Mini 861: Hellsing Mafia - (Game Over!)

[Albert B. Rampage]

Oh you would have loved being mafia in this game, 6:1, it's really cool and fair. Not. 2 scum SUCK BALLZ.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Hey Neto, how do you think I can improve?

I think you can improve, but you have to pay your dues. Put the work in. Read theory. Make your own theory. Play in games and read games you're not playing. Immerse yourself in it. Your improvements are proportional to the time you put in.

[forbiddanlight]

I think you can improve, but you have to pay your dues. Put the work in. Read theory. Make your own theory. Play in games and read games you're not playing. Immerse yourself in it. Your improvements are proportional to the time you put in.

So effectively you're saying I'm lazy?

And I'd have to agree with that assessment if so.

[Amished]

I do wanna say that Saber's reaction to that joke vote was on scum >_> That is all.

Net, I did notice a lot better improvement D2; so keep up that playstyle. Not sure if it was cause of me that D1 didn't go all that well =\

[Kairyuu]

Oh you would have loved being mafia in this game, 6:1, it's really cool and fair. Not. 2 scum SUCK BALLZ.

The balance worked out with 2 scum. With 3 the town was pretty much screwed without crosskills. A SK doesn't work with a 3 person scum team.

[Shotty to the Body]

Haha if being lazy equates to mafia failure then I am boned, though I did have 5 games running at once in the past month. I think I learn by trial and error, this was my trial by fire as an SK and I got burned. =P Yeah ABR, I want to play with you again so I signed up for that, plus the set-up will help me work on more basic skills.

[Netopalis]

FL - I thought you were brilliant, but I'm kind of a newbie, so I don't know that my opinion is all that valid...

[Chaco]

I'd love more critiquing if possible. Bring on your worst, I don't get my feelings hurt.

[Netopalis]

Amished: Honestly, the thing is, I know you discounted this logic in the QT, but I really do suck at D1. I improve greatly on D2, because my playstyle is based on logic and analysis. D1 is, to me, an amorphous blob of random pressure votes which seem to be the holy grail of play to some players and challenging the accepted norms on that day has gotten me lynched in multiple games. I'm considering a policy of only replacing in, honestly.

[Chaco]

Amished: Honestly, the thing is, I know you discounted this logic in the QT, but I really do suck at D1. I improve greatly on D2, because my playstyle is based on logic and analysis. D1 is, to me, an amorphous blob of random pressure votes which seem to be the holy grail of play to some players and challenging the accepted norms on that day has gotten me lynched in multiple games. I'm considering a policy of only replacing in, honestly.

So that's why you didn't vote much D1. I kinda wondered about that since your patterns changed drastically at the end of D1.

[forbiddanlight]

FL - I thought you were brilliant, but I'm kind of a newbie, so I don't know that my opinion is all that valid...

I was good at looking town. I did NOT, however, catch any scum on my own and actually was going in the wrong direction most of D2

But yeah, actually, I open the question about improvement to anyone ^-^. Any critiques, etc.?

[Netopalis]

Well, Chaco, like I said, work on your logic. The biggest problem with your statements was that your conclusion did not follow your premise. Let me give some examples...

Most arguments take the form of "Because X and Y are true, Z are true."

The problem was that your X and Y facts were indeed right. Your Z conclusion may have been right. However, there was no causal connection between X, Y or the intersection thereof which led to Z.

The biggest time this was evident was when you tried to use killed confirmed players as auto-lynches against certain players. You have two facts here: X was town and X suspected Y. However, it does not necessarily follow from these facts that Y is scum. To do that, you'd need to show that X had an investigative role or some other insight. It may help add to the suspicion, but it is by no means the entire basis for a claim.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Oh you would have loved being mafia in this game, 6:1, it's really cool and fair. Not. 2 scum SUCK BALLZ.

The balance worked out with 2 scum. With 3 the town was pretty much screwed without crosskills. A SK doesn't work with a 3 person scum team.

Balance is BALLS.

The only thing anyone needs to remember about balance is this: "Do respective parties have a REASONABLE chance at winning?". If the answer is yes, then the setup is valid. Playability takes precedence over balance. My idea of fun is not counting the mislynches until my victory and being sadly disapointed by the number. Nor is it avoiding lynch all day then getting my whole team NK'd by scum and a vig. Oh, but by whole team, I mean just me and kik.

So pardon my french, but FUCK BALANCE.

[forbiddanlight]

I have a tendency towards swingy but balanced (or I strive for it)

I do a lot of 8:1:3 and it tends to work out balanced IMO. Then again, both games that have completed with that balance ended in scum win. On the flip side town was stupid in both of them.

[Netopalis]

Incidentally, FL, do you mind if I ask what part of VA you're in? I'm driving through the western panhandle on Saturday, and I thought we might meet for lunch or something....

[forbiddanlight]

Incidentally, FL, do you mind if I ask what part of VA you're in? I'm driving through the western panhandle on Saturday, and I thought we might meet for lunch or something....

Hehe, I see. And I'm pretty much in Southern Northern VA, around a place called Fredericksburg. You won't be anywhere close if I understand you properly :S.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Your balance is what caused Shotty to overestimate scum capabilities and draw negative attention to himself.

Your balance is what made this game prematurely end (and I'm sure it would have ended this way even if I hadn't outed myself).

Your balance means that the game can end on NIGHT ONE.

This does not please me.

[Netopalis]

Ah, yeah, I'm over near Roanoke. Been to Fredericksburg, though....Civil war battleground, if I recall.

[forbiddanlight]

Ah, yeah, I'm over near Roanoke. Been to Fredericksburg, though....Civil war battleground, if I recall.

Yeah, a bit. Rather boring though.

Though I just remembered. I'm in Arlington this Saturday.

AnimeUSA for the WIN!

[Albert B. Rampage]

*continues to shake his fist*

Bah lol, not actually angry, just hammering a point down because I never want to be in such a setup again.

[Amished]

Chaco, early on D2 you did alright, but then you started to go into your "alternate playstyle" which was just god awful and I'm surprised people didn't vote you out of frustration. Put some thought into why something happens/why something is posted (motivation is key) and then you should do a lot better for yourself.

@FL: Scumtells are largely bogus. Joking only "works" cause you're not advancing the game (which is a scummy objective). Look at motivation. Shotty had it right on the number though, kik's bussing, then backing off D1 was scummy. Look for people who know more than you should as vanilla. Scumhunting just takes time, and overall it goes a lot to "gut". I remember before I ever posted in a game here, I read one of ABR's games and he called out scum (and damn near got him lynched before being NK'd) for taking something that was pro-town and casting suspicion on it when there shouldn't be suspicion.

I tend to look for thinks that I wouldn't think of as vanilla (outlooks). If somebody suggests something that's unconventional, determine if they know something due to scum or PR. If their outlook doesn't match yours, it's a pretty good indicator. Just keep your mouth shut until you're more sure that they're scum rather than PRs.

[Netopalis]

Woot! DC is an amazing city....Some people hate it, but I definitely loved the time that I spent there.

[Chaco]

Well, Chaco, like I said, work on your logic. The biggest problem with your statements was that your conclusion did not follow your premise. Let me give some examples...

Most arguments take the form of "Because X and Y are true, Z are true."

The problem was that your X and Y facts were indeed right. Your Z conclusion may have been right. However, there was no causal connection between X, Y or the intersection thereof which led to Z.

The biggest time this was evident was when you tried to use killed confirmed players as auto-lynches against certain players. You have two facts here: X was town and X suspected Y. However, it does not necessarily follow from these facts that Y is scum. To do that, you'd need to show that X had an investigative role or some other insight. It may help add to the suspicion, but it is by no means the entire basis for a claim.

Thanks, and it took me forever to read this because I did, in fact, try to read it (aloud) like Morgan Freeman. It did not work well.

[Netopalis]

It takes time to learn to read it like that. It takes time.

[forbiddanlight]

@FL: Scumtells are largely bogus. Joking only "works" cause you're not advancing the game (which is a scummy objective). Look at motivation. Shotty had it right on the number though, kik's bussing, then backing off D1 was scummy. Look for people who know more than you should as vanilla. Scumhunting just takes time, and overall it goes a lot to "gut". I remember before I ever posted in a game here, I read one of ABR's games and he called out scum (and damn near got him lynched before being NK'd) for taking something that was pro-town and casting suspicion on it when there shouldn't be suspicion.

Hmm, that makes a lot of sense. I agree there's no such thing as scumtells, I just never think about the big picture so it makes it harder on me

Woot! DC is an amazing city....Some people hate it, but I definitely loved the time that I spent there.

I really wish I lived in NOVA to be honest. But, it's alright