STEVEN UNIVERSE MAFIA - GAME OVER

[Titus]

Take it, aiding town imploding is what I do but if town started working together, y'all would have won.

[Drixx]

This flatters me a bit but it will look good on my record.

Ftr RR, i'm not the one blocking the PT and i'm sorry Varsoon uses the awful policy of blocking PTs. We have an awesome 75 page scum PT and it sucks that you won't be able to view it.

As for your masonry logic ... since when are ICs designed to live longer than N4, let alone lylo. I'm surprised no one else really questioned this logic at any point in the game.

As I brought up with Varsoon already, my only issues with this game were the shitty fakeclaims and Vez/Beer being flavour confirmed to each other. If anything it felt a bit scumsided if you fix those two small things, but a lot of towns powerful roles died early so maybe not.

I'm glad we won, I was terrified of another night with no kill possible after that kill on mastin failed.

This is from my PT monologue on D9:

I am not fucking with them. I've just had a kill unexpectedly fail and i'm legitimately concerned the same will happen again tonight. Clearly RR was able to protect mastin, so i'm currently having a punt at drawing this protection away from mastin. Not expecting much, but might as well try, I figure.

Milestone: First successful rolefish of Steven, Day 9. Not bulletproof. Doctor who can choose to self protect? Something weird I can't think of? I wish those two hadn't refused to rolecop RR. "he'll claim soon" they said. Yeah?? D9, where's the claim? Thanks for that.

Also, new paranoia: Hermit is a mass wagon roleblocker? He's the rave guy, after all. I really can't afford to spend tonight dancing. Can't avoid voting Hermit though, so i'll just ignore this thought.

So yeah, I want to hammer Hermit, but I want to at least try and improve my chances should tonight go wrong for me. It's also weirding me out that RR is so willing to rush this day and makes me think he has another card up his sleeve.

We expected to live long enough to actually become innocent child, since we didn't become that until day 5. As designed, we should have died night 4. That's all. A better design would have had seasons be shorter by 1 day, and have you and mastin neibhor with us on the day we can IC, which would have presented us with a lot more choices, and also put our death date at night 6, which is reasonable. Two days to work as IC is fairly strong but not over the top. Lasting all game was a little crazy. We kept wondering when scum was going to shoot at us and it just never happened.

[Titus]

Reasons why Steven doesn't die N4
Bulletproof
Buddying Steven
Grapes Roleblock
NicCage camp on Steven
Strongman still alive
I double kill Steven

[Titus]

I kinda built a good chunk of my game on fooling you RR. Sorry.

[Titus]

The idea was to spread knowledge I was the inventor to limited townies, and just have me not dying suggests whoever knows is town and lynch whoever doesn't. Had to scrap that though after awhile.

[Cerberus v666]

Anyways, so, my thoughts.

1) Drixx is right. Setting our slot up to be killed on N3 or N4 extremely consistently is pretty shitty. I don't think it's quite as bad as Drixx thinks it is, but it certainly isn't okay to get a slot that just dies.

2) Xtoxm, why didn't you just hammer? Were you afraid of some vengeful/supersaint variant, or were you afraid you'd be unable to get the kill off tonight? Drixx and I had a post read to make in our neighborhood to test you(confirming that we protected, and implying that we had a shot left), but before we ended up getting together to make sure it said what we wanted it to say(cause damnit I had to play DnD last night instead of working on that post with Drixx), you had voted. The first draft of that post is in our PT, on the last page, between the walls of text from my irc chats with Drixx about the game.

3) The game was lost when grapes hammered fuzzy in an extremely scummy fashion. At the moment he got hammered, we had already cleared him, like 90%, and were working to reconcile why he had seemed to forget that his lie detect power, as claimed to us in our PT, didn't work unless he was allied with the target of it. If fuzzy hadn't died, xtoxm was basically obligated to kill fuzzy that night(out of paranoia, at least, that he had lied about how his lie detect worked and he could catch xtoxm). Even if we had been swayed on fuzzy, and ended up lynching him anyways, we would have had enough time to plan our alliances, and then we would have realized it was STUPID to ally klingon that night, when we needed to ensure we had an alliance the next day so we could bodyguard two nights in a row.

The above, btw, is why I wouldn't say I'm a sore loser(beyond my knowledge of my own personality). I know exactly where and how the game was lost, and I know the part I had in it. If anybody does bother reading all the stuff drixx and I wrote, I even say it in there that if we lose, it's 100% because of drixx and myself. Even with grapes hammer, we still could have changed who we were allying that night to mastin in our pt, or to xtoxm(who would have been kinda obligated to ally us), and that would have put us in a position to give the town the chance to use nic cages watching ability one more time, plus keeping town from dying, so we could have easily confirmed who the last scum was.

[Varsoon]

I was far too ambitious with a lot of the roles and flavor--the next game should still have fun interactions and such, but I'm probably going to dial back those other aspects a lot.
I learned a lot about modding from this game. I also felt like I was under a lot of pressure, as the scum team constantly expressed how broken town was and several town players were constantly frustrated about how strong the scum team was. ><
Maybe that's a good indicator, I don't know.

Regardless, like I said, my next non-bastard game (based on the anime/manga Parasyte) will be far less over-the-top/rolemadness/crazy.

[Xtoxm]

I am glad the game made it to a lylo situation, honestly.

This is generally a pretty good indication of balance.

@Cerb, I was just worried about you and your protection for the coming night phase (that i'm glad wasn't needed in the end). Hermit was obviously not a fucking supersaint and I was beginning to build up annoyance that I would be caught for the wrong reason. You really seemed too confident today, and voted far more quickly than what i'd expect from you in a lylo situation, so I thought you had means to block my night kill again for a 3p lylo.

[Drixx]

It makes me a bit sick actually. We had a post ready to try and make Xtoxm think that mislynching wouldn't help him because we were going to claim to be able to self protect and protect Mastin again, and we worked out how we expected him to respond if scum ... and we didn't use it.

@Titus - If you read our hydra PT, you'll see that we basically never trusted you, but did our very best to give the impression that we did but were just being cautious.

[Titus]

2) I can eliminate supersaint as a possibility.

Farside rolecopped as supersaint, so we nked him after I went down. We needed everyone viable as an ml to win and Farside wasn't and not likely to be watched or healed.

It was your bulletproof that fucked up Xtoxm.

[St Constantine the Hermit]

Great game guys.
Awesome moderating Varsoon, you earned some serious rep points from this game.

My only complaint is that I think lynching me was incredibly stupid that final day, but I guess I have to adapt to account for bad scope from other players during Mylo.
Thinking Mastin2 was scum seems a bit of a stretch now that I consider it as well.

Best players were Maxwell, Titus, and Cerberus by far. Titus actually had the model scum play this game if it were not for RR calling her out on that slip.

Xtoxm, you played like a pro, but I am wondering why you drew out the ending. Did you think I was a supersaint? Cerberus unvoting and you revoting is the equivalent of declaring yourself scum, but I guess you knew what you were doing since you got Cerberus to hammer.

[St Constantine the Hermit]

I think we might of won if I didn't have that change of heart on Mastin2 and opened the day going hard on Xtoxm.

[Drixx]

I am glad the game made it to a lylo situation, honestly.

This is generally a pretty good indication of balance.

@Cerb, I was just worried about you and your protection for the coming night phase (that i'm glad wasn't needed in the end). Hermit was obviously not a fucking supersaint and I was beginning to build up annoyance that I would be caught for the wrong reason. You really seemed too confident today, and voted far more quickly than what i'd expect from you in a lylo situation, so I thought you had means to block my night kill again for a 3p lylo.

We were going to test you, but the way Constantine played the day, he tipped the scales. You guys were probably both pretty even in our minds for a long time. In our original planned lynch order, you came before him even. But his play was just so scummy today. You did a good job. Playing as the last scum, especially for a few weeks, is really quite a lot more mentally taxing than people realize until they're doing it. Playing it to a win is super satisfying. Enjoy it. I know I enjoyed the hell out of winning SMITE.

[St Constantine the Hermit]

This was a really tough one to lose, since I can be pretty competitive as town. I kind of saw from the start of mylo that I was going to be lynched one way or another.

Since I had fun though and got to learn about some of the veteran players here, I can walk away quite satisfied.

[Xtoxm]

I liked these posts at the time and even more given the outcome.

Yea only the one reason.

I'm not going to rant.
I'm not going to bitch but eventually someone can smack rr.
He may not have get it today and maybe not the next lynch but God I hope lylo he gets a clue.

Vote: tw

It's an incredibly weak power in town hands. Scum are more interested in killing things like investigatives (Skybird) and protectives (Nic) and Steven. Hermit also has a blatantly anti town attitude, he's the type of player you look at when you're scum and say "I want this guy around in lylo". I think it's fair to speculate that scum would not ever kill a town-Hermit in this game.

[St Constantine the Hermit]

Drixx

- Pro tip. Plays are only scummy when the player ends up being scum. You can't go around using that as an excuse for mislynching, but I think I know where you are trying to come from.

[Drixx]

Well ... I guess Constantine

really

doesn't like me.

Well, he was close anyway: onto the WotC list goes SCtH.

[Xtoxm]

I am glad the game made it to a lylo situation, honestly.

This is generally a pretty good indication of balance.

@Cerb, I was just worried about you and your protection for the coming night phase (that i'm glad wasn't needed in the end). Hermit was obviously not a fucking supersaint and I was beginning to build up annoyance that I would be caught for the wrong reason. You really seemed too confident today, and voted far more quickly than what i'd expect from you in a lylo situation, so I thought you had means to block my night kill again for a 3p lylo.

We were going to test you, but the way Constantine played the day, he tipped the scales. You guys were probably both pretty even in our minds for a long time. In our original planned lynch order, you came before him even. But his play was just so scummy today. You did a good job. Playing as the last scum, especially for a few weeks, is really quite a lot more mentally taxing than people realize until they're doing it. Playing it to a win is super satisfying. Enjoy it. I know I enjoyed the hell out of winning SMITE.

Thank you. <3

[St Constantine the Hermit]

Drixx

Keep trying m8

You and Cerberus have the potential to be some kick ass players. Don't let constructive criticism demotivate you.
A couple times this game I tried to give you advice, but you interpreted like I was demeaning you, and I didn't want you to go away with that sort of vibe.

[Xtoxm]

Drixx

- Pro tip. Plays are only scummy when the player ends up being scum. You can't go around using that as an excuse for mislynching, but I think I know where you are trying to come from.

This is true, the onus is on the IC to make the correct decision in a lylo situation. However this does not excuse your lack of effort for the majority of the game.

[Cerberus v666]

I am glad the game made it to a lylo situation, honestly.

This is generally a pretty good indication of balance.

@Cerb, I was just worried about you and your protection for the coming night phase (that i'm glad wasn't needed in the end). Hermit was obviously not a fucking supersaint and I was beginning to build up annoyance that I would be caught for the wrong reason. You really seemed too confident today, and voted far more quickly than what i'd expect from you in a lylo situation, so I thought you had means to block my night kill again for a 3p lylo.

Ugh. Go read that post in our PT when Varsoon makes it available, please. The entire point of it was to determine if you were waiting to hammer because you were afraid we'd protect, and if you were still wary about voting after we made it, we'd know you were scum.

pedit: We knew supersaint was a stretch, but the hesitance to hammer, or even just vote, was EXTREMELY confusing, given that it was known by xtoxm that we'd be voting for constantine. We'd make that clear in the PT.

peditx2!: Constantine, it's a fundamental difference in play styles. Gut doesn't mean anything to me. Like, gut means so little to me that I'm inclined to think you're an idiot if it's the reason you give for anything, without any backing. It means a bit more to Drixx, but that's because he views it as a precursor to conscious deduction. Seriously, all you had to do was do what we asked, and we would have thought about it. You gave us no reason to think that you weren't a clever scum godfather killing the cop because, as cleared scum, there's no reason for you to kill the cop.

[St Constantine the Hermit]

Xtoxm

I'm expecting people to realize sooner than later that my meta is unconventional.
A lot of players have expressed frustration at their inability to read me. Burn it with fire! <--- That kind of thing.

If you want someone to not lurk though, that isn't me. I have to lurk given how long the time interval is between day and night.

[St Constantine the Hermit]

Cerberus

Don't mean to break it to you, but the only thing that means anything in this game is gut.
Notice how the veteran players become more and more susceptible to short one line posts over walls.

[Titus]

Cerb, finally someone with my play style. I wanted to test a theory for years I had. When I was first playing on another site, Damus_Graves, told me that by ignoring gut that I would be vulnerable to logic based attacks. By withholding information and revealing selectively, I do think the theory holds true somewhat.

[Titus]

Cerberus

Don't mean to break it to you, but the only thing that means anything in this game is gut.
Notice how the veteran players become more and more susceptible to short one line posts over walls.

Hands down no.