The Brave and the Beautiful 2: Fairy Tales ÔÇô Game Over

[SpyreX]

My actual opinions at this point are that I think ooba, LLD, and you are sketchy. I have specific opinions about Ooba, but I think he should post what his feelings are up to this point before I put words into his mouth. For LLD I can refer back to her meta after my exam.

Voting for fate, saying you'd vote for me, and saying you wouldn't vote for one of the people you think are sketchy NOICE.

[Kdub]

LL:
I don't think you needed to claim just yet, but whatever. The claim seems believable and can be proven.

Were I to switch, I'd switch to SX because I don't want to put LLD at L-1 when

I clearly want other stuff to happen today

, but I don't think the distraction is warranted.

Could have fooled me.

[Iecerint]

That is a wild distortion.

I am happy with the LLD wagon. I want commentary at this moment, not the n+1th moment.

P-edit LOLWTF Kdub. Here are the things just on the previous page I have said I want to happen:

Lingering mysteries:

1. I have no idea why Ooba thought kunk was scum early on or now. Was it for his RVS vote? For his weird/mistaken vote for me?

2. I don't know why Fate thought Ooba was town prior to this return. [this one Fate responded to]

Still waiting on ooba re: kunk and the rest of the game to come.

My posts are not hard to read.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Vote: Iecerint

So you're happy with the wagon, but you won't vote it?

Also, you've been advocating a neutral position this entire time, when did your read change?

[Iecerint]

1. That is correct. I do not want the day to end for, namely, the reasons clearly quoted above, so I will not put you at L-1. No idea why you find this scummy.

This is another example of "categorical flaws" vs. "scum motivations"-type scumhunting. I'm scummy for violating someone's feelings about how a vote should be used. Town would take context and the players themselves into account.

2. I have not been advocating a neutral position; I have found you scummy. The fact that I acknowledge that it is possible that you could be town expressing yourself poorly (as in almost any D1 circumstance) does not constitute a "neutral position;" it is simply acknowledging the obvious.

[Amrun]

VOTE: Kdub

Not lynching that claim.

LL's vote on Iece is bad, though.

[Kast]

Spoiler: Catchup(not actually that much to comment on...the LLD wagon has been pretty center stage)

I get a similar scummy read on LLD as Robo. Also dislike LLD's subsequent reactions. LLD is inconsistent, takes extreme positions while arguing one side, then immediately switches to an opposite extreme when referencing her own behavior. Her reaction is overly defensive and extremely out of proportion. It may be playstyle difference, but it reminds me a lot of her scum play in Metropolis (btw, you were OBVIOUS SCUM in Metropolis and we lynched you for being OBVIOUS SCUM so excuse me if I doubt your self-meta).

Disagree with Kdub's read on Iec (or rather his assessment of the motivations behind Iec's play). Iec plays carefully as town and it's one of his assets.

Not liking this excuse, from kunkstar. He pushed a competing wagon on "accident"? Then completely abandoning that to push Kdub reads like he's trying to appease/blend with town (specifically reads like he's trying to sheep Spyrex without understanding what Spyrex actally posted).

Generally, not liking most of LLD's reactions. They don't seem genuine and match with her play in Metropolis when she was caught scum.

That said, we're not lynching a claimed watcher/tracker on D1. LLD's ability is demonstrable (barring RBs) and she's got a spotlight on her for the rest of the game, so if she's scum she's already caught.

Kunk is my next scum read, primarily for the post listed in my catchup.

Vote: Kunk

[Kast]

@Iec-
Please clarify; you appear to be ok with an LLD lynch DESPITE her investigative PR claim, provided that we take time to look at other players. Is that correct?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Kast, you can't count Metropolis because my scum partner claimed scum in thread and named me as his scum partner.

You didn't "catch" me. I was given up by my teammate.

[Amrun]

Oh, shoot, I got kdub and kunk mixed up a little bit. Now I can't decide whether to vote for kdub or kunk.

LLD, why did you lie and say you had never been lynched as scum when you have?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

As I explained above, the game involves my scum partner telling the entire town that they are scum, and that I am their scum buddy.

For obvious reasons, there was a great deal of outrage about the game due to this.

[ReaperCharlie]

The Brave and Beautiful Vote Count

1.5

---

Lady Lambdadelta [4] – Robocopter87, Fate, havingfitz, ooba

Iecerint [2]

– Kdub, Lady Lambdadelta

Kdub [2]

– kunkstar7, Amrun

kunkstar7 [2]

– bv310, Kast

Fate [1]

– Iecerint

ooba [1]

– SpyreX

Not Voting

– Albert B. Rampage

---

With 13 players alive, it is 7 votes to lynch.
Deadline is July 1 at 12pm PST (3pm EST).

[Kast]

@LLD-
You're kidding yourself and ignoring the plethora of posts from the majority of town who all IDed you as scum from D1/D2. And that's not counting the ICs who had inside info.

Also, you forced your partner to claim in thread by claiming first that he was definitely guaranteed scum. He only claimed as a counterclaim to yours.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

@LLD-
You're kidding yourself and ignoring the plethora of posts from the majority of town who all IDed you as scum from D1/D2. And that's not counting the ICs who had inside info.

Also, you forced your partner to claim in thread by claiming first that he was definitely guaranteed scum. He only claimed as a counterclaim to yours.

The most important line is there "The IC's with inside info".

[Iecerint]

Please clarify; you appear to be ok with an LLD lynch DESPITE her investigative PR claim, provided that we take time to look at other players. Is that correct?

More correct to say that I think she is scum despite her investigative PR claim.

I want her dead, BUT not necessarily today, and I am open to other lynches.

I need to go over the old B&B game and [REDACTED] before I come to any definite conclusions, not to mention hearing from those who aren't here.

I acknowledge that it is normative to lynch someone who isn't LLD given her claim.

[Iecerint]

Unvote

[Iecerint]

See, here's the thing.

I have a HARD TIME believing that both of LLD's scumfriends would come to her defense rather than bus (though Ythill's team did pull something like this D1 in [REDACTED]).

I have a HARD TIME believing that SX and Kdub would be this obvious (but see above).

I have a HARD TIME believing that SX and Kdub are town (no reference necessary).

[Iecerint]

THOUGH it is wrong to try to connect all three dots, so nevermind.

Anyway, wheels are spinnin until our friends come.

[SpyreX]

When did I become scum in your worldview?

Also:

Voting for fate, saying you'd vote for me, and saying you wouldn't vote for one of the people you think are sketchy NOICE.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

THOUGH it is wrong to try to connect all three dots, so nevermind.

Anyway, wheels are spinnin until our friends come.

Is this not a subtle way of saying "Come finish her off Fate?"

That said, I have a town read on Fate.

[Iecerint]

You have been scummy in my worldview for awhile. I was at first evaluating the extent to which you may just have moral problems with /self-meta that affected your reads. I resolved that confusion at this point:

Given that you have personal awareness that I am a total wimp as scum, I am a little surprised at your indifference with regard to how that post should be interpreted.

I'm referring to your inside knowledge of the scum QT in DW mafia here.

More recently, you were most transparently scum in my worldview here:

Were I to switch, I'd switch to SX because I don't want to put LLD at L-1 when I clearly want other stuff to happen today, but I don't think the distraction is warranted.

I already addressed your Also:'d quote. Hint: it's the post that starts with "That is a wild distortion."

[Iecerint]

@ LLD -- No, I'm referring to bv and ABR and fitz and those people.

[Iecerint]

Err, quote-fail there. Those should both be Iec quotes. I'm at sapo's house atm.

[SpyreX]

Self-meta is self-meta is worthless.

However, if you want to argue "I'm a wimp as scum" you spent two large posts defending a singular vote under the "Look, I can't be scum because of it."

You absolutely laid the groundwork for going onto LLD but didn't because its "too soon" while being fine with it existing. You had up until this page a vote parked for all intents and purposes on Fate and said you'd vote for ME instead of one of the ones you'd clearly said were "sketchy"

I am not getting sidetracked at the moment though. I want people to chime in about ooba because its a damn elephant in the room at the moment.

[Iecerint]

Self-meta is self-meta is worthless.

Self-meta is the best thing ever if you get lucky and happen to have legitimately done something highly discriminating.

However, if you want to argue "I'm a wimp as scum" you spent two large posts defending a singular vote under the "Look, I can't be scum because of it."

This is incorrect. I made 1 post explaining the basis for the vote (which the vote target acknowledged), then a separate post where I recognized that I would never have made said vote as scum.

As scum, I think I would've followed Ooba onto kunk, even if I had been scum with kunk, because early wagons on scumfriends are the best time to do it OR supporting confident wrong people is my preferred playstyle as scum.

You absolutely laid the groundwork for going onto LLD but didn't because its "too soon" while being fine with it existing. You had up until this page a vote parked for all intents and purposes on Fate and said you'd vote for ME instead of one of the ones you'd clearly said were "sketchy"

As stated (well, implied) above, I need you to stipulate why you think this is scummy. What does the wily /self-meta-manipulating-Fate-vote-gambiter have up his sleeve now?