Mini Normal 2334: trees (Day 5)

[DrNickRiviera]

In addition, why did you deem my case scummy rather than just wrong or misguided here?

Well there is the thing about me jailing you

There's also this thing where another blocking action was claimed afterwards. I get why you think it's dubious that scum shot into me, but from your view why am I more likely to have been blocked then Grov here.

You need to direct this question at DGB

I have considered that my action didn't stop scum(you) from killing someone.......DGB has not taken the same under consideration

Notice how I am not voting you? Not yet at least

[SmileyDude1]

In addition, why did you deem my case scummy rather than just wrong or misguided here?

Well there is the thing about me jailing you

There's also this thing where another blocking action was claimed afterwards. I get why you think it's dubious that scum shot into me, but from your view why am I more likely to have been blocked then Grov here.

You need to direct this question at DGB

I have considered that my action didn't stop scum(you) from killing someone.......DGB has not taken the same under consideration

Notice how I am not voting you? Not yet at least

I think both of you are town regardless, I think you can only be scum in a world where scum no killed last night (which just why?) and DGB can only be scum if weird setup shenanigans are at play. I think you two are getting into a silly TvT fight atm.

Want to be clear i'm not meaning to press or accuse you here, just want to make sure due consideration is being made.

[DrNickRiviera]

In addition, why did you deem my case scummy rather than just wrong or misguided here?

Well there is the thing about me jailing you

There's also this thing where another blocking action was claimed afterwards. I get why you think it's dubious that scum shot into me, but from your view why am I more likely to have been blocked then Grov here.

You need to direct this question at DGB

I have considered that my action didn't stop scum(you) from killing someone.......DGB has not taken the same under consideration

Notice how I am not voting you? Not yet at least

I think both of you are town regardless, I think you can only be scum in a world where scum no killed last night (which just why?) and DGB can only be scum if weird setup shenanigans are at play. I think you two are getting into a silly TvT fight atm.

Want to be clear i'm not meaning to press or accuse you here, just want to make sure due consideration is being made.

What 'weird setup shenanigans' do you mean?

Also, DGB and I are not fighting.........again you need to question her more than you need to question me

[SmileyDude1]

In addition, why did you deem my case scummy rather than just wrong or misguided here?

Well there is the thing about me jailing you

There's also this thing where another blocking action was claimed afterwards. I get why you think it's dubious that scum shot into me, but from your view why am I more likely to have been blocked then Grov here.

You need to direct this question at DGB

I have considered that my action didn't stop scum(you) from killing someone.......DGB has not taken the same under consideration

Notice how I am not voting you? Not yet at least

I think both of you are town regardless, I think you can only be scum in a world where scum no killed last night (which just why?) and DGB can only be scum if weird setup shenanigans are at play. I think you two are getting into a silly TvT fight atm.

Want to be clear i'm not meaning to press or accuse you here, just want to make sure due consideration is being made.

What 'weird setup shenanigans' do you mean?

Also, DGB and I are not fighting.........again you need to question her more than you need to question me

I mentioned my logic on it in 2302, and the posts surrounding it.

[DrNickRiviera]

In addition, why did you deem my case scummy rather than just wrong or misguided here?

Well there is the thing about me jailing you

There's also this thing where another blocking action was claimed afterwards. I get why you think it's dubious that scum shot into me, but from your view why am I more likely to have been blocked then Grov here.

You need to direct this question at DGB

I have considered that my action didn't stop scum(you) from killing someone.......DGB has not taken the same under consideration

Notice how I am not voting you? Not yet at least

I think both of you are town regardless, I think you can only be scum in a world where scum no killed last night (which just why?) and DGB can only be scum if weird setup shenanigans are at play. I think you two are getting into a silly TvT fight atm.

Want to be clear i'm not meaning to press or accuse you here, just want to make sure due consideration is being made.

What 'weird setup shenanigans' do you mean?

Also, DGB and I are not fighting.........again you need to question her more than you need to question me

I mentioned my logic on it in 2302, and the posts surrounding it.

K

First off, setup spec is definitely a tool that scum like to use to disprove/prove an agenda

Second, why is it so hard to believe that there is a town JK and a scum RB?(and with a vanilla cop)

Third, why is DGB not considering that she didn't prevent the NK?

Fourth, why are you going out of your way to not think DGB is scum?

[SmileyDude1]

In addition, why did you deem my case scummy rather than just wrong or misguided here?

Well there is the thing about me jailing you

There's also this thing where another blocking action was claimed afterwards. I get why you think it's dubious that scum shot into me, but from your view why am I more likely to have been blocked then Grov here.

You need to direct this question at DGB

I have considered that my action didn't stop scum(you) from killing someone.......DGB has not taken the same under consideration

Notice how I am not voting you? Not yet at least

I think both of you are town regardless, I think you can only be scum in a world where scum no killed last night (which just why?) and DGB can only be scum if weird setup shenanigans are at play. I think you two are getting into a silly TvT fight atm.

Want to be clear i'm not meaning to press or accuse you here, just want to make sure due consideration is being made.

What 'weird setup shenanigans' do you mean?

Also, DGB and I are not fighting.........again you need to question her more than you need to question me

I mentioned my logic on it in 2302, and the posts surrounding it.

K

First off, setup spec is definitely a tool that scum like to use to disprove/prove an agenda

Second, why is it so hard to believe that there is a town JK and a scum RB?(and with a vanilla cop)

Third, why is DGB not considering that she didn't prevent the NK?

Fourth, why are you going out of your way to not think DGB is scum?

I usually don't focus this much on spec. Mainly did so here because, from my view it seemed to lead to a clear conclusion in regards to the claims. Maybe i'm just crazy and let it bake into my head too much, but it helped clarify the game state for me.

I think in regards to scum roleblocker. I don't think JK/Neighborizer/VC really warrants a roleblocker to counter, especially considering the VC is gated and can' act immediately. Like I think the strongest role (jailkeeper) potentially being neutralized by rb would feel kind of rough for town here. I could be underrating vanilla cop here, but I do think the effect of neighborizer + novice vanilla cop isn't major in most scenarios.


On your third point good question, as I mentioned earlier I think there is room for RB + JK to exist for town in this setup so i'm not sure why DGB is insistent that she blocked the kill here. Part of the reason I made 2322 was because of her 2313

It seems unlikely that we have a town JK and town RB.

DGB, can I have you respond to the below when you are able.

I kind of feel like town roleblocker + town jailkeeper can coexist within the same setup actually. I know some may find it counterintuitive since they serve a similar function, but like I can kind of see double blocking roles being given in lieu of an investigative role here from a power standpoint.

Feels like i'm missing something here, but I would like to hear more about why those roles are unlikely to coexist here.

Fourth, it's mostly based on mech, like from my standpoint I crunch the setup in the world they're fake and it just doesn't really feel like it works for me. For what it's worth I feel the most confident on you by a good margin, I think comparatively it feels like you have to stretch it more to see DGB scum than Grovyle scum if you're looking in the PRs. Really all it is, for me.

[SmileyDude1]

I read through the Aureal's slots ISO.

Notable things:

-In regards to ming, 409 catches my eye due to Salty town leaning the slot here. Though I think the slots become less connected upon ActionDan replacing into the slot. I think the way AD places additional pressure on the slot in 1054, and 1160 feels like dissociative between the two. Like I feel like AD presses ming less here if scum or helps them come up with a good response if scum together that doesn't happen here. There's more to it but the interaction feels like AD trying to get something out of Ming slot and not really succeeding which feels like an awkwardish route to take if scum buddies here. I do find it weird that they don't vote ming during day 1 here given the lack of progress there, and given posts like 1221 and 1251. It feels like they were setting up to vote Ming but don't get around to doing so, kind of don't know what to make of it but gut instinct that feels like it maybe could've been a bus, Overall i'd say a mixed bag in terms of awesomeing interactions.

- Notable links in this ISO include Gibdo and Grovyle, in both cases AD made multiple posts postulating a hard townread of the two slots (examples of this being 1719, and 1895 among others). These aren't really elaborated on that much from Dan's end (Only saw 1722 in this regard and it's kind of weak reasoning). The intensity with which this was said, makes me think it's less likely these are paired unless AD is a defend their team type of player, feels like it'd create too obvious of a link otherwise. Also noticed some light positive mentions of elements slot and black slot which I can maybe envision being paired if looked at under the lens of "scum not interacting with their partners that much" but I don't really see anything at least from this end that jumps out here.

Conclusion: I think this slot actually feels alright to me. There's some weird stances being taken in regards to the Ming slot though I think the pressure sequence AD performed on Ming (which if i'm reading the context correctly occurred before the wagon caught fire) feels like it's not partnered. I think the potential pairings with other living slots don't feel like they're there as well. Like most of the potential links feel either too weak to the point of being close to a stretch or too obvious to the point where it doesn't feel feasible. Didn't get anything that jumped out as likely when reading through here.

----
1 down, 3 to go. It's approaching 1 AM where i'm at so I'm going to call it a night here. See ya

[DrippingGoofball]

Smiley Dude's thought processes are 100% town.

[DrippingGoofball]

VC 1.00
Grovyle in a Fedora (2):

DrippingGoofball

10, Aureal 23

Enchant

(1): DrNickRiviera 7
DrNickRiviera (1): Grovyle in a Fedora 8

Hu Tao

(1): KayJayQueue 13
Not Voting: Gypyx,

Enchant

,

Hu Tao

, SmileyDude1,

Klick

,

Dannflor

,

awesomeming327

, Gibdo

VC 1.02
Grovyle in a Fedora (2):

DrippingGoofball

10, Aureal 23

Enchant

(2): DrNickRiviera 7, Gypyx 46
Gypyx (2): SmileyDude1 52, Grovyle in a Fedora 71
DrNickRiviera (1):

Dannflor

66

Hu Tao

(1): KayJayQueue 13
No Elimination (1):

Enchant

42
SmileyDude1 (1):

Klick

61
Not Voting:

Hu Tao

,

awesomeming327

, Gibdo

VC 1.03
SmileyDude1 (2):

Klick

61, DrNickRiviera 114
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23

Enchant

(1): Gypyx 46
DrNickRiviera (1):

Dannflor

66

Hu Tao

(1): KayJayQueue 13
No Elimination (1):

Enchant

42

Dannflor

(1): Grovyle in a Fedora 124
Not Voting:

Hu Tao

,

awesomeming327

, Gibdo, SmileyDude1 110,

DrippingGoofball

131

VC 1.04
SmileyDude1 (3):

Klick

61, DrNickRiviera 114, Gypyx 171
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
DrNickRiviera (1):

Dannflor

66

Hu Tao

(1): KayJayQueue 13
No Elimination (1):

Enchant

42
Gypyx (1): Grovyle in a Fedora 185
Not Voting:

Hu Tao

,

awesomeming327

, Gibdo, SmileyDude1 110[post],

DrippingGoofball

[post]131

VC 1.05
Aureal (2):

Hu Tao

241,

Klick

249
SmileyDude1 (1): DrNickRiviera 114
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
DrNickRiviera (1):

Dannflor

66

Hu Tao

(1): KayJayQueue 13
Gypyx (1): Grovyle in a Fedora 185

Enchant

(1): Gypyx 209

awesomeming327

(1):

Enchant

266
Not Voting:

awesomeming327

, Gibdo, SmileyDude1 110,

DrippingGoofball

131

VC 1.06
Aureal (3):

Hu Tao

241,

Klick

249, Gypyx 290
SmileyDude1 (1): DrNickRiviera 114
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
DrNickRiviera (1):

Dannflor

66

Hu Tao

(1): KayJayQueue 13
Gypyx (1): Grovyle in a Fedora 185

awesomeming327

(1):

Enchant

266
KayJayQueue (1):

DrippingGoofball

287

Enchant

(1): Gibdo 292
Not Voting:

awesomeming327

, SmileyDude1 110,

VC 1.07
Aureal (3):

Hu Tao

241,

Klick

249, KayJayQueue 326

Hu Tao

(2): Gypyx 337,

Dannflor

345
SmileyDude1 (1): DrNickRiviera 114
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23

awesomeming327

(1):

Enchant

266
KayJayQueue (1):

DrippingGoofball

287

Enchant

(1): Gibdo 292
Gibdo (1): Grovyle in a Fedora 320
Not Voting:

awesomeming327

, SmileyDude1 110

VC 1.08
SmileyDude1 (4): DrNickRiviera 114,

Klick

475,

Dannflor

477, Gypyx 483

Enchant

(3): Gibdo 292,

awesomeming327

412, Grovyle in a Fedora 417
Aureal (1):

Hu Tao

241
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23

awesomeming327

(1):

Enchant

266
KayJayQueue (1):

DrippingGoofball

287
DrNickRiviera (1): KayJayQueue 415
Not Voting: SmileyDude1 110

VC 1.08

Enchant

(3): Gibdo 292,

awesomeming327

412, Grovyle in a Fedora 417

Klick

(3): SmileyDude1 585,

Dannflor

586, Gypyx 589
SmileyDude1 (2): DrNickRiviera 114,

Klick

475
Aureal (1):

Hu Tao

241
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23

awesomeming327

(1):

Enchant

266
KayJayQueue (1):

DrippingGoofball

287
DrNickRiviera (1): KayJayQueue 415

VC 1.09

Klick

(3): SmileyDude1 585, Gypyx 589,

Hu Tao

592

Enchant

(2):

awesomeming327

412, Grovyle in a Fedora 417
SmileyDude1 (2): DrNickRiviera 114,

Klick

475

awesomeming327

(2):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594

Hu Tao

(2):

Dannflor

606, KayJayQueue 628
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
Not Voting: Gibdo 604

VC 1.10

Klick

(4): SmileyDude1 585, Gypyx 589,

Hu Tao

592, DrNickRiviera 662

Enchant

(2):

awesomeming327

412, Grovyle in a Fedora 417

awesomeming327

(2):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594

Hu Tao

(2):

Dannflor

606, KayJayQueue 628
SmileyDude1 (1):

Klick

475
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
Not Voting: Gibdo 604

VC 1.11

Hu Tao

(3):

Dannflor

606, Black 628, Grovyle in a Fedora 736

Klick

(2): SmileyDude1 585, DrNickRiviera 662

awesomeming327

(2):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594
Black (2):

Hu Tao

723, Gypyx 728

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412
SmileyDude1 (1):

Klick

475
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
Not Voting: Gibdo 604

VC 1.12

Hu Tao

(5):

Dannflor

606, Grovyle in a Fedora 736, Black 792, SmileyDude1 869, Gypyx 925

awesomeming327

(2):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412

DrippingGoofball

(1): DrNickRiviera 862

Klick

(1):

Hu Tao

753
SmileyDude1 (1):

Klick

475
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
Not Voting: Gibdo 604

VC 1.13

Hu Tao

(4):

Dannflor

606, Grovyle in a Fedora 736, Black 792, SmileyDude1 869

awesomeming327

(2):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594

Dannflor

(2): Gypyx 997,

Klick

1001

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412

DrippingGoofball

(1): DrNickRiviera 862

Klick

(1):

Hu Tao

753
Grovyle in a Fedora (1): Aureal 23
Not Voting: Gibdo 604

VC 1.14

Hu Tao

(4):

Dannflor

606, Grovyle in a Fedora 736, Black 792, SmileyDude1 869

Dannflor

(4): Gypyx 997,

Klick

1001,

Hu Tao

1026, DrNickRiviera 1030

awesomeming327

(2):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412
Not Voting: Gibdo 604, Aureal 1012

VC 1.14

awesomeming327

(5):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594,

Dannflor

1153, SmileyDude1 1156, Black 792

Dannflor

(4): Gypyx 997,

Klick

1001,

Hu Tao

1026, DrNickRiviera 1030

Hu Tao

(1): Grovyle in a Fedora 736

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412
Not Voting: Gibdo 604, Aureal 1012

VC 1.15

awesomeming327

(6):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594,

Dannflor

1153, SmileyDude1 1156, Black 792, Gibdo 1223 [E-1]

Dannflor

(4): Gypyx 997,

Klick

1001,

Hu Tao

1026, DrNickRiviera 1030

Hu Tao

(1): Grovyle in a Fedora 736

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412
Not Voting: Aureal 1012

VC 1.FINAL

awesomeming327

(7):

Enchant

266,

DrippingGoofball

594,

Dannflor

1153, SmileyDude1 1156, Black 1159, Gibdo 1223, Gypyx 1261 [Elimination!]

Dannflor

(3):

Klick

1001,

Hu Tao

1026, DrNickRiviera 1030

Hu Tao

(1): Grovyle in a Fedora 736

Enchant

(1):

awesomeming327

412
Not Voting: Aureal 1012

VC 2.01

Klick

(2): Gypyx 1281, Aureal 1300
SmileyDude1 (1):

Enchant

1366

Hu Tao

(1): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370
Not Voting:

DrippingGoofball

, DrNickRiviera,

Hu Tao

, Black, SmileyDude1,

Klick

, Gibdo

VC 2.02

Hu Tao

(3): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370, DrNickRiviera 1432, Gibdo 1495

Klick

(2): Aureal 1300,

Hu Tao

1482
Black (2):

Enchant

1450,

DrippingGoofball

1484

Enchant

(2): Gypyx 1510, Black 1512
Not Voting: SmileyDude1,

Klick

VC 2.02

Klick

(3): Gypyx 1281, Aureal 1300,

Hu Tao

1482

Hu Tao

(3): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370, DrNickRiviera 1432, Gibdo 1495
Black (2):

Enchant

1450,

DrippingGoofball

1484

Enchant

(2): Gypyx 1510, Black 1512
Not Voting: SmileyDude1,

Klick

VC 2.03

Klick

(4): Aureal 1300,

Hu Tao

1482, Black 1560, DrNickRiviera 1563

Hu Tao

(2): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370, Gibdo 1495
Black (1):

DrippingGoofball

1484

Enchant

(1): Gypyx 1510
Gypyx (1):

Enchant

1576
Not Voting: SmileyDude1,

Klick

VC 2.04

Klick

(4): Aureal 1300,

Hu Tao

1482, Black 1560, DrNickRiviera 1563

Hu Tao

(2): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370, Gibdo 1495
Black (2):

DrippingGoofball

1484,

Enchant

1587

Enchant

(1): Gypyx 1510
Not Voting: SmileyDude1,

Klick

VC 2.05

Klick

(4): Aureal 1300,

Hu Tao

1482, Black 1560, DrNickRiviera 1563

Hu Tao

(2): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370, Gibdo 1495
Black (2):

DrippingGoofball

1484,

Enchant

1587
Not Voting: SmileyDude1,

Klick

, Gypyx 1654

VC 2.06

Klick

(2): Aureal 1300, Black 1560
Black (1):

Enchant

1587

Hu Tao

(1): Grovyle in a Fedora 1370

Enchant

(1):

DrippingGoofball

1731
Not Voting: SmileyDude1,

Klick

, Gypyx 1654, Gibdo 1710, DrNickRiviera 1739,

Hu Tao

1740

VC 2.07

Klick

(2): Aureal 1300, Grovyle in a Fedora 1795
Black (1):

Enchant

1587

Enchant

(1):

DrippingGoofball

1731
SmileyDude1 (1):

Klick

1793
Grovyle in a Fedora (1):

Hu Tao

1799

Hu Tao

(1): Black 1811
Not Voting: SmileyDude1, Gypyx 1654, Gibdo 1710, DrNickRiviera 1739

VC 2.08

Klick

(4): Aureal 1300, Grovyle in a Fedora 1795, Gypyx 1818, Gibdo 1827
Black (1):

Enchant

1587

Enchant

(1):

DrippingGoofball

1731
SmileyDude1 (1):

Klick

1793
Grovyle in a Fedora (1):

Hu Tao

1799

Hu Tao

(1): Black 1811
Not Voting: SmileyDude1, DrNickRiviera 1739

VC 2.09

Klick

(4): Aureal 1300, Grovyle in a Fedora 1795, Gypyx 1818, Gibdo 1827

Hu Tao

(2): Black 1811, DrNickRiviera 1871
Black (2):

Enchant

1587,

Klick

1876

Enchant

(1):

DrippingGoofball

1731
Grovyle in a Fedora (1):

Hu Tao

1799
Not Voting: SmileyDude1

VC 2.10

Klick

(4): Aureal 1300, Grovyle in a Fedora 1795, Gypyx 1818, Gibdo 1827

Hu Tao

(2): Black 1811, DrNickRiviera 1871
Gypyx (2):

Hu Tao

1947,

Klick

1954
Black (1):

Enchant

1587

Enchant

(1):

DrippingGoofball

1731
Not Voting: SmileyDude1

[Black]

I feel like we should be fading within Smiley/Grovyle. I don't see any other explanation for the no kill

[Black]

I think Smiley is putting on a great town impression

[Gypyx]

In the hypothetical case that we flip scum today, nick / DGB should both coordinate who they're blocking tonight

[Black]

My townread on Grovyle is fading a bit. Something about 2319 is rubbing me the wrong way

[DrippingGoofball]

Yeah the votes aren't super informative but now being fairly sure that SmileyDude is town, these guys are sus:
Black 1159, Gibdo 1223, Gypyx 1261

And then there is Dr Nick who is scumming up the thread togameday.

[DrippingGoofball]

My townread on Grovyle is fading a bit. Something about 2319 is rubbing me the wrong way

It's bizarre in a meth math kinda way LOL but is it scummy? I am not good at meth math thus unable to evaluate.

[DrippingGoofball]

Is Grovyle implying that they are an unclaimed PR that soft-claimed from they play? wut

[DrippingGoofball]

I"m liking Black's decision path.

[Black]

Damnation

Why did you write this post

DGB can you answer this. What was the "damnation" about

[DrippingGoofball]

It's trivial, I regretted my vote because as I was reading the claim and gauging their reaction to my skepticism, I thought they were scum. But then their kinda "FU farewell" post seemed genuine.

[Black]

Ok I think that makes sense. I was reading it as you regretting the hammer which didn't make any sense with your later post about it not being a hammer

[DrippingGoofball]

In the hypothetical case that we flip scum today, nick / DGB should both coordinate who they're blocking tonight

Definitely something that Nick's buddy would say.

[Gypyx]

woopsie, sowwwy >~<

to be clear this is more of a "if we get scum i do this, if not i could totally do something else lol"

[DrNickRiviera]

In the hypothetical case that we flip scum today, nick / DGB should both coordinate who they're blocking tonight

Definitely something that Nick's buddy would say.

This is some quality open wolfing now, I applaud you DGB

[tris]

,

[tris]

,