Open 143: Jungle Republic (Game Over!) before 787

[hewitt]

I agree that dej went waaay over the line and deserved the modkill. I am not arguing that at all.

The fact is now we won't know for sure if the mod would have killed him without you calling for him to be mod killed. It also robs the town of actually lynching dej which takes away a lot of information. You had your vote on him, I know that I was willing to change to him after how out of hand he got, I'm sure several others would have as well.

I'm nooot quite sure what you're getting at here but I would still do it again in a heartbeat.

Vote Count

Empking 3 - Hewitt, Khamisa, Thesp
Sotty7 1 - AA23
AA23 1 - Empking

Empking is -1

[AA23]

Just got back from the cottage (tres burned.) - I'm relieved a lynch hasn't gone through but am not impressed that there's an L-1 with weak suspicions and les discussion.

In my quickread, some things jumped at me from more than one person.

People think Emp is wolf (seeing as the only case on hims is reliant on the Dej relationship).

While this, in my opinion, is a weaker case than suspicions on Mix(Sotty) - - I'm curious as to why:

1. Khamisa - - you've suggested I'm scum with Emp.

Make up your mind - Emp's lynch is 100% based on the mere idea that he can possibly be the wolf partner (all being baed on Dej)- - otherwise there is no case on him - - what evidence is there that he is mafia scum? That I am? That we are together?

I find that suspicious of you - - it reads that you're hungry for a lynch instead of the RIGHT lynch - the one that will help town. Are you in a rush, Khamisa?

*Note: Dej was going to be taken care of with or without the request on the board. Don't let yourselves think I hadn't sent out PM's to have actions taken in response to what he did*
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thesp states that he believes I'm town.

While I trust other people share the sentiment or accept the idea to an extent, it also makes me stress my point: I'm not being malicious saying Mix(Sotty) has to go.

The Mix case was valid and based on ACTIONS taken - - this is a person who DID something scummy (that everyone at one time has acknowledged) and not only dug themselves a hole, but abandoned the game all together.

I don't believe Sotty would have ever voted Dej and I believe that Dej (who acknowledged the validity of my case) was never going to vote Sotty.

Emp is guilty of being fragmented in text and useless to the town at best - - but I see NO evidence of him truly being wolf - - - this is entirely speculation and I've seen nobody present actually quote worthy evidence.

There is no quote worthy evidence - - Anything to be pulled up is 100% speculation on Dej's state of mind.

What Mafia will now rely on is Emp digging a hole.

There is suspicion on Emp (no case, no evidence, just suspicion, speculation, and variables) and these things are in no way good enough to lynch somone, let alone outweigh the Mix(Sotty) case - - - -

In light of this, The Mafia, unable to rely on such weak reasoning behind the wagon, must rely on Emp being incapable of defending himself.

It's a catch 22 - - How can one defend themselves against nothing but opinions and speculation? How can he defend zero evidence?

The villains will take advantage of his short and distant play - - so they can have the mislynch that puts the odds in their favor.
----------------------------------------------------
You know from my repetition that there is more than enough quotable evidence on Mix, you know how he left this game, you know how poorly he handled the debrief on his scummy hammer, you know everyone in this game has at one time or another agreed with the validity of the suspicions and the scummy nature of his actions - and you know that we never saw any true hunting/interactions between Mix and Dej (yet they both shared interests in the same people at the same time and always left eachother out of pairing speculations)

The Mix(Sotty) case is stronger.

And as I have expressed in detail what the Emp case really is - - either prove me wrong with your evidence, or rethink what you're doing to the town.

Mix(Sotty) - - stronger, more valid case.
Emp - - weak, speculations based on unqualified opinions on Dej's state of mind, no quoted evidence, no questions directed to the non-existent evidence, just a bunch of people taking advantage of Emp's playstyle by making him seem like scum while he is incapable of defending himself (against nothing!).

This isn't complicated - This is accurate - - and I believe that in what will be a very long process to have the lynch moved to Sotty, the scum will reveal themselves.

(not to say I'm not on to you guys alread )

** I'd like to see the Emp case with included evidence that is quote based and not based on speculation - - - and heck, lets see it from everyone.

After all - - you just pust someone at L-1.

Surely, caring about the town at this crucial and important voting time, you all have a case.....right?

[Thesp]

Just got back from the cottage (tres burned.) - I'm relieved a lynch hasn't gone through but am not impressed that there's an L-1 with weak suspicions and les discussion.

In my quickread, some things jumped at me from more than one person.

People think Emp is wolf (seeing as the only case on hims is reliant on the Dej relationship).

While this, in my opinion, is a weaker case than suspicions on Mix(Sotty) - - I'm curious as to why:

1. Khamisa - - you've suggested I'm scum with Emp.

Make up your mind - Emp's lynch is 100% based on the mere idea that he can possibly be the wolf partner (all being baed on Dej)- - otherwise there is no case on him - - what evidence is there that he is mafia scum? That I am? That we are together?

I find that suspicious of you - - it reads that you're hungry for a lynch instead of the RIGHT lynch - the one that will help town. Are you in a rush, Khamisa?

*Note: Dej was going to be taken care of with or without the request on the board. Don't let yourselves think I hadn't sent out PM's to have actions taken in response to what he did*
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thesp states that he believes I'm town.

While I trust other people share the sentiment or accept the idea to an extent, it also makes me stress my point: I'm not being malicious saying Mix(Sotty) has to go.

The Mix case was valid and based on ACTIONS taken - - this is a person who DID something scummy (that everyone at one time has acknowledged) and not only dug themselves a hole, but abandoned the game all together.

I don't believe Sotty would have ever voted Dej and I believe that Dej (who acknowledged the validity of my case) was never going to vote Sotty.

Emp is guilty of being fragmented in text and useless to the town at best - - but I see NO evidence of him truly being wolf - - - this is entirely speculation and I've seen nobody present actually quote worthy evidence.

There is no quote worthy evidence - - Anything to be pulled up is 100% speculation on Dej's state of mind.

What Mafia will now rely on is Emp digging a hole.

There is suspicion on Emp (no case, no evidence, just suspicion, speculation, and variables) and these things are in no way good enough to lynch somone, let alone outweigh the Mix(Sotty) case - - - -

In light of this, The Mafia, unable to rely on such weak reasoning behind the wagon, must rely on Emp being incapable of defending himself.

It's a catch 22 - - How can one defend themselves against nothing but opinions and speculation? How can he defend zero evidence?

The villains will take advantage of his short and distant play - - so they can have the mislynch that puts the odds in their favor.
----------------------------------------------------
You know from my repetition that there is more than enough quotable evidence on Mix, you know how he left this game, you know how poorly he handled the debrief on his scummy hammer, you know everyone in this game has at one time or another agreed with the validity of the suspicions and the scummy nature of his actions - and you know that we never saw any true hunting/interactions between Mix and Dej (yet they both shared interests in the same people at the same time and always left eachother out of pairing speculations)

The Mix(Sotty) case is stronger.

And as I have expressed in detail what the Emp case really is - - either prove me wrong with your evidence, or rethink what you're doing to the town.

Mix(Sotty) - - stronger, more valid case.
Emp - - weak, speculations based on unqualified opinions on Dej's state of mind, no quoted evidence, no questions directed to the non-existent evidence, just a bunch of people taking advantage of Emp's playstyle by making him seem like scum while he is incapable of defending himself (against nothing!).

This isn't complicated - This is accurate - - and I believe that in what will be a very long process to have the lynch moved to Sotty, the scum will reveal themselves.

(not to say I'm not on to you guys alread )

** I'd like to see the Emp case with included evidence that is quote based and not based on speculation - - - and heck, lets see it from everyone.

After all - - you just pust someone at L-1.

Surely, caring about the town at this crucial and important voting time, you all have a case.....right?

I respectfully disagree.

[hewitt]

Honestly I don't have hard evidence on why Empking is a wolf. However, I believe the way dejkha acted towards Empking was shockingly out of character and implies a scum connection. I thought this before dejkha was modkilled and I'm reinforced by that with the knowledge that dejkha was a wolf. The weak pursuit against Empking and quick abandonment by dejkha showed to me scum who is attempting to not make ties with his scum partner but it was so out of character with how he normally reacts to Empking that I can't ignore it. I agree, AA23, that the Sotty case is strong and compelling. But I'm much more convinced that Empking is scum than Sotty at the moment.

[Empking]

Honestly I don't have hard evidence on why Empking is a wolf. However, I believe the way dejkha acted towards Empking was shockingly out of character and implies a scum connection. I thought this before dejkha was modkilled and I'm reinforced by that with the knowledge that dejkha was a wolf. The weak pursuit against Empking and quick abandonment by dejkha showed to me scum who is attempting to not make ties with his scum partner but it was so out of character with how he normally reacts to Empking that I can't ignore it. I agree, AA23, that the Sotty case is strong and compelling. But I'm much more convinced that Empking is scum than Sotty at the moment.

Dej only gets me lynched if you or AA are dupporting him. That's not the case here.. So its not out of chatracter. Its in character.

[AA23]

@ Thesp - - no worries, but I would still like to see the evidence I asked for just so I can better understand where you're coming from and be fair**

@ Hewitt - - You agreed to all the points I hoped many would, it sounds like you're only held back by "Dej/Emp relationship"

You'll notice in a re-read that I dropped that topic when Percy proved it wrong - - Dej had indeed been more than characteristic with Emp - - he only later had little time to address Emp or ANYONE for that matter because he was solely focused on the bickering with me - - - which would make sense, I was not only wagoning against Mix(Sotty) who he never once voted, suspected, admitted did something scummy yet continued to ignore, yet seemed to share the same mindset when scum hunting - - - but lost his cool even futher when I went to connecting him to his partner and having them both in my sights.

If anything, he was being characteristic Dej with Emp, and uncharacteristically aggressive and ignorant when confronted/or suspected of.

-------------------------------------

We're in an important voting stage - we can't afford to prefer thin, evident-less, opinionated cases over admittedly stronger ones.

Mix(Sotty) has to go.

[Thesp]

AA23, which do you think is more likely for scum to do: (A) Aggressively oppose the lynch of their partner; or (B) Ignore pressure on their partner, hope it goes away, and steer it elsewhere?

AA23, did you answer this in your wall of text? I missed it.

[AA23]

Every circumstance is different, and in the matter of Dej's potential partner, I believe there was more of a variation to A - - -

It's not a matter of what scum would do, it's a matter of what people have done. These aren't machines, and Dej as a person got too emotionally unsettled, negatively invested, and agressive - - especially with suspicion on him and even more so when connected to Mix(Sotty).
-----------

Thesp, did you manufacture that case on Emp yet or did I miss it in your "sit back and hope Emp digs a hole by saying something weird" tactic?

I'd like to better understand your position - perhaps our difference of opinions can be easily balanced when we look at the two cases side by side. The Mix/Sotty one has been exhausted with my repetition and we are all familiar with it, I'd like to hold it next to the Emp evidence.

And I once again state - that evidence is hopefully quotable actions and not soley based on opinions and unqualified interpretations in an attempt to fit the man to the theory.

Take your time!

*Everyone else - I think there is enough information to digest at this point. Can everyone find time to lay out the a solid case on Emp to back up any votes?

Otherwise, I'd like to see more deserved conversation and attention brought to the Mix(Sotty) case.

[Thesp]

It's not a matter of what scum would do, it's a matter of what people have done.

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. This is an ineffective way of playing mafia.

We've reached an impasse. I am trying to deduce who is scum based on if people are acting more like scum would act. You apparently think this approach is misguided. Consequently, it doesn't matter much what I say (and have said), you're going to disagree with me and I with you. If you'd like to discuss this point further, I'd be happy to, but this is the crix of our difference - consequently, my discussions on how Empking and dejkha's interaction is more consistent with how scum act will be (and have been) menaningless to you.

(Are you really suggesting that I nor anyone else has made a case against Empking? What qualifies as a "case" to you?)

[AA23]

I'm suggesting I'd like to see it laid out with more support than theoretical variables.

Mix had a genuinely scummy action against him - - Everyone acknowledged it - he failed to defend it - and Dej, a proven wolf, also admitted it was scummy yet ignored it and got aggressive about the wagon, and further agressive about being paired to him.

I think that Dej tried to keep Mix neutral/ignored for the majority of his days and uncharacteristically maintained him in the clear with pursed lips and ignorantly shielded eyes.

I did my homework on Dej's meta as well - - not only was Percy correct in saying that his relationship with Emp was a null tell (which it is) - - If one looks further, you will see it is uncharacteristic for Dej to "ignore" (for lack of a better word) a player in a game.

You don't find it odd that an emotional and aggressive wolf would admit that someone did something scummy and let it SLIDE - - wouldn't the wolf want to persue that person and have them lynched? Make them a NK candidate? Oh wait. Maybe it was indeed scummy, but a different kind of scum - the kind of scum he wouldn't attack being a wolf - - answer - Mix(Sotty) is wolf.

And I indeed picked "A" out of yoru scenarios - but you have to remember that the game isn't so clean cut - - you're no authority figure like the mod, and you can't suggest that "A" and "B" were the only approaches a scum could have to the game - that's manipulation on your part.

So what's the Emp case?

So far it's "Emp is Dej's partner. The evidence? His interactions with Dej"

That evidence is a null tell as was brought up last day by Percy - I then agreed with it.

I think basing a case on something that is 50/50 - a variable - a suggested "null" tell - is weak.

or at least weaker than the case on a person we have ALL said did something SCUMMY.

You're really working for this Thesp, but I'm truly confident in my endgame theory at this point - I'm sure Mix is wolf and I'm confident you are mafiascum.

You know Thesp, for someone that heavily considered the Mix wagon, hopped on it now and then, discussed it, voted for it top of the day regardless of the replacements response - - you're quick to dismiss it.

You put all that time and consideration into Mix, and now that the person I suggested to be his partner is found out, it doesn't seal the deal for you?

Ah yes - because you've realized at this time how much a mislynch will benefit you.
--------------------------------
That's what I've taken away from this.

I am MORE THAN HAPPY to look at your case and discuss it - but you seem to want to dance and be evasive.

just lay it out for me please - I'm totally serious and I'm not loading anything or am trying to make you look stupid - I genuinely want to see the case.

eg. "I'm voting Emp for : (reasons)
These are supported through these quotes/actions
etc.
---------------------------

@Thesp - please do respond to my query. Why so much investment in the Mix case only to abandon it when he is connected to Dej (suspected). Did persuing the wagon seem like a cold trail when an easy mislynch on Emp came up?

@Everyone. The Mix(sotty) case is stronger simply for being existent. Please, post your evidence and your case so we can compare them - otherwise, you are irresponsibly risking a mislynch while exchanging an agreeably scum case (mix) for SUSPICIONS and VARIABLE SPECULATION.
-----------------------

We can avoid this mislynch and win.

[hewitt]

Dej only gets me lynched if you or AA are dupporting him. That's not the case here.. So its not out of chatracter. Its in character.

And this even strikes me as out of character for Empking. I don't think I've ever had him give me a "rational" response without just calling me scum or saying I'm lying. I'm not sure what you're implying though, that dejkha needed me or AA23 on his side to start a bandwagon against you? I doubt that, considering I was not an influential enough player early on this game to be needed. He probably could have easily used me as a pawn.

However, AA23 I actually trust that you're right on this one so...

Unvote, Vote: Sotty7

[AA23]

We're all right* not just me. At one point or another we've given the Mix(Sotty) case the attention it deserved, it's just been a wild couple of days and has rattled the cage is all.

@Thesp - I don't mean to press, by the way. I want you to know I'm serious about wanting to read that Emp case - I'm not setting you up so I can ridicule it.

[AA23]

Also, Emp - if at this time you find Mix a likely candidate for a more appropriate lynch to for this day, your vote would put him at L-1 (same as you) and it would simply be a matter of a single person giving more time and thought to this process long enough for a switch that will hammer Mix(Sotty), a likely scum partner to Dej.

[Sotty7]

Sorry guys, had a busy weekend. Real tired right now, but I will be back tomorrow to catch up.

[Sotty7]

Dej only gets me lynched if you or AA are dupporting him. That's not the case here.. So its not out of chatracter. Its in character.

And this even strikes me as out of character for Empking. I don't think I've ever had him give me a "rational" response without just calling me scum or saying I'm lying. I'm not sure what you're implying though, that dejkha needed me or AA23 on his side to start a bandwagon against you? I doubt that, considering I was not an influential enough player early on this game to be needed. He probably could have easily used me as a pawn.

However, AA23 I actually trust that you're right on this one so...

Unvote, Vote: Sotty7

What changed from post 828 to this one?

The fact is only one thing has been added to AA's case on me and that's all of Dej's actions. These are things I simply cannot answer for and AA knows it. I am actually starting to feel very warn down by his constant repeating attacks in this manner. There is nothing I can do to answer him, there is nothing I can say to make him back off apart from my death. We disagree very much on basic mafia theory and that's just how the cookie crumbles. But the fact he won't even think about the side is enough to make my head hurt.

I'm trying hard not to give up because I know that with my death all hopes of the town winning go out of the window but at this point I can't see anything I can say to convince AA of the truth. He has put me in an impossible situation.

Right now, I think the last wolf is either emp or Hewitt. I will attempt to build my reasons later and place my vote.

[Empking]

Dej only gets me lynched if you or AA are dupporting him. That's not the case here.. So its not out of chatracter. Its in character.

And this even strikes me as out of character for Empking. I don't think I've ever had him give me a "rational" response without just calling me scum or saying I'm lying.

Well at least that's in character.

Unvote

AA is acting very town today.

[AA23]

Vote Count

Mixologist 4 - AA23, AshMC1984, hewitt, Khamisa
AceMarksman 3 - Mixologist, Percy, dejkha
AA23 1 - Empking

with 10 alive it is 6 to lynch so Mixologist is -2

Me, Ash, Hewitt, Khamisa,

I will put a

Vote: Sotty

down as well. At the moment, I think AA's case needs better answers than the ones that were initially provided/

Me, Ash, Hewitt, Khamisa, Percy

Thanks for your contribution, Sotty7.

Vote: Sotty7.

Me, Ash, Hewitt, Khamisa, Percy, Thesp

Scort: You and AA23

Vote: AA23

Me, Ash, Hewitt, Khamisa, Percy, Thesp, Emp (who acknowledged he felt we were both, however voted me - I'm waiting to hear back to see if that's changed)

Mixologist/Sotty7

Well AA is right. There is nothing I can say to give you all any insight into Mix's thought process. On reading the game

I agree the hammer was scummy. It made me

wince

as I read it. It did

come seemingly from nowhere

. The best I can say now knowing that Mix is a townie, is that he really did believe Zwet was scum and thought the hammer would prove as much. Like you have been saying (over and over and over again) AA,

the hammer was bad

. If Mix was scum he didn't do a good job trying to blend in with it did he? All I can reason is that he thought the flip would truly justify the action.

Sadly it didn't

.

Sotty, your only defense for a scummy player you winced at was wifom and an appeal to emotion with subtle tones of a town claim.

Me, Ash, Hewitt, Khamisa, Percy, Thesp, Emp, Sotty

In addition to everyone having already agreed with this case being valid, substantial, and worth persuing, Dej, a wolf, acknowledged the evidence as well

Mix hammered,

then

lied

and only seems to be

lurking

at this moment.

1. Only that

the hammer was a scummy thing to do

], but I didn't feel like it was anything to make a big deal out of.
2. Not for the reasons you do. Possibly if something else came up.
3. You are

correct, I wanted

nothing

to do with the Mix wagon, for reasons you presented.

While

Mix made a scummy hammer

, I'll let Sotty give his thoughts on the game and take it from there.

For now,

Vote: Hewitt

Dej was passionate about calling people liars. His definition of a lie was huge and he dropped that word like crazy - he called people liars so much it made me sick to read the word - - that guy was NOT cool with lying (or at least put that front on)

1. Isn't it odd that he would acknowledge Mix's hammer as scummy, dirty? That he would admit Mix lied? That he would note Mix lurking, and not

persue

it? He admittedly stated he wanted nothing to do with the wagon - - - -

This is a Wolf being opposed to the wagon on his partner

2. Percy pointed out that Dej was in fact being characteristic with Emp. He was! He acknowledged Emp, he degrated him, he included him in pair suspicions.

He is even quoted in my above evidence to have interest in only keeping Emp around "to get rid of" - - a mislynch, an easy kill - - Dej proved he was only interested in lynches more so than scum, just as I suspected, and it was made concrete when he flipped Villain.

3. Dej also persued Hewitt. He did so top of the day. I don't think Emp or Hewitt are his partners.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Me, Ash, Hewitt, Khamisa, Percy, Thesp, Emp, Sotty, Dej

All the people who have supported the Mix/Sotty lynch, wagon, or evidence (by agreeing it's validity)

This is enough for us to confidently state that Mix(Sotty) is a villain.

Applying this to known allingments.

Ash - Mafiascum - liked the Mix wagon and made mention of it multiple times

Scum wouldn't hunt their own.
Dej and Ash - Mafiascum and a Wolf - both addressed Hewitt. I don't think he's villain.

That, hand in hand with Dej's position, would suggest Mix(Sotty) is indeed

wolf

----------------------------------------------

***This is why I feel the Mix(Sotty) case is still alive and worth persuing. I think that only mafiascum are interested in a mislynch for the day (proven in my early scenario post)*****

@Emp - Does this case do anything for your current vote on me?

[AA23]

Posted same time as Emp.

I believe Mix(Sotty) is L-1

It will take either Khamisa or Thesp, the two possible scum (and most strongly in my opinion, Thesp) to switch their vote.

This will eliminate our NK's and we will be left outnumbering scum by one which will afford us more time, and we will have a prime Scum suspect to investigate tomorrow

[hewitt]

Okay I'm going to try to ignore the blatantly pathetic appeal to emotion by Sotty7.

[Sotty7]

Gonna asnwer my question though?

What changed from your two posts? You switched votes by saying "I agree with AA" which basically is you setting up his lynch tomorrow based on my flip. The thing is, AA hasn't presented anything new so why the sudden change.

AA, by my count I only have two votes on me. Yourself and Hewitt. You can confirm vote all you like, but it still only counts as one.

[AA23]

Thought Emp changed his vote instead of just removing it - -

And why open your post with "Still haven't answered my question, though" when confronted with yet again more appeals to emotion? Can you not defend yourself with a decent offense on who you believe to be the last wolf? I believe that's because there is no better case - nobody seems to want to lay one out (especially when holding it next to the one on you and Mix) and after post 841, why would they?

Your only defense has been (paraphrased, and not to be rude) "Guys, I totally agree that Mix was scummy as heck, but I can tell you he's innocent. Why? Because I know his role (winky).....I know his role, guys (winky blinky)"

You're making statements about how screwed we are if you're gone, and how Hewitt is setting me up for an easy lynch tomorrow (which doesn't make sense seeing as they would immediately go for a freeby on Emp - irresponsibly - for the win) I think you're just trying to incriminate Hewitt with that statement to scare him off your wagon.

Try at least defending yourself, and since you can't defend Mix, why not prove the guilt of who you feel is the true culprit - because all I'm seeing is one strong case being challenged by the person it's going to kill, and the mafiascum who want to save it for one more day.

Emp plays a tricky game of mafia, because whether he knows it or not, he always attracts scum - without fail - every time. Dej was a wolf that proved he indeed wanted easy lynches - - then he flat out said he was saving Emp for later (hello??)

So that rules him out as wolf for me, and Hewitt is ruled out as wolf because Dej persued him as well -

Ash was mafiascum and he liked the Mix wagon a lot - meaning that Mix(you) aren't mafiascum.

So if you were looked at as a

villain

by:
Everyone in this game (including you)
A proven Mafia Scum (who wanted you lynched)
A proven Wolf (who acknowledged Mix's lies, lurking, and dirty hammer and

didn't

want you lynched).

Does that not point to you and everyone else that you're more likely scum than Hewitt and Emp? Having everyone suspect you, mafia want you dead, and wolf buddy want you alive?

And Emp, being the scumtool at this time for an easy lynch - he would be the obvious choice for a lynch tomorrow if something fell through today - not me. I think you just said it would be me to scare hewitt off your vote.

Scare tactics and emotional appeals won't work.

Defend - or display your offense clear and concise on another player. Those are two understandable approaches.

But I think the case is speaking for itself at this point.

[hewitt]

I always agreed with AA23. I think I've actually stated that a couple times but that I felt Empking was more likely to be dejkha's scum partner. I don't think I believe that anymore so I switched my vote over to you. So what's with the appeals to emotion?

[AA23]

Emp - if the evidence is enough for you and the school of thought seems appropriate, I'd like to move things forward and hope to see your vote move to Sotty.

Then, as I mentioned before - it will require a single person to move from one wagon to the other (potentially a scum sucking up the lost opportunity at a mislynch)

Whichever way THAT one turns out, I'm confident Thesp is Mafiascum.

[Thesp]

I'm going to try to get a good post in here today or tomorrow, but work is crazy right now and I'm packing for Flayming Man. I will definitely be on V/LA from Wednesday afternoon, July 1st through Sunday, July 5th. I'm not forgetting about you all, I promise!

[Empking]

Vote; Sotty

I agree with AA2