Double-Dip Mafia, Game Over

[[Low Key]]

As of right now, after reading post #206, I am def confirm vote Hiraki. More on this after I catch up.

[[Low Key]]

Unvote Small, vote iam

y u vote iam

QFT.

[[Low Key]]

Ok done.

First of all I want to say that after catching up from 5 pages back, I am a little embarassed over my behavior. I definitely got off on the wrong foot with Smalls and Ran. I think my best play is when I am more "Spock"-like. I start playing bad when I get more like "Bones"; playing emotionally in the moment. So I want to apologize to everyone and start fresh here now that I've caught up.

If I had to call a 3-man scum team it would be: Hiraki, Crazy, Ran. They all seem to be saying the same things and voting in the same way (even though that might not be immediately apparent). I find it interesting that Ran leaves Hiraki out of his list of queries in post #319 and instead talks about how Amelia is so bad for being on Hiraki's wagon.

If there is a 4th scum member they are hiding pretty well and I haven't made up my mind on who those candidates might be.

But as it is, trying to call the scum team this early is pretty dangerous. I am torn on whether my second vote should be on Crazy or on Ran -- I REALLY disliked Crazy's #309 catchup post and it confirms my early scum read of him but I also dislike Ran's voting and Hiraki defending. Hiraki, Crazy and Ran just all read as 3 peas in a pod to me.

I am going to focus on Hiraki though. I noticed several very strange things about his post #206. There is a person in this room that once said:

"Whether a person believes what they are saying or not is the foundation upon which all scum hunting is built."

I don't think Hiraki believes what he has been saying and I will show this below but in addition to that I think we have all seen that Hiraki has done nothing this game but

OMGUS his own wagon to the exclusion of all else

. I was hoping his post #206 would fix that but I got the opposite reaction:

1) Says he didn't know Eli question was a question?
2) Says Iam's question was confusing?
3) Has a scum list I have no idea where he got it (Iam, Imagine, Eli) all 3 are leaning town in my book.

I'm bored, so I'll answer these in detail.

First off, your first question is extremely inconsequential.

This is RVS, it's got nothing to do with the real game

.

This is such a terrible argument on its own merits BUT I have seen Hiraki scum hunt in RVS before and use it as a scum hunting tool so,

LIE

. Why does Hiraki need to lie about the value of the RVS in his own defense?

To continue, the question, as written asks, "Who's played with Furry before."

Considering I knew no one by the name of Furry, and I'm never interested in the NK of N1, I had no clue what Elliberith was talking about.

There is so much wrong with this post. First of all I want everyone to link below and stare at the green part from our Mod and look closely at the post below it and then repeat like a shampoo bottle until you get this weird like "aha!" feeling: Hiraki Link

I stared at that for probably a minute and I just can't believe Hiraki could say he didn't know who was night killed. Here's what I think happened there:

I think Eli called out the NK and Hiraki thought, "Wow NK speculation looks like an easy 'scum' target" as evidenced by this post:

Hiraki licks his chops

But then he suddenly realizes that he's actually the one being scum hunted and has to double back and say that he had no idea who Furry even was which he tries to explain here:

After snooping around, I finally caught on to what she was doing. That's why there was a delayed response between my first post regarding Elliberith's post, and the second post.

But before I am done with that, why does Hiraki call it N1??

For me, I was sitting around for 4 frustrating days and I definitely saw it as N0. But he calls it N1. Because for him it

WAS

N1 with his scum buddies in the QT.

I hope they had a good time on deciding to kill Furry because I wasn't having fun. I was like Smalls, you know, "what to do?".

After that he really doesn't defend against the scum reads issue but just says "Wrong."

And not you forgetting which of Empking and imaginality was supposed to be a serious vote.

First off, this is shitty grammar. I can't, and still can't, make out what Iamusername wants me to say here, or anything I can possibly say here. The only thing that I can see, is that Iamusername is implying more about my counting error which is a horribly small snippet of the case that's iamusername is making a mountain out of a molehill.

Iam has spoken the King's English here. I can't see why you thought it was confusing. You seem to understand it here but before you said it was confusing. So which is it?

We're 10 pages in. There's nothing that has been produced from the Furry question.

No, I think something HAS been produced. I think he caught scum on page 1 and its you.

and then jump on him if he failed to do anything useful with them at that point.

And here we are. I believe Elliberith has enough information, no?

Where's the jumping. oh right you can't do that.

I just did.

Hiraki just fits the overall profile of caught scum lying and trying to discredit the means by which he was caught. He is obviously overly concerned with his wagon and has done zero scum hunting. His scum list is scumtatsic and he has done nothing to support it.

He needs to hang and today.

[[Low Key]]

Also, I forgot. Check out post #288 where he attempts to coerce a newbie into unvoting him. Shameful that.

[petroleumjelly]

Day One: Vote Count #13

6 Hiraki (Pomegranate, iamausername, smallpeoples343, [Low Key], Amrun, Ameliaslay)
3 kunkstar7 (WeyounsLastClone, Ranmaru, RedCoyote)
3 Ranmaru ([Low Key], Ameliaslay, Empking)
3 WeyounsLastClone (Amrun, Empking, Pomegranate)
2 Ameliaslay (Ranmaru, imaginality)
2 iamausername (Hiraki, Ellibereth)
2 imaginality (Hiraki, Crazy)
1 Amrun (WeyounsLastClone)
1 Crazy (Ellibereth)
1 Ellibereth (Crazy)
1 Empking (iamausername)
1 Pomegranate (imaginality)
1 smallpeoples343 (RedCoyote)

With

15

alive, it takes

8

to lynch. Deadline is July 15 at 4:00 PM PDT.

Not Voting – 1 – kunkstar7

[Ranmaru]

Lk, I have addressed people I felt haven't given much content or stances. Hiraki wasn't the only person I didn't address.

How exactly were we saying the same things? How does that make us scum?

How exactly were we voting the same? Are we voting the same? How does that make us scum?

Where did I say Slay was being bad for being on Hiraki's wagon exactly?

[[Low Key]]

Slay just used bad reasoning and justified it with GUT.

Which means there's something wrong. I'm glad you inadvertently agree.

Well it either means there is something newb scummy, or just newbie because it seems Slay is used to seeing scum being activity police, especially with seeing how Small's played in his scum game, it could be possible that was her site meta. Plus it seems Slay has offsite experience:

/in? I don't know if I have three games under my belt though....

Due to Petry stating that he knows Slay has ton of experience, it sounds like they have offsite experience together and has seen him play quite a bit. This is only a theory though.

Do you agree?

You're all over it here.

[Ranmaru]

Right, but where in that quote do I say that Slay was bad for

being on Hiraki's wagon

?

How exactly were we saying the same things? How does that make us scum?

How exactly were we voting the same? Are we voting the same? How does that make us scum?

[[Low Key]]

First part its in red. You are demonstrating the same motivation for your actions; people on the same team would share the same motivations. You are all voting badly and I think because you are all scum but I know its dangerous to wear a tinfoil hat so early. I think we have definitely caught scum with Hiraki but you say nothing. You just query your wagon and attack Amelia for voting Hiraki.

[Ranmaru]

You do? Just like you did with Smalls? You only noticed Hiraki was scummy after your theory of Small = scum was disproven.

You never mentioned Hiraki until your #186. You then voted him in your #204. Tell me, if you believe you have caught Hiraki scum, why haven't you said nothing of it before your 186?

[you have mentioned him in your #34 once before but it was referring mechanics therefore it is irrelevant to you 'catching Hiraki scum', here is the quote "@Hiraki: Can you please just unvote and re-vote or at least explain where your two votes stand?"]

I never attacked Slay for

being on

Hiraki's wagon, I think you may need to re-read what I actually said.

How exactly do you think we are voting badly? What makes a

good

vote? What essentially makes those scum tells?

What did you think of this? -
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p3166372

What did Elli's vote on Iam make you think of him?

What do you mean I queried my wagon?

Amelia has no scum tells in her entry post. You either did not read or have conveniently forgotten my case on Smalls. He posted a "who/why me" post (which is a scum tell in itself) and that in combination with his RVS votes in a content full thread demonstrate a desire to fit in while avoiding suspicion for any stances. There is plenty of scum motivation in that post. You can't point to any such thing in Amelia's post.

You jumped on her for saying she was busy and would catch up soon

: read disingenuous grasping at straws.

Btw I never jumped on Slay for saying that he was too busy. Where have I said that?

[Ranmaru]

Also, how are we all sharing the same motivation? What motivation is that?

[[Low Key]]

Hiraki's behavior really came under scuntiny for me with his defense of smalls and I mentioned as much. The full cog-dis about Hiraki Page 1 didn't come full circle for me until his defense post #206. That explained everything for me and so I took the appropriate action. If Hiraki had properly defended in #206 like he claimed, I was prepared to unvote him.

You ARE criticizing her for being on his wagon because she is on his wagon and you are criticizing her. I don't see why you are so hung up about it.

A bad scum list is a scum tell.

I had no problems with Pom's post that you linked but imagine makes some good points about her. I just read her as town at this point.

Eli has yet to explain his Iam vote.

What you are doing right now is querying your wagon. You did the same thing with some others earlier. In a sense you are doing the same thing as Hiraki, its just that you are better at it.

You jumped on Amelia for a vote where she clearly said she was returning to explain. Just as I said and again you are hung up on it.

[[Low Key]]

Here's something for you Ran. If you are town I want you to think about this and see what you come up with. Don't you see similarities between what Hiraki is saying and what Crazy is saying? Don't you see them like talking from the same perspective? Like ISO them and see if you get my drift on that.

[smallpeoples343]

Wow. A 5/6 post talk about why you guys called me smalls. I feel so special (and partially small. )

[[Low Key]]

Smalls you actually made a good point about Hiraki OMGUS-ing his wagon. You helped in the scum hunting process there. Good work.

[smallpeoples343]

1) A little random question always helps. RQS in the middle of Day 1 FTW!
2) Thanks!
3) He always seemed a little too eager to lynch me.

[[Low Key]]

Actually that's where you made a mistake though. He never voted you or wanted your lynch. It was the opposite. Now Amrun sees that as a scum tell. Amrun has a point.

[smallpeoples343]

Oh really? *checking back*

Sorry Hiraki. Apparently I was wrong about that accusation about you being part of my L-1.

[[Low Key]]

But that's the secret about tryiong to find scum and pursuing cases; even if they are wrong they stir the pot and generate reactions that can be read. That's why its good to pay attention and pursue scummy things.

[[Low Key]]

Oh really? *checking back*

Sorry Hiraki. Apparently I was wrong about that accusation about you being part of my L-1.

How did you find that out in less than 3 minutes?

[smallpeoples343]

I looked for all of my posts, which they aren't a lot of. I also used the find thing. (Ctrl+F)

The post I was looking for had an accusation of me accusing Hiraki that he was part of my L-1. I searched a close wording and found it.

[[Low Key]]

Ok I did the same thing but how did that show you that you were wrong??

[smallpeoples343]

Vote Count on same page.

[[Low Key]]

Ok ya, that's how I checked it myself but I actually ISO'ed the Mod.

[smallpeoples343]

ISO?