Xenoblade Mafia (Game Over)

[borkjerfkin]

r

[Majiffy]

r

[Varsoon]

What you really don't understand is that anyone and everyone in this game realizes I'm getting lynched. There aren't many roles out there that are so important, you'd think of sacrificing another scum just to save scum for one more day. Ergo, bullshit on Varsoon's comment. Plus, this lynch was seen weeks ago. Were I a power role, my actions would've been fully implemented yesterday.

So bullshit, Varsoon. You didn't think that one through at all.

not following.

Why is everyone attributing Spinachattack's 2994 comment to me?

So bullshit, AJ. You didn't think that one through at all.

[Nachomamma8]

Sorry, I've been busy moving a friend out of the apartment/in to the house so I've been busy all day/tomorrow too.
Though I feel like I have visited with you a bit, I'm down for more quality time. How do you want to spend it?

talk to me when you're not busy
i want your townie best

Not really? I said I didn't like him because it seemed he just dropped his suspicion of Sajin suddenly, without really a reason (I mean I know he said he'd reread him but the answer to Orc seems artificial and it doesn't feel right coming from someone who just had a suspicion of Sajin at the end of the day before.)

Venmar seems the type of player to do that regardless of alignment, don't you think?

okay varsoon is looking pretty bad right now

why?
take me inside the mind of scum-Varsoon.

Okay

So are we lynching varsoon before or after aj

Because we're lynching varsoon

if all you're going to do is show up and tunnel without reasons, well
you're not going to get a lot of the things you want to get

What you really don't understand is that anyone and everyone in this game realizes I'm getting lynched. There aren't many roles out there that are so important, you'd think of sacrificing another scum just to save scum for one more day. Ergo, bullshit on Varsoon's comment. Plus, this lynch was seen weeks ago. Were I a power role, my actions would've been fully implemented yesterday.

You also understand you're getting lynched and you know that i will listen to you while you're going down. Instead, you're shutting down completely, not cursing my name, not yelling at me, not anything really. If you want to talk, I'm here. Even though you're scum.

[Nachomamma8]

hum. Didn't get what I quote tagged from the first page of ISO.

Regardless, B&B, why aren't you scum?

lol

I am going to love reading this scumboard

you said yourself you think 2 is a better player than all of us why the fuck do you think I would bus them like that. like that does not even make sense.

VARSOON DOES NOT MAKE SENSE
IN EVERY SINGLE ONE OF HIS TOWNGAMES (EVERY SINGLE ONE)
HE GETS LYNCHED D1
EXCEPT FOR ONE
WHERE I SAID THIS TYPE OF THOUGHT PROCESS CAN'T BE FAKED
IT'S TOO FUCKING CRAZY TO BE FAKED
AND IS THERE REASON FOR HIM TO FAKE IT
NO
HELL NO
UNLESS HE KNOWS I WILL TOWNREAD HIM FOR IT AND I WILL NOT BE AROUND FOREVER
SO IT'S A SHIT SCUM STRATEGY
VARSOON'S SCUMGAME IS BORING
boring as hell
he's sensible, he's too helpful, he doesn't rock the boat
when varsoon is town
he rocks the fuck out of every boat because his thought process is free. he has no reason to keep it inside; it's absolutely everywhere. that's what he is this game. at all.

[Nachomamma8]

Varsoon town:

I'd rather lynch the newb. Why? It prevents you underestimating them, and, furthermore, you can meta the experienced ones. Every scum has the same level of power in the game (that is, a night kill) outside of PRs, so if it's equally likely that both are scum, the question becomes not so much who holds tangible power but what the nature of intangible power is.

Varsoon scum:

Oh right, now i get you, it read like scum sitting there forgeting that confirming someone town means confirming the scum

Makes sense.
Still, I don't want the time issue to make us over-rush things. We should be really sure about who we lynch. I'd rather not risk a mislynch on something that isn't substantial, or a fluke.

That said, I wish Voided could come in and make some comments. It hasn't been that long since his last post, but I feel like it's better to have a lot of posts and interactions to look at and garner reads from rather than just a few.

Varsoon town:

No, you didn't. But if you start talking about 'not-so-talkative' people, you should have at least players in mind.
Because it's way too early to talk about things like that. Take me for example. Just after you posted it, I was done with dinner. Before I started posting, I only had 1 post. Why? Because of my sister's birthday, staying over at my boyfriend's and work. People have lives and calling them out after one day of playing is bad.
I want the pre-game over and you, Serra and Untrod caught my interest during it. For me, it's good enough to look at it.

Pre-game is over.

Let's keep our personal lives out of the game. ATE comes up sometimes and I'd rather it not in this one. I've seen games where scum has lurked 15 pages and made clever dodges about family and loved ones in order to dodge suspicion. We all, as players, understand that people are busy and can't lurk the forums 24/7. I think that we can also agree that if a player makes no post within about 5 days, they should be scrutinized.

With as many power roles as there are, it's an interesting set up. We, however, should play as if there are just town and mafia for now. PRs can become an issue to think about after the first day. Talking about it today will only lead to fluff discussion and won't get to the core of what needs to get done--scumhunting.

I'm going to go on a limb and say that one of the people posting so far is scum. Why? Scum often posts early on in threads instead of waiting to introduce and post. Also, it's statistically likewise, too, assuming a 1 to 3 scum/town ratio.

Varsoon scum:

@Orozorro: I don't like participating in RVS. I'd rather do something to get players engaged and out of random voting and flinging baseless accusations until something sticks.

Yeah, that should definitely read "I'd rather not give them that pleasure."


I'm kinda curious as to what AA means about balancing it out, myself.

Orozorro, what do you think of the other players?

[Andrius]

Nacholove I'm here
Are you?

[Andrius]

predit: ohai yes you are

You have my undivided attention, save for catching up on the last two pages

[spinachattack]

not following.

Why is everyone attributing Spinachattack's 2994 comment to me?

So bullshit, AJ. You didn't think that one through at all.

Because it was directed at you, or more specifically your comment about wheels falling off the AJ wagon. Then AJ pretty much confirmed his back hair and threw you under the bus for the bad comment:

What you really don't understand is that anyone and everyone in this game realizes I'm getting lynched. There aren't many roles out there that are so important, you'd think of sacrificing another scum just to save scum for one more day. Ergo, bullshit on Varsoon's comment. Plus, this lynch was seen weeks ago. Were I a power role, my actions would've been fully implemented yesterday.

So bullshit, Varsoon. You didn't think that one through at all.

[Nachomamma8]

2. Aj The Epic - bad
3. Andrius - good
4. BeautyAndTheBeast - good
5. BROseidon - good
6. Cabd - good
7. Venmar - good
8. Ghostlin - good
9. GuyInFreezer - good
10. Ser Arthur Dayne - bad
12. Metal Sonic - good
13. orcinus_theorigina - good
14. RachMarie - good
15. Sajin - good
17. Nachomamma8 - good
18. TiphaineDeath - good
19. spinachattack - bad
20. Varsoon - good

Here's where I lie. Where do we differ?

[Andrius]

2. Aj The Epic - bad
3. Andrius - good
4. BeautyAndTheBeast - good
5. BROseidon - good
6. Cabd - good
7. Venmar - good
8. Ghostlin - good
9. GuyInFreezer - good
10. Ser Arthur Dayne - bad
12. Metal Sonic - good
13. orcinus_theorigina - good
14. RachMarie - good
15. Sajin - good
17. Nachomamma8 - good
18. TiphaineDeath - good
19. spinachattack - bad
20. Varsoon - good

Here's where I lie. Where do we differ?

Yes we do; just a bit.

2. I still think AJ is town even if jiffy wants to bust my balls over the read. (Honestly I don't think he's scum for it, I just think he's trying to divine whether or not

I'm

scum by pressuring my read to see if it holds under pressure.)
10. I think the keybladewielder slot is iffy at best. Seemed like a weak player, so the scumtells I did see could be coming from that line of town-logic but who knows. Still wonder about it though.
12. Iffy on MS.
19. Agree that spinachattack is bad.
20. VARSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON. Scummier than townier. The reaction was better than I expected. Going to look into 2's stuff and wagon analysis and whatnot since 2 was a major read for me so I now have to find a new kingpin to chase after.

Yes, I know there's a lack of scumreads here but 2 was my big one so I'm happy with that and need to reevaluate varsoon regarding the 2 wagon and that response.

[Andrius]

One more note.
jiffy makes me question that hydra at times though I trust your read in mollie, even if she doesn't trust me herself. Couple bumps here and there but what doesn't?

[Nachomamma8]

2. I still think AJ is town even if jiffy wants to bust my balls over the read. (Honestly I don't think he's scum for it, I just think he's trying to divine whether or not I'm scum by pressuring my read to see if it holds under pressure.)

why town? what do you think of his play today? have you read my wallpost on him; what problems do you have with that?

10. I think the keybladewielder slot is iffy at best. Seemed like a weak player, so the scumtells I did see could be coming from that line of town-logic but who knows. Still wonder about it though.

iffy bad is close enough

12. Iffy on MS.

that's OK too

20. VARSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON. Scummier than townier. The reaction was better than I expected. Going to look into 2's stuff and wagon analysis and whatnot since 2 was a major read for me so I now have to find a new kingpin to chase after.

what do you think of my recent posting on him?

[Andrius]

...I've posted and quoted and requoted my thing on AJ. You look that up, I'll look up the rest of those posts if I miss them in the catchup.

Re: KBW
Yes, yes it is.

Re: MS
sounds good to me

Re: varsoon
working my way down the pages...

[Nachomamma8]

[11] ² (

Andrius

,

orcinus_theoriginal

,

Nachomamma8

,

BROseidon

,

Sajin

,

GuyInFreezer

,

Varsoon

,

Venmar

)

[3] waynegg (Ghostlin,

Aj The Epic

)
[2] Metal Sonic (

Cabd, TiphaineDeath

)
[1] Aj The Epic (

RachMarie

)
[1] orcinus_theoriginal (waynegg)
[1] TiphaineDeath (

Metal Sonic

)

[1] Not Voting (

Ser Arthur Dayne

)

Reads mixed with last votecount.

Majiffy: Andrius, BRO, AJ, Cabd, TD, SAD is where we differ
The harshest differences are with AJ and Cabd; TD and Andrius differences I can live with (Andrius especially, since mollie), and SAD you'll need to explain to me because no one in that slot has done anything good.

[Andrius]

TD and Andrius differences I can live with (Andrius especially, since mollie)

...someone explain this
because all I hear is cabd's voice in my head

[Cabd]

TD and Andrius differences I can live with (Andrius especially, since mollie)

...someone explain this
because all I hear is cabd's voice in my head

Why is my voice in your head?

[Varsoon]

Nacho's right. I should probably play scummier in my scum games. Or maybe just less vocal? Ahhh, it's be way to obvious!

Anyway, here's my clothing, out to dry:

2. Aj The Epic - Scummy. Has accepted defeat, but seems like he's really pushing to see my lynch. Reading that as scum trying to line up a lynch on me after he flips.
3. Andrius - I dunno, I just don't know how to feel about andy. I think the slot might be scum. He seems like scum to me.
4. BeautyAndTheBeast - Iffy on this. Leaning scum.
5. BROseidon - Town.
6. Cabd - Leaning scum, don't like any of my interactions with him. Also, he won't order me a pizza. I really don't like his approaches.
7. Venmar - Ooof. This slot's a hard call. There's some weird tunneling happening at places, too. Scum?
8. Ghostlin - Town. I like my interactions with Ghostlin.
9. GuyInFreezer - Town, until I get paranoid again.
10. Ser Arthur Dayne - Scummy. The slot's done a lot of nothing this game.
12. Metal Sonic - I think he's town.
13. orcinus_theorigina - Definitely town, until I get paranoid, that is.
14. RachMarie - She's Rach.
15. Sajin - Dunno. Null here.
17. Nachomamma8 - Townboss.
18. TiphaineDeath - Scummy, but I've been over this.
19. spinachattack - Mitebscum. I didn't really like the slot before, but the new hydra just -feels- scummy.
20. Varsoon - Town, but nonsense.

[Nachomamma8]

AJ's first post is a great entry post.

It's sort of funny, but not particularly town.

Focus on TD and ignoring the issue of millertracker is also town.

Why is ignoring millertracker issue town?

Don't see scum_AJ arguing with towngod_Nacho regarding a TD lynch this early on.

It's a little dangerous, yeah, but picking on towngods early isn't necessarily a bad idea as scum. Yeah it's hard to tango with, but TD is a man that is occasionally a little hard to understand and so makes a great mislynch; arguing with me about it to win my support so he doesn't get blamed seems like a perfectly viable scumtactic.

AJ's posting is strong and consistent.

Posts that I thought weren't strong:

2 is town. That last discussion with nacho cemented it. Nacho, your points were almost mirrored. Get over it, that read is wrong.

He called 2 definite town because 2 copied my points on other people and didn't bring anything new to the table.

I get the impression with all these "Lynch this order" lists of UN and his fucking with the town in Posh mafia. Let's not worry about that shit, you get one flip at a time and you move on. Telegraphing every person that you want dead is only going to cause the scum to kill everyone else, but congratulations on accomplishing that. The way you're negotiating lists to lynch feels very scummy. Why worry? Push a reasonable case, get the flip, move on. Nacho, I know for a fact you're smarter than this, but then you go around pretending that this isn't going to affect a scum night kill. What the hell, nacho? I expect town play from you, not that. If I didn't know Braveheart was scum, I'd be voting you for encouraging and not stopping that bullshit.

Freaks the hell out because I post a PURGE list, which doesn't make any fucking sense at all.

Some posts I thought weren't consistent:

TMT is scum but no one wants to lynch for some reason. (Had 8 null reads in his one read list)

Hard tunnels the fuck out of TMT day 1.

Venmar, I think that Rach could be scum, but Bro is the constant one that steps scum more than Rach to me. Compared to Andrius' catch up posts, Bro doesn't sit right. I think that's your day three lynch. And TMT's hydra can be the vig shot.

Says that BRO should be the day 3 lynch and the hydra should be the vig shot?

This guy is not town. Why the fuck would you consider any of his posts town?

also tunnels the fuck out of TD

TMT, Ghost, Mac (motive bad, reasoning good... light scum read), Metal sonic, dntfkingcare, possibly 2.

but drops him in his next reads list without any explanation whatsoever

AJ does no sheeping, all original work, and isn't afraid of shit.

That's fine. But his original work wasn't very good anywhere.

Like seriously, 1291 is a great example of AJtown doing legwork. 1787, 1974, 1978 are other great posts.

1291 seems like a bunch of waffling, 1787 is "he's lurking and no one is paying attention to him" which is BAD because he's ignoring all of the other lurkers getting heat at that time, 1974 has "i'm not going into preservation mode" which shows he's conscious of literally the only thing going for him, 1978 has a horrible reason for declaring scum town, and has him call out a bunch of lurkers for being scum even though none of those people are lurking and A WHOLE BUNCH OF SCUM ARE LURKING AND ACTUALLY SCUM.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho's right. I should probably play scummier in my scum games. Or maybe just less vocal? Ahhh, it's be way to obvious!

or figure out how to stop getting yourself lynched in your towngames

[Andrius]

rach marie you are very very right

i will slow down my reading

also td is most probably bad for the town so if he flips town later at least he wont spoil some lynch or something !

This reads off. Kinda' contrived.
But then again there's good townie reasoning for it so.

TD relenting the pursuit is town-motivated.

@Andrius: Yeah, man, I was wrong. Rub it in, I guess.

Its more of a 'the guy you fencesat about and whined about flipping town flipped scum so I'm going to pressure you for your reaction'.
Your reaction was a whole lot more town than I expected.

Anyway, my scum-list is currently AJ, TD, Andrius, and Cabd. Don't know how I feel about the new Spinachattack or w/e.
Mayonegg.

So, I'd like to explore how I became a scumread of varsoon's.

1) varsoon was scummy to me, as his posting was lacking.
2) I caught up, he read me as town.
3) He put in effort, I thought he was town.
4) I drew lines from him to 2.
5) 2 flipped scum
6) I voted him D2 off of the 2 flip
7) I am suddenly a scumread of his.
8) This interaction happens, regarding that read:

Spoiler: Cabd/varsoon on pizza and Andarius

Could one of you guys order me a pizza or something? I'm really hungry, but broke.
Like, I'll give you my address and you can pay online for it or something.

Not sure if joking or just lame.

Mind explaining your andy read? Or hell, your cabd read?

Could one of you guys order me a pizza or something? I'm really hungry, but broke.
Like, I'll give you my address and you can pay online for it or something.

Not sure if joking or just lame.

Mind explaining your andy read? Or hell, your cabd read?

Oh, because ordering a pizza for someone isn't lame?
Come on, it's that mentality which perpetuates our cynical, non-pizza-ordering society.

Explanations? Just suspicions.

Could one of you guys order me a pizza or something? I'm really hungry, but broke.
Like, I'll give you my address and you can pay online for it or something.

Not sure if joking or just lame.

Mind explaining your andy read? Or hell, your cabd read?

Oh, because ordering a pizza for someone isn't lame?
Come on, it's that mentality which perpetuates our cynical, non-pizza-ordering society.

Explanations? Just suspicions.

I'm Italian, online order pizza is mostly crap anyways, so we're doing you a favor by not ordering it for you.

So you don't actually have a case on andy (or myself, or anyone else one your list) besides gut suspicions, ooor?

Oh, the quality of most pizza here in the states is variable, but probably pretty low. I wouldn't know, you know?
Regardless, there's more than just pizza that delivers.


I actually have a case, but articulation would take time, effort, and wouldn't be incredibly worth it.
It serves the same purpose for me to just say I suspect you're scum.
After all, if I did an ISO, like with 2, I'd probably interpret things as scummy.
My thought process is that there's got to be scum in the ineffable town-body, and even if there isn't, there's likely scum latching onto it. Cabd and Andrius feel like that. Also, Andy called me out and put a vote on me, so I've got to OMGUS or something.
It's actually interesting how few people cared that I was ardently defending 2, waffling a bit on it, and then I put the L-1 vote down.
Also, basing a few things off of an ISO of 2 and who 2 put in town/null buckets.

So in the end he admits its more of an OMGUS thing than a 'here's a solid case' thing.
Its like, this was scummy until the OMGUS thing.
THen it was just bad.
Which makes me think the badness is contrived to take away from the fact that there's
1) no case

Did Var and Cabd REALLY spend posts analyzing the pizza comment??

Did you REALLY read those posts?

...mollie has tagged her name in her posts in the past.

Because I'm not? I outlined why and telling me im working really hard doesn't cut it.

why are you getting cranky with me andy?

also I asked you in a pivotal point in the game what you thought was going on and you ignored the question. I then said again later that I asked you that question and you ignored it and you did not respond to that post either.

you addressing me in some ways but distancing yourself in others. I don't like that. if you want to get close then get close don't pussy-foot around it. nacho says you can but so far I am not seeing it so you either lack the balls for it or are scum.

eta: ahahahahaha, rach, inorite

You're accusing me of being lazy/noncommitted to it.

Also tag your posts please? A number of players have asked you to do it so regardless of who is posting this we would ALL appreciate it. You signed up as a hydra,

act like one

.

K well I'll go look back at your post and write you... probably a few lines on it.

Whoa now; I don't like fast women so me not getting close isn't some form of GOAWAY. Nacho knows me not because he just met me this game- we went through a lot of games together ranging from cultists to mason-lynching so don't expect me to be all PUSHING YOUR BOUNDARIES.

...somewhere cabd is enjoying this.

This town needs unity.
And pizza.

I read this as 'utility'.
Either way, I'm down for this though I'm more of a 'works from the shadow' guy.

Hey Rachmarie.

A couple very important questions.

1) If you had to shoot me or B2B, who wouldn't make it to D3, assuming nothing would interfere?
2) If you could 100% ascertain the alignment of any player in the game who would it be?
Oh and tell NS I said hi.

hum. Didn't get what I quote tagged from the first page of ISO.

Regardless, B&B, why aren't you scum?

Okay

So are we lynching varsoon before or after aj

Because we're lynching varsoon

I support this train of thought.

Yeah fuck man I'm scared of your opinions yeah that's it


To everyone else: sorry I haven't been posting substantially, but I don't really see a lot to talk about given today's lynch is a bit of a foregone conclusion before now. Ill make something big when I get home

You're squirming again.

...that's not squirming


I really like cabd's style, BTW.

Nacho.
You saying varsoon is rocking this game makes me laugh. In the good way.
But I still don't agree.

predit: Oh man, Nacho's coming down on my post. Hang on this got more srs.

Seperate post for replies to that and the walls he mentioned earlier.

[Ghostlin]

@Ghostlin: My thought process was something like this: 2's probably town. I meta'd 2, but then again, when I meta'd 2, I kinda -wanted- 2 to be town and interpreted it that way. 2 could not be town. The wagon is mostly people I think are town, though. If 2's town and this wagon is scummy, oh fuck. Well. Day is going to end soon, and everyone seems stubborn about this. Hum. Fuck it, 2 could be scum, and I could be wrong, and if I'm not, then I can hope to expose his wagon,

since I'll likely live to the next day.

You know; you almost reassured Paranoid!Ghostlin until you hit the bolded. The unconcern about you not worried about making it to Day 2 clangs a bit.

Guys, here's my problem with Vashoon: he's playing roulette and we're playing poker. This really came through in the ISO diving last night.

I don't like Vashoon's play. I don't like the uncertainty principle he creates: for example, after his gambit with 2 and another player: he calls 2 town due to the reaction to the gambit. He even used phrasing like '2's playing better than most of you' (a paraphrase, I admit) and the gambit created a false positive result, while it didn't fool anyone, if it did it would of cleared 2.

And yet, the gambit and the amount of times Vashoon was at the center of attention makes me wonder if it's not sub-optimal scum tactics to do so.

[Ghostlin]

Oh. For discussion purposes and because I want my stance out there:

Vote: Sajin

[Nachomamma8]

I don't like Vashoon's play. I don't like the uncertainty principle he creates: for example, after his gambit with 2 and another player: he calls 2 town due to the reaction to the gambit. He even used phrasing like '2's playing better than most of you' (a paraphrase, I admit) and the gambit created a false positive result, while it didn't fool anyone, if it did it would of cleared 2.

And yet, the gambit and the amount of times Vashoon was at the center of attention makes me wonder if it's not sub-optimal scum tactics to do so.

it's farther than sub-optimal
he cannot handle pressure worth shit; he just digs himself a deeper hole
his scumgame isn't like that at all

[Varsoon]

Nacho's right. I should probably play scummier in my scum games. Or maybe just less vocal? Ahhh, it's be way to obvious!

or figure out how to stop getting yourself lynched in your towngames

I'm working on that, too.
I was actually doing pretty well in the last few games I was in, but I /out'd of all my games but this one.

By the way, guys, I'll be on V/LA from this upcoming thursday to next friday. Thought I should let you know.