Open 284: Tit for Tat (Over)


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Post Post #125 (ISO) » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:14 pm

Post by aaah400 »

Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
Uite wrote:
Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:Everyone not voting should either do so or explain why they're not. I still believe in the page 3 scum lynch.
Just noting that everyone was already voting at that point. Sloppy.
Well, this explains why no one responded - I meant to write "Everyone not voting aaaah400".
hmm? Y is no one voting me (aaah). what does this supposed to mean? OH. wanting to lynch me asap.
AurorusVox wrote:
aaah400 wrote:and of course i have a feeling both Cogito and Vox is scum
^You haven't said why you think I'm scum. You also haven't answered my question to you earlier.
I dont see why i cannot have my random vote and have a FOS as well. Of course the vote was random vote as i have explained before in the game.

and of course
Unvote
for now
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Post Post #126 (ISO) » Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:07 pm

Post by silverbullet999 »

-Kitty!
I figure out whether I should be laughing, crying, or both.
Laugh cause I'm funny!
Cry cause I'm right!
... People were right it seems....
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Post Post #127 (ISO) » Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:14 pm

Post by AurorusVox »

@aaah
You kept a random vote on someone when there was someone else who you actually thought was scum. There was no reason for you to not vote that person. You still haven't voted that person.

So am I now scummy because I disagreed with your voting? Again, this isn't right. You said there was a reason for me to be considered scum before I'd even mentioned you.

---
don_johnson wrote:104 is another winner. this could just be dh misunderstanding, though.
I'm wondering this. He's not talked about anyone else yet, and he's been putting words in my mouth, so its beginning to look a little desperate on his part :\

---
DemonHybrid wrote:Vox, is that not the basis of your argument? He's scum and he's trying to confuse town by voting No Lynch?
There's a huge difference between
building cases
and pointing out
suspicious acts
, and saying someone is 100% scum. My point is that voting for no one has a scum motivation as I have already shown. Therefore I voted for the person who did it. I think the no lynch vote was scummy, and ConSpiracy is scummy for it, but I am not saying he is 100% confirmed needs-to-die-today scum.

DH, what do you think about ANYONE in this game, other than me?
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Post Post #128 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:00 am

Post by RedCoyote »

DRK 78 wrote:aaaah400 would make an awesome policy lynch if it came down to it, but this setup comes equipped with a nice way to handle that without wasting a lynch anyway. Aside from that, he realllllly needs to make his posts more comprehensible. His actions are difficult enough to make heads or tails of without his posts sounding like he's on a word limit.

Also, if I had a second vote, it would be on silverbullet right now. The fact that there's a mafia game going on in this thread seems to have somehow escaped him completely.
DRK is town. I feel very much the same way. DRK, don't let me forget this should we ever quarrel later in this game. I'm getting into a habit of telling people who I think are town to hold me to that prediction, heh.
DRK 83 wrote:What have we learned here? We've learned that silverbullet has opinions on who's town and who's scum (based on things like who's voting for him) and yet has posted no content this game and still has his random vote out on Shattered Viewpoint. Yeah, he's town.
I don't think I need to tell you he's being a little tongue-in-cheek, but I'll keep an eye on him. I have faith silver will open up on someone if he needs to, but if he stays too fluffy then we might have to put the hurt on him.

---
aaah 90 wrote:Well im just saying it is RVS stage so i have voted Silverbullet as my random vote.

Congito/Aurovox/Silverbullet is my suspicious 3.
Oh, wow.

AV & CES, you guys may be right. We may have to just rid ourselves of this.

This is going to be hard, because this would be an easy mislynch if aaah is town. We won't learn much about it.

---
Uite 111 wrote:What it looked like to me was that the two seemed pretty much equal, both having people on their case, so I was curious why the reasoning for Shattered Viewpoint held up in his opinion, while the reasoning for AurorusVox didn't.
This isn't much of a response. I'll hold out for your promised analysis. As I said, CS had a reason for voting SV. Did you or did you not agree with it? You completely dodged my questions.

---
don 113 wrote:104 is another winner. this could just be dh misunderstanding, though.

CS and silverbullet are two peas in a pod.
I don't know about silver yet; I still think he's just goofing off. CS, on the other hand, I am not fond of thus far. Do I foresee a don-DRK-RC wagon?

Unvote
;
vote: ConSpiracy


---

silver, would you start taking this game seriously, please? We have a lot of potential VI-ish people in this game, and we don't really need you as one of them. I know you can actually play.
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Post Post #129 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:01 am

Post by DeathRowKitty »

RC wrote:silver, would you start taking this game seriously, please? We have a lot of potential VI-ish people in this game, and we don't really need you as one of them. I know you can actually play.
Damn it, I was being trolled >.< I guess this is what I get for not trying to meta him earlier...

I'm really not sure what to make of silver tbh. I was half-serious when I said I wasn't sure if I should be laughing or crying (I was literally laughing when I wrote that post). I do like the idea of a CS wagon though.

Unvote, vote: ConSpiracy
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Post Post #130 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:37 am

Post by don_johnson »

generalcoyote wrote:Do I foresee a don-DRK-RC wagon?
your insight is grand.

vote: CS


now we just need a catchy name. how about "the chuck wagon"?
town 39-32
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Post Post #131 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 4:56 am

Post by ConSpiracy »

DeathRowKitty wrote:
CS wrote:You got it. He didn´t even pretend to be town. Well done.
Too scummy to be scum. Got it.
FoS CS
Or maybe to null to be scum?
RedCoyote wrote:his is going to be hard, because this would be an easy mislynch if aaah is town. We won't learn much about it.
Scumslip?
This scumsuspect mustn't be lynched because it would be an easy mislynch without any information. You lynch people for their information, not for their scummyness? Who would do that? You're right: scum.
FoS: RedCoyote
RedCoyote wrote:I don't know about silver yet; I still think he's just goofing off. CS, on the other hand, I am not fond of thus far. Do I foresee a don-DRK-RC wagon?

Unvote; vote: ConSpiracy
Love this. Random bandwagon day?
don_johnson wrote:now we just need a catchy name. how about "the chuck wagon"?
"The Istanbul wagon"
If somebody has tools to fix my scumdar, pm me.
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Post Post #132 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:19 pm

Post by Shattered Viewpoint »

Hi. Still hapy wih my vote. You guys should vote Aaaah. It's good for the soul.
Better than you. Don't doubt me; it won't end well.

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Post Post #133 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:25 pm

Post by aaah400 »

Shattered Viewpoint wrote:Hi. Still hapy wih my vote. You guys should vote Aaaah. It's good for the soul.
Because?
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Post Post #134 (ISO) » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:34 pm

Post by RedCoyote »

DRK 129 wrote:Damn it, I was being trolled >.< I guess this is what I get for not trying to meta him earlier...
Well, he's naturally a little fluffy, but the little meta I have of him knows he can be more serious about the game.

---
CS 131 wrote:This scumsuspect mustn't be lynched because it would be an easy mislynch without any information. You lynch people for their information, not for their scummyness? Who would do that? You're right: scum.
No, don't misunderstand. I meant that it will be an easy mislynch regardless of aaah's alignment. Whatever he flips, we won't learn much about who on the wagon was bandwagonning him because of the VI-ness and who was doing it sinisterly.
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Post Post #135 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:02 am

Post by Uite »

First off, I'm visiting my parents this weekend, so I probably won't be able to post again till Monday. However, as I've mentioned before, I have next week off, so I should have plenty of time to go in-depth then.
RedCoyote wrote:
Uite 111 wrote:What it looked like to me was that the two seemed pretty much equal, both having people on their case, so I was curious why the reasoning for Shattered Viewpoint held up in his opinion, while the reasoning for AurorusVox didn't.
This isn't much of a response. I'll hold out for your promised analysis. As I said, CS had a reason for voting SV. Did you or did you not agree with it? You completely dodged my questions.
The reason itself was fairly meh, just standard RVS fare, though the fact that he was blatantly sheeping DRK, combined with both wagons seeming fairly equal to me, prompted me to question him on it.
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Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master.
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Post Post #136 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:19 am

Post by AurorusVox »

aaah400 wrote:
Shattered Viewpoint wrote:Hi. Still hapy wih my vote. You guys should vote Aaaah. It's good for the soul.
Because?
Because of all the reasons I've said that you have yet to answer, maybe?
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Post Post #137 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 4:49 am

Post by silverbullet999 »

-The Red Coyote
silver, would you start taking this game seriously, please? We have a lot of potential VI-ish people in this game, and we don't really need you as one of them. I know you can actually play.
*blush* at the compliment!
*grumble* at supposedly not being serious! (Lighthearted though? sure!)

-Kitty!
I would suggest listening to this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDYw-61NRic) as you read my words!
Damn it, I was being trolled >.< I guess this is what I get for not trying to meta him earlier...
There is no troll here this day!

You have misrepped me twice so far this game!

*coughs to clear throat to present case... this is where the music above should be blasting*
*Is going to use " " and bold to directly quote things vs having a bunch of quote windows to drive me mad*

First misrep!
I said
"aaaah400 is voting me so his wagon is an improvement!"

which you translated to
"aaaah400 is scum because he's voting for you"

Using this misrep you further say (in same post)
"We've learned that silverbullet has opinions on who's town and who's scum (based on things like who's voting for him)"

Upon which you justify with your vote on me!
I posted a reply upon which you had no retorts thus I make the assumption that what I point out was true and you (from what I see) agree, also earning my vote!

Anyway we talk of cherries and pies and biscuits for awhile but then!

The Second Misrep!
You ask this
"Also, do you think I intentionally misrepped you about aaah? (and if so, why?)"

Which I reply with
"yes, cause you scum! (more justification to your voteeee)"
which means (you did the misrep to further justify your vote).
However you misrep it as
"No, it doesn't work that way. You're saying I'm scum because I misrepped you and I misrepped you because I'm scum. That's completely circular. What about this misrep leads you to believe it was intentional?"


And then talk of trolls and knights and fantasy adventures was brought up!

That Ladies and Gents is the Case! Good Day!

Also would anyone post the case on the ConMan? I'd appreciate itsss.
... People were right it seems....
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Post Post #138 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:57 am

Post by mothrax »

Ok, so I didn't have to read very far to find scum (remind me to subscribe next time)

SV had no random vote, and then when called out on it random voted. When DRK questioned him about it it was all "DONT QUESTION ME"

other than that all he has done has requested prods, and said "oh lolscum" and bitched about RVS. We know he thinks aaah is scum but we have no reasoning behind it at all.
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Post Post #139 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:59 am

Post by DeathRowKitty »

silver, I ignored a lot of what you said earlier because it honestly didn't deserve a reply, but if you're going to use it as an excuse to tunnel me, you win. You're getting a reply:
silverbullet wrote:First misrep!
I said "aaaah400 is voting me so his wagon is an improvement!"
which you translated to "aaaah400 is scum because he's voting for you"
Using this misrep you further say (in same post) "We've learned that silverbullet has opinions on who's town and who's scum (based on things like who's voting for him)"
Upon which you justify with your vote on me!
I posted a reply upon which you had no retorts thus I make the assumption that what I point out was true and you (from what I see) agree, also earning my vote!"
You said you thought the aaaah400 wagon was an improvement. Now, logically, I assumed better wagon = on someone more likely to be scum. Since your reasoning for his wagon being an improvement was that he voted you, I decided you were saying he was scummy because he was voting you. *turns off music* (God, that music is killing my brain. :s Where the hell did you find that?)
silverbullet wrote:The Second Misrep!
You ask this "Also, do you think I intentionally misrepped you about aaah? (and if so, why?)"
Which I reply with "yes, cause you scum! (more justification to your voteeee)" which means (you did the misrep to further justify your vote).
However you misrep it as "No, it doesn't work that way. You're saying I'm scum because I misrepped you and I misrepped you because I'm scum. That's completely circular. What about this misrep leads you to believe it was intentional?"
Your posts aren't exactly clear. You see, "yes, cause you scum!" (ignoring some word usage issues), normally means "Yes, I think you misrepped me. I hold this belief because you are scum." I didn't actually bother to parse what you meant by "more justification to your voteeee" because it seemed to simply be auxiliary to the stuff not in parentheses.




Comments on other things:
-After his early game posting binge, CES has failed to barely mentioned anyone but aaaah. He should really do that.
-@SV
Can't discuss ongoing games and such, but I've been keeping an eye (not that closely, but enough) on aaaah's current games since you brought up your meta tell. Perhaps there's a bit of a learning curve you're not factoring in?
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Post Post #140 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:00 am

Post by mothrax »

DH 39 is bad... AV screams town to me. He explained why he thought what he thought and DH tried to paint that as him pushing a no lynch...
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Post Post #141 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:05 am

Post by Cogito Ergo Sum »

DRK wrote:-After his early game posting binge, CES has failed to barely mentioned anyone but aaaah. He should really do that.
Bzzt. Wrong. The correct solution is for a aaahlynch to take place, thereby making all my posts incredibly relevant.
Scumchat is awesome. Yarr!

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Post Post #142 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:09 am

Post by mothrax »

not really liking aaaah, and if aaaah were to flip scum RC would be my next choice... Note PG 3 and the whole language thing. It looks like RC is trying to find a way to discredit any attack on aaaah.
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Post Post #143 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:11 am

Post by mothrax »

and since my SV vote isn't doing anything:
Unvote Shattered Viewpoint; Vote aaah400
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Post Post #144 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:11 am

Post by DeathRowKitty »

mothrax, you can do this in one post. A new post for each little point is not useful.
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Post Post #145 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:11 am

Post by DemonHybrid »

There's a huge difference between building cases and pointing out suspicious acts, and saying someone is 100% scum. My point is that voting for no one has a scum motivation as I have already shown. Therefore I voted for the person who did it. I think the no lynch vote was scummy, and ConSpiracy is scummy for it, but I am not saying he is 100% confirmed needs-to-die-today scum.
Look at this post:

AurorusVox wrote:
DemonHybrid wrote:No.

With this logic, if you flip town, you'd shock me.

In fact, lets take a majority vote. Who here thought that ConSpiracy's NL vote was particularly scummy because he was trying to stop any and all voting analysis?
My logic is sound.

Scum know who is town and who is scum: Y/N
Scum do not therefore vote randomly: Y/N

A vote for no one prevents a vote on a someone: Y/N
A vote for no one prevents connections between the voter and a someone: Y/N

4 Yesses = A vote on no one circumvents scum's predicament of not being able to randomly vote
You take ConSpiracy's vote and you do not apply just scum motivation behind it; instead, you are using the basis of him being scum behind your core logic. You're saying, basically, "In order for Conspiracy's vote to be scum, he would NEED to have been scum in the first place, or else my logic doesn't make sense". It's circular logic.

For him to be scum,
he would need to have been scum
when making his "Random vote", so says you.

I'm asking for you to prove that bolded.

As far as my thoughts on everyone else:

aaah is alright; I'm keeping an eye on him but I think his shakiness of the english language puts himself into scummy positions. I've sort of ganged up on him in the last game we were in because his presentation of the language created straw man arguments and circular logic, so I'm being more careful when assessing him this time.

Antihero needs to post more. The lurkiness is getting to me; IIRC, he's not usually this lurky.

CES is biting on the aaah wagon due to scummy wording. It's a little alarming that he's discrediting our exchange as being worthless information, so I'm not so sure about him at the moment. He also needs to post more.

CS started out okay, but he's in the realm of picking out fake scumslips and tunneling where it's not needed. Under Antihero, he's probably my third suspicion. It wouldn't surprise me, as well, if you were scum and were RVS-bussing scum CS.

DRK is okay in my opinion. Nothing really has scum motivation, I feel. Same with RC.

Uite is like AV lite, only more lurky. I need more information and possibly meta on him; somehow, I feel as if you are scum, AV, then he wouldn't be, and vice versa. That's just a feeling, though, so I can just cast that away.

DJ is...alright, but he needs to give us more information too. Everything is an offhand comment or a criticism.

Don Johnson: can you give us a top 3 scumlist please?


mothrax, he said himself clearly that he voted him because he is scum, knows who scum and town is and tried to deny everyone information by voting No Lynch. So, how can you mistake that fact? Go back and read again.

SV is alright again, but he's another aaah biter. I don't think that means much in his case; he's doing decent scumhunting. Silver's also okay in my eyes, even though he might be on the wrong track with his scumhunting.
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Post Post #146 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:14 am

Post by DemonHybrid »

Sorry for not giving mafia the attention it deserves, my major work has been killing me, but I'll start to be on site more.
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Post Post #147 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:14 am

Post by mothrax »

DRK: I am doing it as I read along. I don't want to forget something while I read through.
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Post Post #148 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:19 am

Post by AurorusVox »

DH, I've said clearly that I don't
know
he is scum. It's not like I've said "I know he is scum, and so therefore his no vote is scummy." I have said his no vote is scummy, and therefore I think he is scum. Why would it be the other way around? I have proven and shown why I found the no vote to be scummy, which was reflected by my vote. If ANYONE had voted for no lynch, I would have said the same about them. Yes, for my point to be right he would have to be scum but that's how this game works. For anyone's cases to be right, the person the case is on has to be scum.
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Post Post #149 (ISO) » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:24 am

Post by DemonHybrid »

Then why didn't you say that in the first place? Hence why I'm voting you.

You started out, again, with this post, which uses the circular logic that you used which I placed in front of you and asked you to explain:
AurorusVox wrote:
DemonHybrid wrote:No.

With this logic, if you flip town, you'd shock me.

In fact, lets take a majority vote. Who here thought that ConSpiracy's NL vote was particularly scummy because he was trying to stop any and all voting analysis?
My logic is sound.

Scum know who is town and who is scum: Y/N
Scum do not therefore vote randomly: Y/N

A vote for no one prevents a vote on a someone: Y/N
A vote for no one prevents connections between the voter and a someone: Y/N

4 Yesses = A vote on no one circumvents scum's predicament of not being able to randomly vote
and took that and tried to run with it. But after I call you out, it's just "scum motivation". What gives?

Scum motivation means you had a null read on him before he made that No-Lynch vote, and you believe that him voting No-Lynch therefore incriminates him due to the scum motivation behind it. That's acceptable. But I'm voting you not for that anymore (My original vote was RVS and was because you found that scummy); but now I'm voting you because the above quote assumes that he was originally scum and that's WHY it's scummy. Because he knew who is scum and who is town and used that information to No-Lynch vote and to deny the players RVS information.

So, what gives? I'm not trying to tunnel here, but you can see my thought process, right?
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