Mini Normal 2327: Bird Species (Game Over)

[Ausuka]

(I am v/la, these vcs will be mobile so please correct if I made a mistake, thanks)

VOTECOUNT 3.3

Hu Tao (3)

- shaddowez, NotAScum, Random Nurse

Random Nurse (2)

- Save the Dragons, Hu Tao

Not Voting (3)

- Black, Naerys, SmileyDude1

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate.

The deadline for Day 3 is in (expired on 2024-03-10 17:16:48).

[Black]

3 days huh. Hmm

[Black]

Ideally we get some game advancing content from Naerys and we can make a decision afterwards

[Black]

ping

How many Mafia games have you played in your life?

[Black]

I'm pretty sure NAS is just newtown

His other game on the site has a similar vibe to this game imo

I'm going to take NAS out of my PoE for now and I'll reevaluate later if I have to

If Smiley is lying then we might be screwed but we'll cross that bridge if we have to. Assuming Smiley is telling the truth, that means there are two scum in {shaddow; RN; Hu; Naerys}

[SmileyDude1]

Am online right now btw. Currently composing the results of the Hu Tao dive

[SmileyDude1]

Black, I see your point in your 1364.

Honestly I think there's a part of me that feels like it might be tunneled in regards to wanting Nurse/NAS, and I feel like i'm being pulled into certain directions right now due to my status. Thinking about it, I probably should stop procrastinating and actually go back and do a deep dive on Hu Tao. I plan on letting myself decompress for a little while beforehand so I can look at it with fresh eyes. Expect my conclusion on that anywhere between later tonight and sometime tomorrow at the very latest.
-SNIP-

Going to just note down anything that I found to be of interest to me. Might condense this into a spoiler if this turns out to be too long.

Spoiler: Day 1

Any consensus on the expected number of Scum members this game?

I'm thinking it's safe to assume it's 3.

Don't bitch about me asking.

Going to bed now, and will be up later this evening. No quickhammers either.

VOTE: nurse

Votes Nurse here without explanation

I know what he posted.

I'm asking you why you're assuming he's town who wants to kill you for being good at mafia rather than mafia trying to push you for an excuse

This is true

Hu Tao indicates agreeance with Ari's line of thinking here. Given their read on Black shortly after, this feels more like Hu Tao is still trying to figure out what she thinks about Black here rather than scum agreeing to enable a push (probs didnt explain that the best, i'm trying to say this gives more "uncertain" vibes then "hedgy" vibes to me)

BTW, is there anything we deduce from the text on Snowy Owl?
3 threats (human activity, climate change, decline in species they hunt) = 3 scums?
Or based on your experience here it's just a text with no hints?

Nice to meet you, Snow. Glad to see you got a green pm

Posits an early townread on Snow. Based purely on the above quote i'm not sure that was the most warranted at that point. I can see liking the post based on vibes though the language feels pretty strong for that point in the game. Feels like that could be a pocket attempt

VOTE: black sheeping gob

Votes SirCakez for not liking his Black vote
VOTE: cakez

My take on the black vote so far. In the only game I've played with scum black she was sus from the beginning and something felt off. I don't sense that so far. Not saying i think she's town or anything but I don't scumread her so far.

This feels +town here. I think the progression from 92 feels more likely to come from town that was trying to figure out their thoughts on Black rather than scum. It'd be pretty easy to twist 92 into agreeing with the Black case assuming Gob/Hu Tao pair against Black!Town. For Scum!Hu to take the stance would indicate that the plan was to have one scum push Black while another scum "white knights" for her, though I feel like Hu Tao would've been more vocal in pushing back against Black wagon if that was the angle she was shooting for

I think cakes vote seemed weird though. And nurses post seemed forced that I quoted. I'm fine with either of them being the elimination so far

Justifies the 86 and 101 votes. I think I vibe with these as valid reasons with her going on to expand on thest thoughts in posts like 115 and 132 among others (I'm probs not going to go over non-notable read progression, If I covered every post where Hu expanded on her reads I'd still be typing by the next morning (context it's evening 7 PM rn as I type this)

BTW, is there anything we deduce from the text on Snowy Owl?
3 threats (human activity, climate change, decline in species they hunt) = 3 scums?
Or based on your experience here it's just a text with no hints?

Nice to meet you, Snow. Glad to see you got a green pm

Uhhhh


isnt this a slip?

Yes. Since i got a red pm, I know that he got a green pm. You caught me

think I mentioned this before, but this interaction seems unpartnered. Feels like a weird angle to push a slip in order to distance and Hu Tao's response gives off genuine sassiness vibes to me

Never mind my question, this answers it. Do you find anyone that seems fake so far?

I don't like votes vs Black.
Gob started with previous experience (looked like a fear or revenge vote for me), but then read Black's text(s) as scummy (I don't).
Cakez switch votes from T1 to Black (no matter whom to lim? smells scummy for me) explaining that he followed Gob (I usually don't follow others that early, some people do, so alright, but why not wait until Gob's vote if it is so authoritative?), but then claimed that Black is scummy (again, don't see it).
Other 2 votes (NotAScum and T1) with little to no reasons. Interestingly T1 did not target Cakez for quick vote switch, but also went after Black.

If Black is townie, can there be 3 scums in this group of 4? Unlikely. 2 scums? Yes, may be. But probably at least 1 scum there.
If Black is scum, can there be 2 scums in this group? Quite unlikely. 1 scum - may be, to distance from Black. No scums - also possible.

There is a reasonable chance that in any scenario we have at least 1 scum between these 4, but there can also be none (as well as 2), so I don't think that this warrant a change in my vote.

Things here seem to rest on how we see Black. OMGUS arguments against her don't look plausible. She has not switched her vote to one of those 4. (I would have probably done so had I been in her position.) Why has not she? Townie who wants to test people's reaction to this train? Scum who doesn't want to attack the train, since there is (are) fellow scum(s) there? All quite speculative at this stage.

Travelling for the rest of the day, so will not be until late at night.

Really good analysis. Glad my first instinct was right on you

Re-iterates Snow Townread. Think this makes the first Snow interaction feel better as a vibe read for me, given this analysis being a strong reason to townread him

Black is likely town BTW. This is how I expect her to act as town.

Black is likely town BTW. This is how I expect her to act as town.

can you give more specifics/words to this read?

She has a habit of acting a certain way as town rather than scum. I'd rather not say exactly what it is so I can use it in the future. But both games I've played where she was scum I called her scum day 1.

The above posts reiterates her Black read and expands on it with a bit of a meta read precedes to back it up later

I'm fine with voting NotAScum. Kinda just want to do something, this game feels dead

States intention with being alright voting NotScum,

VOTE: NotAScum

Votes him here, precedes to pressure the slot in 457

Random Nurse - unsure, leaning sus. Could just be busy
NotAScum - Is a scum
Hu Tao - Hu Taown
SmileyDude1 - Towny
Black - towny
T3 - idk
gob - gob
SirCakez - idk
Naerys - idk
Snow2697 - towniest town to ever town
shaddowez - towny based on lady interaction
Aristeia - towny
Save the Dragons - idk

This feels mostly consistent with what they've said so far, though the Shadow placement is curious. I was unable to find the lady interaction upon a quick skim through
the beginning of Shaddow's ISO, and i'm not sure HT's posting towards Shaddow indicates reason to TR on it's own there.

T3->NotScum->Nurse------->Black--> (everyone else not in my keep category)

This would describe where i'm at in terms of priority launch order right now.

My thoughts about T3 212 still hold up. I'm not sure what to make of there 449 walkback. Gut instinct, it feels bad to me to 180 on their position given the other posts within the ISO but I probs need to think on it more.

I'm taking NotScum's 464 as a sign they may become easier to get a read on from day 2 onward (otherwise they'd probs be on the same rank as T3 for not providing much to work with)


VOTE: T3

I didn't realize NotAScum was new too. So I'm willing to give him more time. I'm fine with t3

VOTE: t3

Transitions off NotScum onto T3 after realizing they're new. Kind of starting to get follow the wagon vibes here but I think it does make sense given they didn't have a read on T# per their readlist.

VOTE: Cakez

Switches their vote to Cakez after T3 claims. Given they also didn't have a strong read on Cakez it feels alright to me to want to get the claim there.

I think in general their day 1 feels more towny than scummy to me. Hu Tao's actions day 1 feel like they match her thoughts on the game here. There are some aspects that I found iffy but most of those were either minor or resolved itself over time

Spoiler: Day 2

I'm assuming cakes was the vigilante shot. Which is fair

This starts a back-and-forth between Hu Tao and Black about whether it's correct to assume Cakez was vig shot. Having read through the interaction multiple times now, while I do see Black's point, I do think it's fair to make the assumption that Cakez was vig killed given the kills night 1 were Ari and Cakez. The situation Black brings up as a counter (Mini 2325) feels different in the sense that both of those shot in that game nigt 1 (Delta and IAVH) were considered scummy to my recollection of the game. Thing is Hu Tao doesn't really go that route with the argument which makes it hard for me to give credit there, and the argument they do go with feels a bit defensive to me at the very least.

I mean look at how yesterday went. It's pretty obvious. The fact you even said it like that is sus.

This feels awkwardly defensive

Maybe I should have listened to gob day 1, cause what do you mean?
[/quote]
The last sentence of this post in particular rubs me the wrong way given Gob was scum here though that's probs not AI so much as I don't like it.

VOTECOUNT 1.10

T3 (7)

- Black, SirCakez, Random Nurse, SmileyDude1, Naerys, Aristeia, shaddowez

SirCakez (4)

- Save the Dragons, T3, Hu Tao, gob

No Elimination (1)

- Snow2697

Not Voting (1)

- NotAScum

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2024-02-26 01:12:53).

I'm dead. This means none of us were on scum LMFAO

Yeah that seems about right considering scum were allowed to sit around and do nothing D1

Do you think scum is lurkers?

I am getting slight pings due to her asking Black the same question in her 229. Granted this is the type of question where it may be feasible for someone's answer to change based on what period of time you ask them, but this feels like it could be fake.

I killed SorCakez

Why wouldn't you kill black

This post soon after Gob's claim feels less likely to be partnered. That kind of question undermines Gob's claim and feels like something I wouldn't expect a partner HT to posit this quickly before Gob had a chance to get their bearings.

What did you do last night?

slept well

Do you have a guilty check on Hu?

Why are you role fishing

I don't really know what to make of this interaction. Like it feels rolefishey, but then that's in response to NotScum rolefishing and comes off the back of Black also kind of rolefishing and my brain hurts . Just going to say it's probs NAI and move on.

Ok so one of gob/Snow is confscum

I actually disagree. Gob could have just been trying to take the kill from scum and let the vigilante stay alive. But then again I fake claim a lot so what do I know

Hu Tao posits a reality where gob is town despite fake claiming vig. On it's own that is unfortunate given the flip but a reasonable stance to take.

Awfully quick of Black to vote gob without giving the guy a chance to explain. Also I doubt a real vig would outright claim vig when they can just kill the imposter during night

Agreed actually if they thought they were scum

This feels bad. It feels like they're trying to shade Snow here by agreeing with NotScum's post doubting Snow being vig. Given the Snow/Gob competing claim situation, I could see this as a subtle attempt to undermine Snow to help Gob (NotScum also is guilty of this for the exact same reasons, though I feel Hu Tao comes out slightly worse due to agreeing with NAS's view at that juncture. Feels like a more convenient position to take given that it can allow for hiding behind NAS in the event you catch heat for something like this later.

Awfully quick of Black to vote gob without giving the guy a chance to explain. Also I doubt a real vig would outright claim vig when they can just kill the imposter during night

I cannot kill at N2. Had I remained silent and been killed at N2, Gob's claim would have been unchallenged.

I think Snow is telling the truth here

Snow is clearly the vigilante but I think both can be town still

Another instance of Hu Tao espousing Gob/Snow TvT viewpoints

Okay i think the team is snow and black + someone else.

Anyway there is no reason to lim Snow here today. Lets get Black.

Oh wait. You're actually hard claiming vig?

I think it's pretty obvious that Snow is telling the truth and that gob is trying to fade someone not named Snow because a one-shot Vig isn't that big of a threat to him

Agreed. Guess you were actually right

This revelation on Hu Tao's end is another aspect pointing away from being a Gob partner. The amount of commitment Hu Tao put into Gob in the leadup to this post only to realize that Gob was hard claiming vig feels like HT wasn't informed of the situation. I feel like a scum HT probably turns on Gob quicker after Snow CCed the claim, and is probably doesn't commit to Gob/Snow both being town as hard to begin with in the world where she's aware Gob's claim is fake.

gob makes a lot of tongue in cheek posts. I didn't even take his cakez claim seriously at first

So did I at first. But he did not retract his "kill Cakez" statement. And Black and Shaddowez, may be Hu Tao, seemed to take his statement as a vig claim. So I thought I had to challenge.
BTW, I still consider it possible for Black and Gob to be scums.

Yeah I agree. I thought he was fake claiming. I'm surprised Black didn't think that at first

I have a feeling that one of these people trying to pair me with gob is actually a gob partner posturing to push me once he flips scum

I can also see this being the case

I don't really vibe with these two posts in conjunction with each other. The first post seems to indicate agreeance with Snow's post in thinking Gob was originally fake claiming at first, while the second agrees with Black in thinking there's scum trying to pair her as a Gob partner. Something I find notable is that the first post isn't really cut and includes Snow's postulation that Black andd Gob could still be scum together. I'm getting bad vibes that 886 may have been a subtle signal advancing the Black+Gob theory with Hu Tao playing both sides in setting up to push those who are pushing Black/Gob in 1022. This theory does feel like it may be tinfoily though so maybe I shouldn't read too much into it.

Gut pinging on Gob and Black.

VOTE: Black

Then why not just vote gob?

Think I agree with Black in that this is kind of a critical point of the day (with Gob and Black being tied in votes at that point) and thus it feels +town for Hu Tao to advocate for a Gob lim here.

Day 2 Conclusion: This was more of a mixed bag. There generally seem to be a good amount of things when looking at partner interactions with Gob that seem unlikelt to have occurred which I find to be the main positive of the day for her. I don't think i really vibe with the early response to the Snow counterclaim though, thinking both Gob/Snow can be town probs will draw eyes after Gob red flip but on it's own is a reasonable stance to take. I don't like her echoing doubt on Snow's claim in 880 in the sense that it serves to aid what we know now to be flipped scum and is kind of hiding behind another player's opinion allowing for an out should that be scrutinized.

Spoiler: Day 3

VOTE: Random Nurse

I think the way he initially sided with gob to try and get me faded indicates he was part of the scum agenda. There's a chance he was just scumsiding as town, I just don't think the thought process of "gob is lying scum, but my gut is telling me Black is his partner so I want to go Black first" makes any sense for a townie to have. He didn't back off of me and switch to gob until gob's lim was inevitable

I have a theory on the third but I want to keep that under wraps for now

I personally think NAS was worse than him

States that NAS was worse than RN in regard to Black's argument

sus people:
gob
NotAScum
RN
StD

Town:
Smiley
Snow

Hu,Black,shaddowez are null

lotta sus people and only four town. Seems fake to me

I think I'm more wary of Naerys because I'm not sure why gob would townspew her like this after he fake claimed Vig and there was a real possibility that he would be faded

This is a good point

Agrees with Black's point about Naerys

I agree with NAS being scum. I think the last is Dragons. I liked Naerys push on gob day 1. I liked shadows overall play. And I don't think random and NAS are a team. I think black is town and I think smiley is town.

VOTE: black

Lets get rid of Black. Unironically. She is a good scum player and too hard to catch.

Not going to grudge vote

I don't feel like that's partnered interaction. I feel like if gob was scum with Naerys they would have talked about it already what gob was doing.

VOTE: gob
sus

When everyone was trying to push black, she started going to gob. And it actually caused others to think it over and derailed the black wagon

I kind of like that HT provided support for reasons she liked Naerys day 1 in relation to Gob

I can see Gob/RN here

What happened to this

I think it's one of RN or NAS and I'm leaning NAS. I've seen RN be this stubborn on me before and he was town so I could see that here.

Provides reasoning for wanting NAS over RN. I think I can see HT believing this
Why do you think only one of them is scum?

I doubt both scum would take the same position here

Vibe with this viewpoint, does seem weird for both scum to approach the game from the same angle here

Yeah I think I was wrong sorry RN. I should have listened to you yesterday

This also feels bad. Even if you scumread Black at this point, scum was flipped yesterday. This implies regret for flipping scum which is just ???

I'm a town PR. I'd rather not reveal my role as it would greatly benefit scum if I do

UNVOTE:

Kind of agree with Black that a scum!Tao probs pushes more for a full claim instead of relieving pressure by unvoting here

[SmileyDude1]

I think my conclusion is that Hu Tao is a bit of a mixed bag. I think looking at it in terms of associations with flipped scum she feels likely to be town here. Though I think some of her play looking at things in a vacuum feels meh (and in some cases a tad inexplicable).

I think i'd be willing to keep it in the pool, though I don't know if it's it's my first choice. I'm probably going to think about my reasonings for each of RN/NAS/Hu Tao being scum and revote what I feel most confident about in short order. I want to say I'll do this tonight, but i've spent the last 3 hours composing the above so i'm kind of tired.

Will do so tomorrow

[Random Nurse]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me. If and when I do flip Town they will be forced to explain themselves.

[Hu Tao]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me. If and when I do flip Town they will be forced to explain themselves.

I've already said I think it's NaS and Shadow. But it seems no one else agrees with me.

[Random Nurse]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me. If and when I do flip Town they will be forced to explain themselves.

I've already said I think it's NaS and Shadow. But it seems no one else agrees with me.

...

If this is true then why do your actions not currently align with your words? Your vote is on me, not them.

[SmileyDude1]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me. If and when I do flip Town they will be forced to explain themselves.

Save the Dragons is town btw, refer to here

Bringing this back again

<---- My Brain after reading these last few pages

Ok given the cat's out of the bag now I think it's best for me to claim what I know.

I am a town neapolitan

.

N1: Checked Black. came up not a VT
N2 Checked StD. came up a VT

I'm inclined to believe that Black is telling the truth when she claims TPR here. I think her postulating concern in her 772 about NaS rolefishing alongside the multiple instances where she expressed more worry about being forced to claim than actually being eliminated ( 824, 831, 935, 939, 946 there might be more in there though I think this sufficiently shows my point) point towards Black telling the truth in regards to being a town PR in my opinion

[Random Nurse]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me. If and when I do flip Town they will be forced to explain themselves.

Save the Dragons is town btw, refer to here

Bringing this back again

<---- My Brain after reading these last few pages

Ok given the cat's out of the bag now I think it's best for me to claim what I know.

I am a town neapolitan

.

N1: Checked Black. came up not a VT
N2 Checked StD. came up a VT

I'm inclined to believe that Black is telling the truth when she claims TPR here. I think her postulating concern in her 772 about NaS rolefishing alongside the multiple instances where she expressed more worry about being forced to claim than actually being eliminated ( 824, 831, 935, 939, 946 there might be more in there though I think this sufficiently shows my point) point towards Black telling the truth in regards to being a town PR in my opinion

...

What exactly makes them Town Neapolitan instead of Scum Neapolitan?

[Random Nurse]

Wait, I take that back.

What makes them VT instead of a Goon?

[SmileyDude1]

Neapolitan specifically checks for is a VT vs Is not a VT

If they were a goon they would come up "not a VT"

Save the Dragons came up VT, therefore they are clear

[Hu Tao]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me. If and when I do flip Town they will be forced to explain themselves.

I've already said I think it's NaS and Shadow. But it seems no one else agrees with me.

...

If this is true then why do your actions not currently align with your words? Your vote is on me, not them.

I've already explained. I'm only voting you because black doesn't think Nas is scum but will have to reevaluate after you likely flip town.

[Black]

I think RN might be town too. The "why are people voting for me" comments just feel too guilty and I don't think scum are super likely to show visible concern about it over and over again

Still waiting on Naerys

[Naerys]

I think RN might be town too. The "why are people voting for me" comments just feel too guilty and I don't think scum are super likely to show visible concern about it over and over again

Still waiting on Naerys

What exactly are you waiting on? I am not a content maker, never was and never will be.

[Naerys]

Honestly, i prefer to observe and ocassionally pointing stuff out that stands out. I dont like making cases bcz i suk at that

[Naerys]

Little owl - Athene noctua

The little owl can be identified by their small size relative to other animals, their brown feathers with white spots, and their piercing yellow glare. This bird is native to Eurasia, from France to China, but it was first introduced into the UK by humans in the 1800s. It has similarly been introduced to New Zealand, but not Australia for whatever reason. For the most part, it eats small birds and small mammals, but it can also eat worms. It is monogamous and will often stay with a single partner for most of its life. Due to its large range, it is rated LC by the IUCN. Its population trend appears to be stable.

VOTECOUNT 2.2

gob (6)

- Black, Naerys, NotAScum, Hu Tao, Random Nurse, Snow2697

Black (3)

- gob, Save the Dragons

Not Voting (4)

- shaddowez, SmileyDude1, Snow2697

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate.

The deadline for Day 2 is in (expired on 2024-03-06 10:33:47).

cant really rule out hardbus from scum out there but i feel like scum would prefer not to be close with each other

in town!Black word that leaves Hu,RN,NAS and shaddow to look at
if i believe Black about NAS being newb town then Hu-RN-shaddow contains both scum
the problem is i dont really trust Black

[Naerys]

Black what do you think about shaddow?

[Black]

I think RN might be town too. The "why are people voting for me" comments just feel too guilty and I don't think scum are super likely to show visible concern about it over and over again

Still waiting on Naerys

What exactly are you waiting on? I am not a content maker, never was and never will be.

I want you to talk about your thoughts on the game and who might be scum. You do this in every game you play. For some reason this game you haven't speculated who the scum team might be. Where are your solve theories?

Honestly, i prefer to observe and ocassionally pointing stuff out that stands out. I dont like making cases bcz i suk at that

I'm not asking you to make a case. I'm looking for something specific that you do as town that you haven't done yet

[Black]

Black what do you think about shaddow?

Could be scum

[Black]

What do you think about shaddow?

[Save The Dragons]

For posterity sake I would like both Save the Dragons and Hu Tao to explain exactly why they're voting me.

If

and when

I

do

flip Town

they will be forced to explain themselves.

Spoiler: