Mini Normal 2009: Day 6

[Mathdino]

It's like you want me to play puppetmaster and try to manipulate you and una to vote each other
When I'm trying to play arbiter

[Mathdino]

I never lie about mechanics
I don't understand how you're not concerned about 3 mafia vs 1 SK, in which voting me is still throwing the game to mafia

If you think I'm an sk genuinely, you would no lynch

Since you're not, I can't see you as town here

[Mathdino]

And fuck your "stop talking about game mechanics", you literally asked me for the balance argument and now you have it

viewtopic.php?p=8960189#p8960189

First sk normal I could find
Guess what
Against a stacked town, it has 3 mafia

Your 2 mafia game was balanced because IT HAD. TWO. FEWER. TOWNIES.

[profii]

Chill out man

[profii]

I know you dont lie about mechanics I never said you did

[profii]

Let me go re read una

[profii]

I suck at setup-spec too..
All I know is that I'd hate to ever play in a 3v1v9 as ANY faction, so that is a setup I felt free to close off.

Una around to chat it through? What do you think to my theory that Stan was setting up a “if SK exists then a cross kill should happen”

I GUESS it is still a possibility.
I'd say scum!profii would've been more likely to shoot Stan here for a multitude of reasons, but at this point of the game there's always the WIFOM-side of the coin to muddy it all up..
I'd say scum!profii might just no-kill here for the WIFOM too, and to keep N_M around "for whatever reason" (=scumreads Una over profii).

This is what I was looking for

[profii]

That is also why I said no-killing would've been sub-optimal to scum!anyone.
I mean, even theoretical SK!Stan ought to kill N_M here, because we would've likely crossvoted at the start of the day anyway.
scum!profii shoots Stan and crossvotes with me at the start of day (and hopes N_M keeps to his stance on scum!Una)..

And this (sorry phone posting rn)

[Mathdino]

I mean
I'm good at setup spec and have designed games with 3ps soooo

I'm just saying
The setup you think is happening here, would only have passed review if it were 11p
And even then, it's pretty townsided

[profii]

Ok so I am going to trigger Mathdino in a huge way right now

I didn’t notice the godel game was 11p so figured 3v1vT was unlikely - also as per the una quote about he just made me assume we were going in the right direction

However Mathdino has put a new possibility into my mind that 3v1 is a possibility


So I can see the scum agenda of Una in these posts as he probably would rush lynch Math given the chance which would mean he can win
Una said he is bad at setup spec but I think it’s in his scum range to play dumb if he knew any better


I still believe math is a SK so I guess no lynch is the safe play and hope Math/Una x-kil

UNVOTE:

[profii]

Hypothetically

If you both shot N_M and it goes to 1v1v1 is that a town loss and scum/SK Draw?

[profii]

Assuming the answer is yes

Math!Sk shoots me? And scum!Una shoots Presumably Math to get a scum win

So surely optimal town play is take a chance on lynching Una and hope to feck Math is a legit vig otherwise we will never actually win

[Mathdino]

No, the correct play is for them to crossvote and try to convince town
Town can only win by no lynching again and hoping for a cross shoot

If draws are allowed then yeah they just lynch town and call a draw

[profii]

That makes sense

[profii]

I think no lynch is maybe the optimal play and hope Una sees the sense in my SK math case then

[Mathdino]

Mafia can use their abilities and perform the NK on the same night.

It's not unlikely there's a scum rolecop and they already know I'm not sk

[profii]

But you would shoot me as you SR me and then win a 1v1 result with N_M

[profii]

Ive gotta take a chance on the una lynch then?

[Mathdino]

But you would shoot me as you SR me and then win a 1v1 result with N_M

no, here are the possible situations:

A. I'm town vig vs 3p scumteam.
In this situation, mafia probably has a rolecop and knows I'm town already. So they're just gonna shoot N_M.

B. I'm SK vs 3p scumteam.
In this situation, mafia probably has a rolecop and knows I'm SK. So they have to shoot me.
Honestly, if I were mafia in this situation, I'd probably just straight up claim and work out a deal. The fact that mafia hasn't (and that I haven't tried either) should indicate I'm town.

C. I'm SK vs 2p scumteam (all dead).
In this situation, I'm obviously going to shoot conftown N_M.

[UnaBombaH]

Second day is WAY worse than the first was.. And I still have so much left to drink for today....
My post yesterday was apparently
1.riddled with typos
2. Unclear in message

I STILL think scum!profii is absolutely the likeliest scenario.
I was just pondering whether he could fake all of todays content. And considering that it would likely be much easier for him to just get me lynched, rather than try to bash his head on Dino..well, I have had momentary hesitations.
But I wouldn't vote Mathdino in a MyLo ever unless N_M thought it was the way to go.

[UnaBombaH]

My biggest problem is obviously our beloved MilkyTank.
I know he's such a stubborn cow that he will likely never change his mind about me, so we have already more or less lost this day phase.
If we no lynch, we lose the conf.town and "risk" losing the game for the SK. (remember that 1% I mentioned D4?)

I do not feel like "casing" profii - if you go read my ISO you can see how early I started to scumread him, and I think I more or less PoE'd the scumteam D3/D4.
I'd say we crossvote with profii here, and I hope N_M finally reconsiders.
I'm still willing to lose to MD here rather than go down with paranoia.

If you have any questions for me, I'll try to answer them to the best of my abilities, but I think I've already given my reasonings for why I've done what I've done.

[profii]

If we lynch Una then we take control of the game

If we no lynch una _should_ shoot N-M but we eliminate random wifom potential and win rn if Math is telling the truth

Math is right that 2v1 vT is unlikely in the 13 player setup and I missed that so I’d prefer to take control and lynch Una now based on the quotes I recently did suggesting he thought 3v1 was not possible and that a no lynch isn’t optimal


I guess me and Una are saying the exact same thing except pointing true finger at each other so I dunno I’ll place my vote and see if you agree

VOTE: Una

[UnaBombaH]

If we lynch Una then we take control of the game

What does this even mean?
If you lynch me, the game is over.
You kill Stan/N_M (doesn't even matter at that point) and you win.
Do you really think these faked perspective-slips go through to anyone?

VOTE: profii - I guess our game is basically in N_Ms hands.

[Mathdino]

UNVOTE:
Waiting on nm

[profii]

If we lynch Una then we take control of the game

What does this even mean?
If you lynch me, the game is over.
You kill Stan/N_M (doesn't even matter at that point) and you win.
Do you really think these faked perspective-slips go through to anyone?

VOTE: profii - I guess our game is basically in N_Ms hands.

It means I still think there is a chance of a serial killer but I think it’s better to try and just take control now and lynch scum!you and on the less likely chance of Math!Vig then town just win

Do you not acknowledge Maths point that 3v1 vT can be a setup and therefore there is only 2 town left

Surely scum have to shoot the SK tonight imo but if it doesn’t exist lynching scum is better