Mini 536: Heroes Smalltown. Game Over!

[ZONEACE]

umm because i think lynching someone simply because they are vanilla is a bad idea. A lynch for lynches sake is a bad lynch. Lynching someone just because you're supposed to lynch (in general) is not a sufficient reason.

[shaft.ed]

Shaft.ed - It is a bad idea to give scum investigative powers. Why? because we'll TRUST her. And trusting scum is not a good move.

Oman this argument is silly at best. I have already pointed out that when scum make up investigation results there will be an obvious situation where someone is lying and thus scum are unlikely to make it out of such a situation unscathed. Also you didn't even address the part where if Adele is anti-town she can be passed some dangerous powers from her scum buddies. If we give her investigative powers she will have to answer as to why those were not used, or make up investigation results. I think this could conceivably neutralize the risk of her receiving dangerous powers from her scum buddies.

Given the conversation the two of you had about passing your power to her I'm a bit suspicious of this situation. Adele would you care to comment?

[shaft.ed]

umm because i think lynching someone simply because they are vanilla is a bad idea. A lynch for lynches sake is a bad lynch. Lynching someone just because you're supposed to lynch (in general) is not a sufficient reason.

Sorry if my words were unclear I wasn't trying to suggest lynching TSQ. What I was getting at was:

So why not pressure TSQ if all you're worried about is losing power roles?

You have people with no/detrimental powers. Yet you just want to move to No Lynch straight away. You might as well pressure them ahead of time to see if you can get a read right? It seems as though you are just giving up on the day because you can't force claims in this situation.

[Thestatusquo]

And completely ignores my post....

[shaft.ed]

And completely ignores my post....

He musn't like you or your questions. He answered me pretty quick...the first time at least.

Is there some kind of global holiday going on?
I would really like to hear something from the following people:

Adele-last post Dec 06
CKD-last post Dec 06
davidangelsummers-last post Dec 07
YvonneSeer-last post Dec 07
Zindaras-last contentful post never

[curiouskarmadog]

will post when I get a second

[Adele]

Sorry for absence - will post in about half an hour.

[Thestatusquo]

Sorry for absence - will post in about half an hour.

will post when I get a second

I approve of this product and/or service.

[Adele]

OK. Sorry for my absence. To some extent, I've had little time on PCs at all (in the run up to exams I was at college, at home or at my parents, but mostly just studying).

Also, there's little to discuss here that I can see. Most of it's gameplans and going round in circles over whether we can trust people based on their roles (here's a hint: no)

I agree. While nothing jumps out about the plan as being particularly dangerous, the more choreographed the plan is, the easier it is for the mafia to know how to circumvent it -- especially since this plan takes at least a couple of game days before we see any results out of it.

QFT

Shaft.ed - It is a bad idea to give scum investigative powers. Why? because we'll TRUST her. And trusting scum is not a good move.

Hands up everyone who plans to blindly trust me because of an ability I absorb from someone? Seriously. Slippery slope argument.

[Thestatusquo]

Can the rest of the town please comment on whats going on between zoneace and myself right now.

[Gorgon]

Can the rest of the town please comment on whats going on between zoneace and myself right now.

Yeah sure.

I feel that that your points and questions are valid and do not appear to be based on personal grounds. You're basically just prompting him to comment on what has been discussed so far, and to give his opinion on strategy. Nothing wrong with this.

ZA has been unhelpful in this game, and I don't like his no lynch suggestion. Sure, it's a possible option, but I don't think it's something that should be rushed into at this point. People will die tonight, unless some amazing piece of luck prevents both the mafia and Sylar kill. The first day is needed to gain information on everyone. Just no lynching and letting people die without sufficient info gained on them is A Bad Thing.

I do admit I've been ignoring TSQ. I'm not going to answer his questions about my observcations today because well, it's day one of a day start game where we know EVERYONE'S power, I'd rather not blow my load yet. I think we need a night of activities before we can make a legitimate attempt at locating our resident scums.

As per what I said above, I believe that day 1 discussion is useful, even in this game, seeing that everyone's alive and all. What exactly, in your opinion, is the potential harm in this?

[curiouskarmadog]

Can the rest of the town please comment on whats going on between zoneace and myself right now.

I assume that the problem is the fact that this was the main part of his response to your points you posted about him. He again doesn’t address your points and says this.

I do admit I've been ignoring TSQ. I'm not going to answer his questions about my observcations today because well, it's day one of a day start game where we know EVERYONE'S power, I'd rather not blow my load yet. I think we need a night of activities before we can make a legitimate attempt at locating our resident scums.

I await further attempts by TSQ to justify his policy lynch.

I don’t think you were policy lynching ZA because before your vote returned to him it was on me for essentially a misunderstanding between cam and myself.

It strikes me odd that ZA is moving toward a No Lynch. In every other game I have ever been in with him, he votes for silly reasons and quite frankly appears to lynching just for lynching. Most of these games are ongoing, but if you meta him and read the games I am sure it will be quite apparent what I am talking about.

The vote for a no lynch seems like ZA is trying to look town.

FoS Zoneace.

Now to Gorgon’s vote.

I also went back and skimmed over the game, and I must say I really don't like ckd's vote and subsequent unvote on mathcam.

vote mathcam

"for proposing a strategy for deciding who to vote for"

quite scummy

who proposes a strategy to vote for someone on the fisrt page of voting just based on roles?

to pick a lynch based on a role that could be too powerful if in the hands of scum no matter the alignment versus scum hunting the normal way to find scum?

to pick a lynch based on a role that could be too powerful if in the hands of scum no matter the alignment versus scum hunting the normal way to find scum?

do I really need to answer this question?

what is your plan tomorrow? Lynch the second most powerful role?

I dont mind the idea if we are generating conversation (like a random voting stage), but to lynch Day 1 based on this is crap.

I note that he says twice that he's objecting to mathcam suggesting people

vote

based on the roles, but then ups it to actually lynching, which is neither what matcham was suggesting, nor how ckd originally interpreted it.

well maybe you need to actually read what happened instead of "skimming" before you vote. I admit that I misunderstood what he meant, thus the unvote, which you have also quoted.

well, i dont typically vote for someone unless I think they are scummy, thus would be ok for a lynch....but it sounds like you are only really proposing a conversation starter..

unvote.

Jdodge...now did you mean voting (like mathcam) or lynching?

Then he again acknowledges that matchcam's suggestion was just a conversation starter/voting device ... so which was it? Did ckd think that mathcam was proposing we lynch based on roles, or that he was merely generating conversation/semi-random votes?

You are taking this out of context. Why? It is obvious that I misunderstood what cam was saying. The first sentence is explaining why I voted, then next sentence is explaining why I unvoted. What are you not understanding here?

Couple this with ckd's vote then downgrade to a FOS on das, and I find ckd to be suspiciously wavering in his accusations. This warrants a vote.

Vote: curiouskarmadog

So you are voting me because I am indecisive? You are voting me because when someone shows that my thought processes might be incorrect (or I am misunderstanding something) I unvote instead of being prideful and keeping my vote. So are you saying I would be less scummy in your eyes, if I kept my votes on even though I no longer agree with them, please explain.

[Gorgon]

Well ckd, what I found most suspicious was you mixing up the terms vote/lynch, but I can see how you could have been thinking 'lynch' while saying 'vote'. The big picture does point to you having first having seen mathcam's idea as a strategy for lynching, and then accepting the fact that he was merely discussing semi-random voting rather than lynching - I'll give you that. I still think this was worthy of questioning, though.

I'm feeling a ZA wagon pretty strongly right now, truth to tell.

Unvote, Vote: ZONEACE

[shaft.ed]

I'm not liking Zonace's play. His interaction with TSQ has been rehashed twice now so I won't bother, and I have asked him a couple times to respond to the original questions. I don't know his playstyle too well as I have only read him for the last few pages of MAD II mafia so I'll have to do a meta check before I vote for reasons of altered playstyle. However, as I've stated above, the No Lynch vote doesn't make sense this early in the day and his explanation doesn't exactly jive. But I will state up front I am reluctant to lynch Zoneace today simply based on his role. Stringing up a known tracker D1 would be a big gain for scum if he is in fact town aligned.

FoS: Zoneace

. Will move to a vote depending on meta, and his response to the current querries.

[curiouskarmadog]

I'm feeling a ZA wagon pretty strongly right now, truth to tell.

Unvote, Vote: ZONEACE

Now who is being...

suspiciously wavering in his accusations

now????

By your standards that deserves a vote. Now that Thestatusquo has moved his vote back to ZA, I am no longer the bandwagon that is in the limelight. Was the CKD bandwagon not good enough for you, "truth to tell"? Why do you keep following Thestatusquo vote? or is it the bandwagon of the hour?

What happened to this question?

I do admit I've been ignoring TSQ. I'm not going to answer his questions about my observcations today because well, it's day one of a day start game where we know EVERYONE'S power, I'd rather not blow my load yet. I think we need a night of activities before we can make a legitimate attempt at locating our resident scums.

As per what I said above, I believe that day 1 discussion is useful, even in this game, seeing that everyone's alive and all. What exactly, in your opinion, is the potential harm in this?

You didnt seem to think that a vote on ZA was warrented here, what changed in the past 2 posts?

Vote Gorgon

[ZONEACE]

oh christ, this bullshit again.


yay



seriously, you guys, why the fuck is me not answering shea scummy?


he's being petulant. And if he got his head of his ass he'd realize ive actually answered more than one of his questions, i just didn't direct my answers at him.


so lets all try reading again, and then getting back to me.

[ZONEACE]

I'm feeling a ZA wagon pretty strongly right now, truth to tell.

Unvote, Vote: ZONEACE

Now who is being...

suspiciously wavering in his accusations

now????

By your standards that deserves a vote. Now that Thestatusquo has moved his vote back to ZA, I am no longer the bandwagon that is in the limelight. Was the CKD bandwagon not good enough for you, "truth to tell"? Why do you keep following Thestatusquo vote? or is it the bandwagon of the hour?

What happened to this question?

I do admit I've been ignoring TSQ. I'm not going to answer his questions about my observcations today because well, it's day one of a day start game where we know EVERYONE'S power, I'd rather not blow my load yet. I think we need a night of activities before we can make a legitimate attempt at locating our resident scums.

As per what I said above, I believe that day 1 discussion is useful, even in this game, seeing that everyone's alive and all. What exactly, in your opinion, is the potential harm in this?

You didnt seem to think that a vote on ZA was warrented here, what changed in the past 2 posts?

Vote Gorgon

Oh good I'm not the only who looked at that post and went, WOW THAT WAS SCUMMY.

[mathcam]

Can the rest of the town please comment on whats going on between zoneace and myself right now.

Well, if you really want it. Your claims of joking notwithstanding, I think it's clear you picked a fight with ZONEACE. I think you chose your words carefully enough so that you would come off as the reasonable one, which you do, but I think it's fairly disingenuous of you to pretend that you didn't have this in mind all along, or that you didn't bring any out-of-game feelings in to the game.

As to ZONEACE, Shea's been asking reasonable questions, and your lack of willpower to not be drawn into a conflict has prevented you from answering them in a reasonable pro-town-seeming fashion. And now your shocked that everyone thinks your actions have been scummy! You've fallen right into Shea's trap, and you have only yourself to blame.

I'm not sure I find either of you/them particularly scummy right now.

Cam

[shaft.ed]

oh christ, this bullshit again.


yay



seriously, you guys, why the fuck is me not answering shea scummy?


he's being petulant. And if he got his head of his ass he'd realize ive actually answered more than one of his questions, i just didn't direct my answers at him.


so lets all try reading again, and then getting back to me.

Thanks for addressing the No Lynch vote, much appreciated.

[ZONEACE]

i explained it already shafted RTFG.

[mathcam]

ZONEACE -- I know you're not out to make friends in the game, but your attitude is nonetheless quite senseless. What do you hope to gain by being horribly obnoxious? Especially when you're quite wrong -- Shaft.ed not only clearly saw your post, but has even responded to it specifically, and in fact made a reasonable counterpoint to it.

Cam

[ZONEACE]

then why is he asking the same damn question like he didn't the post? I explained why i voted No lynch, when i did so. Those are reasons, i have no others. would he like me now to make up something?

[Gorgon]

You didnt seem to think that a vote on ZA was warrented here, what changed in the past 2 posts?

You may notice that what happened is that you popped in and answered the points I made against you - mostly to my satisfaction. I wasn't about to unvote you while you hadn't even shown up to address what I said when I voted you, was I? Well, I could have, but that's not my style. I'm pretty amazed you failed to make this connection. Also, you throw in the accusation that I was following TSQ, who voted ZA before he made his no lynch post, which is what drove me personally to vote him (and you yourself to FOS him, funnily enough). Not cool.

And let me also emphasise that the 'wavering' part of my accusation mostly applied to you mixing up the terms 'vote' and 'lynch', which suggested to me like you weren't sure what you were accusing mathcam of ... so it was your phrasing that jumped out at me, more than the fact that you voted and then unvoted. Your attempted "NO U" is therefore flawed.

Also, way to accuse me of being scummy for bandwagoning the very guy that you yourself FOS'd - which is an excellent way to cast suspicion on someone without really commiting to anything. Double hypocrite points then go out to attacking someone who actually votes said person. Again, the only reason I didn't switch my vote straight away is that I felt it would be lame to unvote you before you addressed my points against you - I had no idea how you would respond and whether that would be reason enough for me to move my vote. Turns out it was. Anything unclear about this?

[curiouskarmadog]

please explain to me how wavering means mixing up words.

you provided two examples of me voting then unvoting and said I was wavering..

why are you backtracking now?

I FoSed ZA because I think he is being slightly scummy and if there was a choice between a no lynch and voting ZA he will get my vote. Currently the shea ZA discussion is still being discussed...however, your actions are scummy and the fact that you are backtracking is even more apparent.

so my FoS on Za was enough for you to vote him? ZA voted for a no lynch way before you voted me...so this makes

[curiouskarmadog]

that is not correct...ZA voted for a no lynch AFTER you voted me....