New York 196: My Game, My Flavor Mafia (Mafia Win)

[Zachstralkita]

If you looked at me and Titus interactions when we were voting each other and you DON'T see TvT, then I can't help you.

Oh, shut! Titus did flip TOWN!

Like I SAID SHE WOULD ON DAY 1?

[Almost50]

OK, you both are bringing good points to the table, although I still feel implosion's arguments are more solid to be extremely blunt.

OK, Zack: how do you explain the Varsoon role in light of Scum!implosion? Because that point in his argument is solid as a rock.

[Zachstralkita]

OK, you both are bringing good points to the table, although I still feel implosion's arguments are more solid to be extremely blunt.

OK, Zack: how do you explain the Varsoon role in light of Scum!implosion? Because that point in his argument is solid as a rock.

I am a backup Nurse.
I know there is a Nurse and a Doctor in the game.
I had thought my role told me they were a

town

nurse and doctor, but it turns out that they could be any alignment.
At the very least, I can confirm their claim, which is likely to be town, imo.

Point blank, Varsoon's role confirms role, not alignment. He even says here that it's ambiguous.

[Zachstralkita]

Nah, I'm gonna vote A50.

[implosion]

Why the fuck would I be so reckless as scum when caution is the exact reason the last scum has made it to the final 3? It doesn't make sense. As scum, the objective is to not get lynched, not to appear town. And you can see that implosion is trying to not get lynched in his post.

implosion wouldn't have wrote those 3 extra paragraphs if he were town. Varsoon's role along with Peregrine's flip should have been the only reason he needed. Instead, he also says " but there are other better reasons to think that I'm town over him.", which is excessive and seems paranoid. It looks like he's just covering all his bases, but if he was honestly town there would be literally no reason to do that.

Okay this is just completely absurd. Not getting lynched is imperative for everyone, not just scum; me not wanting to be lynched is not a scumtell and implying that it's scummy to not want to be lynched is just ludicrous. I am somewhat paranoid, rightfully so, that whichever of you is town won't figure out that I'm town and that we'll lose that way. Unlike you, I don't believe that others are obligated to townread me for (at least at first) no stated reason; I'm going to do everything in my power to ensure a town win, and that involves both my read between you two being correct and me not being the lynch.

Meanwhile, today, you have wavered from calling a50 scum to saying you want to vote me to saying you want to a50 without giving a single reason for any of those three opinions at their respective times; your opinion is changing with the wind, and that just doesn't feel like a townie in LYLO desperately trying to figure out who scum is; it feels like scum in LYLO desperately trying to keep both options open, possibly because you feel like pushing A50 will look more natural but you don't think you can swing me to a mislynch on him. A50 meanwhile is making and questioning specific arguments and, generally, feels like he's genuinely trying to figure the situation today out. His words make it sound like he feels that there's weight behind the decision he's making.

[Zachstralkita]

That's objectively not true.

I have a 50/50 shot of lynching scum between you two and I'm TRYING to make the right choice.

[implosion]

What part of what I said are you calling objectively not true? And why do you say that?
And if it's that I don't think you look like you're trying to figure out who scum is today, in what way can you justify that you objectively appear to be scumhunting today?

[Zachstralkita]

What part of what I said are you calling objectively not true? And why do you say that?
And if it's that I don't think you look like you're trying to figure out who scum is today, in what way can you justify that you objectively appear to be scumhunting today?

I've ISO'd you both and I didn't want to believe it because A50 has been my townread all game. But what sealed it for me is that A50 is acting like the conf here when you should be. I dunno, picking between you two was probably the worst LYLO I could end up in, and I directly helped influence that.

[Almost50]

This game is killing me. I hate to lose, but I'd hate it even more if I was the reason we lost. For what it's worth, implo still looks more convincing to me. I took Zach for granted way too long, but -gun to my head and forced to cast a vote right now- I think I'll vote him.

Is there anything more either of you would like to add, ask, or advise me to do? (Other than the "vote him bc I'm town" cliché).

[Zachstralkita]

This game is killing me. I hate to lose, but I'd hate it even more if I was the reason we lost. For what it's worth, implo still looks more convincing to me. I took Zach for granted way too long, but -gun to my head and forced to cast a vote right now- I think I'll vote him.

Is there anything more either of you would like to add, ask, or advise me to do? (Other than the "vote him bc I'm town" cliché).

I would appreciate if you voted yourself and lost

[Almost50]

I would appreciate if you voted yourself and lost

Now you're being overly silly! I can't do that as either alignment, but I view this as a tactic to avoid responding to the points thrown your way by both implosion and myself.

Let me get this straight: You are town, and you believe implosion is town, and think that I'm scum. Is this your final stance?

[Zachstralkita]

I would appreciate if you voted yourself and lost

Now you're being overly silly! I can't do that as either alignment, but I view this as a tactic to avoid responding to the points thrown your way by both implosion and myself.

Is that right.

Let me get this straight: You are town, and you believe implosion is town, and think that I'm scum. Is this your final stance?

It would appear so.

[Zachstralkita]

I would appreciate if you voted yourself and lost

Now you're being overly silly! I can't do that as either alignment, but I view this as a tactic to avoid responding to the points thrown your way by both implosion and myself.

Let me get this straight: You are town, and you believe implosion is town, and think that I'm scum. Is this your final stance?

This game is killing me. I hate to lose, but I'd hate it even more if I was the reason we lost. For what it's worth, implo still looks more convincing to me. I took Zach for granted way too long, but -gun to my head and forced to cast a vote right now- I think I'll vote him.

Is there anything more either of you would like to add, ask, or advise me to do? (Other than the "vote him bc I'm town" cliché).

I may as well lose here if no one sees that these posts are practically a scumclaim.

[Almost50]

LOL.. a scum claim?? The reason I asked if that was your final stance is to help me ease my mind voting you. Even if you're town; voting me loses the game. So -from my own PoV- I can only vote you and hope implo will join me AND that he is actually town.

[implosion]

I am curious what exactly in those posts you're referring to, Zach; I think I know what you're referring to (in which case I have more questions of course) but. If you could explain things clearly rather than just pointing to posts and irreverently declaring them scumclaims it would be much more helpful.

[Zachstralkita]

LOL.. a scum claim?? The reason I asked if that was your final stance is to help me ease my mind voting you. Even if you're town; voting me loses the game. So -from my own PoV- I can only vote you and hope implo will join me AND that he is actually town.

No. Your supposed " POV " should have two outcomes, implosion being scum and him winning when he helps you vote me.

You say " even if you're town; voting me loses the game" and in the same breath you declare you're going to vote me?



You realize what that means, right? It means you acknowledge that I could be town(you know I'm town) and you still opt for that. You're not attacking implosion because he's not a threat to your safety. You don't really care about the town's win condition -- your play doesn't indicate such.

I am curious what exactly in those posts you're referring to, Zach; I think I know what you're referring to (in which case I have more questions of course) but. If you could explain things clearly rather than just pointing to posts and irreverently declaring them scumclaims it would be much more helpful.

You know what, JUST for you.

This game is killing me. I hate to lose, but I'd hate it even more if I was the reason we lost.

For what it's worth, implo still looks more convincing to me. I took Zach for granted way too long, but -gun to my head and forced to cast a vote right now- I think I'll vote him.

Is there anything more either of you would like to add, ask, or advise me to do? (Other than the "vote him bc I'm town" cliché).[/

quote]

BOLDED: LAMIST, for lack of a better term. He's treating himself as the conf and deciding vote and indirectly assuming authority. YOU'RE the one that should be holding and wielding this authority, implosion, by all means.

I would appreciate if you voted yourself and lost

Now you're being overly silly! I can't do that as either alignment, but I view this as a tactic to avoid responding to the points thrown your way by both implosion and myself.

Let me get this straight: You are town, and you believe implosion is town, and think that I'm scum. Is this your final stance?

BOLDED: An obvious twisted interpretation of my actions to suit his agenda. He also says " I can't do that as either alignment", just to cover all the bases like a smug fluffy scum ostrich would. Do you not agree this is the case?


The last sentence is like, he's... there was no need to say that. It's obviously what I'm saying.

[Zachstralkita]

LOL.. a scum claim?? The reason I asked if that was your final stance is to help me ease my mind voting you. Even if you're town; voting me loses the game. So -from my own PoV- I can only vote you and hope implo will join me AND that he is actually town.

No. Your supposed " POV " should have two outcomes, implosion being scum and him winning when he helps you vote me.

You say " even if you're town; voting me loses the game" and in the same breath you declare you're going to vote me?



You realize what that means, right? It means you acknowledge that I could be town(you know I'm town) and you still opt for that. You're not attacking implosion because he's not a threat to your safety. You don't really care about the town's win condition -- your play doesn't indicate such.

I am curious what exactly in those posts you're referring to, Zach; I think I know what you're referring to (in which case I have more questions of course) but. If you could explain things clearly rather than just pointing to posts and irreverently declaring them scumclaims it would be much more helpful.

You know what, JUST for you.

This game is killing me. I hate to lose, but I'd hate it even more if I was the reason we lost.

For what it's worth, implo still looks more convincing to me. I took Zach for granted way too long, but -gun to my head and forced to cast a vote right now- I think I'll vote him.

Is there anything more either of you would like to add, ask, or advise me to do? (Other than the "vote him bc I'm town" cliché).[/

quote]

BOLDED: LAMIST, for lack of a better term. He's treating himself as the conf and deciding vote and indirectly assuming authority. YOU'RE the one that should be holding and wielding this authority, implosion, by all means.

I would appreciate if you voted yourself and lost

Now you're being overly silly! I can't do that as either alignment, but I view this as a tactic to avoid responding to the points thrown your way by both implosion and myself.

Let me get this straight: You are town, and you believe implosion is town, and think that I'm scum. Is this your final stance?

BOLDED: An obvious twisted interpretation of my actions to suit his agenda. He also says " I can't do that as either alignment", just to cover all the bases like a smug fluffy scum ostrich would. Do you not agree this is the case?


The last sentence is like, he's... there was no need to say that. It's obviously what I'm saying.

FUCK. I FUCKED UP THE QUOTE SO I DIDNT BOLD IT. fixed.

[Zachstralkita]

I know I considered implosion scum (first, actually, and moreso than implosion) but I'm either a fucking moron or... A town backup nurse and a town doctor but the nurse is scum? I don't want to believe the game is loaded.

[Zachstralkita]

I know I considered implosion scum (first, actually, and moreso than implosion) but I'm either a fucking moron or... A town backup nurse and a town doctor but the nurse is scum? I don't want to believe the game is loaded.

*moreso than A50

[Zachstralkita]

sorry, I'm just in too many games.

replacing out

rip my replacement for having to read through all this.

pedit: or you guys could lynch me, that could happen too.

Is this an invitation? This doesn't sound towny.

that's a loaded question. If you guys were still looking for scum, ^^^^^.

Loaded questions are more like " Hey, how often do you beat your wife?" or " Did your elbow hurt after you shot John F. Kennedy?"

For someone who doesn't have time to spend in this thread, it would seem you have... time to spend in this thread when it's deflecting people off your scummy ass. Au revoir.

I would have directly bussed Nos (To reiterate, I was the SECOND initial vote on Nosferatu's wagon BEFORE Nosferatu was even Vedith, back when there were a few votes on Nos the first time. The first person on that initial wagon was WAKE. ) for NO REASON?

vc 1.12

Zachstralkita (1):

Mirhawk

Sickofit1138 (2):

PeregrineV, Dunnstral

Dunnstral (2):

Sickofit1138, Varsoon

Titus (2):

AGar, Lapsa

PeregrineV (3):

Almost50, podoboq, implosion

Wake88 (1):

shannon

Transcend (1):

Titus

Almost50 (1):

Transcend

Nosferatu (2):

Zachstralkita, Wake88

No Lynch (1):

Performer

Not Voting:

Airick10, Nosferatu, Boem_u_dusi

Nosferatu was not a topic beforehand. The votes on him PRIOR to this in other VCs were podoboq and Dunnstral -- all separate, so one vote each. He was not receiving pressure whatsoever.

Now my vote on him means I actually wanted his lynch because I actually pushed for it later on, after all the bullshit.



So yeah, I'd have bussed him, like, hard as shit for no reason instead of getting any one of the fucking townies lynched, for towncred? Yeah? Just so I could look town all the way up to............. NOW?

Say what you want, but I never expected it to make it this long in the game. But I'm scum and that's what I did? And even in LYLO I'm playing as brash as I am with virtually no " content " in your posts or presenting a defense backed up with facts and evidence until now?

LOL

[Zachstralkita]

^ content in MY posts. Okay thats like a 7tuple post I'm sorry

[Almost50]

@Zach:

Of course I treat myself as "conf", and if you were town you should too. I mean, the MOD must've told you your alignment, so you KNOW whether you are town or not. I may not be confirmed to wither of you, but TO ME I am! Duh!

And, I'm not twisting anything. I do consider the possibility of you being town still, but IF YOU ARE you're still going to lose us the game.

OK, let me try to simplify things for you:

First let's say implosion is currently evenly and equally undecided (50% chance voting me & 50% chance voting you). OK?

From where I stand right now it's about 75% you're scum and 25% you're town, so voting you (and being right about it) makes the town winning chance = 75 * 50/100 = 37.5%

Voting you (and being right about it) also has another 37.5% chance of still losing, but only due to implosion making the wrong decision (i.e. we still lsoe, but I'm not to blame).

Now there's the remaining 25% of me being wrong about you, but you already made your FINAL decision and it's the wrong one, so we lose either way. Capisce?

That's why I asked if that was you FINAL stance. You said it was, so there's no chance we're winning this if I vote implosion anyway, and I would rather bank on our 37.5% chance of winning by voting you than on a 0% chance by voting him.

I hope you do get it now. "Even if you're town WE STILL LOSE".

[Zachstralkita]

@Zach:

Of course I treat myself as "conf", and if you were town you should too. I mean, the MOD must've told you your alignment, so you KNOW whether you are town or not. I may not be confirmed to wither of you, but TO ME I am! Duh!

no. Implosion is role-confirmed, it is right for him to be acting as such. What you're saying here and what I was addressing are two different things.


You're asserting that you're the deciding vote and the one who determines the outcome of this.

That's why I asked if that was you FINAL stance. You said it was, so there's no chance we're winning this if I vote implosion anyway, and I would rather bank on our 37.5% chance of winning by voting you than on a 0% chance by voting him.

Vote me.

[Almost50]

You're asserting that you're the deciding vote and the one who determines the outcome of this.

Actually, implosion is the deciding vote right now. You and I are cross voting and he will get too choose between us.

Vote me.

Is this a trick of some kind?? Because if it is; you've got me! OK..

VOTE: Zach

You yourself say implo is confirmed, so it's either you, you or you!!

[Zachstralkita]

I'm a 1-shot vigilante, I shot Lapsa.

What's important here is that Dunn claims the Lapsa kill first. Let's all applaud his brilliance for a second. (blatant sarcasm)

Lapsa dies. But scum sees an opportunity for a fakeclaim because they targeted Lapsa as well.

A50 can claim JK off of the strength of this, and he'll be believed because it lines up. There was no real reason for him to claim Jailkeeper in the first place, even if he WERE a jailkeeper? Why?

---> Lapsa dies

---> Dunn claims to have targeted Lapsa

--> Dunn was " jailkept " (In this theoretical scenario, only town!A50 knows this and it has not been announced in the thread.)


OBVIOUS CONCLUSION: SOMEONE ELSE TARGETED LAPSA. BUT WHAT HAPPENS????

OK.. I'm totally lost, so you guys work it out.

1- I'm the Jailkeeper
2- Dunn didn't shoot Lapsa bc I Jailed HIM (Dunn).
3- I let him go with it to see if he was faking, and it looks to me that he totally believed his shit, so he may still be a vig and all, but he DID NOT SHOOT LAPSA! Period.

?????????

He couldn't have done the numbers in his head, and went to 4, and said, " Oh, shit. I guess scum shot Lapsa too."

Only investigative role that town has heard from is ME and my role is super weak as it is.

Well, I'm about to prove to you that JK COULD be used as an investigating role too. It's one of the basics you learn in BEGINNERS games.

This quote right here from D4 shows us A50 is not a beginner, so he does not do this because he is a confused townie and doesn't know any better.

No, he completely feigns ignorance and instead claims -- when a few posts earlier he says

Ok scum probably targeted me LMFAO but I had someone looking out for me

Probably no kill from mafia because I got docced.

Anyone else want to claim NOT doctor??

Berating myself and Dunn for narrowing it down, yet his claim OUTS another PR in theory (himself) and does the same thing.


Furthermore, we're still being theoretical here, but why does A50 "jail" Dunn in the first place?

a50, opinions on a vedith lynch?

I'm neutral on that lynch. That sot has not provided much through either of it's occupiers. I guess I'll go with it if it's between Vedith & Titus though. I'd much rather Peregrine still, but I'm the only one who thinks PV is lurking scum.

My full reads (in no particular order):

Town: Lapsa, Dunn, Zach, Mirhawk, Performer, Varsoon, Titus
Leaning town: AGar, shannon, Transcend, Boem, podoboq, implosion
Not sure (i.e. null): Sick, Airick, Wake, Vedith
Leaning scum: Peregrine

And I do realize I have too many town reads vs too little scum reads, but that's the way it is and until I see a flip I cannot draw connections, so the above table maybe redone upside down with a flip.

This was his most recent reads list, circa Day 1.

In his posts AFTER that before Day 1 ends, he does NOT address Dunn a lot, and his read on Dunn DOES NOT change.


Why does A50 jailkeep a

townread

of his?

The logic of A50's claim only follows because Dunn's claim happened. It is absolutely ludicrous otherwise.

Before Dunn even claimed, A50 jailkeeping Dunn on Night 1 does not make sense given the facts. That is, probably because A50 is not a jailkeeper and he is scum. Scum DID have a jailkeeper, though, and they could have used Airick to keep up the illusion that A50 indeed WAS the jailkeeper until Airick died, and THEN the illusion could be kept up by A50 selectively NKing.

And what does our hero do on the day Airick is lynched?

a50 who did you roleblock today?

*Scratches Head*

Airick!! This is getting confusing. we have at least 2 Mafioso members on the lose, and I'm not sure if the second kill the comes from vig or some second killing role with X shots. And yes, 2 Machos apparently were in the setup together, so I'm confused as hell.

My list of suspects include Transcend, beeboy and AGar, but I have no case on either tbh. Any good ideas?

Claims he jailkept Airick so Airick is absolved of suspicion. Later, he leaves himself room to backpedal on this when he says

Anyway, Airick might be scum yes, but he's not the one who shot "whoever the Mafia shot of the two" last night. But if there's another anti-town killing role then he's right back in it (the kills of last night) too. If it was Dunn who shot Wake/podoq then Airick steps back a little in favour of finding the actual killer.

But hang on, this doesn't make sense at all.

No matter what the fuck Airick was to anyone at that point in time, he couldn't have made ANY kill if he was actually jailkept. If another member of the mafia committed the kill, Airick is STILL cleared of that kill on the basis of being JK'd.

But what's this? Later... we have...

Frankly I'm getting bored, and I don't think my prime suspect (beeboy) is getting enough attention, so let's just end the day.

VOTE: Airick

If you read what I wrote just above and then come back to this.. does it make sense?

So.. just directly contradicted the results of his claim there with his own vote... that or mafia that WASN'T airick made the NK, in which case that certainly should have been pointed out by A50.

yeah, that..

all of that's fine.

You're asserting that you're the deciding vote and the one who determines the outcome of this.

Actually, implosion is the deciding vote right now. You and I are cross voting and he will get too choose between us.

Um, that was what I said he was supposed to be. But it's what YOU were acting like.

Is this a trick of some kind?? Because if it is; you've got me! OK..

VOTE: Zach

You yourself say implo is confirmed, so it's either you, you or you!!

Okay, leave that there. And the LAST thing I want is for implosion to come in and make me look like a fucking idiot by hammering me and winning the game on the .003% chance he's scum, but so be it.