Mini 730 - Hard Nights in the City - OVER!

[don_johnson]

Self voting is ridiculously stupid. It accomplishes nothing positive for the town and provides no information that we can use to determine your alignment. Knock it off. Seriously. Don't try to defend this boneheaded action or you will just be risking getting yourself lynched for no benefit whatsoever.

sorry, i thought we were in the random/joke vote phase.

unvote

funny. it is "ridiculously stupid" and has "no benefit", yet you use my self vote to show your towniness.

just to be clear: have we moved past the random/joke vote phase?

[Juls]

I personally have no problem with self voting in the joke vote stage. If you do it later it is a bit annoying. Joke votes are to get conversation rolling and I think he accomplished that with his self-vote.

[Porkens]

Self voting is ridiculously stupid. It accomplishes nothing positive for the town and provides no information that we can use to determine your alignment. Knock it off. Seriously. Don't try to defend this boneheaded action or you will just be risking getting yourself lynched for no benefit whatsoever.

sorry, i thought we were in the random/joke vote phase.

unvote

funny. it is "ridiculously stupid" and has "no benefit", yet you use my self vote to show your towniness.

just to be clear: have we moved past the random/joke vote phase?

1. The last sentence in Megatheory's post says to me he's assuming/knows you're town, too.

2. "Are we out of RVS?" -

ahhhh, a question for the ages.

Vote: Danchaofan

who is clearly looking for an excuse to vote somebody rather than correct them. Or is he just HOPING for a townie to be modkilled

Correcting them?

What

is this? A Newbie game? Can't we assume that everyone has read and understood the rules using their own god damn faculties?

And how do you know Ger is town, anyway?

You know what, don't even bother answering. Lynch this man.

vote: Nameless

[Megatheory]

sorry, i thought we were in the random/joke vote phase.

unvote

funny. it is "ridiculously stupid" and has "no benefit", yet you use my self vote to show your towniness.

just to be clear: have we moved past the random/joke vote phase?

You're acting like the random phase has no actual purpose. Besides breaking the ice, sometimes scumtells can come through during that time. Beyond that, self voting is bad

all the time

. What was your intent other than to say "haw haw, I self voted! Isn't that goofy?"

This is a team game, remember? If the town doesn't work together, there is no chance for success. Advising you the way I did is intended to move you towards better play. I don't know if you are town or not, but statistically you are probably town unless I have a reason to believe otherwise. My intent was not to appear now townie, that was just a side effect.

[ChaosOmega]

vote: Megatheory

[canadianbovine]

vote: chaosomega

for not have an explanation for voting for Megatheory

[Danchaofan]

just a note to all. i don't really post at weekend

I really hope you're on the mafia's side.

nope
you think it will hurt us that much?
i just don't get access at the weekends, the other 5 days i am pretty good thouhg. the onyl other problem i sometimes have is i amin the UK and so time zones can get out o synch.

anyways, are we all in yet?

The implication is from nameless is that gera is on the mafia side, to which gera respons something about 'us'. This is wifom as surely no mafia would imply that they are mafia. Or, would they? =P

Current serious level:-25%

[don_johnson]

You're acting like the random phase has no actual purpose. Besides breaking the ice, sometimes scumtells can come through during that time.

my vote broke the ice. by virtue of us still talking about it, it has obviously generated some type of discussion. discussion is pro town. also, the idea of the random vote is multi faceted. by randomly choosing someone we can hope to land on scum. if we land on scum then perhaps a "scumtell" comes through in their reaction. so why wouldn't a "scumtell" come through in someone elses reaction to a self vote? i.e. you say my lynch has no benefit. does that mean that you know i'm town?

Beyond that, self voting is bad

all the time

.

i believe you mean "anti-town." self voting can actually be a "good" scum manuver later in the game if properly executed. again, the fact that we are having a discussion contradicts your assertion that self voting is ridiculous. come to think of it, it also contradicts the fact you are trying to make with the above statement.

What was your intent other than to say "haw haw, I self voted! Isn't that goofy?"

generate discussion.

This is a team game, remember? If the town doesn't work together, there is no chance for success. Advising you the way I did is intended to move you towards better play.

uh, thanks?

I don't know if you are town or not, but statistically you are probably town unless I have a reason to believe otherwise. My intent was not to appear now townie, that was just a side effect.

your intent is irrelevant. you

used

my self vote. you responded. now we are talking. do you still believe a self vote in the random phase to be "ridiculous and stupid"?

[ChaosOmega]

vote: chaosomega for not have an explanation for voting for Megatheory

Who says I don't have an explanation for it?

And Juls, you haven't voted yet. Why?

[Nameless]

Calling "Random Voting" a stage is wrong. You may start with, but there is no distinct phase, seriousness and arguments just slowly build from there.

Don and Mega have started going at each other very quickly, perhaps suspiciously so? Penguin comments, but doesn't contribute to serious or non serious discussion, is that suspicious? Chaos says nothing but votes, suspicious?

Here's a question for whoever feels like answering it: If I now changed my vote to Megatheory, would that be suspicious and why?

Upon clarification, I find SpyreX's posting rules to be weak, and furthermore, lame.

PSH.

[canadianbovine]

vote: chaosomega for not have an explanation for voting for Megatheory

Who says I don't have an explanation for it?

And Juls, you haven't voted yet. Why?

would you care to explain why you voted for megatheory?

[insanepenguin02]

Penguin comments, but doesn't contribute to serious or non serious discussion, is that suspicious?

I was just surprised that things got hot and heated so quickly. I'm used to things starting slowly with a little bit of fun random voting. But I see that the methods shown by this group thus far has done a fine job of stimulating discussion therefore - no problem here!

[Megatheory]

vote: chaosomega

for not have an explanation for voting for Megatheory

Why don't you try asking him why he voted for me instead of jumping to conclusions?

The implication is from nameless is that gera is on the mafia side, to which gera respons something about 'us'. This is wifom as surely no mafia would imply that they are mafia. Or, would they? =P

Current serious level:-25%

I saw his use of "us" to mean "the town." You're really grasping at straws.

my vote broke the ice. by virtue of us still talking about it, it has obviously generated some type of discussion. discussion is pro town.

Discussion does not always benefit the town. If two townies get into an argument and one of them gets lynched over it, their discussion was ultimately bad for the town. Our goal here is to find scum, so our discussion needs to be aimed at that end. Discussions about self votes rarely help find scum.

also, the idea of the random vote is multi faceted. by randomly choosing someone we can hope to land on scum. if we land on scum then perhaps a "scumtell" comes through in their reaction. so why wouldn't a "scumtell" come through in someone elses reaction to a self vote? i.e. you say my lynch has no benefit. does that mean that you know i'm town?

Two aspects of this are completely wrong. First, you're ignoring the fact that we can gain information about a random voter's alignment. If said voter votes for himself, there is no alignment related information to gain. Second, scumtells usually come out during random votes

when a scum reacts to someone voting for them

. The idea is that the scum is more concerned about being lynched than a town player, so they will be more sensitive about a vote for them and react too strongly.

i believe you mean "anti-town." self voting can actually be a "good" scum manuver later in the game if properly executed. again, the fact that we are having a discussion contradicts your assertion that self voting is ridiculous. come to think of it, it also contradicts the fact you are trying to make with the above statement.

Wow, this makes no sense whatsoever. Self voting is good for the town because it's good for the scum in certain situations? So why on God's Green Earth would it be good for a

townie

to self vote? If I didn't know better, I'd see this as you admitting that you are scum!

do you still believe a self vote in the random phase to be "ridiculous and stupid"?

Yes. You haven't demonstrated that self voting is good for the town in any way, except "it generates discussion." Is it still good for the town if we are both townies and this argument leads to one of us being lynched because you didn't realize what you were doing?

[insanepenguin02]

The implication is from nameless is that gera is on the mafia side, to which gera respons something about 'us'. This is wifom as surely no mafia would imply that they are mafia. Or, would they? =P

Current serious level:-25%

Everything in this post is WIFOM - The use of 'us' is WIFOM, the 'or would they' is WIFOM, etc. But I see you are joking....or are you!

[insanepenguin02]

Calling "Random Voting" a stage is wrong. You may start with, but there is no distinct phase, seriousness and arguments just slowly build from there.

Come on, it is an unofficial phase.

Here's a question for whoever feels like answering it: If I now changed my vote to Megatheory, would that be suspicious and why?

I'll answer. Not really. It would put him at two votes. And you would need some sort of explanation as you and mega haven't really interacted at all just yet.

[insanepenguin02]

And FYI -

Vote: canadianbovine

BLAME CANADA!!!!

[Atronach]

<b>Vote: insanepenguin02</b><p>

b/c my girlfriend is from Canada, and she said to.<br>
and for having a picture/avatar that scares me:(

[Nameless]

Mega is pushing very hard for early, weak points. He's also placing vote/lynching under general discussion, and his idea of scum being more sensitive than town to votes is bad (I'd say a player's personality would have has much impact and townie power roles would be as sensitive anyway). Suspicious, and that's not a question this time.

[Atronach]

Obviously I don't know what I'm doing yet:|, I take it html is no good here?

[canadianbovine]

vote: chaosomega

for not have an explanation for voting for Megatheory

Why don't you try asking him why he voted for me instead of jumping to conclusions?

i have asked him

vote: chaosomega for not have an explanation for voting for Megatheory

Who says I don't have an explanation for it?

And Juls, you haven't voted yet. Why?

would you care to explain why you voted for megatheory?

And FYI -

Vote: canadianbovine

BLAME CANADA!!!!

been forever since i saw that movie..... and in case you noticed, i live in San Francisco. Last time i checked, there isn't a San Francisco in canada..so i can indeed blame canada! but i will not blame my namesake [moose] because....

MINIMOOSE WILL DESTROY YOU ALL



...look at those NUBS OF DOOM!

[canadianbovine]

Obviously I don't know what I'm doing yet:|, I take it html is no good here?

use [ b ], [ / b ] not <b>, only without spaces

[don_johnson]

my vote broke the ice. by virtue of us still talking about it, it has obviously generated some type of discussion. discussion is pro town.

Discussion does not always benefit the town. If two townies get into an argument and one of them gets lynched over it, their discussion was ultimately bad for the town. Our goal here is to find scum, so our discussion needs to be aimed at that end. Discussions about self votes rarely help find scum.

discussion always helps town. that is my stand.

also, the idea of the random vote is multi faceted

. by randomly choosing someone we can hope to land on scum. if we land on scum then perhaps a "scumtell" comes through in their reaction. so why wouldn't a "scumtell" come through in someone elses reaction to a self vote? i.e. you say my lynch has no benefit. does that mean that you know i'm town?

Two aspects of this are completely wrong. First, you're ignoring the fact that we can gain information about a random voter's alignment. If said voter votes for himself, there is no alignment related information to gain. Second, scumtells usually come out during random votes

when a scum reacts to someone voting for them

. The idea is that the scum is more concerned about being lynched than a town player, so they will be more sensitive about a vote for them and react too strongly.

multifaceted was meant to imply that there are more than just two ideas and motivations behind the random voting phase. you make no sense here. first, are you implying that you can determine someones alignment based on who they randomly vote for? the self vote promotes discussion. through that discussion scum can be exposed.

also, as i said: someones reaction to a self vote can also contain a scumtell. the point you italicize is part of the point i made. we agree on that. no aspect of what i said is wrong. you have misunderstood.

this:

Second, scumtells usually come out during random votes when a scum reacts to someone voting for them.

equals this:

by randomly choosing someone we can hope to land on scum. if we land on scum then perhaps a "scumtell" comes through in their reaction.

see? so we agree.

i believe you mean "anti-town." self voting can actually be a "good" scum manuver later in the game if properly executed. again, the fact that we are having a discussion contradicts your assertion that self voting is ridiculous. come to think of it, it also contradicts the fact you are trying to make with the above statement.

Wow, this makes no sense whatsoever. Self voting is good for the town because it's good for the scum in certain situations? So why on God's Green Earth would it be good for a

townie

to self vote? If I didn't know better, I'd see this as you admitting that you are scum!

who said "self voting is good for the town because it's good for the scum in certain situations"? if one is scum, then self voting can be a "good" manuver late in the game. i.e. to cut off discussion and drop the hammer on oneself. no one implied or said anything about this being good for town. you said "self voting is always bad." what you should have said is "self voting is anti-town." either way, you are wrong. self voting is not

always

anything.

do you still believe a self vote in the random phase to be "ridiculous and stupid"?

Yes. You haven't demonstrated that self voting is good for the town in any way, except "it generates discussion." Is it still good for the town if we are both townies and this argument leads to one of us being lynched because you didn't realize what you were doing?

you seem to be overly concerned with lynching. its quite early in the day. also, for someone so concerned with this argument leading to a mislynch, you seem to be pushing it towards that end quite forcefully. are you going to vote me now?

[Danchaofan]

discussion does not always help town i.e. excessive discussion that makes town's head spin...

The implication is from nameless is that gera is on the mafia side, to which gera respons something about 'us'. This is wifom as surely no mafia would imply that they are mafia. Or, would they? =P

Current serious level:-25%

I saw his use of "us" to mean "the town." You're really grasping at straws.

RVS votes tend to grasp at straws?

[Danchaofan]

d'oh preview =/= send...

[Danchaofan]

Mega is pushing very hard for early, weak points. He's also placing vote/lynching under general discussion, and his idea of scum being more sensitive than town to votes is bad (I'd say a player's personality would have has much impact and townie power roles would be as sensitive anyway). Suspicious, and that's not a question this time.

I want Megas response to this. It seems to be a good point.