Driving Mafia - GAME OVER - Kentic controls all the cock!

[petroleumjelly]

When did I ever call you scum...?

My points against you do not hinge on whether you have actually called Kcdaspot/myself scum. Now please answer my questions.

[Shadow Dancer]

@kiwi: To get the right reads sometimes you have to consider that you are actually

wrong

, so you can adjust your reads. Unfortunately the truth gives a damn about how allegedly confident you are in your opinions.

To come back to your Kcda case - do you still think he is suspect? Did petrol's play support your opinion at least not change it, and if so, why?

@Petrol: Right now if Nobody is claiming the truth scum will likely NK him anyway, or probably roleblock him which would give us setup information. Lynching him now is counterpoductive. If he is fake claiming and there is a real cop he will sooner or later claim, thus uncovering Nobody, but ideally giving town more info. Right now he most likely only has on innocent and will then be NKed (or his innocent). Very little gain. If the cop is NKed by chance Nobody would still be exposed, so unlike with a guilty investigation there is no urge to get it out. In abstract: There's almost nothing to gain for town that would justify burning an unclaimed cop from an immediate counterclaim.
Lynching Nobody unCCed is obviously bad. If it's a mislynch scum NK Stevie and town gained less than nothing.

[petroleumjelly]

@Petrol: Right now if Nobody is claiming the truth scum will likely NK him anyway, or probably roleblock him which would give us setup information. Lynching him now is counterpoductive. If he is fake claiming and there is a real cop he will sooner or later claim, thus uncovering Nobody, but ideally giving town more info. Right now he most likely only has on innocent and will then be NKed (or his innocent). Very little gain. If the cop is NKed by chance Nobody would still be exposed, so unlike with a guilty investigation there is no urge to get it out. In abstract: There's almost nothing to gain for town that would justify burning an unclaimed cop from an immediate counterclaim.
Lynching Nobody unCCed is obviously bad. If it's a mislynch scum NK Stevie and town gained less than nothing.

You have your priorities wrong.

The point of mafia is to lynch scum, not to protect "the Cop." If all a Cop has to do is claim in order to catch scum, then that's fantastic. If that Cop also has a useful result, that's an added bonus.

[Nocmen]

Unvote, Vote: SC

Back to this for now. Just got in after an 8 hour drive, skimmed over the posts, looking into kiwi wagon now - not liking it.

[DeasVail]

@Shadow You may not like my reasons for suspecting StrangerCoug, but they're why I think he's scum, so deal with it.

You are right that those I have suspected were voting Ankamius- It may have something to do with:
1) Me knowing that Ankamius was town
2) Me thinking Ankamius wasn't really that scummy at all, with scum more likely to pick on non-scummy things than town.
You reducing it to OMGUS is pretty scummy imo.

Since Stranger stopped suspecting me, he hasn't come across as particularly scummy. (And this will fit with your love for OMGUS pretty nicely).

About nocmen, I changed my vote and was interested to see if/how anyone would respond to it. I thought Nocmen was a good choice because I felt he could be scum, but didn't really have anything concrete on him. Of course I can't place a vote on a real suspect and fish for reactions at the same time. That's just totally absurd...

[StrangerCoug]

One of my scum suspects votes me for not answering a question. (I admit it, I HATE HATE HATE answering many questions. Meta me.)

Screw your meta. Scummy actions are scummy actions.

I seriously dont know how to defend myself.

You should have thought about that before you started refusing to answer questions about what you've been doing. Sorry.

If I was scum, wouldnt you think I would be MUCH MORE CAREFUL where I tread, PJ?

WIFOM.

I really don't know of a better person to whom to give the rope, people. petroleumjelly put kiwieagle in a corner, I joined in PJ's attack, and now KE is unable to handle the pressure of not one, but two people asking him perfectly legitimate questions about his actions.

[StevieT92]

Hmm, I didn't think that scum would be so bold as to proclaim someone they knew would be a mislynch as an obvious mislynch.

WIFOM and defending your scum buddy, real nice.

[StevieT92]

So I have a wagon on me.

YAY!

Atleast I know NS was lying now.


Nice counter-wagon though.

Why have you not considered the fact that NS could be telling the truth?

If you are town; are you that arrogant that you are so sure in your reads (me + NS)? after you just said you think your reads are crap and you have no idea who is scum?

[Riceballtail]

Unvote

I have no reason to doubt NS, and thus believe his investigation.

I'm going to read SC/Kiwi next time I get a chance to decide who is better to lynch today.

[StevieT92]

@Kiwi I realized that Nobody special already asked you my above question and you answered it. feel free to ignore that.

I also like how once vezok votes you, you immediately attack him. You've mentioned he was a lurker before, why would a townie need to bring it up at that point?

[Shadow Dancer]

@Deas: Yes, that's pretty much the definition of OMGUS - being overly focussed on your own person. The "they vote for town so they mist be scum" theory is inherently flawed because average townies are far from impecable and if you are a townie you should be able to have a wider outllook on things.
What do you say about Coug's D2 play and his reactions to the waggon on him? Do they support your case?
You said your Noc vote was for reaction fishing. That implies that you were expexting certain people to react in a certain way to it. What kind of reaction did you expect? Did you get any desired reactions? What do they tell you.
And don't even try to scare me away with sarcasm, you don't want me to tit fot tat you back. Of yourse you can hunt scum on reactions to any vote, no matter when and whom you vote. But that's not really reaction fishing because you have no expaction what, if anything, you will evntually get out of it. It is just a very poor excuse to justify a vote. Additionally you already said that your real reason suppoedly was that you considered Noc scum, but you avoided the issue ever since. If "you felt he was scum" there must be a reason for it, like a post that seemed suspicious to you, and you should be able to point it out.

@Petrol: No, you got your priorities wrong. Unless you have some evidence that Nobody's scum that is far more striking than "he's somewhat anti-town" which most of his case boils down to. I already explained why the quasi autoguilty if there was an unclaimed real cop would nopt require that cop to CC immediatelly.

[Amrun]

VC2.6

(0) Nocmen
(0) petroleumjelly
(3) StrangerCoug - Nobody Special, DeasVail, Nocmen
(0) Fishythefish
(0) vezokpiraka
(0) StevieT92
(0) scooby
(1) DeasVail - Shadow Dancer
(0) Riceballtail
(4) kiwieagle - petroleumjelly, StrangerCoug, vezokpiraka, StevieT92
(3) Nobody Special - kiwieagle, Fishythefish, scooby
(0) Shadow Dancer

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Not voting: Riceballtail

V/LA: THE MOD!

Deadline: December 3, 9pm EST

Spoiler: Vote History

Nocmen - StevieT92 > Nobody Special > StrangerCoug
petroleumjelly - Nobody Special > kiwieagle
StrangerCoug - DeasVail > unvote > Nobody Special > kiwieagle
Fishythefish - StrangerCoug > Nobody Special
vezokpiraka - StrangerCoug > kiwieagle
StevieT92 - Nobody Special > unvote > kiwieagle
scooby - StrangerCoug > Nobody Special
DeasVail - StrangerCoug > Nocmen > StrangerCoug
Riceballtail - StevieT92 > unvote
kiwieagle - Nobody Special
Nobody Special - StrangerCoug
Shadow Dancer - DeasVail

If you spot any mistakes, please let me know.

[DeasVail]

@Shadow: I'm not going to suspect someone just because they attack me (OMGUS) or because they voted for a townie.

But picking on things that aren't actually scummy are what I think scum are more likely to do.

Coug's Day 2 play, after he stopped suspecting me, does not support my case, but he still is the one I suspect the most as no one else has stood out as particularly scummy.

I don't think I need such a great reason to temporarily change a vote and I wasn't exactly sure which possible reactions I considered scummy. I didn't feel I was doing much so I thought I'd change a vote, see if there are any reactions to it, and then think about which ones were likely to come from scum. That's the thing, I didn't have anything which I could point to and say "that's scummy", but I did feel he could be scum.
I didn't really get much from it, but I'm not really fussed because it's not like I made any sacrifices or did any harm by changing my vote for a bit. I thought Stevie's reaction was scummy, but obviously he's probably town.

[Fishythefish]

@NS: if you had an innocent on Stevie, why did you post these:

Haven't looked at Stevie lately; will do that later, in tandem with other players.

These two shining examples of scumminess far outshine Stevie, who, while less luminous, is still in my notes to be watched.

Aside from your claim, what do you now think of DV? You said he was a "shining example of scumminess" - why haven't you mentioned him today?

I'm very surprised about the number of people who believe NS without question. I think he could easily be scum trying to avoid the lynch. He's still given bugger all to back up his reads. There's nothing about his claim that makes it particularly likely to be true. Sure, it explains away one of his unexplained shifts of reads, but aside from that it doesn't make him any less likely to be scum.

@RBT, SC, vezok, kiwi: why do you believe NS? "There isn't a reason not to" is a pretty crap reason - what makes you think it isn't a fakeclaim?

kiwi should respond to PJ's questions in 620. I'm having great difficulty deciding about kiwi - rather clouded by my recent game with him. Not at all sure that anything he's doing here is a scumtell for him.

[DeasVail]

@Fishy, I was never all that convinced of NS being scum, although not of him being town either. I don't think he should be lynched, because I believe it's quite possible that he is actually the cop. I still think it's possible that he's scum, but I don't really want to take the chance.

[StrangerCoug]

@RBT, SC, vezok, kiwi: why do you believe NS? "There isn't a reason not to" is a pretty crap reason - what makes you think it isn't a fakeclaim?

As I remember saying, it explains why he stopped pursuing StevieT92.

[Nocmen]

While the evidence does make me believe NS's claim, I'm still dissatisfied with his play and refusal to answer questions, as well as the result. I'm able to take the claim, but I want to take the result on Stevie with a grain of salt. I don't like how his attack on scooby/kiwi shifted towards kiwi suddenly with the wagon appearing. Also very little content in detail.

That's my main issue with the wagon on kiwi, I see Stevie as a good bussing with kiwi because of the attacks on each other make sense in a bussing perspective. I would like to see one of them lynched very soon. But...

At the same time, vezok again is disturbing me. Another vote that makes sense only as a wagon perspective. First mention of kiwi in his posts is a vote?

Unvote, Vote: Vezok

[StrangerCoug]

I'm able to take the claim, but I want to take the result on Stevie with a grain of salt.

Why?

[kiwieagle]

So I have a wagon on me.

YAY!

Atleast I know NS was lying now.


Nice counter-wagon though.

Why have you not considered the fact that NS could be telling the truth?

If you are town; are you that arrogant that you are so sure in your reads (me + NS)? after you just said you think your reads are crap and you have no idea who is scum?

Lol misrep more please

Will answer everything tomorow, in cellphone

[Nocmen]

I'm able to take the claim, but I want to take the result on Stevie with a grain of salt.

Why?

Nothing with regards to the claim, I just see kiwi/Stevie interactions as being bussing more than anything. However, I will not vote for Stevie today with the result on him. If kiwi flips scum, I'll be even more suspicious of him, but if he flips town, I'll feel a bit more comfortable with Stevie. I'm slightly okay with a kiwi lynch as a last minute effort, but I'd much prefer to see SC/vezok go today.

[petroleumjelly]

Unvote: kiwieagle, Vote: Nobody Special

1.)

Nobody Special, where's that post you promised? You have several questions you need to clear up. I see you've been posting elsewhere (you've made at least fifty posts outside of this game since your last post here), so you really don't have an excuse to be avoiding this game.

2.)

Shadow Dancer, your argument completely hinges on the assumption that Nobody Special is Town. I am not making that assumption. If he is scum, then having an actual Cop counterclaim him is better, in my opinion, than a Cop keeping their mouth shut.

3.)

Nocmen, I do not understand your posts. What exactly is your opinion of kiwieagle? Furthermore, please explain why you think vezokpiraka is scummier than kiwieagle.

4.)

StrangerCoug, explain to me in your own words the "corner" I have backed kiwieagle into.

[vezokpiraka]

At the same time, vezok again is disturbing me. Another vote that makes sense only as a wagon perspective. First mention of kiwi in his posts is a vote?

Unvote, Vote: Vezok

First mention? Is this a joke? Are you even reading this thread?

[Fishythefish]

@RBT, SC, vezok, kiwi: why do you believe NS? "There isn't a reason not to" is a pretty crap reason - what makes you think it isn't a fakeclaim?

As I remember saying, it explains why he stopped pursuing StevieT92.

Yes, it does. But it's hardly a claim that would be surprising from scum under pressure for flipping on Stevie. It's pretty obvious to me that this claim could come either from scumNS or townNS - what about the claim means that scum wouldn't have made it?