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[vollkan]

Thanks again Adel.

Just to test the URL once more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubris

[vollkan]

Rejoice, for I am no longer mute.

[Adel]

Thanks again Adel.

Just to test the URL once more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubris

so my posting that link, you are accusing me of being guilty of hubris, or what? I'm not very clear on what you are attempting to communicate.

[curiouskarmadog]

nice.....good job team.

[vollkan]

Thanks again Adel.

Just to test the URL once more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubris

so my posting that link, you are accusing me of being guilty of hubris, or what? I'm not very clear on what you are attempting to communicate.

Oh. No. It wasn't in reference to you at all.

You probably didn't see it but on p. 46-47 OGML and I had this exchange (I'll just quote the final post, since it covers it all):

Hell yes I predicted the Vollkan vigging.

Bow-chicka-bow-wow

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubris

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_your_base

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_Accomplished

As in, all the time I knew just how completely and utterly wrong OMGL was, despite his boo-yahing. Now he can see why

[Adel]

"mission accomplished" is pretty awesome.

[Yosarian2]

I've reread page 30 many times, the immediate pages leading up to page 30 several times, and the entire game up to that point a few times.
Each time it leaves me very frustrated.

I won't be playing mafia again any time soon.

I'm sorry to hear that, Adel.

[SensFan]

I've reread page 30 many times, the immediate pages leading up to page 30 several times, and the entire game up to that point a few times.
Each time it leaves me very frustrated.

I won't be playing mafia again any time soon.

In all fairness, Adel, I don't think that was that much worse than how you've treated me in previous game(s).

[OhGodMyLife]

Hoo lordy.

Great

, great game Goat, and Yos and CKD as well. Vollkan, carry on all you want about hubris and mission accomplished, but you were clearly the weakest link on that scumteam, and you're lucky you had three much more proactive partners steering conversation.

Don't count on squirming out of a lynch next time though Yos, I've got your number now

This was a really well put together game design, and I loved the flavor, but I think four scum out of fourteen players was very unbalanced. With no real inherent power roles and the possibility of scum interference at every level of the assigned power roles usage, there was just no way I saw that coming.

[Goatrevolt]

I do think the setup was balanced in favor of the scum. How much so? I don't know. The plan to get me semi-confirmed off the bus drive put us in a really commanding position, and we used that to steer the rest of the game. Had that not happened, I'm not sure how it would have gone down. We were pretty much in control of this game the entire way through. We had great communication as well, which made things really smooth. Everything we did was very well choreographed.

The way the last day played out was completely just off the cuff. We had discussed and come to an agreement on going for the fake tracker claim, but once I saw vig, it made things more interesting (and also easier).

I think 20% is far too low of a town win chance. I'd say maybe 65/35% scum wins. I think 3 scum would have had their work cut out for them though. I think 3 scum would be unbalanced in the town's favor at probably about the same ratio.

Maybe make it a 15 player game, add in a townie somewhere (possibly another unique position like Creative Director or CEO with a minor level of power) and it would probably be a balanced game. I think people would expect 4 scum in a 15 player game.

-----

Korts the only thing I didn't like about the game was that you allowed people to post screenshots of their private quick topics. Yosarian and I had to spend time faking a quick topic for that purpose, which felt unnecessary. It's kind of a minor thing, but it was annoying.

Other than that, I thought it was well designed/well run. The flavor was excellent, and the interlocked design aspects were combined very well. If it was run again, I would sign up.

[Goatrevolt]

Scum QT:

http://www.quicktopic.com/43/H/u7jHd8WNzaY

Me and Budja the last day:

http://www.quicktopic.com/43/H/6fvveUSDx5Mx6

You've already seen all of my QT with Yosarian.

[curiouskarmadog]

I agree, the QT posts shouldnt been shown in game....

[MichelSableheart]

First things first: A well earned congratulations to the scumteam. You kept me second guessing througout the game, I never came close to pinpointing things down. Just a small highlight from my IM convo with Yos though, when it was in fact too late:

MichelDdt (21:41:56): I even played around with the (im)possibility that there are 4 scum, which would include Goatrevolt
MichelDdt (21:42:21): It would explain why he wanted the vig kill
MichelDdt (21:42:27): can't see that balanced though

The main reason I couldn't see 4 scum being balanced is that the day 1 choices didn't give much in the way of info roles. A tracker is nice, but with 4 scum they can choose who makes the kill to avoid the track relatively easily. And getting more then 1 track result on day 1 was unlikely: if we chose 2 trackers, one of them would have died almost certainly. I think 3 scum, slightly more players, or stronger powerroles early would have been better balanced.

I'm not too happy with my own play. I replaced into a relatively difficult spot, but I don't feel I did much to help. What could I have done better? In particular, could I have convinced the rest of the town to rethink the "confirmed innocents"?

@Ojanen: you did catch me in an inconsistency there. If I had originally given the entire truth, my statement would have read "in no way am I implying that Goat

has to be

scum, even though I think that's highly likely". With the town sentiments at that time, calling Goat highly likely scum seemed suicide. I guess the wording I finally settled on had a far too strong "I believe Goat to be town" meaning, getting myself into trouble.

I also agree that Quicktopics shouldn't be allowed to be showed or quoted ingame. They are too much hassle for the scum to fake. I'm not going to throw away a weapon when it's given to me though.

Finally, some more quicktopics for you:
Creative Department
Adel-MSH/Sensfan
Yosarian/MSH

[OhGodMyLife]

I've put in some well deserved scummy nominations for this game, all those who were as outclassed as I was should go agree with me.

[curiouskarmadog]

thanks for the nom....glad to be part of such a good team...I think everyone played their part well and everyone equally put in ideas.

[Goatrevolt]

thanks for the nom....glad to be part of such a good team...I think everyone played their part well and everyone equally put in ideas.

This. I couldn't have asked for a better team to be a part of.

I appreciate the nominations.

[scotmany12]

Good play scum. I do think the setup is unbalanced in favor of the scum. I like the setup and everything, but I think 3 scum would make this game a lot better, and a lot more balanced. Still a great game though.

[TDC]

Man, when Korts told me who the scum were after I died, I knew this was a lost cause (and not because of the number, but because of who it was).

Enjoyed the game while I lasted. I think it could perhaps have used one or two more Account Execs but other than that I don't think the balance was that bad. I figure it's pretty hard to balance a smalltown anyway, seeing how role distribution is going to have quite an impact.

[Ojanen]

I'm not too happy with my own play. I replaced into a relatively difficult spot, but I don't feel I did much to help. What could I have done better? In particular, could I have convinced the rest of the town to rethink the "confirmed innocents"?

I'm not too happy with my own play either, I didn't help at all. But this was a useful game to be town in. Thought-provoking. Hopefully it'll slightly recalibrate my feel for which thoughts coming to me to ignore and especially which not.
I always did agree something was strange with the Seraphim kill, but didn't come close to actually evaluating it from the correct angle. Didn't truly rethink from Goat's boots. I'm not sure how you could have gotten people to listen. Perhaps first impression post could have been more concisely/clearly written, but honestly I think people wanted the confirmed to be confirmed. Your insistence level was pretty good.

[OhGodMyLife]

My play was obviously sub par. I thought I was playing a pretty strong game at the time, but then I always do right up until I'm endgamed. Its nice to see that I had Yos worried enough to be fretting over it being a mistake not to kill me though.

[Goatrevolt]

Honestly, I don't think anyone played a truly bad game. The only exception really, and I don't mean this offensively, was Sens simply because of the severe lurking making him an easy lynch. Ojanen you were an easy mislynch I had set up based on Crywolf, but then your play was simply too pro-town so I reversed that idea. You didn't correctly peg us all, but you played well enough to establish yourself as pro-town to the majority of the game.

OGML, you were the biggest threat in the game to us. You had Yosarian pegged and later Vollkan. 2/3 isn't bad at all. You were playing a pretty strong game. We regretted not killing you day 2.

If you read the scum quick topic, you will see that I was nervous about doing the "I claim a fake track result on Ojanen" plan simply because I knew both Ojanen and MSH wouldn't buy into it (well, Ojanen because she would know I was lying). I was worried that you would be able to go back into the thread and nail me over something and the whole stronghold we scum had built would crumble to dust.

--------------------

This game right here is pure proof that coordinated scum win games, and proof of how good day talking is if used well. This is two games in a row that I've won as scum where we made excellent use of day talking to coordinate plans and team up to accomplish goals. I am going to link to this game every time I'm in a scum group with someone who says something like "I like to play solo as scum."

---------

Here's some theory: I think the town would have been better off by choosing Tracker, Tracker, Roleblocker day 1. Thoughts?

[Adel]

The only exception really, and I don't mean this offensively, was Sens simply because of the severe lurking making him an easy lynch.

I thought that Ren self-voting to lynch -1 was a really bad move. Even though it didn't result in his lynch, it was a distraction and make it harder for other players to focus on scumtells that might actually be accurate.

I currently think that Ren = ABR.

[Goatrevolt]

We aren't lynching Yos today. Unvote.

So we leave the scum alive?

That sounds like a foolproof plan.

Just wanted to quote this post. I found it funny at the time .

@Adel: Agreed. Ren's self-vote was bad too. I had forgotten about that.

[ortolan]

This game had a cool and original setup, I thought it was very well thought out.

Adel: Ren Hoek is DGB

[Adel]

Ren Hoek is DGB

damnit, you are right. I really wish I would've known that while I was playing. Trying to lynch DGB on day 1 is a serious scumtell.