Well then, I have a lot to say, now, I suppose. My absence in this game for most of the first half of Day 2 is going to make some of what I say look 'Opportunistic', but I'll clarify all of those concerns later in the post.
AndyTony wrote:I think Guiseppe is defending himself against the guilt of EMP's meta, rather than guilt in this game.
Yes! I, in my defense of Empking, was unsure of his guilt. Please recall, I was defending him from a policy lynch, as seen here:
Giuseppe wrote:Any real reason you're setting me and Zwet up to be lynched?
I hardly say that stopping a quick lynch of Empking qualifies as defending him overtly. Let him actually have a chance to be scummy before you lynch him, at the very least.
Dejkha's been conveniently leaving out the fact that at that time, I had no read on Emp's alignment. I was defending him from a Quick Lynch, not from any lynch. I'm actually going to advocate for his lynch further down in the post, as I've seen his scumminess within this game.
What's more, I was the
only
one defending him from a policy lynch at that point in the game. Copying what others have said? No. Bandwagoning? No. Following along? No.
That was initiative of my own, and it's not like it was some petty, little thing to try. Defending Empking, Lord knows, isn't a popular decision. Zwet and Dejkha's attitudes on the matter are more than a testament to that. I defended Empking because I felt that his lynch would be disadvantageous at that time. Emphasis on 'At that time'.
You'll recall that before Millar's little stunt, I had no distinct suspicions. I was trying to stop Emp from being quick lynched. With Millar's appearance, I had a suspicion, and followed up on it with all haste. When someone claims scum, why lallygag?
I find that there's a certain quandary you're placing me in through your arguments against me. Half the time what you say I do is that I follow people around, like a sheep. The other half of the time I'm being opportunistic, and making grabs where I can.
To me, these don't compute, and they fail to make accounts for what I have done to counter these.
Examples of Leadership Include:
1. Defending Empking from a quick lynch.
2. Voting Millar13 for his scum claim. *People started voting for him
after
I did, and for the same reasons*
As for opportunism, well, it's much harder to cite an example of a topic so ill-defined. It comes down to opinion whether one sees my actions as opportunistic or not. When a person claims scum, is it not right to vote them? I had no suspects before, and then I had one. Opportunism, or simply a wanting to put forth original material on someone who I thought was scum?
In the end, a lot of Dej's argument against me lies in twisting my motive: I was defending Emp from a quick lynch, not a total lynch. I was not acting sheep-like in the case against Millar, as I started it.
To continue, what about this quote:
dejkha wrote:Millar was a threat to himself, not town, or whatever faction he was on. He didn't care if he was lynched and it's extremely rare that scum will claim and truthfully give up their scumbuddy. From the moment he self voted, it should've been clear that we weren't getting anymore out of him.
If he was town, he hurts the town through his behavior. He's not an isolated player; his actions affect which ever side he's on. He was a threat to the town because he was acting anti-town, there's not much more to say about it. My questions to Millar were to at the very least try to get information: you say that when he self-voted it was hopeless, and I say that he who does not try has a 100% chance of failure.
dejkha wrote:You seem to repeat what people say, which may be due to the time in which you read the game and it's after everyone else has said everything there is to say, but your defense of Emp as a scumbuddy is
supported by the NK
.
Did you really just try and use the NK as a piece of evidence against me? Isn't that WIFOM out the wazoo? That sits really ill with me that you'd try to devise the motives of the scum out of the night action. Not to mention that I was defending Empking against the quick lynch, not a real lynch.
So, yeah, that's my defense. If I forgot a point, please notify me, and I'll put forward my argument.
* * *
So, my suspect? Well, here's the part where everyone screams: 'Opportunistic!' I was V/LA for a couple of days, and so thus, my opinions come late, and that really doesn't help me all that much.
That said, Empking has more than proven his lack of usefulness to the Town now, and I can and will vote for him by the end of this post. Before my argument, let me say it again: I was against his quick lynch, not his lynch for the entire game.
So, well, Empking has officially proven himself to not only be anti-Town, but also destructive to the game environment. His unexplained accusations of lies and just general OMGUS insults... *For example this quote in response to Dej*:
Empking wrote:Just typical stupidf Dejhka.
(sic)
...show that he's degenerated past the point of putting forth useful, substantive arguments. The neutral that he began with, as all players at the start of every Mafia game that I play with them do, on my ScumScale has now fallen deep into the depths of Scum and villainy.
His single sentence posts against AndyTony feel childish, unhelpful, and insulting, and they do not put forth any useful information towards the discussion. I propose the lynch of Empking not because of the fact that he is Empking, as Zwet and Dej have been advocating since the beginning, but because his behavior at this point in the game has derailed proper discussion, been inflammatory to at least one of the parties involved, and made me ashamed that I gave him the benefit of the doubt.
Vote: Empking
I'm not currently aware of the vote count, and would like to have one.
Mod, Vote Count please?
On a side note, I don't approve of any of the petty name-calling going on between Empking and Dej&Co., and would request that you guys stop bickering and progress towards a more pro-Town aim than vendettas that existed outside of this game. If that means ignoring each other, so be it.
Just type Giu.
