Just tell your thoughts on my post.

[-Grey-]

Sorry about the signature part. Either you changed yours or it was someone else's.

Yeah like... a week ago.

[Spade_Ace]

Any and all PT's will be open throughout the course of day.

[Spade_Ace]

Let's check out the worst case scenario for town.

4 town vs 5 scum: what does this imply. There are two scum factions in the game. Again the worst possible case for town is one faction having a large majority and both factions having a nightkill.

Lets's suppose Scum A has 4 members and Scum B has just 1 and Grey belongs to A.

1) We lynch grey. Grey gets converted to town.
Night starts as 5v3v1 now. Suppose both factions use their kill on town. Next day starts as 3v3v1. Day3 could be a potential LYLO.

2) We do not lynch Grey. We mislynch. Night starts with 3v4v1. Suppose both factions use their kill on town. 1v4v1 and game is over.

@Bang you are right. It is best to lynch Grey. At least town is still in the game.
UNVOTE:

@MOD What happens to the Saulus when the rest of the mafia are dead? Does he inherit the ability to nighkill?

[Aristodog]

VC 2.4

Spade_Ace

(3): BangTheMafia 559, Alban 626, Not_Mafia 888

BangTheMafia

(2): Gamma Emerald 594, -Grey- 839

-Grey-

(1): Vaxkiller 833

Not Voting

(3): Kop, Davesaz 669, Spade_Ace 937

With 9 Alive, it takes 5 to lynch

The day will end on February 14th, 2017 at 3 AM EST. (V-Day ♥)
(expired on 2017-02-14 02:00:00)

Mod Notes:

BangTheMafia is V/LA until Monday
Gamma Emerald is V/LA until Monday
Vaxkiller is being prodded

@Mod, please explicitly clarify-If there were a black goo, what was their role PM? Do they convert everyone targetting them or only town PRs? This is what wiki page on Goo says- Black Goo: Whenever a player targets you with an action, they will join your cult as another black goo regardless of their original team.

1. If a

kill

is attempted on a Black Goo,

the killer will not change alignment

. If

any other action

is performed, the

player's alignment will change

and they will lose access to their Factional PTs should they have any.

@ Mod,

1. Does saulus get converted to townie even on a night kill? Or is it only lynch?

2. Is it compsory to play by one's CURRENT wincon? If yes, hows Grey offering him for a lynch?

1. If a Saulus is killed by either means, they are converted.

2. It is always proper to play towards one's wincon. Sometimes one's wincon is fluid, and it is thus up to said player to play towards what they deem to be their wincon.

@MOD What happens to the Saulus when the rest of the mafia are dead? Does he inherit the ability to nighkill?

No, they would not gain a factional kill.

[alban]

We are stalling. Take a decision and stick to it. I think everyone needs to present their list. Either make compromises, or go for no lynch. Waiting another week for some miracle to happen is a passive strategy. Not comfy with that.

My reads right now are (claims not withstanding coz they all seem fake):

Town
Vax (come back to the game)

Null
-

Scum/other faction lean
Not Mafia (opportunistic, deliberate absence, prodging),
Bang (too defensive, less contribution),
Grey (more interested in the lynch than the reasons for lynching),
Dave (Spade's wagon, pops up whenever mentioned, more interested in status quo than moving the game fwd),
Gamma (fake claim, discarded card),
Kop (deliberate absence, more interested in status quo than moving the game fwd)

Scum/Other factions
Spade (opportunistic, buddying and sheeping, interrogating others, divulging less, too defensive, less contribution even with so many posts, behavioural change from earlier games).

[-Grey-]

Cool your jets, alban.

I for one am waiting on bang's response to my case. You know, since I'm not interested in the reason for the lynch and all.

[alban]

ok

[Spade_Ace]

Alban stop.with the tunnelling. Am not scum/ 3rd party. Also looking at the worst case scenarios, lynching grey is the best play for town.

[-Grey-]

ok

Listen here you cheeky shit, I've done a hell of a lot more to lynch scum than you have, so you can lose the 'tude.

[alban]

Not laughing at you. It's just funny that I unintentionally annoyed you and you are swearing at me for that

[Spade_Ace]

Any and all PT's will be open throughout the course of day.

Btw do keep in mind that scum have daychat.

[-Grey-]

Any and all PT's will be open throughout the course of day.

Btw do keep in mind that scum have daychat.

Okay.

What does that tell us?

[Spade_Ace]

Maybe not to trust associatives too much.

In situations like lylo, scum can coordinate a mass lynch.

[Spade_Ace]

Btw didn't like Kop's catchups. He had been just reiterating what has been already said.

Dave, kop, and nm really need to contribute more.

[-Grey-]

Maybe not to trust associatives too much.

In situations like lylo, scum can coordinate a mass lynch.

1) Day chat suggests there will be less associatives because they don't need to crosstalk in game thread.

2) We're not likely to know when it's LyLo until it's too late anyway so we should treat everyday like LyLo.