Mini #534 - Vegetable Mafia (Game Over!)

[Patrick]

Votecount

destructor (1) -- thedragonsprincess
thedragonsprincess (2) -- Bookitty, Crub
Bookitty (1) -- gorckat
gorckat (1) -- destructor

Not voting: soupfly, Phate
7 alive, 4 to lynch.

Soupfly has picked up his prod but obviously hasn't posted. I'll give him maybe a day or so before looking for a replacement.

[soupfly]

i got the prod. sorry for not posting. i've been reading the thread but i just have no inspiration as to who is scum.

at this point i'm not thrilled with the kitty PR because it just seems sort of pointless but who knows.

i wish we'd never done the veggie claim cause that doesn't seem to have helped at all.

anyways i will:

vote: gorckat

here's why:

tdp (could have burned her safe claim to confirm herself by jumoing in after Phate)

...

Phate (likely town due to clumsy claim)

i can't understand why tdp is scummy in his book and phate gets a pass based on his quick lettuce claim. both of them posted their claims before we agreed to do so. why does phate get a pass for this and tdp not?

[gorckat]

Phate really seems to have not known what a safe claim was. Since scum seem to have safe claims, perhaps they knew that vanillas had different names, so tdp jumped in to do what Phate did- clear herself.

Its speculation on who I think Kitty's likely partner is.

[Crub]

So? What's stopping Phate getting Lettuce as a Safe Claim, and then him just assuming that it means that all the Vanilla's are Lettuce?

It's why I think Phate and tdp could still be Scum together, maybe tdp was pointing out to her partner that he had no idea what he was talking about?

Also after re-reading day 1, I couldn't find anything specifically that would exclude Phate and/or Destructor from being partners with ryan.

Phate/gorck please give me post numbers so I can read it again.

[gorckat]

Read Phate's 42nd post and on from there. Its apprarent he had no idea what safe claim meant.

[Crub]

So?

He thinks to himself oh boy Lettuce is a safe claim all the Vanilla's in the town must be Lettuce. If I claim lettuce at the first opportunity all the other vanilla's will know that I'm cleared. yay for me! Then when tdp comes along and ruins the party for him he has to back track fully.

I do not think his dodgy claim clears him as anything. So he misunderstood what a Safe Claim is ... why can't he have misunderstood what a Safe Claim is juts as easily as scum as town? In fact his selfish rush to clear himself at the first opportunity makes more sense for him to be scum than what it does for him to be town.

Anyway I'm not talking about him mis-understanding Safe Claims I want to know specifically what excludes Phate and Destructor from being scum with ryan.

[gorckat]

He thinks to himself oh boy Lettuce is a safe claim all the Vanilla's in the town must be Lettuce.

Its also possible the scum were given multiple names since they survived the popcorn.

In fact his selfish rush to clear himself at the first opportunity makes more sense for him to be scum than what it does for him to be town.

I thought that for awhile, as well, but now dismiss it.

I don't think the way destructor/phate went after ryan and vice versa looks like they were scum together.

[destructor]

WhoMe is a pick, and my mind has changed on Crub to put him on the possiblescumlist too.

@Phate: No. It looks like Crub hadn't been looked at.

I actually thought Crub was Oman's N1 investigation because he'd put him in his town list for seemingly trivial reasons but missed that post from Oman. This is why I said I'd be more willing to look at a gorckat/tdp scum-pair than a gorckat/Crub one. But now that I've seen that post, I'm reconsidering.

I should clarify that I never really 'went after' ryan in Day 1 at all, and honestly, didn't think he was scum right up until Pat revealed his role. The only thing I think I share in common with Phate in relation to ryan is that his attacks on both of us were similar.

Crub, Phate misusing a safe-claim relies on him only receiving

one

. Maybe someone more experience in themed games can comment on this, but in the only other themed mini I played (SG:A Mafia), every member of the scum group I was in was given a list of the same safe claims, so a misuse like this couldn't have happened. After the popcorn claim I assumed this was the same in this game, although, now that I think about it there was no reason for me to assume that, given the flavour differences.

Also, do you still think tdp is scum? If Phate is, tdp most probably isn't in light of her counter-claim. I wouldn't mind seeing a case on whomever it is you want to keep your vote on either.

gorckat, do you have anything to say in regards to my last post?

Bookitty should probably post a response to questions and comments now too.

[thedragonsprincess]

I'm still here... just nothing really to post right now. still happy with where my vote is

[Phate]

TDP, what do you think of the way Ryan went after destructor? How does this fit in with your theory that destructor is scum?

It's ok if you disagree with me, but just a "posting to avoid modkill" post != good.

[thedragonsprincess]

I have seen mafia go after fellow mafia before... wouldn't surprise me if that was the case. If you constantly stick up for a fellow mafia, it looks pretty suspicous if you're trying to fake being a townie.

[Crub]

@gorkcat/destructor re: Multiple Safe-Claims:
I've never been scum with a Safe Claim before. I just assumed that each scum would get a different Safe Claim that they can use.

Also @destructor this is why I'm not willing to rule out Phate as being possible scum. I still think it's possible that tdp is scum with Phate even though she counter-claimed, because in the end that counter-claim actually helped Phate by drawing his attention to the fact that he was mistaken about the nature of Safe Claims, and their use in a closed setup. In the worst case scenario if Phate had of been lynched and flipped as scum tdp has bought herself a nice defence to use down the track.

Also @Phate about ryan attacking people. I've seen Mafia brutally attack other Mafia before, in fact I think it can get even more heated between scum buddies that don't see eye to eye.

[destructor]

This is getting irritating. Our two claimed vanillas aren't providing half the content they should be and we've got another player with an apparently discouraging post restriction. More from soup would be great too.

Crub, why don't you think Boo's scum? Do you have no issues with her PR?

tdp, why is your vote on Bookitty? Do you disagree with my case on gorckat? Do you think it's likely that Phate misused a safe claim? Who do you think is Bookitty's last scum buddy?

Phate, I'd like you to elaborate more on why you don't like any of the wagons. The disparity between the content involved in the cases against players and your thoughts against the cases is not entirely convincing.

[thedragonsprincess]

my vote's not on bookitty- its on destructor

[destructor]

Er, ok, so then why's your vote on me? And can you answer the other questions too? (just replace Bookitty with "destructor".

[Bookitty]

I don't think Destructor or Crub are scum based on their recent comments. I am still pretty sure about my vote on tdp, but I can pretty readily see a phate/gorckat scumteam as well based on how carefully they post about each other. Also see here

Phate is not confirmed town. The only person we have who is confirmed is Soupfly. Since every single person had a different veggie, we have no gain from the popcorn claim. Phate is not a new player, to my knowledge, so his ignorance of what a safe claim was seems a little... unbelievable.

Also, this looks like a reason that Oman might have been killed. The post is referring to thedragonsprincess and Phate.

Suspicions on tdp, Phate and Gorckat right now.

unvote; vote: Phate

[soupfly]

unvote: gorkcat

because i see a better target.

vote: thedragonprincess

--> should have seen it sooner.

who do i like: destructor, kitty, crub

who don't i like: phate, gorkat

[gorckat]

She's tied for my top two as well. She's been pretty useless today, not offering anything.

unvote vote: thedragonprincess

[Crub]

woah. You do realise that's a hammer right?

[Phate]

Gorckat just jumped onto my scumlist.

[Patrick]

Votecount

destructor (1) -- thedragonsprincess
thedragonsprincess (3) -- Crub, soupfly, gorckat
gorckat (1) -- destructor
Phate (1) -- Bookitty

Not voting: Phate
7 alive, 4 to lynch.

[Phate]

Oh. Ok.

Gorckat just slid off my scumlist.

[destructor]

Why do I feel like I get ignored all the time... =(

If there's one thing I'm getting increasingly frustrated about in games at the moment, it's how people are getting away with not answering questions asked of them. I can't imagine a pro-town motivation for it so if pro-towners do ignore questions, then that's just poor play.

I think it's in the town's interest to wait for some answers and responses before hammering

anyone

.

[thedragonsprincess]

pretty useless today? if you dont want to give people at least a day to respond, then you might as well lynch me now because I'm tired of stressing out over trying to find the time to post in between working 8 hour days and taking 5 classes in college.... but on the off chance you actually do feel like seeing my answers, here they are: I am voting destructor because of his 'half claim' as I have already explained. I still don't see the point of half claiming... either you're cop or you're not. And we know now that hes not. I think it's possible that Phate misused a safe claim, but not likely. Anyone with a few games experience under their belt should know better. And as for bookitty's last scumbuddy, I don't think bookitty is scum anymore at all. As for destructor, I'm not sure.

[Crub]

oh kitty unvoted oops sorry for being alarmist