Open 99: Mayo Clinic (Game Over!) before 703

[Stef]

EBWOP: Changing our minds are we?* since that's the expression.

[TonyMontana]

Ugh.. for christs sake, wall-e.

You made a shockmoney move, and you've had 3 people since ask you to explain. Quit being coy, and answer.

[Stef]

TonyMontana: After 4 days and 6 pages of posting that's all you have to say? Please give your impressions on all the players in the game and state your top suspects and why you suspect them.

[Kmd4390]

Wall-E, I'd like to hear why you made the sudden turn around.

Tony, suspicions?

[Nameless]

Aaaaand

, I'm back, now on a new, shinier, and more tediously reproduced inane levels of option/program/tweak/etc settings THINGIER laptop! Let's take a look at what I've missed, shall we?

Another absurd "If you X, you must be scum" statement from Charter aside, what worries me most is the defeatism regarding lynching. I know from personal experience Charter CAN play this poorly as town, but he never struck me as someone who would give up that easily.

Kiro makes some good points in the follow post, anyway, but I really don't like the vote on animorpherv. It seems pretty weak, particularly in comparison to the other equally bad lurkers. (Anim's reply is rather bad, mind you.)

GK's #446 has officially triggered my Pet Peeve - suspecting a large number of people is not scummy, and lord forbid he might have stopped suspecting his previous suspect as much when he decides on a new one(s). Also attempting to just shrug off attacks (the clearly lashing out comment).

Wall-E's still being unhelpful, making general accusations without evidence or discussion.

... did Stef just place a serious vote on Charter based on mild comparison between games? That sounds a poor excuse to jump on a bandwagon.

FOS: Stef.

(Re: Charter's question, I'd say Stef was mildly inactive but not deliberately lurking akin to certain players in this game.)

Charter and GK haven't SEMANTICS BATTLE!1! and many eyes were rolled at both side of the argument.

Kmd's comments on hammering in #484 seem somewhat dubious. He's saying he will hammer, when HE "feels" nothing else needs to be answered, but he doesn't really mind if the lurkers don't? Sounds dodgy.

After reading Charter's (at the time) possible last few posts I'm ... actually inclined to think he might be town (or at least, not mafia). There's certainly a few players I'd look hard at if he flipped such, and it helps that the other players I suspect the most are happy to be on the bandwagon.

Wall-E and OP's 500 to 503 are ... horrible. Wall-E's ONLY lead is that Charter is "wimping out"? OP is convinced Charter is scum for explained reason whatsoever (unless "is obvious" counts). OP will "address the questions" by ... no actually, he doesn't any specific questions at all - and Wall-E is fine with that?!

Sudden mind change by Wall-E? Unexplained? Attempts to distance himself from a dubious and seemingly inevitable bandwagon? Lurkerscum Tony is displeased his scumbuddy is backing down? ALL SYSTEMS CHECK.

Hmm ... I'm going to go with Tony / GK / Wall-E scumteam. Some of Wall-E and GK's interaction seems off (closeness earlier on, prompting by GK to Wall-e, the whole "wake up" vote thing) and Wall-E could be seen buddying with lurker OP (I mentioned the exchange above). Don't know about the SK, there's too many other mildly suspicious players. >_<

Vote: GnKoichi

[Wall-E]

If I get nothing out of this game but derision and blame, let me be remembered for this: I think GnK and charter are town.

you guys read way too much into interactions before scum have been caught... it's really quite silly and i will enjoy watching this town learn some hard lessons... here are some words you will likely regret ignoring: scumteam speculation is near worthless before the 1st scum is caught

[Wall-E]

GnKoihi

The moderator mispelled GnKoichi's name.

[Wall-E]

Wall-E, I'd like to hear why you made the sudden turn around.

The answer is in post 531: When I misspell something it means I was experiencing consternation or anxiety over the thing. I think the Mod is worried GnK is going to deflate this game with a townie vs newbie townie brawl.

[Nameless]

When I misspell something it means I was experiencing consternation or anxiety over the thing. I think the Mod is worried GnK is going to deflate this game with a townie vs newbie townie brawl.

(Sorry for the empty post here, but you have to admit that's pretty funny.)

[charter]

Hmm ... I'm going to go with Tony / GK / Wall-E scumteam. Some of Wall-E and GK's interaction seems off (closeness earlier on, prompting by GK to Wall-e, the whole "wake up" vote thing) and Wall-E could be seen buddying with lurker OP (I mentioned the exchange above). Don't know about the SK, there's too many other mildly suspicious players.

I'd actually say Tony, GK, animorph. Regardless, GK is a fine lynch for today.

[GnKoichi]

I'm not really sure how to defend myself at this point. I've been doing the scumhunting that everyone was calling for earlier. No one has really pointed out a good argument against the lying Charter has done. Some people have questioned how it would be helpful for scum to lie as Charter has. That seems like a silly question. It seems any misdirection is only beneficial to scum. They know who we are, we don't know who they are. Any informations is helpful to town. Any lies would thus seem helpful to scum.

Nameless, my point about the seven scum and Charter lashing out are one and the same. I wasn't trying to say that Charters attacks are meaningless. His posts with actual analysis have been the one's I've tried to take seriously. The lynchpin of this argument is that he made four scum predictions with NO REASONS. He refused to give any reasons, and made two lies to avoid having to back up his opinions. My analysis: He is scum, trying to make people look at people who are not scum. He's trying to protect his team by pointing out another potential team (or several, as he's had different theories since then). But he's not planning it through very well. He doesn't have legitimate reasons for those he points out as scum. This is why he lied to avoid giving his thought process.

Since then, he changed his mind saying that pretty much anyone who voted for him must also be scum (or scummy, whatever. I hate the semantics arguments, too, and also hate that I end up having to defend my ideas on that kind of basis). This is the lashing out I was talking about. He's sending baseless scum calls against anyone who votes for him, not to mention the tried and true strategy of continuing to insult other players who don't agree with him.

Lastly, I think his whole defeatest thing is a game. I almost want to believe him. I want to say, wow, scum really wouldn't do that. Scum would fight to the bitter end. Then I remember, I believed him when he said he was too lazy to give his reasons. Then he proved himself a liar (and even later admitted to this lie). I also believed him when he said he wasn't using his suspicions as the basis for his actions, until I remembered the post about Wall-E. I really think Charter has lost the right to be believed at this point. He needs to go.

And Wall-E, Mirth misspelled my name a LONG time ago, I think before any of the Charter/Me feud began. So I don't think your theory holds water. Please bring your vote back. I need you on this.

[charter]

I don't really care if I'm believed or not. I see two options for day one. I get lynched or GK gets lynched. Either way I'm happy, I would just prefer it happen sooner rather than later. This is the longest and dumbest day one I've been a part of in a long time.

And I said I think people are scum, GK. You don't always have to have a nice post detailing why you think someone is scum. I have my own opinions about people that aren't formed from concrete stuff.

[Mirth]

"A reminder to all personnel, all personnel, get a hair cut"

VOTE COUNT

GnKoichi - 5 - [Kmd, charter , Plum, Kiro, Nameless]

Charter - 4 - [GnKoichi, animorpherv, Tony Montana, orangepenguin]

Not Voting - 3 - [Mana_Ku, , Stef, Wall-E]

Tentative Deadline Dec 6

I am now looking for a replacement for Mana

I apologize for any misspellings, I just copy and edit these things, so if you don't point them out, I wont catch them.

[GnKoichi]

You don't always have to say it flat out, no. But when the majority of the other players ask for your reasons, and you give lies instead, that looks pretty scummy.

[Mirth]

EdwardElric replaces Mana.

Tentative deadline moved to Dec 10 because of this

[Kmd4390]

Let me ask this to both Charter and GnK. If you were lynched today, what would you like to see happen Day 2? I'm not saying we should blindly follow what you say. I just feel that in games I've played recently, players aren't paying enough attention to what dead people said before they died. You see people say that we get valuable information from dead townies, but nobody seems to take that info and use it.

Nameless, you should know by now that I like to see things answered before a hammer. That doesn't mean a lynch should never happen though.

[charter]

By the end of day two, I want all these people dead, assuming no major changes. This is the order I'd prefer.

GK, animorph, Tony, maybe OP/Kmd. If for some reason there are more than two anti town people left, I will be astonished.

[GnKoichi]

If I were lynched, I would hope that people would analyze the voting patterns of those who went after me, especially Charter, Nameless, and Plum, since they've given the most "reasons" for wanting me gone. If you all find people to be blameless, thinking that in retrospect they had a good argument, I'd say let it go. Honest mistake. If it seems like something more, I think that should be the basis of your next move. I know that the scum team knows I'm town, so I wouldn't be surprised if you find a common thread in some of the votes against me.

Bigger than that, however, I would want all the lurkers, as well as our new player, to give a FULL analysis post, detailing their reads on all other players. I'd rather that happen today, but I'd settle for it on Day 2.

[orangepenguin]

Bigger than that, however, I would want all the lurkers, as well as our new player, to give a FULL analysis post, detailing their reads on all other players. I'd rather that happen today, but I'd settle for it on Day 2.

All the players? I'd rather not give the scum that info. I'm fine with giving my top suspects and all that, but I am not going to say who I think is the most townest. (yes, that's not a word)

[Nameless]

All the players? I'd rather not give the scum that info. I'm fine with giving my top suspects and all that, but I am not going to say who I think is the most townest. (yes, that's not a word)

OP you say that, but you're yet to give (as GK asked) a

detailed

analysis of ANYthing/one so that doesn't actually mean much coming from you.

[GnKoichi]

Nameless, your catching-up analysis post seems to leave out the biggest thing that happened while you were gone: Charter's lies. How do you feel about posts #398, #400, #403, and #476. Those posts detail the three flat out lies Charter has made. What do you think about this?

I'm worried at this point that I have become my own counter-point. I know I acted somewhat rashly at the beginning of the day, and my original reasons for Charter were weak. But I think I lucked out in that focus on Charter, because it ended up revealing those lies. If you just look at the last third of the game, there's a really strong case against him, and I hope it doesn't look weaker just because I'm the one who pointed it out.

[charter]

You didn't luck out. You had scum tunnel vision.

[Wall-E]

THEY ARE BOTH TOWN AAAAAUGH

*dies of heart failure*

*rises as a concerned zombie*

Vote: OrangePenguin

Tired of your lurkish fluff.

[Wall-E]

When I misspell something it means I was experiencing consternation or anxiety over the thing. I think the Mod is worried GnK is going to deflate this game with a townie vs newbie townie brawl.

(Sorry for the empty post here, but you have to admit that's pretty funny.)

Yeah, I was concerned as I wrote that I'd get lynched for using the most ridiculous metagaming I'd ever heard of.

[orangepenguin]

All the players? I'd rather not give the scum that info. I'm fine with giving my top suspects and all that, but I am not going to say who I think is the most townest. (yes, that's not a word)

OP you say that, but you're yet to give (as GK asked) a

detailed

analysis of ANYthing/one so that doesn't actually mean much coming from you.

...and your point is? You guys don't want me to lurk, yet when I do post, I get stuff like this. So basically, everything I say is utterly meaningless.