Mini 828 - ProzacMod 3 - Lost Mafia - Over

[ZONEACE]

CKD, Reck CDB in that order. I didnt have an urge to lynch Juls so I dont have an urge to lynch BM.

[VP Baltar]

Emp seems to find BM scummy, does that alter your read at all?

Mod, please prod CDB

[ZONEACE]

no. As I said. I had no urge to lynch Juls, and until we get something from BM that won't change.

[Porochaz]

Questions have been sent.

CDB has been prodded.

As you can probably tell episodic summaries were killing me anyway but due to v/la has been totally cancelled.

[ChannelDelibird]

I can just about look at a computer screen again without feeling queasy (while I know it is frustrating for everyone, it is definitely more frustrating to be feverishly hallucinating, so <3 those who were asking for prods.), so I am back. I skim read the last two pages but I will go back and do so properly.

Has BM actually said anything yet? (Hi BM!)

[VP Baltar]

Really CDB, I just needed someone to comfort me after that dismal Champions Trophy match on Wed.

Plus I forgot you said you were ill. Sorry.

[EmpTyger]

BM:
So be it. You had a chance to play, and you choose to play the lurkergame.

---

Everyone else:
This isn’t how I was hoping to do this, but Zoneace pretty much let the cat out of the bag prematurely, and I stalled as best I could while waiting for Juls’s replacement, but I’ve no choice but to conclude now that BM’s deliberately not playing. So here’s how this is going to work instead.

Zoneace was the SK.
I was the psychiatrist.

Unless someone wants to counterclaim either of us, we are 100% confirmed not-mafia.
We are not going to be claiming anything further about ourselves or each other unless to rebut someone’s claim.

Now, everyone who believed Santos’s claim needs to explain why they believed him. And they need to be very specific. Starting with:

---

Reckoner:

I believe Santos' claim, Emp.
<snip>

Why? Again, you need to be very specific.

Emp, your question to me is one where I cannot answer either way and look good, so I'll decline to respond. I stand by what I said.

Uh, that’s my point: I don’t see any good reason for you to have said what you said in [1365]. I asked you to clarify in case there was an innocent explanation that I missed. But apparently there isn’t.

For someone who is repeatedly insisting that we’re in lynch-or-lose, you are incredibly content to sit back and not do anything about it.

---

CKD:
You ignored Santos and his claim, in order to pressure me- despite how Santos supposedly cleared me. You need to explain why you ignored Santos’s claim.

<snip>
and no CDB is not the lynch.....

Just out of curiosity, why not?

<snip>
Actually out of EVERYBODY who has claimed anything….my has been the closet to being proven truth. As scum, how would I have know he was vanilla and not a power role…or an SK…or anything else?
<snip>

How about:
You’re mafia. CB isn’t in your mafia group. So you knew that CB was telling the truth when he claimed vanilla. That’s how you knew. It’s very similar to…

---

VP:
…Hey, remember yesterday when you had these wonderful metareads that Juls and Zoneace were innocent, but you said you wouldn't ever post them because then you'd never be able to use them in a future game? Well, now you’ve processed-of-elimination that Juls is mafia and Zoneace is a confirmed SK. So those alleged metareads seem pretty worthless. You have a new excuse for why you can't reveal them?

But, more importantly:
You didn’t like the timing of Santos’s claim (which I’ve already pointed out is incongruous) but you haven’t had anything critical to say about his actual claim. Just vague tentative hedging that “it’s something he would do as town” etc. Time to explain yourself fully.

---

CDB:
You like VP, disliked the timing of Santos’s claim, but didn’t really say much about the substance. Except you vaguely leaned towards it being true, and eliminated Santos from lynch consideration today. Why, and be specific.

---

Zoneace:

We are not going to be claiming anything further about ourselves or each other unless to rebut someone’s claim.

Understand?

Otherwise, go to town on whichever of the other 6 you want.

[curiouskarmadog]

emp, how did I know he would flip vanilla? and it would have been so easy to jump on that lynch if I was mafia...matter of fact I took fucking heat BECAUSE i didnt want to lynch him...remember "CKD is really going out of his way to not lynch CB" and "CKD is trying to distract" from the CB lynch?

And I didnt ignore anything...I dont know if I believe Santos claim is different than ignoring.....I am coming around on you and ZA's claim, though no SK in thier right mind would counter that claim, so to ask for it was ridiculous.

still waiting on Reck's case.

and BM and CDB to post content.

[xRECKONERx]

About to run out the door for work, but Emp:

I'm not incredibly content to sit back and do nothing. I'm very ready to lynch CKD or CDB.

[VP Baltar]

@Emp, I never said I had a meta read of Zone. I've never played with him before. I said he seemed town to me. Can't do anything about that. In fairness, he was the SK, so his scumhunting was likely genuine. Unlike you, I had no insight into there being a third party so the logical conclusion for me to reach from that is that he was town.

Re: Juls- She's not here anymore, so I can delve into that a bit. My town meta on Juls comes mostly from two things 1) a widespread attack 2) a certain emotional response when attacked for what she feels are bad reasons.

The latter one is the most significant to me since I've attacked her for bad reasons many times (as scum), and I know she can get frustrated. However, she has been working on calming that down, so it is becoming less reliable. I noticed it flare up a little bit when you and I were attacking her during the IMDB incident.

The reason I didn't want to reveal my meta on her while she was here is that frustation is an easy thing to fabricate, and since it was mostly off of that one incident I wasn't 100% certain, just that I was certain I did not want to lynch her that day.

You didn’t like the timing of Santos’s claim (which I’ve already pointed out is incongruous) but you haven’t had anything critical to say about his actual claim. Just vague tentative hedging that “it’s something he would do as town” etc. Time to explain yourself fully.

I don't have something negative to say because even though you have possibly played one of the most fucking frustating games I have ever seen, I was mostly inclined to believe you were town even before his claim. I still don't like the way that he did it because at best it was really anti-town, but that's not really a reason for me to say that I don't believe it. With there being an SK in the game, I can see the need for a cop.

[VP Baltar]

I'm not incredibly content to sit back and do nothing. I'm very ready to lynch CKD or CDB.

Why aren't you voting for one of them then? What have you been doing to question them and figure out if they are scum?

[curiouskarmadog]

About to run out the door for work, but Emp:

I'm not incredibly content to sit back and do nothing. I'm very ready to lynch CKD or CDB.

WHY?..STATE YOU CASE!...

[curiouskarmadog]

YOUR.....fucking "r"

[Porochaz]

Questions are asked based on the numbers of days the thread has been running.
As Ive been away the questions for day 3 have been screwed up a bit. They will probably be done today. I will notify you when this happens.

[EmpTyger]

Running to work now, more later, especially about Santos’s claim and people’s reactions (or lack of) to it.

---

VP:
But how do you know that Juls doesn’t get frustrated as mafia, and that she only gets frustrated as town? Moreover *Juls* was the first one to bring up frustration = innocent in this game (re Zoneace), so what did you think you were hiding from her re tells? But evenso- as far as frustration goes, I don’t really see it in her play. In fact, she seems to me to be rather consistent in her demeanor.

[VP Baltar]

How much prior experience do you have with Juls, Emp?

[Battle Mage]

hey all. I'm here!

This game is confusing as hell. I've read the last couple of pages, so

Vote: Emptyger

for his rudeness. Any attempt to make my reading more constructive, would be most welcome. Will probably start tomorrow.

BM

[xRECKONERx]

Umm... so nothing about Santos' claim, BM?

Oh, and...

Vote: CDB

[curiouskarmadog]

why do you expect anyone to answer your questions, when you refuse to put a case forward....what is your CDB case?

[xRECKONERx]

My case against CDB is simply a process of elimination, given the fact that I believe Santos' claim, others are eliminated from the possibility of being scum. I don't like how CDB has contributed basically NOTHING the entire game, especially when we're this late into the game.

[Battle Mage]

Umm... so nothing about Santos' claim, BM?

Oh, and...

Vote: CDB

which was?

BM

[VP Baltar]

BM, I am seriously expecting some good analysis from you or you need to die.

I specifically want your thoughts on CDB and Reckoner.

[curiouskarmadog]

ok going to vote on who i think most likely is scum....

vote VP

as I am no longer sure about Emp/ZA...if it is a ploy, seems risky, the SK (if they are lying AND we have one) knows exactly who to kill tonight.....too risky

dont know what to think of Santos.....

think Reck is probably scum with VP...most of the game, Reck has thrown some mild suspicion on VP, but has not backed it up with anything...mostly just useless

BM and CDB is anyone's guess....this is why you SHOULD lynch lurkers earlier vs. later in the game. think i am beginning to see the wisdom behind this.

as for VP, thought he was scum yesterday....thought he was scum today (with Emp?) but ZA/Emp's claim has swayed that...so you are getting the vote and hopefully the lynch you deserved yesterday.

[ZONEACE]

as I am no longer sure about Emp/ZA...if it is a ploy, seems risky, the SK (if they are lying AND we have one) knows exactly who to kill tonight.....too risky

The SK doesn't exist anymore.

And I'm really getting sick of your nonsensical reasoning for everything. you're lucky Emp found me last night. Cause otherwise you wouldn't be around anymore.


Let's see if we can correct that.

vote ckd

[EmpTyger]

Everyone excapt Santos:
I really don’t get why you all have so much trouble finding stuff to discuss regarding Santos’s claim. Here, I’ll start you off:

1) This statement makes no sense.

<snip>
- since I am alive today it seems my plan to defend reckoner on false information kept me alive during the night.
<snip>

Except no one died last night! How could Santos think that his being alive had anything to do with his claim? Unless he didn’t write that after dawn. He wrote it before dawn- expecting someone to be dead.

And consider what would have happened if someone *had* died overnight. Then this statement makes sense: Santos points to the fact that that the only reason he lived was that mafia chose a different target.

2) In order to clear Reckoner D2, Santos jumped through a flaming hoop of doom involving complex flavor speculation, drawn out polling, and a 100% made up claim- all just so that he wouldn’t have to reveal his cop ability.
But in order to clear me D3, Santos blurts out his ability as soon as he can at the start of the day.

3) D2 Santos claims that he must find for Jin. Then Juls claims Jin.
And now that Santos, having found Jin, despite having turned into a complete blabbermouth regarding himself and me- has absolutely nothing further to say on the subject of Juls/Jin.

4) Santos claims he allegedly learned Reckoner was innocent based on something that happened either N1 or D2.
But Santos was already stating on D1 that Reckoner’s claim of Kate makes him definitely innocent- before this alleged event occurred..

5) Santos getting a cop ability…
…is not the result of the question to Santos, because he didn’t get his question until much later.
…is not the result of the question to Reckoner, because Reckoner allegedly still had the ability N2.
…is not the result of a town ability, because that person would have said something yesterday when Santos made his fakeclaim. (Especially after Zoneace opened the way with a Santos vote.)
…is not the result of a mafia ability, because mafia aren’t going to give a cop ability to a townsperson. (Unless, of course, Santos himself is mafia.)

---

BM:
If you showed any intention of playing this game, I would be less rude and you wouldn’t be audacious enough to use that reasoning to vote a confirmed innocent.

However, instead, it seems that you either xreplaced into a game you had no intention of playing, or you’re using replacement as an excuse to drag your feet. Change your behavior, I’ll change my attitude.

(Seriously, we have a deadline in 14 days, and it takes you X days to merely *confirm*? What reaction are you expecting?)

BM, I am seriously expecting some good analysis from you or you need to die.

I specifically want your thoughts on CDB and Reckoner.

Also, I’m sure VP will have a good explanation for how he left Santos off this list, but in the meantime, why don’t you put Santos on that list.

---

VP:
…I’m sure you have a very good explanation for how you left Santos off that list, right?

As for Juls: 1 game, LI758. She was innocent, I was mafia, mafia win, mafia killed Juls N1 (daystart), I lived until endgame. As a comafia argued: “Juls: One of the more active players. She actively scumhunts and usually comes off town while doing so, which is bad for us. She is my #1 candidate for night kill.”

---

Reckoner:

My case against CDB is simply a process of elimination, given the fact that I believe Santos' claim, others are eliminated from the possibility of being scum.
<snip>

What process of elimination? What makes VP/Juls different from CDB/CKD:

“Personally, I'd be happy with a lynch on CDB or CKD. Process of elimination tells me it has to be one of them: though I still don't like the Emp/Zone interactions in the slightest, and the jury's still out on VPB/Juls.”

Also you insist out of one side of your mouth that we must have a 3-person mafia, while at the same time out of the other side you insist that the only players who can be mafia are CKD/CDB. So, how can we have a 3-person mafia when you’ve eliminated all but 2 from contention?

And again, please explain *specifically why* you believe Santos.

---

CKD:

<snip>
as for VP, thought he was scum yesterday....thought he was scum today (with Emp?) but ZA/Emp's claim has swayed that...so you are getting the vote and hopefully the lynch you deserved yesterday.
<snip>

(Did you learn nothing from yesterday?)
What *specifically* made you think VP was mafia? With me or without me?